Exactly. It's not like he has anything left to prove nor achieve in football.
Ousmane Dembele
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
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I agree, Fred is a level above McTominay at the moment. The latter has looked awful since the restart, I'm confident he can be a good rotational player going forward though.
Fred before the Covid break was playing well. Would be good if we could get into some routine of Matic starting games and being subbed for Fred when he tires, rarely seems to pan out that way when we do start with Matic recently though.
Yeah... and that wasn't his only season like that. His first season was as bad. The lad has missed 80 games over 3 seasons at Barca with injury.
Averaging 27 games missed per season...and that in the ages 20-23. Imagine how bad that could get with age.
On top of that he has been largely shit for Barca when fit and has been mostly restricted to the bench. Yet people want to spend 70m (and in this depressed transfer climate) for him. Because he looked great for BVB 4 years ago.
That would be bailing Barca out of their mistake big time.
Was it a long time ago when they were in monaco etc?
It's so balanced with the right footed players, left footed players the supportive forward ability of Martial - I'd like to see it given another chance
Well no shit Sherlock. But what we are doing with Sancho is a long term investment. That makes more sense. You don’t spend so much on a stop gap solution which isn’t even guaranteed to work. His fitness levels must be shot and he has his own injury problems. You wanna pay a guy 300k for him to miss half the season? That’s Sanchez all over again. We are trying to move away from that. If we get him on a loan with no wages or fees paid then that’s a different story.
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Dembele played for Rennes
Yeah I'm talking about when Mbappe was in Monaco etc was that when they last played together?
I cant have imagined them doing much together then but Martial is a season & Dembele is a good club transfer away from making that France front 3 happening away imo.
Why are we always linked to injury prone players? Bale, now Dembele...
Christ, he could compete with Phil Jones. Why did Barca even sign him?! Their transfer record with galacticos has been outright horrible. At least Real Madrid knows how to get that right. Dembele, Coutinho, Griezmann.Only loan with option. Which Barca would never go for probably.
Too injury prone for straight transfer risk. This is his last season...
What about our physio and injury management makes people think we’d be a great fit for an injury hit player?
Yeah that is a very valid point but Jones & Tuanzebe apart recently I do think we are steadily improving in that area
Dembele is still very young, but older. If he matures, gets support and the proper training regime, he might well be one of the best options around again.
Would take him on loan only.
if Sancho doesn’t work out.
if Sancho doesn’t work out.
Any club would be happy to sell a player who has been injured so often but how could he be nothing but a liability when he won games on his own when Messi and co were toiling.
Spoken like someone who did not watch Dembélé much but when he is fully fit he starts and he is the only player so far that Messi vacates the right for. This player if he can be nursed back to fitness can be devastating but not for us though, rather he went back home to France maybe to Lyon or Marseille.
The reason why I'm happy with players like Dembele and brooks is because long term I'd love -
LW - Rashford, Sancho, Martial
CF - Martial, Greenwood, Rashford
RW - Dembele or Brooks, Sancho, Greenwood
Im not talking about the starting ability of each player (brooks wouldnt be starting over Sancho or Greenwood) but more the position they can cover. I feel like that's the type of depth in quality we should and can have.
5 top quality players (Dembele OR brooks) playing for 3 position also capable players at CAM.
Maybe its unrealistic - but if Barcelona and City can do such things I dont see why we need to be so 'nice' in the transfer window.
LW - Rashford, Sancho, Martial
CF - Martial, Greenwood, Rashford
RW - Dembele or Brooks, Sancho, Greenwood
Im not talking about the starting ability of each player (brooks wouldnt be starting over Sancho or Greenwood) but more the position they can cover. I feel like that's the type of depth in quality we should and can have.
5 top quality players (Dembele OR brooks) playing for 3 position also capable players at CAM.
Maybe its unrealistic - but if Barcelona and City can do such things I dont see why we need to be so 'nice' in the transfer window.
