Our squad is NOT sh*t

[POF]

The squad is definitely better than it looked at the end under Jose but I think the euphoria needs to die down before getting too carried away.

Rashford, Martial and Pogba have been outstanding over the last 3 games (2 for Martial) but they are young players and inconsistency is to be expected. If Solskjaer can get Sanchez and Lukaku firing too then that really will be a top class attack with lots of options and depth.

I don't think it's any secret that the squad is badly in need of a defensive leader and has been since Vidic left. It beggars belief that the club signed 2 centre backs who are as poor in the air as Lindelof and Bailly. Leaving yourself that vulnerable from set pieces is a huge disadvantage.

Whoever is managing the squad at United isn't doing a good job. I can see why Jose would have been frustrated by that.

Michael Keane isn't a superstar but if he was still at the club, he would play every week. He's very good in the air and able to play out from the back. That decision to sell him will cost the club £50m. Then you see how many players are in the last 18 months of their contracts and the incompetence is quite alarming.

I do think that frustration spilled over into Jose's public criticisms of the squad and also was behind some of the bizarre defensive selections.

In the same way that the players under performed due to frustrations with Jose's management, I think Jose had frustrations with his bosses that he didn't deal with well that led to underperformance on his end.

 

[iluvoursolskjær]

And yet every other supporter on here of other clubs saw how good your players are. Is your defence as bad as the stats say? Individually, are they that bad? or have they played in a system which invites pressure on them?

I think you have a squad of great players, get rid of Fellaini, he just represents negativity, across all factors when he plays. If he is not there to disrupt the opposition, he is there to nick a goal from a long ball, or to play defensively, but not in a clever controlled way, just in a break things up until final whistle kind of way.

Ashley Young, he has been a great servant for you, but you can do so much better with proper fullbacks. Ashley Young has been a great servant for both united and england, but he is very limited.

Other than those, I dont see a problem with the squad you have. Yeah sure, add an established centre back in there and a proven goalscorer and for me your troubles are sorted.

The problem never were the players. It was the manager, and his negative style of how football should be played.

+1

 

[snk123]

What is the fixation on mediocre players? You don't have to have 11 top players on the field to play well and win things. Why can't people understand this when we've literally won titles playing OShea, Wes Brown, Evans etc.

Players like Park Ji Sung, Fletcher, Neville, Heinze, Alan Smith were never the most gifted either. It's all about players giving their all, the world class ones making a difference at vital moments and everyone contributing all over the pitch throughout the season.

Look at half the Liverpool squad, it's average af. There are literally so many examples but there is some weird fetish to have 11 top players starting every game on here.

 

[Lentwood]

I would be wary of getting too carried away until we have played a few better sides

We all know we are weak defensively, that showed even against Bournemouth, Cardiff and Huddersfield

 

[LoveFootball]

We lost stupid points against clubs which we should have won (BHA, Palace, etc.,).Had we managed,say 10 points out of those games, which I don't think is unrealistic, we would have been challenging.

It was the same last season, We dropped at least 10-12 points (Newcastle, WBA, BHA,Huddersfield, Stoke etc.,) which the squad is capable of getting,with a right manager. It may not have mattered in the end, but that has been the case. We were rightly the second best team last year, but the margin should have been nowhere near that big.

People tend to forget that if it wasn't for magic Pep' City last season, we'd had won the league easily with this same squad bar Fred and Dalot and with less confident Martial and Pogba. Even this season we lost unnecessary points against the teams you quoted there and even we shouldn't have lost that Tottenham game with a better manager in charge.

This team is good enouth to challenge for the tittle and given time Ole will prove it. It takes time to build a settled defense and right now Ole is rotating defenders to find the best partener to Lindelof. Attack and midfield are functionning well already and on part with any other team. And the idea that without Pogba we'll struggle is not 100% true, because we won games without him in the team under the previous manager.

 

[Yakuza_devils]

Under LVG and Jose, we were so predictable and boring where majority of the match we were making side way and backward passes. It took eternity for us to bring the ball from the back to attacking position. We were so easy to play against and really looked very bad as a team.

