Yeah it’s kind of a bummer because I think Mbeumo would work out better for us than Cunha. But I think we need to focus on midfield and GK and some kind of solution that isn’t ultra risky at CF, even if it’s a loan. Player sales won’t yield much this summer, despite popular opinion here.
Optimism for 25/26 season
- Thread starter Pughnichi
- Start date
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Nik (@Rood), Jamie (@Vault Dweller) and Ed (@That'sHernandez) give their end of season awards out! They celebrate the best players, goals and moments of the season (there were some, honestly) and also give out awards for the worst and most disappointing players/moments of the season.
They then discuss all the latest transfer rumours and get into the potential ins and outs this summer at Old Trafford.
Can we start a reasons to be miserable for next season thread for this type of chat please?
That's every other thread on the Utd forum!
Would disagree on both overpays, I think we have to reflect on how awful last season was. Forget Amorim in/out or 343/433, I think it's fair to say the switch in style contributed to almost every player struggling. Hopefully it is worth it long term but I think some fans quite readily forget how that then affects their rating of players. Ugarte I hope makes many on here look a bit stupid, he had no pre season and we were warned he was massively unfit when he came - he's had some great games, some bad games and drifted in and out of form which is somewhat expected especially being in a system that seems to place a huge amount of stress on the CM pair.
Cunha/Mbuemo are about as safe a bet as we can make, if they aren't firing to good level I think Amorim's time will be up because there really won't be any excuses - if you sign 2 guys who are in their pomp and scored/assisted a combined 49 PL goals - more than our entire team managed in a whole season - and they join the list of strugglers it will be curtains. I don't think that will happen though, I think they are two good and we have underperformed so badly the rebound next season I think will be strong if we do add Mbuemo.
I think so far the value of transfer fees looks much more in line with other clubs these days, De Ligt seems good value, Dorgu I think will be seen as a shrewd deal though I suspect eventually he'll end up as LB
I always hear the “hello darkness my old friend” song ringing through my head when reading the average post on here!
Let's not pretend that we lost a lot of points because of Onana. No way. We lost a lot of points simply because our midfield and defense was a complete mess. Simply becsuse Amorim was unable to create any usable tactics to make something out of these players. With a working defence even a mediocre goalkeeper can perform. A good example, a mediocre Victor Valdes of Barcelona won more Zamora Trophy (the award goes to the goalkeeper who has the lowest "goals-to-games" ratio) than Iker Casillas who is considered as the best spanish goalkeeper ever and one of the world's best ever just because Barcelona's defense with Carles Puyol, Marquez and so on was a lot better for years than Real Madrid's.
1. We will have a whole new front 3. Goals was the biggest issue so that should address it at least partially.
2. Hopefully, we will have a new GK. We must have dropped 5-10 points (?) because of Onana.
3. Players understand the system particularly in defense and winning the ball back. Some work needs to be done in attack but a pre-season and new front 3 should help.
4. The pain that we underwent mid season by loaning Rash, Antony hopefully bears fruit (if we are able to sell).
5. New young players emerged during this painful season - Yoro, Amad, Heaven who will help us this season.
6. Club seems to be doing quite well in signing young gems - we signed Heaven, Chido, Kone last season. All 3 are potential 50m+ players. Hopefully, we sign another 3-4 of these in the coming season.
7. Academy continues to produce.
8. We are better at transfers overall - in selling and buying. Albeit not perfect or best in class.
9. We don't seem to be having FFP issues inspite of disastrous league position.
2. Hopefully, we will have a new GK. We must have dropped 5-10 points (?) because of Onana.
3. Players understand the system particularly in defense and winning the ball back. Some work needs to be done in attack but a pre-season and new front 3 should help.
4. The pain that we underwent mid season by loaning Rash, Antony hopefully bears fruit (if we are able to sell).
5. New young players emerged during this painful season - Yoro, Amad, Heaven who will help us this season.
6. Club seems to be doing quite well in signing young gems - we signed Heaven, Chido, Kone last season. All 3 are potential 50m+ players. Hopefully, we sign another 3-4 of these in the coming season.
7. Academy continues to produce.
8. We are better at transfers overall - in selling and buying. Albeit not perfect or best in class.
9. We don't seem to be having FFP issues inspite of disastrous league position.
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I have to say I am really optimistic for next season.
I am confident the club are recognising the issues we have up top and are putting all their efforts in to overcome this with the signings of Cunha and possibly 2 other forward players. Lets be honest, if we had a 20/30 goal striker last season we wouldn't be where we were on the last day of the season - it would have made that much difference!
The only thing I am unsure about is the goalkeeping situation.... I'm still not convinced Onana will leave and we'll bring someone new in.
