In the first half of the tournament he wasn't actually all that good overall, but he still ultimately made the telling impact (either a goal or an assist out of nothing) that led France to win a number of the matches. For instance against Australia he was fairly average, but he was the one created and scored the winning goal (although it harshly went down as an own goal off the defender).
6
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 22
- Goals
- 1
- Assists
- 4
- Yellow cards
- 2
- Status
It's funny though cause he is a literal Saint as a person compared to about a million football players. When he had blue hair for the city game despite having it for the international break and everyone including pundits went crazy showed them for who they really where.
Absolute mad as hatters.
I agree there were matches like that although I don't think Australia was one either. Just re-watched the highlights and his every touch video and literally all their attacks come from a long Pogba pass over the top onto Griezmann or Mbappe or Giroud. He didn't dominate the midfield the way he can do but he was the player on the pitch who was actually making things happen, switching play from side to side, starting moves through the middle, dropping the ball onto his strikers.
Most people are very bias or just don't know what a good midfield performance is TBH.
As others said he had similar defensive stats to Kante, but linked the attack also. Pogba has always been the fall guy for us as he WAS our only genuine quality player.
I wonder if Bruno had joined a losing team whether he'd be labelled a flop.
Kante was brilliant to be fair.
For me Kante has been the most overrated player in recent years. It's true that he's got incredible stamina and coverage but he offers nothing else. He wins a lot of possessions back but he also gives the ball away cheaply. He struggles to hold onto and bring the ball forward due to his poor technique. Many of his passes put his teammates in danger as well. He looks pretty limited in the modern game which emphasizes in all-round ability.
This season the aforementioned problems have been highlighted under Lampard's management. Chelsea have got 1.06 points per league game (19 points in 18 games) with Kante and 2.64 points (29 points in 11 games) without him. They have scored 1.17 goals per league game (21 goals in 18 games) with Kante and 2.73 goals (30 points in 11 games) without him. The lack of creativity in midfield when he is playing is pretty obvious.
Frankly, Lampard's obsession in Kante is the major reason why we are still in the top 4 chase.
Not near the others. Awful final as well. Like diabolical.
That's absolute bollocks. Pogba was lauded when he first came through, and even when he had his last comeback after all the shit that was spouted by his agent he was still warmly received and had the loudest cheer. And then let's not forget the run under Ole last season, or the fact that his shirt has been the highest selling shirt for every season he's been at the club.
He's been getting grief because of his own inconsistencies and for the fact that he's been hankering for a move for the best part of two years. You put anyone in those shoes, including Rashford or Greenwood, and they'd be similarly persona non grata.
This victim complex from Pogba fanboys on his behalf is nothing less than pathetic.
Oh save your patronising ‘fanboys’ it’s ok to have a different opinion.
Since coming back to the club he really hasn’t been taken in by matchgoing fans....not at games where he could feel loved. I’m a season ticket holder....I was at Pogbas return game and all you could hear for 90 mins was Zlatan Ibrohimovic he is our Swedish hero. There’s not been a song for Pogba in the three years he’s been back, bar ‘one Paul Pogba’ one game after he was racially abused. That lasted one game.If you look at Bruno singing his own song, whether you like it or not, it does matter to players. Bruno loves it. So do all players. It won’tbe lost on Pogba that the fans have never sung for him.
I don’t get why people with an issue with Pogba, which is fine, need to paint it as a one way street. It definitely isn’t in either case. But my feeling is more could’ve been done by the fans.....the abuse Pogba got at the end of last season by his own fans was a disgrace, that should never happen. Personally I’m not surprised he’d want to leave given the way he’s been treated by the media, United legends and fans alike....the same as I’m not surprised at this point that a lot of fans want to see him gone. It’s just a big mess at this point. Everyone has some blame.