Make no mistake, if you force Barca or Real to play LVG or Jose system the team will also look as bad as us. And soon enough most of the players will lose all the confidence and the team will suffer.

The squad was never so bad that we have countless 0 or 1 shot on target for the whole fecking match. This was the norm under LVG and Jose. There was no creativity, no risks and no desires. LVG and Jose really killed all the fun of watching football. How can Man Utd fans allowed that to happen for so long. Barca or Real fans will never allowed that.

With the right manager, we are 2-3 big signing away from challenging the EPL and CL.

 

[NLunited]

You don't need eleven world class players on the field to compete for the title. We have enough top players to make the difference and loads of very good squad players.

Lay off Herrera, Lingard and Fellaini please they give their all when they play which is what counts most. You might not like Fellaini but he brings qualities we don't currently have to the squad. He can break up play and bully the opponent offensively and defensively.

 

[BigChap74]

It's not a terrible squad but there are some very average players around.

Our defense is average but it's more the morale which has suffered over the last couple of years, with Jose gone I think we'll actually get to see how good the squad actually is.

 

[Bobski]

Michael Keane isn't a superstar but if he was still at the club, he would play every week. He's very good in the air and able to play out from the back. That decision to sell him will cost the club £50m. Then you see how many players are in the last 18 months of their contracts and the incompetence is quite alarming.

Keane is a slightly above average CB in the Pl, nothing more. He is not better than what we have, a few weeks of him starting for Utd and undergoing the level of scrutiny that would bring would soon expose him.

 

[ForestRGoinUp]

You don't need eleven world class players on the field to compete for the title. We have enough top players to make the difference and loads of very good squad players.

Lay off Herrera, Lingard and Fellaini please they give their all when they play which is what counts most. You might not like Fellaini but he brings qualities we don't currently have to the squad. He can break up play and bully the opponent offensively and defensively.

Fellaini could play for Hull City with those qualities and no one would think otherwise.

 

[Oneunited26]

Some are going on and on about wait until we play someone half decent, can people just enjoy we getting a philosophy together, skinning these terrible sides apart. We are rebuilding this club, let alone the team. We know we need a CB, CDM, maybe a CM and a top class right winger, but look what we have DDG, Shaw, pogba, martial, rashford, good players in lindelof, Herrera, some how matic is looking better. But we have the foundations, we rebuilding so I don’t care about playing half decent sides, we got the players to destroy these average teams. Hopefully in the next 3 to 5 years we will rebuild a squad that will be feared. But now we no longer a club tainted by mourinho’s toxic personality, and players will want to come here. Good times ahead, now the club get what we need to be. Championship and division 2 sides were outplaying us at old Trafford, now we are playing has a top club, Paul Mersons latest comments defending mourinho shows the ABU show their true colours again

 

[Keefy18]

You need to look beyond the goals against column which only tells part of the story. We were/are conceding more shots and more shots on target than the rest of the top 4, last season we were getting lucky/De Gea was performing heroics, this season it's caught up with us. See Burnley for the same effect, conceded 39 last season, 41 already this.

You can place the blame of that FIRMLY at the door of Jose! Just as an example,

Lets take Ole's opening trio of games shall we?

So far our defence (and De Gea) under Ole has faced:

Total shots - 26
Shots on Target - 8

vs

Jose last 3 wins in the league (Fulham, Bournemouth & Everton) - Why his last 3 wins in the league? Well I'm trying to be as fair as possible here and pick games where we arguably performed well and it puts the argument in your favor in that apparently our defence is simply awful and not good enough.

Total shots - 42
Shots on Target - 17

It very, very much was a case of it being a systemic issue. Granted its a small sample size but I'd be fairly confident that what ever sample of games you took you'd see a similar story throughout Jose's reign of terror at United.