I am confident the club are recognising the issues we have up top and are putting all their efforts in to overcome this with the signings of Cunha and possibly 2 other forward players. Lets be honest, if we had a 20/30 goal striker last season we wouldn't be where we were on the last day of the season - it would have made that much difference!
The only thing I am unsure about is the goalkeeping situation.... I'm still not convinced Onana will leave and we'll bring someone new in.
Reasons to be cheerful part 1
1. We have made 1 signing so far. Can we afford 2 more?
2. Hopefully.
3. Not sure about that.
4. See 1.
5. Agreed.
6. 50m? That is very optimistic. Looking forward to Leon.
7. No it doesn't, unless you think about Obi and Heaven. Amass and Fredricson are not super talents.
8. Based on what? Who have we sold? Sancho and Rashford might go on another loan.
9. We still don’t have the resources to strengthen CM and WB in my opinion.
I am optimistic and like the direction they are going with the signing/potential signings. Changing the front 3 is a great start.
Question marks still remain in the 2 midfielders and the goalkeeper, but I’m not sure if we have the money to fix this all one season.
Biggest concern is the backline’s inability to stay fit. Dalot never gets injured, but got injured late last season. The most consistent defender was apparently a crock, but fair play to Maz, he managed to stay fit most of the season. The top teams will always have a stable back line, but each week we are just picking on who’s available, despite the large number of defenders we have. If this can be managed, we will look much, much better
Question marks still remain in the 2 midfielders and the goalkeeper, but I’m not sure if we have the money to fix this all one season.
Biggest concern is the backline’s inability to stay fit. Dalot never gets injured, but got injured late last season. The most consistent defender was apparently a crock, but fair play to Maz, he managed to stay fit most of the season. The top teams will always have a stable back line, but each week we are just picking on who’s available, despite the large number of defenders we have. If this can be managed, we will look much, much better
1. I think we can do at least 1 more signing before we need to sell. This is just based on my read of news etc. But I think we will sell at least 100m of players this window. Garnacho (50m), Antony (25-30m), Alvaro sell-on (8m), Elanga sell-on (12m). Maybe some upside to this number from selling any or all of Malacia, Rash, Sancho and Hojlund.
7. Not super talents but squad players.
8. This was more from last year. Greenwood, McT, Kambwala etc. Same INEOS people.
9. Miracle we can sign anyone with no CL, 15th league position and c. 800m of debt.
Onana is pretty terrible but fortunately our defence is decent.
A quick look at the table last year shows we were 11th for goals conceded but 16th for goals scored.
So on that basis you'd argue a CF is more important than a GK. That said, since we're loading up our front line with goal threats like Cunha and (hopefully) Mbuemo then maybe we could save the money for a central midfielder which is arguably the most critical area of the pitch we need to sort.
We're currently looking at fielding a midfield two compromising of one player who has zero ball playing ability (Ugarte) is way past his prime and slow (Casemiro) or has highly questionable tactical discipline and isn't even a centre mid (Bruno)
Well, lets not pretend we didn't lose any points because of Onana, because simply put.. we did.
No... its not all because Amorim was bad... just blame the whole season on Amorim's tactics right? Forgot that we were 12th prior to Amorim... unless you thought he was managing the team then?
All the missed chances was because Amorim was unable to set up defensively?
Amorim got alot of things wrong but you putting the whole season on him is just stupid./
Based on mostly nothing, I think we'll get top 4 
He is undeniably one of the biggest contributors to us dropping points throughout the season though. Consistent, massive basic errors. How can this be argued otherwise?
Not specifically for next season, but just for the future in general we have done a lot of great work in terms of getting our wage structure back under control.
I don't know how reliable Capology is (the numbers seem reasonably accurate vs. reported figures) but according to that site our wage bill for 24/25 was £173m - the lowest since 2020. It peaked at an outrageous £233million in 22/23.
If we get rid of Rashford, Sancho & Antony we'll be looking at the lowest wage bill we've had in about ten years. Casemiro leaving will make a huge impact from 26/27 as well.
The new players we're signing don't seem to be on ridiculous wages (I don't believe the Mbuemo £250k p/w nonsense....) and our best player (Bruno) will also be our highest paid - as it should be.
I don't know how reliable Capology is (the numbers seem reasonably accurate vs. reported figures) but according to that site our wage bill for 24/25 was £173m - the lowest since 2020. It peaked at an outrageous £233million in 22/23.
If we get rid of Rashford, Sancho & Antony we'll be looking at the lowest wage bill we've had in about ten years. Casemiro leaving will make a huge impact from 26/27 as well.
The new players we're signing don't seem to be on ridiculous wages (I don't believe the Mbuemo £250k p/w nonsense....) and our best player (Bruno) will also be our highest paid - as it should be.