I'm a season ticket holder also. I've seen him cheered to the hilt even after his agent and himself stated that he wanted to leave. We let his inconsistencies for a large part of his first two years slide and there wasn't any talk of him being disliked by the fans until Jose made him public enemy number one in January 2019. Until then there was hardly any murmuring of discontent. And that song issue: he did have a prominent role in the Jose/Ole's at the wheel song. I was there when it was first sung at Bournemouth away, and was also there at City away the week or two after when the whole away end sang it in unison for the whole second half.
The abuse at the end was absolutely unwarranted, I agree. But equally, he was very, very poor in those last 10 games. He wasn't the only one, but when you break the world record on someone you expect a higher standard. A standard which, we've seen all too briefly during his time here.
Pogba was very much labelled as a flop at the moment he returned, even before he had played his debut. The media were too desperate to make a big fuss over his pricetag and they certainly couldn't afford to change their viewpoints and admit mistakes.
Pogba's inconsistency also made him vulnerable as it's easy for the media to pick a poor game and write an essay about it. Those numerous good games were gone unnoticed unless he was directly involved in a goal. His hairstyle would be attacked by then.
The fact that he once left United under the Fergie era also imposed a negative image on him as well.
To be fair, it's normal for top players to take unreasonable criticisms. But as fans we should back our players as much as possible, at least we should only criticize reasonably.
A few things here :-
Cheered to the hilt ? Sounds a Bit OTT but ok, suppose it’s hard to quantify hilt
You say we let his inconsistencies slide, as if he hasn’t also been outstanding at times, I can’t think of a game where the team has played well and he hasn’t, this season aside, where he’s been injured can you name the players, over the three years that’s been consistently better ?
Weren’t Sanchez and Fred (who up to that point had been a disaster) part of that song ? It was generic and actually was more of a feelgood song for Ole once Jose was sacked. It wasn’t Rashfords or Sanchez’s song and it wasn’t Pogbas.
Those last ten games? He wasn’t the only one? You could put it like that, a bit like saying we’ve let his inconsistencies slide. We’ve let everyone’s inconsistencies slide because we’ve been inconsistent besides the odd run here and there, even in finishing second under Jose our performances were very sketchy.
Those last ten games......equally EVERYBODY was very, very, very poor. Possibly and probably down to the running Ole had them doing against the lack of running under Jose, the players dropped like flies around the Liverpool PSG games. Ole has weeded out those who’s attitudes were to blame, Pogba has never been mentioned by anyone other than Jose....but sure let’s make him the scapegoat and act offended when he wants to leave.
He was very sick
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Dont have any time for him and wanted him out almost as much as he wants out himself.
Despite him being absolutely desperate to move its become clear noone will pay even 80-100m for him with coronovirus not helping things.
Therefore we are stuck with each other for the next year whatever so need to make the most of it.
I didnt want to see him in the shirt for another minute but its in all our interests to have a good season next year - he can showcase his talent to Madrid etc after a year on the sidelines and we can benefit with hopefully a title challenge.
I think its also now dawned on Pogba/Raiola that he is not as in demand as they thought so he will need to put the effort in.
Despite him being absolutely desperate to move its become clear noone will pay even 80-100m for him with coronovirus not helping things.
Therefore we are stuck with each other for the next year whatever so need to make the most of it.
I didnt want to see him in the shirt for another minute but its in all our interests to have a good season next year - he can showcase his talent to Madrid etc after a year on the sidelines and we can benefit with hopefully a title challenge.
I think its also now dawned on Pogba/Raiola that he is not as in demand as they thought so he will need to put the effort in.
Easy question really.After Jones, definitely Bailly. Then Lindelof.
It’s almost like people see what they want to see. He had a mega WC. There’s plenty of free time — people who say otherwise should give a rewatch.
Until his disastrous half in the final.
Yes.
I would nominate Fred,
His shooting is so bad that he only has to be in the wrong penalty area and anything could happen.
Jesus what happened
He's better now, but he's been operating in a different area of the pitch than at Juventus.
Im trying to accept him in the role Ole has given him but He's being underutilized when playing as the deep lying playmaker. He can do much more other than ping long balls and ball progression.
