Pep's spending is insane

OutlawGER

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I think the general thing is he spends money. The branch argument is can he win without it. He does improve players like sterling - but it was a 50m start point. I personally think he could transform any top 6 side into champions, given some cash and time. Mourinho and van gaal failed that here.

I dont buy into the idea hes a god though. Stick him in charge of crystal palace and theyd still be bottom 6 i reckon
Do the same with Klopp, give him 2 years and you'd know they would be challenging for top 4.

Not sure how he would perform with leading top clubs, but for underdogs Klopp is probably the greatest of all time after what he has done with Liverpool and Dortmund.


For me Klopp and Guardiola are the Messi and Ronaldo among managers.
 

Matt007a

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Guardiola is the best at what he does. He can make very good teams into world beaters. He wouldn't be much good at a mid-table side because the players there wouldn't have the ability to play his style.

He isn't as adaptable as other managers which probably prevents him being the best we've ever seen. Mourinho in his prime and Ferguson to name two recent managers did more impressive things with lesser teams. I mean we could go out with players like Obertan, Macheda and Eagles in our team and win games under Fergie, which is something Pep could not do. Mourinho similarly did incredible things at Porto and Inter especially, with good players but nothing like the ones Guardiola has at his disposal.

In some ways I think what Klopp is doing at Liverpool is more impressive. Man for man they're not as strong, they have less depth on the bench and less money, yet they match them toe to toe domestically while also backing it up in Europe.
 

Fluctuation0161

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Countless managers would not succeed, history has plenty examples.

Guardiola always tries to take football to its highest technical levels. He is perfectionist. His training and demands to all his players are extremely exhausting physically and mentally, requiring great concentration, intelligence and the players totally embracing together his philosophy. This is why he does train any club for more than a few years, his works burn out and the players can not maintain the necessary level of dedication and concentration for many years. It is exhausting physically and mentally not only for them, but for Guardiola himself.

The crazily high levels of technique and consistency that Guardiola wants his teams to play and to execute his philosophy to maximum efficience can not be satisfyingly reached in anything other than a top team, specially for someone as perfectionist as him.

Guardiola is a coach that you hire when you already have a great squad full of great players that you want to take to even higher levels. Guardiola is overall fantastic at improving players, making the best players in the world play even better individually and as a team, improving their qualities and masking their weaknesses masterfully. Sterling is a player who has evolved terrifically under Pep. This is his genius! Don't you get anything that I say?
That is the point. He has the most expensively assembled squad ever in history. So there are no other examples!

He's a top manager. But with a distinct advantage of resources. I'm willing to rephrase to, any top manager would succeed with that money.
 

SquishyMcSquish

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Do the same with Klopp, give him 2 years and you'd know they would be challenging for top 4.

Not sure how he would perform with leading top clubs, but for underdogs Klopp is probably the greatest of all time after what he has done with Liverpool and Dortmund.


For me Klopp and Guardiola are the Messi and Ronaldo among managers.

:lol: No they fecking wouldn't.
 

romufc

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First, I suggest you read up on the history of Barcelona and their playing style cos Pep did not create or introduce it. (That credit goes to Michels and subsequently Cryuff). Pep like many managers that are belong to the Ajax 'total football' school of thought have simply added their own variation to it to suit their preferences and/or personnel.

While you may like that style of football, it is silly to assume everyone else does. For example, Klopp employs a far more direct approach to the game and has had his own success. I for one have never liked the possession style of football (and thus would never pick any of the coaches you listed)
Pep is the best at implementing it.
 

matbezlima

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That is the point. He has the most expensively assembled squad ever in history. So there are no other examples!
Players today are much more expensive than in the past. Even a mediocre player today can be more expensive than Zidane at his prime. I was thinking about Galácticos of the 2000s. Or Mourinho's Real in 2010, which was back then the most expansive squad ever.
 

roonster09

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Do the same with Klopp, give him 2 years and you'd know they would be challenging for top 4.

Not sure how he would perform with leading top clubs, but for underdogs Klopp is probably the greatest of all time after what he has done with Liverpool and Dortmund.


For me Klopp and Guardiola are the Messi and Ronaldo among managers.
Good that you kept hyperbole to minimum.
 

Subho611

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Using Pep’s spending as a factor to rationalise his success is akin to saying Apple hasn’t achieved anything if they can’t sell the same iPhone for $100.

There is a reason people pay more for an iPhone in the first place. They have a proven track record of success at the highest level. They would be foolish to sell it for any lesser.

