Paul Scholes the pundit

FortunaUtd said:
Never mind Scholes, what's really depressing is that this thoroughly unpleasant and offensively clueless man that is Butt was tasked with running our youth department and "first team development" for years. No wonder our club was struggling.
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The majority of our fans seem to love ex-players being given jobs that as outsiders we have no idea if they're qualified for, suited for or performing well in.

"Knows the club, "experience", "mentality", "United way" and all that.
 
They both think that Liverpool can't get better than Gerrard to manage them because he "knows" the club. The empowerment these dinosaur traditionalists have been enjoying recently is really dangerous for English football.
 
Scholes is a tit, but my god Butt is even worse. Comes across as a proper aggressive clueless bloke. Talks like he was something special, it would be quite funny if he didn't say so much toxic shite.
 
Might be unpopular opinion, but apart of Dorgu and Yoro, i think both Scholes and Butt are pretty spot on.
Keeping Dalot as one of the senior and experienced player is also sensible especially with CL football coming.
Despite I disagree with them about Dorgu but I can see their reasoning. Before managed by Carrick, Dorgu is hardly have any good games with the team so they might just worried about a limited player hitting purple patch which we had seen many times before.
 
Whatever you think of the players individually, selling so many in one summer would be undoubtedly destabilising. Not every player they have wanted sold necessarily has a long-term future at the club, but it would be an horrendous decision to get rid of everyone they listed in one summer. You'd need to spend much of preparation for the new season working to mitigate the massive unnecessary shock you've just inflicted to the culture of the dressing room. Get rid of a few but we can't sell so many players that those that are left are going to notice a draft. There'll be personalities, characters that might not belong to someone you want to give a contract extension to, but you need to be strategic about when you move players on you can't just have a cull every summer, not if you're looking to build something.

Especially where we are at the moment if everyone turns up in July to find out half their team mates have been sold I don't think it's going to do much to ensure we get off to the best of starts. You need to be strategic with these things and often the decisions aren't just about football. Wrecking the morale of a squad because you've identified 1/3 of the team probably aren't of the calibre you're looking for in the long run would be a terrible short sighted decision. You need to churn them out strategically over a few cycles.
 
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dann496 said:
Might be unpopular opinion, but apart of Dorgu and Yoro, i think both Scholes and Butt are pretty spot on.
Keeping Dalot as one of the senior and experienced player is also sensible especially with CL football coming.
Despite I disagree with them about Dorgu but I can see their reasoning. Before managed by Carrick, Dorgu is hardly have any good games with the team so they might just worried about a limited player hitting purple patch which we had seen many times before.
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Their worst take was still thinking Shaw might be the best left back in the world.

These keep or sell games never seem to take into account that any player you let go, needs replacing, so you're just adding to the positions you need to fill in one summer, and we don't have the finances to replace half the starting 11.
 
My feeling with Scholes and Butt is that if they posted on here they likely wouldn't make it out of the Newbies. You certainly wouldn't know they had such a storied history in the game based on their opinions and the way they express them. The kind of content they now produce, such as these mind-numbing "Sell or Keep" time-fillers, is pretty much slop and shows they are properly scraping the bottom of their "How can we make money from our United past while doing as little as possible" shtick.

Adding a Sick Boy/Begbie style "Still, he's a mate (legend)" disclaimer.
 
Nyland said:
Whatever you think of the players individually, selling so many in one summer would be undoubtedly destabilising. Not every player they have wanted sold necessarily has a long-term future at the club, but it would be an horrendous decision to get rid of everyone they listed in one summer. You'd need to spend much of preparation for the new season working to mitigate the massive unnecessary shock you've just inflicted to the culture of the dressing room. Get rid of a few but we can't sell so many players that those that are left are going to notice a draft. There'll be personalities, characters that might not belong to someone you want to give a contract extension to, but you need to be strategic about when you move players on you can't just have a cull every summer, not if you're looking to build something.