Only watched 1:34...he’s so good, he’s our player and all we do is blame him for everything.....A prime example being the last ten games of last season.....Does any other player have that thrown at them? Nope. Not a one. Just Pogba.
Quelle Suprise he may want to leave.
I actually agree. His form for Chelsea has been nothing like his Leicester form, primarily because he has found it difficult to fit into different systems. He is clearly not versatile. People have been letting a lot of average performances slide because the role is barely looked at and for some reason, Chelsea is a side that a lot of people seem to ignore despite how big they are ( I will get stick for it but its true). Even if we consider 2016-2017 a great season, personally i don't, it's been 3 seasons since then.
You are right in that the media came with their knives out for Pogba. But the club, and particularly Mourinho supported Pogba. It was Pogba and his agent in February 2018 who really started all of this, with him first complaining about where he wanted to play and then the rumours about going to City. The war between him and Mourinho started around March 2018 and continued along the summer with both parties taking shots at each other and forming factions. Remember when Pogba was purposely ignoring Mourinho and the pictures and videos of the training ground bust up. I personally felt that Pogba disrespected the club by being insubordinate with Mourinho so publically, but understood that emotions may have played a role, and give Mourinho's nature was willing to provide him with some leeway. Once Mourinho left, I expected Pogba to be fully committed to us, as United had actually backed Pogba by not selling him that summer. Instead, the turning of the rumour mill by his agent and brother got worse and Pogba did nothing to diminish them. Simply providing vague statements. Pogba's performances have not been consistently good since then, and given the money he is making and potentially demanding, it simply isn't worth it. More than that, since Mourinho left, his agent has publically bashed the club on several occassions, and the fact that a player who is supposedly committed to the club is still running with the same agent who has placed a cloud over the club for almost three seasons would make a lot of people resentful.
Personally, not everyone has to love United and given our recent positions, it is understandable if a player feels that he wants more in his career. I as a fan also have the right to want players here who would provide consistently good performances and would not create a circus around the club. His presence reminds me of the Liverpool Spice Boy's era with a lot of players seemingly not committed to the club and more concerned with things outside football. Of course, that is a personal opinion. I also do not feel that his game suits the league, I think he moves at a slower pace than the league requires which is why he always seems to be caught in possession and has poor defensive awareness. Souness and other media pundits may have their own gripe with him, which is justifiable given his wage and price tag. It's the same thing Ozil, Dembele and Hazard are getting at their respective clubs ( regardless of injury). Some here see him as independent of the teams that finished 6th previously, I see him as part of the team and problem. We have been inconsistent for this short period in history and he has been inconsistent in his time with us, so a divorce is totally acceptable and can be used to facilitate spending on players that can be consistent and help us to become more consistent.
Another underlying gripe I have with him and players like him, one may even call it an unfair issue, is that I expect a level of respect for the club based on the many years of success we have had. We have only been average league wise for 6 seasons and still have the most fans and are one of the richest clubs in the world. The pedigree is still there. I believe that we are big enough to let a players like Pogba leave without batting an eyelid. We should only shake when truly world class players like Messi, Ronaldo, Neymar or Mbappe are involved in such a situation. I feel that some fans here will have us cede to a simply decent player like Pogba, when he isn't worth the hassle, even if he is our best player.
With all due respect, I couldn't care less about what the media say. As you've said it yourself, they come with their knives out from day one and they have an agenda to bring Pogba down whenever possible. This also applies to the so-called war between Mourinho and Pogba. We were not Mourinho nor Pogba and we wouldn't know what was actually going on. People basically judged only on what the media had presented to us (which was clearly biased), and that's why they were resentful.
From what I saw, Mourinho chose to stick with Pogba at that time, despite his reputation for dropping and getting rid of disobedient players. He didn't actively put him on the transfer list either. Therefore, I highly doubted whether their relationship was as bad as the media described. In my opinion, the media exaggerated the incident and were largely responsible for the circus.