Similarly, why should Guardiola give up being on the forefront of football success to grind out wins with a lesser team just to score points with internet critics who doubt his capability?
 

romufc

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Using Pep’s spending as a factor to rationalise his success is akin to saying Apple hasn’t achieved anything if they can’t sell the same iPhone for $100.

There is a reason people pay more for an iPhone in the first place. They have a proven track record of success at the highest level. They would be foolish to sell it for any lesser.

Similarly, why should Guardiola give up being on the forefront of football success to grind out wins with a lesser team just to score points with internet critics who doubt his capability?
Yes, but like Apple we have seen Pep is not durable for the long run.

I would like to see what Pep can achieve at clubs for longer than 3/4 years. This City stint will be his longest as manager of a football club?
 

Fluctuation0161

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Players today are much more expensive than in the past. Even a mediocre player today can be more expensive than Zidane at his prime. I was thinking about Galácticos of the 2000s. Or Mourinho's Real in 2010, which was back then the most expansive squad ever.
If any top manager (Klopp or Mourinho for example) had inherited the squad he did at City, then went on to spend the amount he has (more then any club has done in premier league history). They would also succeed like Pep.
 

Fluctuation0161

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Using Pep’s spending as a factor to rationalise his success is akin to saying Apple hasn’t achieved anything if they can’t sell the same iPhone for $100.

There is a reason people pay more for an iPhone in the first place. They have a proven track record of success at the highest level. They would be foolish to sell it for any lesser.

Similarly, why should Guardiola give up being on the forefront of football success to grind out wins with a lesser team just to score points with internet critics who doubt his capability?
Because spending is a big factor.

He's bought trophies. If you can accept that then we're on the same page.
 

Amerifan

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Pep’s spending is working. We don’t know how Pep would do with a lesser squad. And as long as he keeps winning we never will.
 

romufc

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If any top manager (Klopp or Mourinho for example) had inherited the squad he did at City, then went on to spend the amount he has (more then any club has done in premier league history). They would also succeed like Pep.

Funny because Jose had money to spend, spent it and done Feck all.

I would rather have spend £150m more and get success.
 

stepic

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Because spending is a big factor.

He's bought trophies. If you can accept that then we're on the same page.
you make it sound like Pep is the only manager in the world that's spent money. which is obviously wrong. we know this literally first hand as United fans.

he's the best manager in the world, comfortably. end of story.
 

SquishyMcSquish

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you make it sound like Pep is the only manager in the world that's spent money. which is obviously wrong. we know this literally first hand as United fans.

he's the best manager in the world, comfortably. end of story.
I think he's the best but I wouldn't say comfortably better than Klopp. We're seeing now that they're basically neck and neck in the league with Guardiola slightly edging it with the greater resources.

Obviously he's won a lot more, but the context of those trophies is important and Klopp's work at Dortmund was also hugely impressive.
 

adz_87

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If any top manager (Klopp or Mourinho for example) had inherited the squad he did at City, then went on to spend the amount he has (more then any club has done in premier league history). They would also succeed like Pep.
I seriously doubt they would be able to do it in the style that pep has. The records he's broke are ridiculous.
 

ayushreddevil9

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I think he's the best but I wouldn't say comfortably better than Klopp. We're seeing now that they're basically neck and neck in the league with Guardiola slightly edging it with the greater resources.

Obviously he's won a lot more, but the context of those trophies is important and Klopp's work at Dortmund was also hugely impressive.
Agreed. Klopp worked it out with limited resources. I don't think Pep will ever join a club that can't buy him 60-70m worth shiny new toys every other season or after every other injury.
 

adexkola

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Pep’s spending is working. We don’t know how Pep would do with a lesser squad. And as long as he keeps winning we never will.
One of two things needs to happen

1. He needs to do a Mourinho (many people say he's better than Guardiola so this may be the most logical choice). Fail completely at City, and the next big club that gives him a chance... Until no big club with resources is willing to hire him. Then go to a smaller club with limited resources, and then contrary to his scorched earth history of the previous 3 years, builds a club up while keeping his net spend below 49.2 million per month in 2023 figures

2. Disturbed by the football observers writing his record off as luck or "Pardew would have done that", he leaves City and takes over Swansea, Girona or Palermo. He attempts to bring them to the top while maintaining a positive net spend, and ignoring the same football observers blasting him for a lack of ambition shown by him refusing to manage their club.