Especially where we are at the moment if everyone turns up in July to find out half their team mates have been sold I don't think it's going to do much to ensure we get off to the best of starts. You need to be strategic with these things and often the decisions aren't just about football. Wrecking the morale of a squad because you've identified 1/3 of the team probably aren't of the calibre you're looking for in the long run would be a terrible short sighted decision. You need to churn them out strategically over a few cycles.
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We can't change too much but I think the main reason we don't is financial. If we genuinely had the chance to replace our right backs and centre backs with much better players, then we'd be mad not to do it just because "x player is a good lad round the dressing room".

The reason we won't be replacing any RB or CB this summer is because we have too many other positions to fill and funds are always limited, the money is best spent elsewhere.
 
Really don't understand what the problem is, they are supposed to be controversial otherwise nobody would listen would they.

And for me they both come across like working class lads who would be good company for a few pints.
 
dann496 said:
Might be unpopular opinion, but apart of Dorgu and Yoro, i think both Scholes and Butt are pretty spot on.
Keeping Dalot as one of the senior and experienced player is also sensible especially with CL football coming.
Despite I disagree with them about Dorgu but I can see their reasoning. Before managed by Carrick, Dorgu is hardly have any good games with the team so they might just worried about a limited player hitting purple patch which we had seen many times before.
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There is no sense whatsoever in any take that involves selling Dorgu or Yoro. They are super young players who were brought in more for their potential after a few years than their immediate impact. Why would you sell them when they are like 20 years old? It literally makes 0 sense from any perspective at all, why buy young players and then not even attempt to nurture them into top players?
 
Judas said:
Scholes is a tit, but my god Butt is even worse. Comes across as a proper aggressive clueless bloke. Talks like he was something special, it would be quite funny if he didn't say so much toxic shite.
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Indeed, it's bad for anyone to be that toxic, yet it's worse when he does it like if he was an extraordinary player
 
Sticking with Dorgu where he looked absolutely limited and then getting rid after that mad surge of form would be crazy.

And there's no scenario where keeping Maguire on doesn't make sense.
 
Theonas said:
They both think that Liverpool can't get better than Gerrard to manage them because he "knows" the club. The empowerment these dinosaur traditionalists have been enjoying recently is really dangerous for English football.
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How is it actually dangerous for English football? I highly doubt any of the top teams, nor the FA, take into account the opinions of people like Butt and Scholes.
 
Paul Scholes was a great player but a difficult personality
He clashed with Fergie
Because he got out his willy
Even though he was in an awkward position
He still won plenty at club and nothing at nation level
Nation level
National level
National level
 
jem said:
How is it actually dangerous for English football? I highly doubt any of the top teams, nor the FA, take into account the opinions of people like Butt and Scholes.
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Butt was director of our academy for 5 years and then was made "director of first team development" for a couple of years. So yeah, our club definitively took his opinion into account quite heavily for quite a long time.
 
Hopefully someone will pull Scholes up on this shite when Dorgu and/or Yoro are playing well

Great player but a dreadful pundit
 
jem said:
How is it actually dangerous for English football? I highly doubt any of the top teams, nor the FA, take into account the opinions of people like Butt and Scholes.
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Both reckon Keano should come in.
They don't realise the days you can simply rule by fear are long gone.

Sure they suggested Redknapp in at Spurs too. Though that's less a fear thing and more the know the club / badgekissing dinosaur act.
 
Apokalips said:
There is no sense whatsoever in any take that involves selling Dorgu or Yoro. They are super young players who were brought in more for their potential after a few years than their immediate impact. Why would you sell them when they are like 20 years old? It literally makes 0 sense from any perspective at all, why buy young players and then not even attempt to nurture them into top players?
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Pretty sure none of us will disagree selling Dorgu based on his term under Amorim which most likely the major consideration of Scholes and Butt. As for Yoro, yea i am not sure wtf they are thinking too.
 
jem said:
How is it actually dangerous for English football? I highly doubt any of the top teams, nor the FA, take into account the opinions of people like Butt and Scholes.
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I see their dinosaur nonsense coming back in via the academy system, I can tell you now that for all of the technical brilliance we see some English players come through with now, we better get used to it because academies are going after runners again. Others don't see a link between the quality of football discourse in the mainstream and how that gets reflected in the grassroots/lower elite levels of the game but having been amongst it for the last two years, I can tell you that it is a shite state of affairs.
 