Jose sat his team far too deep and opted continually for 2 outright DMF's and sat his wingers only a short distance in front of his fullbacks. We rarely if ever at all pressed teams to win back possession high up the field and continually slated all our creative players publicly and routinely dropped many of them for actually performing well. See Martial, Rashford and Pogba as the prime examples... all this in turn invited pressure on our back line continually.

 

[Leftback99]

You can place the blame of that FIRMLY at the door of Jose! Just as an example,

Lets take Ole's opening trio of games shall we?

So far our defence (and De Gea) under Ole has faced:

Total shots - 26
Shots on Target - 8

vs

Jose last 3 wins in the league (Fulham, Bournemouth & Everton) - Why his last 3 wins in the league? Well I'm trying to be as fair as possible here and pick games where we arguably performed well and it puts the argument in your favor in that apparently our defence is simply awful and not good enough.

Total shots - 42
Shots on Target - 17

It very, very much was a case of it being a systemic issue. Granted its a small sample size but I'd be fairly confident that what ever sample of games you took you'd see a similar story throughout Jose's reign of terror at United.

Jose sat his team far too deep and opted continually for 2 outright DMF's and sat his wingers only a short distance in front of his fullbacks. We rarely if ever at all pressed teams to win back possession high up the field and continually slated all our creative players publicly and routinely dropped many of them for actually performing well. See Martial, Rashford and Pogba as the prime examples... all this in turn invited pressure on our back line continually.

I responded to a post questioning why the defence hadn't performed the same as last season (for goals conceded). Tactics hadn't changed.

Regardless of any statistics from 3 of the easiest fixtures in the season it's clear there is room for significant upgrade in our defence compared to the midfield and attack. We need to stop trying to convince ourselves that the likes of Rojo, Bailly, Jones and Lindelof are good enough. Right back is an issue for us and after we have resolved those (CB and RB) there are better left backs than Shaw around really.

 

[Janson]

The squad is definitely better than it looked at the end under Jose but I think the euphoria needs to die down before getting too carried away.

Rashford, Martial and Pogba have been outstanding over the last 3 games (2 for Martial) but they are young players and inconsistency is to be expected. If Solskjaer can get Sanchez and Lukaku firing too then that really will be a top class attack with lots of options and depth.

I don't think it's any secret that the squad is badly in need of a defensive leader and has been since Vidic left. It beggars belief that the club signed 2 centre backs who are as poor in the air as Lindelof and Bailly. Leaving yourself that vulnerable from set pieces is a huge disadvantage.

Whoever is managing the squad at United isn't doing a good job. I can see why Jose would have been frustrated by that.

Michael Keane isn't a superstar but if he was still at the club, he would play every week. He's very good in the air and able to play out from the back. That decision to sell him will cost the club £50m. Then you see how many players are in the last 18 months of their contracts and the incompetence is quite alarming.

I do think that frustration spilled over into Jose's public criticisms of the squad and also was behind some of the bizarre defensive selections.

In the same way that the players under performed due to frustrations with Jose's management, I think Jose had frustrations with his bosses that he didn't deal with well that led to underperformance on his end.

Definitely this. We need a bigger sample size to see where we really are.

 

[Keefy18]

I responded to a post questioning why the defence hadn't performed the same as last season (for goals conceded). Tactics hadn't changed.

Regardless of any statistics from 3 of the easiest fixtures in the season it's clear there is room for significant upgrade in our defence compared to the midfield and attack. We need to stop trying to convince ourselves that the likes of Rojo, Bailly, Jones and Lindelof are good enough. Right back is an issue for us and after we have resolved those (CB and RB) there are better left backs than Shaw around really.

That's fair enough. It's clear to see Jose's ideas simply weren't working though.

The sample is indeed a small one to judge of course but I felt it a reasonably fair comparison considering one of the teams was included for both managers (Bournemouth). Fulham are equally as bad if not worse than Cardiff. Huddersfield and Everton are on different levels of course.

I do agree we need a quality CB, but who I'm not sure. Possibly Koulibaly from Napoli according to the reports. I've not seen much of him myself at all if I'm honest.

