Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion
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What are layman terms?
Simple terms that everyone can understand? Like how many chances did we create from open play without the help of any xG stats ? Not just looking into shots on target?
Incidentally I was out drinking in a bar in Shoreditch two Fridays ago and Ed Woodward was in there with Gary Lineker and some other suits. I can't imagine what those two have to talk about, unless they are personal acquaintances.Exactly.
Woodward's massive contribution.
He was offered a new contract.Exactly.
Woodward's massive contribution.
Maybe he is going to sign Lineker as his veteran striker.
This has been discussed.
If a contract could not be agreed upon a replacement should have been made.
btw the situation was clear after 2017/18 season.
All good points and i am with Ole for this season as well. Hoping that we make some more big signings next summer ala Sancho and a good midfielder. Then we'll start looking like a proper club.
So what, I should go from game to game and write them here?
This sums up this Place:
Reg: He has taken everything we had, and what has he given us in return ?
Xerxes: Harry Maguire ?
Reg: What ?
Xerxes: Harry Maguire!
Reg: Oh yeah he gave us him. Uh that's true yeah
Xerxes: And Aaron Wan Bissaka
Loretta: Oh yes. Wan-Bissaka, Reg. Do you remember what our defense used to be like ?
Reg: Ok - I'll grant you Wan-Bissaka and Maguire are two things OGS has done for us
Xerxes: DDG's new contract.
Reg: Well yeah, obviously the new contract. That goes without saying doesn't it ? But apart from Maguire, Wan-Bissaka and DDG's new contract
Commando: Dan James
Xerxes: McTominays new contract
Commando 2: Martials new contract
Reg: Yeah, yeah allright - far enough.
Commando: and he brought a smile back to the club
Francis: Yeah that's something we'd really miss if Ole left, Reg!
Commando: He got rid of Darmian, Sanchez and Fellaini
Loretta: And there is a lot less negativity in the press
Francis: Yeah he really knows how to keep the place happy. Let's face it, he is the only one who could in a place like this.
Reg: Oh ok - but apart from Maguire, Wan-Bissaka, DDGs new contract, Dan James, Martials new contract, a smile on everyones face and less
negtivity in the press - what has OGS ever done for us ?
Reg: He has taken everything we had, and what has he given us in return ?
Xerxes: Harry Maguire ?
Reg: What ?
Xerxes: Harry Maguire!
Reg: Oh yeah he gave us him. Uh that's true yeah
Xerxes: And Aaron Wan Bissaka
Loretta: Oh yes. Wan-Bissaka, Reg. Do you remember what our defense used to be like ?
Reg: Ok - I'll grant you Wan-Bissaka and Maguire are two things OGS has done for us
Xerxes: DDG's new contract.
Reg: Well yeah, obviously the new contract. That goes without saying doesn't it ? But apart from Maguire, Wan-Bissaka and DDG's new contract
Commando: Dan James
Xerxes: McTominays new contract
Commando 2: Martials new contract
Reg: Yeah, yeah allright - far enough.
Commando: and he brought a smile back to the club
Francis: Yeah that's something we'd really miss if Ole left, Reg!
Commando: He got rid of Darmian, Sanchez and Fellaini
Loretta: And there is a lot less negativity in the press
Francis: Yeah he really knows how to keep the place happy. Let's face it, he is the only one who could in a place like this.
Reg: Oh ok - but apart from Maguire, Wan-Bissaka, DDGs new contract, Dan James, Martials new contract, a smile on everyones face and less
negtivity in the press - what has OGS ever done for us ?
Yeah good point - How does OGS' defence record compare to Mourinho's at the same number of games into his Utd tenure...?
Oh it was great in his last 17 games at least. Only an average of 1.8 goals against
Dont care whatever you do mate. Fact is , we have been pretty crap in creating chances from open play. Our attacking play is pretty much non existent.
Why not compare it to Mourinho at the same number of games as OGS?
Obviously that's more comparable - he took over a dejected, under-performing side and had to change the style of football entirely.
That wouldn't fit your narrative though, would it?
If you're gonna compare them, do it fairly.
Reg: Oh ok - but apart from Maguire, Wan-Bissaka, DDGs new contract, Dan James, Martials new contract, a smile on everyones face and less negtivity in the press - what has OGS ever done for us ?[/QUOTE]
Giving youth prospects their chance......no-one likes that.