I agree that Pogba has been vague about his future, but so as most of the top footballers in the world. They tend to keep their options open and this is in the best interests for both the team and the player himself. For me, it doesn't matter what a player says as long as he delivers on the pitch. de Gea didn't turn down Madrid nor sack his agent a few years ago, but he was still heavily loved by United fans. Herrera always claimed he loved United blah blah blah, but he eventually chose money over us.
It's true that Pogba is caught in possession at times, but it is understandable considering the context. The lack of movement up front often leaves him no option but to hold onto the ball (sometimes too long I admit). In a 3-man midfield, he is supposed to have a partner helping to bring the ball from back to front, and an attacking midfielder creating chances in the final third, but he's got neither of them before Fred's improvement and Bruno's arrival. That's why many of us expect him to perform better with the introduction of Bruno and possibly another midfielder.
This also explains your another concern - why the team has been inconsistent whenever he's inconsistent. That's because we rely heavily (and too much) on Pogba and he is doing all the work on his own (which is supposed to be shared among 3 midfielders). It's unfair to put the blame on him for not doing other's job, but let those who are not doing their job slide.
As for the last paragraph, I personally disagree. In the past, we could afford the loss of Ronaldo as Fergie was really good at playing 200% of player's ability and potential, and City and Tottenham weren't in the race at all. Nowadays, the competition has become much more fierce and it's virtually impossible to hire another Fergie. All of the post-Fergie managers bar Moyes depend very much on individual brilliance to get results. That's why we have spent so much over the years trying to recruit top or promising players in the world. I can't see why we have to let one of the few successful signings go unless he desperately asks to leave.
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Oh yeah, to Madrid. Where they're famously so nice to their star players...
Can't believe it's been 2 years already today since this beautiful derby comeback
We would've never heard the end of it had Citeh clinched in a derby but glad that Pogba decided not to let it happen on his watch
Might also be the single best contribution in a United shirt for Sanchez as well.
Lukaku in this picture will always make me laugh
He would've skied it into the stands or lost control immediately had it been passed to him
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We would've never heard the end of it had Citeh clinched in a derby but glad that Pogba decided not to let it happen on his watch
Might also be the single best contribution in a United shirt for Sanchez as well.
Lukaku in this picture will always make me laugh
He would've skied it into the stands or lost control immediately had it been passed to him
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On point one: just look at his comeback game against Southampton for starters, or when he had one of his many abortive appearances back from injury this season (I think it might have been Newcastle at home?) - he had the loudest cheer of the night that game. I actively listened out for boos from the ground and heard none. Bearing in mind, this was after everything that his agent had spouted about the club, and a lot of time after he said he wanted a new challenge in the summer
Re point 2: Where have I said he hasn't been outstanding at times? The thing is, he wasn't bought to be outstanding at times, he was bought to be outstanding all the time, or at least be very fecking close to it. It's shit, but that's the expectation when you're the most expensive player in the team (and at the time, the world). You are meant to handle those heightened expectations. In terms of players who have been more consistent: I'd say DDG, Herrera, Mata for a start. Ibra, Lukaku, Rashford, Martial, Lingard at various points as well. Even discounting everything that's happened, the most memorable and positive night in Utd's post-SAF history was when Pogba was nowhere near the pitch. He shrunk against PSG in the first leg, and shrunk even moreso against Barca in the next round. That is a damning indictment on the player, irrespective of the shit that has gone on around him.
Point 3: It was a silly argument in the first place, and I was being facetious when I responded so I'm not going to bother going in to the specifics of this. Needless to say, many millions of fans around the world and at the ground have his name on the back of their shirts. That doesn't exactly scream ambivalence to me.
Point 4: I reiterate point 2: He is the most expensive, most highly paid player in the team, and playing in the most influential position. Forgive me if I don't hold him to the same standards as Diogo fecking Dalot!