It's not just the errors Onana makes, he almost certainly has a substantial impact on the performance levels of our defenders. They must be so hesitant and anxious in their own decision making, we only have to observe the calamities of our trying to defend a corner. It's humiliating at times, also he invariably pushes a shot back into play, very rarely does he put it wide, so our defenders can never entertain the thought "that's the goalies ball..." which again creates more uncertainty. The defenders must be mentally exhausted.
When do we open the 'Are the lad back in training yet' thread?
Give us a week
A core of Gyorkes, Cunha, Bruno, Ugarte, De Ligt, Yoro is very strong in fairness.
The big ifs are if Mainoo can push on after a disappointing second season, and if Amad can nail down a singular position.
The big ifs are if Mainoo can push on after a disappointing second season, and if Amad can nail down a singular position.
It’s early doors, but we have only signed one player so far.
No news on how negotiation's for Mbeumo are going and the transfer window closes tomorrow at 7pm, so we could run out of time on that deal for now.
Everything else with regards to signings is just the usual linking and speculation, which, true to form, is starting to take on a life of its own (in fantasy land).
Apart from only signing one player, we have sold none and the only departures have been the 3 senior players who were released.
Nothings going to happen now for a least a week.
.
No news on how negotiation's for Mbeumo are going and the transfer window closes tomorrow at 7pm, so we could run out of time on that deal for now.
Everything else with regards to signings is just the usual linking and speculation, which, true to form, is starting to take on a life of its own (in fantasy land).
Apart from only signing one player, we have sold none and the only departures have been the 3 senior players who were released.
Nothings going to happen now for a least a week.
.
I’m a little worried that we’ll be going into next season, if the reports are true, without getting a RWB.i know that many are saying that Amad will play there, but that would mean two inverted ‘wingers” Mbueno as a 10 and Amad as the RWB. Where’s the width coming from?
Dalot is not a RWB nor a LWB, same with Maz. It’s such a critical position in this formation. Keeping Dalot for cover is okay, but why not try to sell him and bring on a true RWB. Amad can play there occasionally and play the 10 as well.
I think next season will be another transition year and we’ll get 7th or so.
Dalot is not a RWB nor a LWB, same with Maz. It’s such a critical position in this formation. Keeping Dalot for cover is okay, but why not try to sell him and bring on a true RWB. Amad can play there occasionally and play the 10 as well.
I think next season will be another transition year and we’ll get 7th or so.
Unless we address the CM and RWB I feel like we are in for some underwhelming performances again.
CM is where the game is controlled and won or lost. It's our worst area on the pitch.
Sort that out and the excuses start to get less and less
CM is where the game is controlled and won or lost. It's our worst area on the pitch.
Sort that out and the excuses start to get less and less
You can sort out the CM as much as you want but if you dont have forwards who can't score... it doesn't matter how good your midfield is.
If your keeper can't stop basic crosses and shots.. not keep giving away throw ins when he kicks it long... it doesn't matter how good the midfield is.
The GK and ST are bigger issues imo.
This goes both ways. If the midfield isn’t progressing the ball, helping us sustain attacks then the front line will still struggle no matter who’s playing there.
I agree with this. Yes, the results may not be big and the games would be painful, but without a midfield and with a good strike + keeper, you can definitely get into the top 4.
Who are all these people who see this thread title and think a good use of their time is to come and piss in everyone's cheerios. Literally every other thread in the forum is for that, can't you give it a rest?
I'm naturally optimistic and always feel excited for every new season. Can't help it. Also don't see why anyone bothers following football if they don't feel that way, but that's just my opinion.
If I was to pick a small area where I think low expectations will be exceeded I might look at Dorgu. Personally during the season I thought he didn't do very well, which wasn't a surprise - he was very obviously an emergency, 'best we can do while broke' January signing.
Watching back, though, he offered good examples of being able to do everything we need from that position. A catalogue of great crosses, especially low whipped and cut-backs, the two which Amorim likes his WBs to produce (and which Gyokeres will most want to receive, if we sign him). Beating his man. Sharp passing around the corner. Pace. Power. Tough tackling. Defensive grit.
His issue was consistency. He also provided plenty of examples of fluffing all of the above. But inconsistency is what you expect from a 20-year old who's played two senior seasons ever (for a minor Serie A team). He'll still be inconsistent next season, but I expect much less so. And, as with a few of our players, if we can just put together some vaguely coherent Amorim-ball, I think he might end up being one of the pleasant surprises of the season.
I'm naturally optimistic and always feel excited for every new season. Can't help it. Also don't see why anyone bothers following football if they don't feel that way, but that's just my opinion.
If I was to pick a small area where I think low expectations will be exceeded I might look at Dorgu. Personally during the season I thought he didn't do very well, which wasn't a surprise - he was very obviously an emergency, 'best we can do while broke' January signing.