Giving youth prospects their chance......no-one likes that.
So it's not fair to compare a team that Mourinho spent 2.5 years to build - with a team OGS inherited without signing new players ? You are right, it's not fair - but I thought Ole did quite well compared to Mourinho anyway
So? That's what every fecking manager has to do.
Mourinho took over a team that LvG had built for years and played footy opposite to his own, a squad that was unhappy and discontent in the ground.
The notion of comparing managers at different points in their tenure is laughable - hence stats sources rarely focusing on something as ludicrous as that.
You'll regularly see 'Klopp's first season vs Rodgers first season', or 'Moyes after 20 games vs OGS after 20 games' etc.
That's how managers are compared, don't be so daft as to argue the case just because you like OGS and didn't like Mourinho.
Well, if you want to deal in facts, Jose did take an LvG squad that was all those things you described, spent £180m adding Pogba, Zlatan, Bailly, and Mkhitaryan and ended up 6th, so...
You shouldn't need miracles to beat teams like Wolves, Southampton and Palace. Look at what Bournemouth are doing to Soton right now. We were pathetic against them.
They were also down to 10 men.
You will never, ever convince me that Bournemouth have better players than we do. Never in a million years. Yet they have looked a far better unit with a far more identifiable style than we do, and this against an 11 man Southampton team. Goal aside, we barely even created - or attempted to create - a thing in that game.
As you said, nobody wants miracles - nobody expects a title challenge, nobody expects Pep or Klopp standard football or results.
What we do expect is visible progress and being able to put away teams like Southampton, Crystal Palace and based on their form so far, Wolves.
Bournemouth had 6 shots, 35% possession. I'm sure you would be raving about the style of play if that was us.
How has 'number of shots' got anything to do with 'style of play'...?
If OGS formed an utterly ruthless counter attacking style that saw us concede possession for victories that would be fine my me.
A team with a clear identity and style of play will still lose games, and have games with lower shots on target - that has nothing to do with a clear identity.
You need to try and make sure you're not arguing with the poster rather than with what they're saying...
Otherwise you will end up posting silly rubbish - as quoted here.
Once Ole spends 400 million and ends up with a team 6th in the league we will have a direct comparison.
This is becoming Comedy Club! We were better than Southampon but couldn't get a goal. It's time for some to stop playing FM and come to reality and listen/look to the facts.
With you logic:
Newcastle won against Tottenham. Must mean Pochettino is shit. Because Tottenham should win.
Norwich won against ManCity. Must mean Guardiola is shit. Beacuse ManCity should win.
Pep Guardiola has won trophies in every single country he's managed in, MASSIVE trophies in MASSIVE leagues with MASSIVE teams.
Pep Guardiola has won back to back PL titles in emphatic fashion playing incredible football.
Losing to Norwich is a mere blip on Pep's resume. A drop in the pond.
Come back when Ole has won something other than a Norwegian title and gotten a team relegated from the PL and loses to Norwich. Then you might have a slight resemblance.
It's like a fat bloke who regularly shags 1/10 birds trying to claim his best mate (who looks like Brad Pitt) is on par because he once drunkenly took home a 3/10.
I'm pretty sure none of the 'Ole out' group here are wanting to see the type of football which results in only 6 shots (including a header from a corner and an open goal from a goalkeeper calamity, not utterly ruthless counter attack) but the insinuation was that that it's better than what we are producing.
I don't underestimate what Guardiola has done. Excellent coach and great achivements. I was just making a point and not comparing Solskjaer with Guardiola. You can play better and still lose or draw.
Just for record. Ole have won a title. Even if it is Norwegian league it still is league title. There are not lot of managers in Premier League who can say they have won a league title. Regardless of country.
Cmon mate - argue fair. There wasn't an insinuation from the poster you quoted - there was a statement.
He clearly stated that what he wants is a clear identity from OGS at this point...
You've then tried to move the goalposts and make the conversation about 'shots on target', when that isn't what he's talking about.
If you disagree and think that OGS has built an identifiable style that gets the best out of the players we have - then argue that!
But the constant 're-framing' (moving the goalposts), not just from you specifically, but in general, is really tedious - and beyond that, it's a bad habit to get into in debates or arguments.