RB is a tricky one in that I think Dalot has a bright future but he's a long way's off being at the level we need him to be as he is still defensively naive. Young is at the back end of his career so we could do with either shifting him on and getting in a player in their mid twenties and hitting their peak years ideally.

 

[Greck]

Yeah I don't get the "wait till we play a better team". What's that supposed to prove? That 3 weeks of attacking coaching can't beat 3 years of same? Losing a big game isn't all of a sudden going to demonstrate that the squad is shite. We don't think we're PL/CL contenders. What we do know is we are a solid top 4 team at worst

 

[Schmeichel's Cartwheel]

Our Attackers, Midfielders, and Goalkeepers are not shit.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

Defence is weak.

 

[Random Task]

Defence is weak.

You're not wrong there.

There is a question mark looming every single member of the backline from the first team players through to the squad players. One way or another, this issue needs addressing over the summer. Clear out the shockingly large number of deadwood currently stealing a living and replace them with United standard players.

This management stuff is easy.

 

[Member 115509]

Sort out the back four and get another CDM in and things will be looking good. Easier said than done, but the potential is there to build an impressive squad if these positions can be ironed out.
At the moment, attack is the best form of defence, but when United come up against PSG and other top teams in the EPL in the remainder of the season, the defending could be a real issue.

 

[The United]

I think the squads at this level are more or less similar.

But, people tend to overrate or underrate own squad or others. The class of squad goes up when they are winning a lot due to good management or goes down due to bad management.

If you need more proof of it, just look at how our squad is playing now and has been since SAF last season to now.

The point is it is entirely on how you manage them at this level.

 

[glazed]

True. You only have to think back to the Beckenbauer-like Wes Morgan.
Or his partner in crime, the 53 year old Robert Huth.

Ahem. Yes well you can prove anything with facts, obviously

 

[Oneunited26]

I think the squads at this level are more or less similar.

But, people tend to overrate or underrate own squad or others. The class of squad goes up when they are winning a lot due to good management or goes down due to bad management.

If you need more proof of it, just look at how our squad is playing now and has been since SAF last season to now.

The point is it is entirely on how you manage them at this level.

You hit the nail on the head

before people say oh wait until we play someone decent, we rebuilding, we are a runner trying to become a marathon player again, so people need to calm down and enjoy a management team who gets this club, who understands people died for this football club and we playing how a big club should play.

We have foundations, DDG, delot, lindelof, shaw, pogba, martial, rashford, you look at good players like sanchez, lingard, perrera, herrera, even matic and lukaku shocked I even said that, we have bailly, we have exciting youth coming through, the club who is finally draining the swamp and putting a vision in place.

So its all about common sense tactics, play shaw, pogba, herrera, martial, rashford to their strengths we will do damage. If we have herrera, pogba, lingard, rashford, martial pressing and attacking, with matic holding, allowing shaw to bomb forward, we will be a threat because these are very good players. Not many sides will get the better of matic, pogba, herrera, lingard and martial in midfield

 

[Chris M]

You hit the nail on the head

before people say oh wait until we play someone decent, we rebuilding, we are a runner trying to become a marathon player again, so people need to calm down and enjoy a management team who gets this club, who understands people died for this football club and we playing how a big club should play.

We have foundations, DDG, delot, lindelof, shaw, pogba, martial, rashford, you look at good players like sanchez, lingard, perrera, herrera, even matic and lukaku shocked I even said that, we have bailly, we have exciting youth coming through, the club who is finally draining the swamp and putting a vision in place.
So its all about common sense tactics, play shaw, pogba, herrera, martial, rashford to their strengths we will do damage. If we have herrera, pogba, lingard, rashford, martial pressing and attacking, with matic holding, allowing shaw to bomb forward, we will be a threat because these are very good players. Not many sides will get the better of matic, pogba, herrera, lingard and martial in midfield

Very true, look at the reaction to the result away to Cardiff City, 'Its only Cardiff City' its a better result than most of our competitors managed to achieve with the exception of City.
We have a capable squad who are now playing with confidence after having it repeatedly undermined by Mourinho. I was a Mourinho backer till the pre season dummy spits.