Gab Marcotti was talking about this the other day and Dembele looks like a complete non starter. I must admit I am not an expert on football finances but the position is that Barcelona are up to their eyes in debt and a lot of that is secured by the valuations of the playing squad which reduce as each year of their contract ticks off. Dembele going out on loan doesn't really do enough to help them financially and they would certainly not be willing to subsidise his enormous wages and it seems his current value on paper is north of 80 million Euro and due to the way their finances are structured they cannot sell him for less. If it comes to it I would rather find the other 40m Euro for Sancho than gamble so much money on a player who seems to have no real love of the game.
It was when Mbappe had his first stellar season. I think of Dembele gets over his injury bad luck. It will inevitable happen again
Isn't it the case though that if he was loaned to a big coin they'd comfortable afford his wages? It's not like they are way crazy.
I'd have fits if I thought we were going to spend that much on him. With his injury and disciplinary records, it would be a huge gamble. I've seen €37mn being quoted within the thread and that could be far more palatable. Really don't see him having a future at Barca so there should be plenty of positive leverage for a buying club. Also a transfer you'd be happy to walk away from if the selling club started dicking around.
Based on talent/ability alone, he's probably the only world prospect on par with Sancho in that position. However, the mental gymnastics people are going through to justify signing him is ridiculous. They believe we will both cure an eternally injured player (have a word with Eric Bailly and Phil Jones) and fix his attitude (Hi Ravel) when we don't have much of a history of doing so. Also, his history of poor professionalism points to someone who is not exactly guaranteed to put in his end of the work required to rehab himself.
Based on talent/ability alone, he's probably the only world prospect on par with Sancho in that position. However, the mental gymnastics people are going through to justify signing him is ridiculous. They believe we will both cure an eternally injured player (have a word with Eric Bailly and Phil Jones) and fix his attitude (Hi Ravel) when we don't have much of a history of doing so. Also, his history of poor professionalism points to someone who is not exactly guaranteed to put in his end of the work required to rehab himself.
I think the point being made by Marcotti is that they cannot sell him for a figure like 37 million because it would drop the value of their playing squad as detailed to their creditors by 80 million and that 43 million difference could prevent them being able to secure the next loan they need to pay wages. Barca need to shift players for at least their stated value or even a profit to improve their financial state and even for a loan they would want a fee to cover the decrease in value from knocking a year off his contract and whilst his wages are not God level he would be one of the highest earners here and based on his last 3 seasons we may not even get 10 games out of him. Way too much risk.
Having been an ardent fan of Dembele and Martial for a while I’ve been waiting for this day. Was pretty sure everything going well they would dislodge Griezman from the France team but alas with Dembele injured, Martial not being picked or becoming injured when he was it’s just never happened.
Can’t think of a time they’ve all been on together but the prospect of all 3 at their best playing together would just be
Would there be a better front 3 in all of football? Neymar, Ronaldo, Messi maybe.
I think they would rather an obligation to buy not option. If they can't sell its better to have him as an option, they already have coutinho possibly to on another loanOnly loan with option. Which Barca would never go for probably.
Too injury prone for straight transfer risk. This is his last season...
Injury prone is the last thing you want to get. Do you guys haven't learn anything from it?
The injury history is a valid concern, but it's interesting that he did not have a single injury in his professional career up until moving to Barcelona, so I'm really not sure how much of it is down to him. There was a report posted on here, that suggested, he would sprint far less in training given Barca's play style and insistence on passing movements etc. as imposed to how much he sprinted in the game. Given the majority of his injuries are muscular injuries, I think that's a telling sign he's just playing in a team who aren't accustomed to playing/training to his strengths.
There's no guarantee that we would handle him any better than how Barcelona have. Sure, he could come here, click and it all works out for him. Or, it could then be two top clubs that he fails at. The amount of appearances that he has made at Barcelona really does put me off and I personally would be happy if we stayed well clear. Very talented player, for sure. But we need players to be fit and healthy in order for us to rotate the squad. We've got one too many injury-prone players in our side already without picking up another one.