And finally, point 5: I'm not making him a scapegoat for all our ills. Jose was by far the villain in the piece when that kicked off, and was deservedly sacked. But that doesn't mean Pogba has fallen way below the standards at times as well (I was also there at Southampton away last year, where he was absolutely fecking woeful, almost beyond words). And, if you'd care to look at my posting history you'll see that for a long time I backed Pogba to the hilt. But it all comes down to this for me: He was bought to be the leader in the team, we built around him for the best part of 3-4 years, and what have we got to show for it? It's just been excuse after excuse for him - He needs to be played in a 3, he needs less defensive responsibility, he needs to be the 10, oh wait maybe not the 10 - and yet, when he played for his country at the World Cup, it was in that exact same position he said he couldn't do. Yes, the team hasn't been great for a long time while he's been here, but the team not being great didn't stop Robson, it didn't stop Gerrard, it didn't stop Totti and De Rossi, and so on and so forth.
Then, when Ole came in, he radically changed the team to suit Pogba's preferences, it went well for a period of time, and the moment the going got tough, instead of pulling up everyone to maintain the high standards, he sunk just as low as them. And now, he's been MIA for pretty much the whole season, and has seemingly been more focused on getting fit for France than he has for Utd. This, need I remind you, was a season which was absolutely crucial to Ole's future at the club. And don't even start that he's been injured. The type of injury Pogba had was something that could he could have played on with, and have the operation after the Euros if he was so concerned. Andre Gomes came back from a career threatening injury in the space of a few months. Compare and contrast that with Pogba's minor ankle ailment...
Look, I know he's gone at the end of the season (whenever that may be), and I wish him well wherever he goes, but I won't have a pity party when he does leave. It didn't work out here for both him and the club, but people saying that we're beneath him, or that he's been harshly dealt with by the fans and the club are living in cloud cuckoo land. He's been given plenty of opportunities to show how good he is but outside of last season (and I count the first of half of that under Jose as well, where he was arguably even better in light of his circumstances) he simply hasn't shown enough to say that he's worth the hassle.
Again you’re trying to paint a picture of seeing both sides while actually focusing on one. I’m not going to change your opinion but this isn’t a one way street.
Pogba hasn’t been ‘loved’ in the way Bruno or Ighalo has, for two minutes worth of being here, at any point since returning. If he doesn’t feel loved and is blamed for everything, where no one else is....these could be reasons for wanting to leave. I think it’s fair.
I think it’s fair now that a lot of fans want him to leave. I’m sick of his agent and brothers and he has to be held responsible for that. I think that’s fair.
This over the top reaction though to poor performance, it’s bizarre. Southampton away for example....yeah he was terrible in that game like 2/10 terrible by far the worst he’s played for us. As bad as let’s say Kante in the World Cup final or Rooney away to Fulham.
Again with the last ten games, you’ve clearly no issue with any other player, you just want to put it all on Pogba and hold it against him individually. Footballs a team sport.
As for your point on other players,some of those are the exception like Robson and to a lesser extent Gerrard. Different types of players. I’d have to add that if you look at CAF ratings Pogba has been MOTM 26 times in 98 or so appearances. That’s just games where he’s been the best player. So he’d have to have stunk the place out in all the other games for your perspective to be accurate, which simply isn’t the case.
Your list of players that have been consistently better than him is a joke. It even adds a caveat for inconsistency by saying ‘at times’.
Mata hasn’t been a regular for any of the time Pogba has been here. He’s largely ineffective
Herrera was never a regular as much as I liked him, is nowhere near the player Pogba is.
Lukaku in his first season had two massive spells where he didn’t score for months, at one point the crowd were visibly frustrated he kept getting picked, second season he was just shite.
Rashford...really? Massive Rashford fan but if you take this season out. He’s not been consistent.
Martial....See above comment on Rashford
Lingard....is that a joke ? Can you justify your assertion to my question...who has been consistently better than Pogba in the three years he’s been back?
You’d be better admitting no one actually has than make stupid comments.