Cardiff 0 Spurs 3
Cardiff 2 Arsenal 3
Cardiff 0 Man City 5
Liverpool 4 Cardiff 1
Chelsea 4 Cardiff 1

 

[Don Alfredo]

I think Utd‘s squad has some players with genuine world class talent (Pogba, Martial), but contrary to popular belief it is not the one special player who makes all the difference, but the general level of the starting XI. Madrid only started to dominate the international scene when they added a great midfield and great defence to their massively talented attackers, similar could have been said about Bayern under Heynckes. Dante, Martinez and Mandzukic were the signings in the summer before they won the treble and those are no shiny names, but they would have never had the same success without them.

PSG signed the two most sought-after players in one summer but still looked way off from winning the CL because of glaring holes in midfield and defence in terms of quality (and tactics of course).

Basically you don‘t need to sign that one special player, you need multiple transfer windows of excellent tranfer business coupled with the right tactics and a clear vision.

 

[Oneunited26]

Very true, look at the reaction to the result away to Cardiff City, 'Its only Cardiff City' its a better result than most of our competitors managed to achieve with the exception of City.
We have a capable squad who are now playing with confidence after having it repeatedly undermined by Mourinho. I was a Mourinho backer till the pre season dummy spits.

Cardiff 0 Spurs 3
Cardiff 2 Arsenal 3
Cardiff 0 Man City 5
Liverpool 4 Cardiff 1
Chelsea 4 Cardiff 1

Ole is getting us back where we should be, back to that kind of level the squad is at, the next step in the next few years to come, is to break the ceiling and take us higher. Now a midfield how we set up of matic, herrera, pogba, lingard and martial, do not see many sides getting the better of that five. One game which showed what the damage this side can do, city 2, 3 united, we had matic, herrera, pogba, lingard and sanchez, so when anyone says wait until we play someone decent, well last season we were right at the top of points taken of all the top sides so they have done it they just need to be given a direction, now with the virus removed and the players unleashed they can do it.

The ABU always move the goal posts to suit their narrative, city, liverpool, spurs, chelsea and arsenal beat fodder we get hype from them they can win everything, we do it, its only Cardiff. The ABU are dying for another club to do what united have done for decades, its why they don't get the enthusiastic praise from the ABU media when we skin a cat 4 or 5-0, because they do not like it, its why Pogba is targeted for his dances, yet other rival players do it, its the ronaldo, beckham treatment all over again

 

[sosolid4u09]

Ability wise they may not be shite but mentality wise they sure are. Mourinho was stifling for sure but they downed tools bigtime. Some of the squad is spineless and gutless. This will come to the fore again soon.

Solskjaer coming in has obviously given everyone a boost. But as soon as adversity hits, parts of the squad will bottle it again

Lvg and jose are two excellent managers. They werent quite suited to our club but the players did them no favours. Embarrassing at times.

I'm as pleased as everyone that jose is gone but let's not let the players off the hook completely

 

[sosolid4u09]

Very true, look at the reaction to the result away to Cardiff City, 'Its only Cardiff City' its a better result than most of our competitors managed to achieve with the exception of City.
We have a capable squad who are now playing with confidence after having it repeatedly undermined by Mourinho. I was a Mourinho backer till the pre season dummy spits.

Cardiff 0 Spurs 3
Cardiff 2 Arsenal 3
Cardiff 0 Man City 5
Liverpool 4 Cardiff 1
Chelsea 4 Cardiff 1

So basically, all of our rivals battered them.

 

[StrettyEnder07]

The squad could do with a few tweaks here and there but I don't think it needs a major overhaul. Get rid of a few of the deadwood (Valencia, Rojo, Jones, Smalling, Fellani etc.) two top CB's and we are not far away at all. If Sanchez and Lukaku can find their form under Ole then we are looking good up top, I would go buy a top class RW as I think we are lacking on that side a bit but we have a nucleolus of a very strong squad, with a lot of quality kids coming through.