Watching back, though, he offered good examples of being able to do everything we need from that position. A catalogue of great crosses, especially low whipped and cut-backs, the two which Amorim likes his WBs to produce (and which Gyokeres will most want to receive, if we sign him). Beating his man. Sharp passing around the corner. Pace. Power. Tough tackling. Defensive grit.
His issue was consistency. He also provided plenty of examples of fluffing all of the above. But inconsistency is what you expect from a 20-year old who's played two senior seasons ever (for a minor Serie A team). He'll still be inconsistent next season, but I expect much less so. And, as with a few of our players, if we can just put together some vaguely coherent Amorim-ball, I think he might end up being one of the pleasant surprises of the season.
Capology is nicknamed Crapology because of how inaccurate it is for Premier League wages.
If you look at the Uefa European club finance and investment landscape reports it has 23/24 wages as follows,
City £389m
Liverpool £321m
Chelsea £320m
Us £291m
Arsenal £276m
Spurs £184m
The midfield couldn’t progress the ball because the forwards didn’t want it.
Everytime it got played forward to Hojlund/Garnacho they’d lose it. Then the pressure just comes back on.
I agree that we don’t really have a suitable partner for Bruno in CM, but the forward line was a way bigger issue imo.
It was interesting watching him in Europe where the opposing clubs could not handle his pace and power. Some of them just gave up in the end chasing him.
Not really, we play 2 CM's. We can easily bypass the midfield and go to the forwards or wing backs.
Also... Bruno in CM means there is no way we can say front players wont be getting the ball. We will struggle controlling games but lets not act as if we are that bad in comparison to Gk and ST
Why would we employ Amorim to then go and play hoof ball? The double pivot he plays is pretty important to the system.
We’ve seen Amorim is not changing his playing style so to just move anyway from progressing the ball through the midfield and completing bypassing it would be an odd one.
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Who said anything about hoof ball? Do you think there is only 2 ways of playing? Either go via CM's or hoof it and hope for forwards to chase?
On numerous occasions at the end of the season, we went long passes from Maguire or CB's to wing backs.
When you play Bruno in midfield, do you think he cannot progress the ball?
We could have Caceido and Macalister in our CM right now and it would make no difference... because when they pass the ball to Hojlund or Garnacho... the ball usually comes back.
Then when the ball comes back and we have Onana in goal.. players shoot from anywhere knowing he is a poor shot stoper.
Quietly confident we'll stay up
I love to be optimistic, here a few reasons, even if they’ve been repeated
1 - The recognition of the poor (or perhaps inadequate/incompetant) attitude and skill among certain players and staff. Nothing drags any organisation down like this, it’s not pretty to clean up but hopefully they’re on the right pathway.
2 - Goal threat presumably improving. Proof will be in the pudding but to see a clear focus in recruitment on this is good. So painful to see us so toothless this year, it’s amazing what difference a player or two in that regards makes.
3 - I really want and hope the players who get constantly hammered to turn it around, mainly Hojland and Mount. They seem to always give 100% and I appreciate that, particularly with the above in mind, regardless of their actual output….that being said, their output has to improve a lot.
4 - Call it blind optimism but I reckon we’ll be back in the mix, no other reason than that.
Plenty of reasons and places to be negative, happy to be optimistic here
1 - The recognition of the poor (or perhaps inadequate/incompetant) attitude and skill among certain players and staff. Nothing drags any organisation down like this, it’s not pretty to clean up but hopefully they’re on the right pathway.
2 - Goal threat presumably improving. Proof will be in the pudding but to see a clear focus in recruitment on this is good. So painful to see us so toothless this year, it’s amazing what difference a player or two in that regards makes.
3 - I really want and hope the players who get constantly hammered to turn it around, mainly Hojland and Mount. They seem to always give 100% and I appreciate that, particularly with the above in mind, regardless of their actual output….that being said, their output has to improve a lot.
4 - Call it blind optimism but I reckon we’ll be back in the mix, no other reason than that.
Plenty of reasons and places to be negative, happy to be optimistic here
My optimism is that if it’s any worse we will be relegated which I can’t see happening and the transfer targets look promising so far.
We lose game after game due to being outworked and outplayed through midfield - its a vital area of the pitch, and it's a disaster area for us and has been for years.
Due to having an inept midfield - we are piling more pressure on the CB's and the forwards. You could literally play any striker in the world in our current team and they would all struggle with the service being supplied to them by our midfield.
Games are won and lost in the midfield. Our midfield is shockingly bad and needs sorting if we are going to have a better season than last
Not really.. its been a while since we have been outworked and outplayed through midfield. This was under Ten Hag.
No.. if we had Isaak in this team, we would score loads more goals.. because this team is not reliant on midfield as much, we have wing backs and 10's who should be creating not the CM.
Is that why Bruno is one of the best creators in the team and we are one of the worst teams in terms of missing big chances? or performing much lower than our xG?