One more comment I hear, that you’ve mentioned, is that we’ve tried to build around Pogba for three years? How so? How have we built around Pogba anymore than we’ve built around Matic or Martial or Rashford ? Most people claim Pogbas ideal role is a specialised role on the left side of a midfield three with license to attack. We’ve never really built around Pogba then. He had a couple of games there under Jose and excelled. Had a run under Ole and excelled until the team ran out of gas towards the end of the season and the whole team fell off a cliff.
Pogba has had to fit into the team, and rightly so largely as a deep lying midfielder in a two.75% of his games have been here. It’s nonsense to claim we’ve tried everything to build around him. Complete lie.
So the truth is he’s played wherever he’s been asked, been the best player on the pitch 1/4 of the games he’s played as well as lots of other games where he played really well and some games where he was poor. You cant justifiably name a single outfield player who has been consistently better than him yet you want to blame him and him alone for the teams spells of bad form and that’s simply unfair.
He may well want to leave. That’s fair given the above is largely true of the perception in the media and of our fans in general.
A lot of fans want to see him leave, I think that’s fair given the constant nature of his agent and brothers
Two way street.
Comments on his injury are also a joke.
Good player but that fat feck of an agent will never stop planning for his move after United.
150 pages, almost 6000 replies, for 8 appearances
And that's in this thread alone
And that's in this thread alone
Highlights why he shouldn't be here150 pages, almost 6000 replies, for 8 appearances
And that's in this thread alone
Lukaku in this picture will always make me laugh
He would've skied it into the stands or lost control immediately had it been passed to him
Holy crap I didn't notice at first then I saw the video highlights again to confirm it happened. WTF was Lukaku thinking or even expecting him to cut it back to him there. Just delusional levels of awareness.Poga was like centimetres away from goal and he's asking for a pass.
Honestly, why the **** would Pogba want to go to Juve? They lost their chance to win UCL, the squad needs a huge investment and is pretty average to be honest. Real does not want him so much and their stars are also on a decline (Marcelo, Ramos, Modric; god knows how many yers Kroos and Benz have got on a top level).
However here, at United, there is a young and exciting squad. If Sancho comes, then the attacking five of Rash, Martial, Sancho, Bruno and Pogba is as good as anyone’s. Marcus is 22, Anthony 24, Sancho 20, Bruno 25. Also Mason is 18 and Dan is 21. And I am not talking about the rest of the squad. Clearly, if everyhing goes well we will have a fantastic squad and won't be as reliant on Pogba as we were these past years.
I think it’s clear that here he can achieve more than playing in a boring Serie A. I also would argue, if our players continue to progress, this team can become a real powerhouse in Europe and dominate for years (or at least have good chances for UCL). He also obviously loves the club and no one gonna give him as much money as United. So, sign the contract, shut up and let’s win some trophies.
Pogba (if he wants to stay) signing the new contract plus bringing in Sancho, Bellingham and Ighalo would be a fantastic window for me.
However here, at United, there is a young and exciting squad. If Sancho comes, then the attacking five of Rash, Martial, Sancho, Bruno and Pogba is as good as anyone’s. Marcus is 22, Anthony 24, Sancho 20, Bruno 25. Also Mason is 18 and Dan is 21. And I am not talking about the rest of the squad. Clearly, if everyhing goes well we will have a fantastic squad and won't be as reliant on Pogba as we were these past years.
I think it’s clear that here he can achieve more than playing in a boring Serie A. I also would argue, if our players continue to progress, this team can become a real powerhouse in Europe and dominate for years (or at least have good chances for UCL). He also obviously loves the club and no one gonna give him as much money as United. So, sign the contract, shut up and let’s win some trophies.
Pogba (if he wants to stay) signing the new contract plus bringing in Sancho, Bellingham and Ighalo would be a fantastic window for me.
I would liken it to a toxic relationship where you bring out the worst in each other. Pogba has the ability to drive people insane with endless repetitive posting.
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