Henderson
Tuanzebe
Fosu-Mensah
Williams
Pereira
Chong
Gomes
Greenwood

To name a few, we have been in far worse positions. Couple of top additions and we are not far away at all.

 

[RedStarUnited]

Ability wise they may not be shite but mentality wise they sure are. Mourinho was stifling for sure but they downed tools bigtime. Some of the squad is spineless and gutless. This will come to the fore again soon.

Solskjaer coming in has obviously given everyone a boost. But as soon as adversity hits, parts of the squad will bottle it again

Lvg and jose are two excellent managers. They werent quite suited to our club but the players did them no favours. Embarrassing at times.

I'm as pleased as everyone that jose is gone but let's not let the players off the hook completely

Whos job do you think it is to help them with this? How do people even judge a player being gutless vs a player being instructed negatively?

A team containing Messi, Iniesta, Xavi, Henry and Etoo etc finished 10 points (3rd) behind Villareal in La Liga 07/08. And they went on to become unplayable under Pep. People underestimate how much the right manager can squeeze out of a group of players.

 

[dutchred]

The squad could do with a few tweaks here and there but I don't think it needs a major overhaul. Get rid of a few of the deadwood (Valencia, Rojo, Jones, Smalling, Fellani etc.) two top CB's and we are not far away at all. If Sanchez and Lukaku can find their form under Ole then we are looking good up top, I would go buy a top class RW as I think we are lacking on that side a bit but we have a nucleolus of a very strong squad, with a lot of quality kids coming through.

Henderson
Tuanzebe
Fosu-Mensah
Williams
Pereira
Chong
Gomes
Greenwood

To name a few, we have been in far worse positions. Couple of top additions and we are not far away at all.

you fprgeot 2 of the best
Laird and Garner
Dont think Fosu Mensah will make it here

 

[MikeUpNorth]

We have decent quality but I think there are huge questions marks about the mentality of many of our players when the going gets tough. We’ll only find out more when we suffer a bad defeat and see their reaction.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

You're not wrong there.

There is a question mark looming every single member of the backline from the first team players through to the squad players. One way or another, this issue needs addressing over the summer. Clear out the shockingly large number of deadwood currently stealing a living and replace them with United standard players.

This management stuff is easy.

We've suffered from changing managers so often. Every time the weaker players get yet another chance!

 

[Smores]

So basically, all of our rivals battered them.

Yeah it's really not the best example, even Watford and West Ham put 3 past them.

 

[JMack1234]

Anybody who thought our squad was sh*t is a total melt.

Under the Mourinho our squad looked a total basket case because we had a manager who wanted to play defensive football and a squad that was weak in defence. Now under Ole we look like a good side that's short of a CB, RW and a more dynamic DM.

 

[Janson]

Anybody who thought our squad was sh*t is a total melt.

Under the Mourinho our squad looked a total basket case because we had a manager who wanted to play defensive football and a squad that was weak in defence. Now under Ole we look like a good side that's short of a CB, RW and a more dynamic DM.

We should give it some more time though. We're obviously not shit but I don't think this squad is capable of any better than fighting for top 4.

 

[Janson]

We've suffered from changing managers so often. Every time the weaker players get yet another chance!

Chelsea were constantly changing managers, it didn't seem to hurt them.

 

[Bobski]

Somewhat ridiculous how appalling we were going forward pre Ole with the options this squad has in attack.

 

[iluvoursolskjær]

Somewhat ridiculous how appalling we were going forward pre Ole with the options this squad has in attack.

Innit!

Our depth in attack is fantastic, we had Marti-Rashford-Mata starting tonight with Lukaku and Alexis coming off the bench. Not many teams enjoy those riches.

 

[Chris M]

Yeah it's really not the best example, even Watford and West Ham put 3 past them.

If we scraped a 1 nil win, then you would have a point, the point was we are not that much different than our close rivals