Ozil, China, Arsenal, PL, Hypocrisy...

adexkola

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Arsenal have distanced themselves from comments made by Mesut Özil on Instagram, in which he spoke out strongly against China’s persecution of the Uighur population in the north-western region of Xinjiang and criticised Muslims for not doing more to highlight the issue.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/dec/13/arsenal-distance-themselves-from-mesut-ozil-comments-china-uighur-people
Long story short:

1. Ozil criticizes China for how they treat majority Muslim Uighurs, and other Muslims for not speaking out more

2. Chinese social media farms engage Ozil on Twitter

3. Arsenal wade in to confirm that Ozil's comments are his alone and they remain cool with China ('s money).

For those not in the know, a General Manager in the NBA got into hot water over comments made in support of Hong Kong. The NBA has a huge presence in China, and ultimately the league was forced to apologize and try and smooth things out.

What is the possibility of this occurring more frequent? Will the PL muzzle it's players when it comes to sensitive issues potentially impacting money flow? Should it? I mean, what's China gonna do, boycott the PL and watch it's league instead?

Go!
 

Grande

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Money. I would generally not encourage that you go to war, but if you do, I’d rather sell you the weapons than not. He’s right, though. The uighurs are treated dismally in parts of China. (Now let’s see if my workplace will distance itself from me.)
 

mu4c_20le

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I think it's normal for clubs to distance themselves from politics.
 

horsechoker

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I was watching some videos about the sports boycott of South Africa in the apartheid era. The sporting world was able to put pressure on South Africa to end apartheid. If South Africa had money invested in global sport would the world have been ready to make a stand?

It seems China can isolate themselves from criticism by having their fingers in as many pies as possible.
 

adexkola

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I was watching some videos about the sports boycott of South Africa in the apartheid era. The sporting world was able to put pressure on South Africa to end apartheid. If South Africa had money invested in global sport would the world have been ready to make a stand?

It seems China can isolate themselves from criticism by having their fingers in as many pies as possible.
Answer is no. US/UK support until the late 80s for apartheid was partly driven by business/Cold War considerations.

Not my intent to turn this into a purely political thread mind.

Robs Arsenal of the chance to sell him to China.
:lol:

Chess, not checkers.
 

Dwazza Gunnar Solskjær

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Funny how he doesn't talk about his boy Erdogan killing Kurds though.
 

mu4c_20le

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Is it politics though? I thought it was a human rights issue. Could be wrong I'm not fully informed on this...
I think it's a bit of both. Is it a thing for clubs to constantly speak out against these issues? We even have Saudi Telecom as a sponsor for example.

Funny how he doesn't talk about his boy Erdogan killing Kurds though.
:lol: thank you. I was just wondering if Ozil ever spoke out against other cases involving muslims or human rights abuses.
 

adexkola

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I think it's a bit of both. Is it a thing for clubs to constantly speak out against these issues? We even have Saudi Telecom as a sponsor for example.


:lol: thank you. I was just wondering if Ozil ever spoke out against other cases involving muslims or human rights abuses.
Why do people who speak out about certain things have to be perfect? Genuine question
 

Jam

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1) He’s right.

2) It’s slightly hypocritical. You don’t get to pick and chose which human rights abuses you speak out about. The Erdogan saga was a mess.

3) Clubs will always want to stay out of political minefields like this one especially when it involves major markets like China. Their response doesn’t surprise me one iota.
 

HJ12

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It's a tough one for clubs as they'll always want to stay out of politics for obvious and understandable reasons. What this situation does however highlight is that clubs are sh*t scared of upsetting major/potentially major revenue streams. It's hardly necessary to issue a statement confirming that what player x says is his own views and not of the club - that's implicit and generally accepted.
 
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Skills

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True. He is a hypocrite. Do we ignore his call for attention to the Uighurs because he's a hypocrite?
The fact that he's calling out other muslims for not speaking out more, is what will rub people up the wrong way given his own hypocrisy with the Turkey/Kurds.
 

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Funny how he doesn't talk about his boy Erdogan killing Kurds though.
The first thing that came to my mind, he can go and feck himself, he's nothing but a fecking poser.

Cue him crying like a bitch that he was again made a scapegoat on twitter in near future though. Really hope they sell him to Mars or some other shithole where we won't have to endure him opening his gob.
 

adexkola

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The fact that he's calling out other muslims for not speaking out more, is what will rub people up the wrong way given his own hypocrisy with the Turkey/Kurds.
I get that. Hypocrisy is a bitch and an annoying trait.

Recent involvements in the City cnut fans thread have made me reconsider how hypocrisy should factor into things.
 

Brophs

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Let's hope he's more willing to backtrack than he is to track back.
 

izec

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Good old Özil. He only cares about Turkey and Muslims. I cant take someone serious who only cares about his own religion and nation, but support or empathy disappears as soon as it is the other way around. In Özil's case, he is basically lying in bed with Erdogan and thus supporting a dictator and murderer heavily
 

Dwazza Gunnar Solskjær

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Why do people who speak out about certain things have to be perfect? Genuine question
If he wasn't mates with Erdogan, I wouldn't have been so critical.

But I don't want to take away from the actual point of your thread, which is China using its economic power to muzzle criticism.
 

Snow

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Why do people who speak out about certain things have to be perfect? Genuine question
In this case specifically because Özil is calling out Muslims for not speaking out against atrocities being carried out against a group of Muslims whilst his pal, the dictator of Turkey whom he vocally supports, is killing another group of Muslims.
 