Ole should really get us playing like Bournemouth such that we get dominated every week by teams like Southampton and hope to score from a couple of shots and a goalkeeping mistake. That would be fecking amazing every week!
feck me! the state of this Ole hate
feck me! the state of this Ole hate
"Looked a far better unit" is pretty clear what he's getting at.
Then goes onto say (which you conveniently took out to suit your own 'goalposts') "Goal aside, we barely even created - or attempted to create - a thing in that game" A game where we had 21 attempts on goal!
And i'm the one posting 'silly rubbish'
Do you think Southampton played the same against us as they did against Bournemouth? You can't compare how a team like Bournemouth does against Southampton to us because teams play differently against us knowing that if they do come out of their defensive shell they will get torn apart...Just look at the stats
---------------Southampton 1-------------Bournemouth 3
Possession-----------65%---------------------35%
Shots----------------25(6)--------------------6(3)
-------------Southampton 1------------------MUFC 1
Possession---------41%------------------------59%
Shots-------------10(2)----------------------21(8)
What we need to improve on is our finishing. We were great and took our chances in the first game against Chelsea. Since then, we have been dominant in every aspect of the game except the most important part. However, I strongly believe that if we keep playing the way that we are that the results will come. We have been unlucky...
And yet the only likeable part of Mourinho’s (pre-meltdown) tenure was that we did make quite a lot of good comebacks. Away at City was the last and most notable, but it certainly wasn’t the only one.
Let’s hope so. I’m a bit worried that playing for United might drain the character out of them eventually.
If you can't see the progression that's being made, you're not paying attention.
Under LvG on average, we were solid at the back, aimless going forward, lazy out of possession, poor at getting behind teams and poor in front of goal.
Under Mourinho on average, we were solid at the back, direct going forward, lazy out of possession, poor at getting behind teams and poor in front of goal.
Under Ole on average, we're solid at the back, direct going forward, hard working out of possession, poor at getting behind teams and poor in front of goal.
It's baby steps. What we need now is to play better between the lines and in the box. The right training can achieve that. Transfers alone won't achieve it. Ole's doing a good job so far.
Under LvG on average, we were solid at the back, aimless going forward, lazy out of possession, poor at getting behind teams and poor in front of goal.
Under Mourinho on average, we were solid at the back, direct going forward, lazy out of possession, poor at getting behind teams and poor in front of goal.
Under Ole on average, we're solid at the back, direct going forward, hard working out of possession, poor at getting behind teams and poor in front of goal.
It's baby steps. What we need now is to play better between the lines and in the box. The right training can achieve that. Transfers alone won't achieve it. Ole's doing a good job so far.
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Great in 6 years and with two new managers we'll see the final stage.
The last couple of steps are the easiest to solve. They're more about training than innate mentality.Great in 6 years and with two new managers we'll see the final stage.
1 or 2 seasons should do it.
Maybe he wants some propaganda spread on TV.
If we manage to do this on a regular basis - what you want then we'd be in for the title race not just top 4. Remember the last years under SAF? We usually got beaten by top teams however still managed to put away lesser ones on a regular basis and that was enough for us to win the title. Also the gap between top and lesser teams is now getting smaller and smaller.
Please be more realistic.
This is something we simply have to improve at. From what I've seen Ole doesn't prioritize possession football enough.
I personally disagree, however our expectations may differ. I haven't seen enough from our players, board or manager to make me believe this time we are getting it right.
I admire Ole for going down the SAF route but I cant help but think he is overlooking the sheer fact that maybe our youth team aren't going to become world beaters.
Hate to say it but I think Ole is going to damage the club in the long run despite having it's best interests at heart.
Out of curiosity how confident are you that it is going to work under Ole?
Also, how long do you think he should to be given?
That's the thing though. If he is going to promote academy players and buy young, how much damage can he really do? What Jose did, is 10x worse imo, filling the team with old "stars" at huge contracts that has maybe 1 or 2 good years left. What Ole had to do, and has started doing, is stripping the squad to its bones and building it back up again with the right players
Looking at our current squad it is clear that we are in no position what so ever to challenge for the league this year and we need at least two more windows before we can talk about challenging City and Liverpool. Maybe Ole is not the right man for us in the future, but considering the three players he brought in has been our best this season, i think right now hes the right man for the job.
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