As I said, it's a valid concern, for sure. It may be the muppet in me, but I see us as a much better fit in that regard. Ole has made sprinting and fitness his main concern in training since being here and that doesn't seem to be changing anytime soon. Repetition and matching the intensity you sprint at in games, in training, is bound to reduce injuries and considering he had a perfect injury history before moving to Barcelona, I'm not so sure it's as easy to just say it all comes down to him.
Could be a Robben sort of situation. It would be something that the club would need to be very wary of though, I agree
Wasnt there something said that he was faking injuries because he wasnt happy playing for Barcelona? I'm not great with media so take that for nothing anyway. I wouldn't be surprised his injuries improved once he found the right club for him whoever that maybe
If we could "fix" or at least overcome these injury concerns (either through training or just using him better) then he would be a very handy player to have within the squad. It's a high risk but there is the possibility of a high gain there, so I guess it's all about weighing up those odds and seeing how the other transfer dealings go.
It would be interesting to see how we would do now at a different club, to see how he's used there and how the difference in training affects his performance and injury record. It almost feels like it's the wrong time, as in we could do with him spending a year elsewhere post-Barca to assess him better.
The other side of the coin is that we could spend a year helping this player, and then his loan will be up.
No, that was Pogba. Yes, I'm trolling.
I certainly wouldnt buy him with his injury record since he has been at Barcelona, hamstrings look Owened. I would on a heartbeat take him on loan with an option to buy as he is hugely talented and it would allow us to invest in other problem areas of which we have a few. As somebody else mentioned, cant see Barcelona loaning him though, even someone paying his wages only makes them £10m over the next year. Though they spent a fortune I think they would probably sell him pretty cheaply though, even under £50m....but that isnt a deal to do for us anyway
I don’t think there is anyone who would risk buying him. At least with a loan there’s a chance he finds form and fitness, and they can then sell him next summer.
The problem is that his contract runs up to 2022. If the club loans him out and he finds form, enjoys his time wherever he goes and wants to stay there... Barca will not be able to drive his price up with only one year remaining on his contract. That’s a worry for them.
On the other hand, if he stays and has another season like last ... Barca would have to write off most of his value. Who will pay any serious money for an injury plagued player, on high wages, on his last year of contract. Barca will have to either renew and hope he recovers or let him go for a fraction of what they paid for him.
It’s his attitude that is worrying, along with his injury history, loan with an option to buy would be the only thing I’d consider.
Or they keep him on their books, pay his wages and the same happens regardless, apart from they've now paid his wages.
Won’t they lose him for free if it continues this way for the next 2 years anyway? At least the other way around they have a chance of making a sizable sum in transfer fees.
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Links with absolute no truth in it
A loan with option to buy if we cant get Sancho. If he can stay fit, he's terrific.
Because we have a history of signing them Hargreaves, Shweinsteiger, Rojo.
In Dembele's case though, I think he was offered to us by Barcelona. This is why the link came out of the blue and no notable journos were able to pick up on it.
The way I see it is a lose/lose for Barca. They can keep him and lose him as a free agent or they can sell/loan him out and cut their loses by getting him off the wage bill. And who knows and maybe even get a decent fee for him.
It worth remembering that Barca has the biggest wage budget in Europe and with the current economic climate, they are in a really vulnerable position. So selling Dembele makes way too much sense in these circumstances.
Agreed.
At the end of the day, what's the worst that can happen if we manage to secure a loan with an option to buy?
He either:
- Is going to be injury prone and feature in around 20 games. Which means that he will be more of a rotational player and prevent us from over playing Greenwood. At the end of the loan we say thanks to Barca, but you guys can have him back.
or
- He is going to come good and solve a lot of our issues. And the great thing is that he is going to have only 1 year left on his contract. So we'll be able to sign him for a reduced fee.
Win/win if you ask me. As a mentioned in my previous post. He has that something about him that screams Man Utd player. Can be the muppet talking in me
Trying to think of some puns.
Yesmane Dembele
DembellON...
Ok I give up. Not good at this all
Yesmane Dembele
DembellON...
Ok I give up. Not good at this all
Just not for 250K pw
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