Sandikan said:
Both reckon Keano should come in.
They don't realise the days you can simply rule by fear are long gone.

Sure they suggested Redknapp in at Spurs too. Though that's less a fear thing and more the know the club / badgekissing dinosaur act.
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Yeah and there is zero chance of United following that advice (the same way I reckon both Yoro and Dorgu are safe, despite the ideas of Butt and Scholes.)
 
Devil81 said:
Really don't understand what the problem is, they are supposed to be controversial otherwise nobody would listen would they.

And for me they both come across like working class lads who would be good company for a few pints.
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They're not "supposed" to be anything. But neither has anything interesting, insightful or funny to say, and if they did, I doubt they have the wit or eloquence to say it in a way people would want to listen to. So they're left with being controversial as the only way to get attention.

And I don't know if a guy who beats women is such a great hang, but maybe that's just me.
 
jem said:
Yeah and there is zero chance of United following that advice (the same way I reckon both Yoro and Dorgu are safe, despite the ideas of Butt and Scholes.)
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On another pod they did, they had Nolan of all people on.

He suggested Tottenham should have got Ange Posty back!
How ludicrous is that - he's the guy who oversaw the rot last season and almost took them down!
 
Halftrack said:
They're not "supposed" to be anything. But neither has anything interesting, insightful or funny to say, and if they did, I doubt they have the wit or eloquence to say it in a way people would want to listen to. So they're left with being controversial as the only way to get attention.

And I don't know if a guy who beats women is such a great hang, but maybe that's just me.
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Was anything proven on this?
 
Halftrack said:
They're not "supposed" to be anything. But neither has anything interesting, insightful or funny to say, and if they did, I doubt they have the wit or eloquence to say it in a way people would want to listen to. So they're left with being controversial as the only way to get attention.

And I don't know if a guy who beats women is such a great hang, but maybe that's just me.
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Great lads.

And the podcast is brilliant, hence why it's so popular. Working class lads, maybe your a bit of a snob that doesn't find working class humour funny. That's your own choice and opinion.

I love it and it makes me like them even more. Maybe Rugby Union is more your sport.
 
elmo said:
The world would be a much better place if pundits don’t exist.

It’s amazing how every sport has such terrible pundits.
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It’s interesting how pundits are the only part of the football world today that the game could actually do without. Football cannot exist without fans, players, and managers. You could even argue it wouldn’t be nearly as popular without TV. But pundits are the only group that essentially parasitize the game—football exists perfectly well without them, while they wouldn’t exist without football.

What fascinates me personally is the level of influence various figures like Neville, Carragher, Richards, and others have in English football today (in the media sphere, to be precise). Even Amorim mentioned it in that now-famous recent press conference. Clubs actually care about what someone like Neville or Keane has to say. It’s quite something.
 
Devil81 said:
Great lads.

And the podcast is brilliant, hence why it's so popular. Working class lads, maybe your a bit of a snob that doesn't find working class humour funny. That's your own choice and opinion.

I love it and it makes me like them even more. Maybe Rugby Union is more your sport.
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They annoy all the right people!!! Right?!?!
 
Devil81 said:
Great lads.

And the podcast is brilliant, hence why it's so popular. Working class lads, maybe your a bit of a snob that doesn't find working class humour funny. That's your own choice and opinion.

I love it and it makes me like them even more. Maybe Rugby Union is more your sport.
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Is it actually? Genuinely curious.
 
They get a ridiculous amount of positive comments on their YT vids. Strangely they all read like they're from the same individual though.
 
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Getting rid of Dorgu and wanting to keep Dalot is amazing. I'm not sure any United fan would think that. It's like they aren't watching the games at all.
 
Devil81 said:
Yeah, but they are working class lads at heart and personality.
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This almost insinuates that being "working class at heart and personality" means you're incapable of nuance or insight...
 
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