Barnslig

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Why do people who speak out about certain things have to be perfect? Genuine question
No one has said people speaking out has to be perfect? It does feel hypocritical saying "You guys need to treat these people better" only to turn around and be best mates with a guy that literally slaughters people, no?
 

awop

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It's not a contest, Özil is right to talk about this terrible situation and is wrong to be so close to Erdogan. But the two should not be talked about together. This whataboutism is only going to drown the original message. The way Özil communicated though made it hard for the club to fully support him without creating a huge mess.

 
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criticalanalysis

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It's not a contest, Özil is right to talk about this terrible situation and is wrong to be so close to Erdogan. But the two should not be talked about together. This whataboutism is only going to drown the original message. The way Özil communicated though made it hard for the club to fully support him without creating a huge mess.

HK has a population of around 7 million. How and why the feck does LeTV pay that much? The HK people must be getting shafted with those prices being passed on to them.

Or am I missing something here..
 

adexkola

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No one has said people speaking out has to be perfect? It does feel hypocritical saying "You guys need to treat these people better" only to turn around and be best mates with a guy that literally slaughters people, no?
It is hypocritical! I'm not disagreeing with that at all. Ozil, at best, must be very good at cognitive dissonance.

Now if the convo stops at Ozil's hypocrisy... Then that's a waste of Niall's hard earned money isn't it?
 

Barnslig

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It's not a contest, Özil is right to talk about this terrible situation and is wrong to be so close to Erdogan. But the two should not be talked about together. This whataboutism is only going to drown the original message. The way Özil communicated though made it hard for the club to fully support him without creating a huge mess.

So if you talk out against nazism, but are personal friends with Hitler, that shouldn't be talked about? :houllier:
 

Barnslig

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It is hypocritical! I'm not disagreeing with that at all. Ozil, at best, must be very good at cognitive dissonance.

Now if the convo stops at Ozil's hypocrisy... Then that's a waste of Niall's hard earned money isn't it?
I do very much agree with you that these large corporations bending over backwards for China is a major issue, especially for free speech and human rights. One of my favourite companies, Blizzard, have recently been in a controversy with China as well, and they caved, bent over and kissed China's ass. Lost a lot of respect for them over that.

Understandably, China is a huge market for lots of major international companies, but if the western markets respond by boycotting various companies as well then maybe these companies understand we don't want their backwards communist policies dictating our markets.
 

Lj82

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I think it's a bit of both. Is it a thing for clubs to constantly speak out against these issues? We even have Saudi Telecom as a sponsor for example.


:lol: thank you. I was just wondering if Ozil ever spoke out against other cases involving muslims or human rights abuses.
With the Uyghurs, it's more than just religion. They are historically/ethnically(?) linked to the Turks.
Not unusual for a Turk to show sympathy towards Uyghur.
 

giorno

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I'm sure prime minister Winnie the Pooh won't turn this into a sh*tstorm
 

KM

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It's a noble cause but the response of Arsenal was predictable. I don't think there is any PL clubs who would have not done the same thing in their position. China has far too much money for any club to say anything.
 

Abizzz

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Anyone here from the US/UK/EU blaming Ozil for Erdogans actions is a hypocrite when it's their governments that gave Erdogan the power to do what he does with the kurds...

And yet that doesn't change anything about the fact that what Erdogan does is wrong. Same for the Chinese and Uighur.
 

VJ1762

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Anyone here from the US/UK/EU blaming Ozil for Erdogans actions is a hypocrite when it's their governments that gave Erdogan the power to do what he does with the kurds...

And yet that doesn't change anything about the fact that what Erdogan does is wrong. Same for the Chinese and Uighur.
Politics is built on being hypocritical, tbf. Don't think anybody can do anything because China has major say in global economics. Also, football is making major inroads in China, where before NBA was the thing. I would have expected the same statement from United, economics outweighs all the potential headaches one incurs by taking a stand.

It is the same thing with Saudi Arabia. SA backed Softbank is a major player in Silicon Valley. They also pay billions of dollars for arms from the UK/USA. They have a major say in global oil pricing. You cannot risk to enrage an ally like that, and do all the shenanigans that the US did/continues to do in South America, unless you want to turn SA into another potential Syria.

Having said that, it is admirable to see Ozil offering his support for the Uighur cause. One also hopes that Ozil looks up about what his buddy Erdogan is doing and revises his support for him. He has shown that he has the right intentions.
 

VJ1762

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It's a noble cause but the response of Arsenal was predictable. I don't think there is any PL clubs who would have not done the same thing in their position. China has far too much money for any club to say anything.
This.
 

africanspur

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In this case specifically because Özil is calling out Muslims for not speaking out against atrocities being carried out against a group of Muslims whilst his pal, the dictator of Turkey whom he vocally supports, is killing another group of Muslims.
Not that I agree with it at all but the reason he will see this as different is that, rightly or wrongly, he will see the Uighur persecution as being religiously based (which it partly is) and as an ethnic Turk, probably feels extra sympathy for a group that is ethnically linked to him. Whereas the Turk/Kurd issue is not a religious one but one he may see as a local conflict.

Moreover, I know Erdogan is public enemy number one on here and in the West in general these days and I greatly dislike him but I find a lot of the comments....a little off the mark. What 'his buddy' Erdogan is doing with the Kurds is literally no different to what the Turkish army and state have been doing to the Kurds for literally a century now, yet the way some (want to) frame it on here is loony Erdogan and his murderous focus on the Kurds.

Back to the original point, unfortunately Arsenal reacted as I imagine every single club would have acted and I think you're right, this will happen more and more in sports. China has too many people and too much economic power for sports teams to ignore them and generally don't take kindly to criticism.