Whatever track he chooses, he needs to show he can win without tiki taka. 'ave it Brexit route 1 football needs to be part of his journey. Definitely pragmatism, loads of that.
 
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Fluctuation0161

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Funny because Jose had money to spend, spent it and done Feck all.

I would rather have spend £150m more and get success.
Jose inherited a much weaker squad. With a much lower value to start with. So the measure equivalent investment would have required much more spending from United.
 

Fluctuation0161

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you make it sound like Pep is the only manager in the world that's spent money. which is obviously wrong. we know this literally first hand as United fans.

he's the best manager in the world, comfortably. end of story.
He inherited a greater squad than any manager at United did. Then went on to spend more. What's with all these self critical United fans who can't see this? Strange.

He's great with unlimited funds. Who wouldn't be?
 

Fluctuation0161

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I seriously doubt they would be able to do it in the style that pep has. The records he's broke are ridiculous.
Style of play is a different argument. Down to individual preference.

Personally, I find Peps possession play with tactical fouls when the opponent counter attacks very boring. But no doubt it is effective.
 

adz_87

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He inherited a greater squad than any manager at United did. Then went on to spend more. What's with all these self critical United fans who can't see this? Strange.

He's great with unlimited funds. Who wouldn't be?
It's extremely unfair and very ignorant to think that all his success is solely down to money. Look at the money we've spent and look where we are. Pep has a clear vision of what player will fit his style and more often than not they just slot right in. He needs good, intelligent players to be able to execute his style of play or it just wouldn't work, and I think he's even admitted that himself. But let's not forget the hunger and desire he has created in that team and how he's improved the likes of sterling, zinchenko and even aguero. Take the red tinted specs off mate, he'll be gone soon.
 

KirkDuyt

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Dont really get the stick him at <insert shite team> and he'd end up bottom 6 stuff. So would all other managers in the fecking world.

Pep might be a twat, but he's also rather good at his job.
 

stepic

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He inherited a greater squad than any manager at United did. Then went on to spend more. What's with all these self critical United fans who can't see this? Strange.

He's great with unlimited funds. Who wouldn't be?
Because of how far ahead of the pack they are compared to us.

If Jose took City’s team over and spent what City has spent, and Pep took United over and spent what United spent in the same time frame, I have no doubt United would be ahead of City right now. He would be training his players in a style that wins games and would be signing players that fit that system.

Money is obviously important but Pep is still the best manager.
 

adexkola

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Dont really get the stick him at <insert shite team> and he'd end up bottom 6 stuff. So would all other managers in the fecking world.

Pep might be a twat, but he's also rather good at his job.
Well you know, you really can't play proactive unless you have money. You think Pep's methods would work in the Championship?
 

VJ1762

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You know, before, I would have said "Pep has managed only loaded teams in his career, so of course he wins", but the way he has transformed Sterling and the entire Man City team to reach heights never before seen in the PL ( just go look at the December 2017 match or any other matches between the teams since he took over) and it always looks like boys(us) playing against men(them). If he wins the title this season, he would have presided over arguably the greatest 3 season stretch in the PL, atleast domestically. Even our teams under SAF have never pummeled teams over the course of an entire season like this. 198 points in 2 seasons? That's insane. He is in contention for the GOAT alongside SAF.

But it's an oddity that he has never won the CL after leaving Barcelona. Just goes on to show that anything can happen in cup competitions.
 

Jimmy_Bond

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Personally can't understand how anyone could rate Guardiola above Klopp.

In my opinion the job Klopp has done at Liverpool far surpasses any job Guardiola has ever done. He's taken a shower of shit that were eighth in the table to being the best in Europe whilst spending about three or four times less than Guardiola after inheriting a squad nowhere near as good (or expensive) as the one Guardiola inherited.

If I could choose one person to be United's manager, it would be Klopp. Guardiola for me is the second best in the world, and I'd love to see how he'd do in a situation like Klopp found himself in when he took over at Liverpool.

Doubt we'll ever see it though to be honest. I think if it started going a bit wrong for Guardiola, he'd just retire. Not sure his ego could cope with having his stock fall, so I think he'd just get out of the game before finding himself in a Jose esque situation, and he'd never take a challenging job whilst his stock is as high as it is now. To he fair, how many would step down just to prove a point?
 

Jimmy_Bond

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But it's an oddity that he has never won the CL after leaving Barcelona. Just goes on to show that anything can happen in cup competitions.
Also highlights his lack of Plan B in the real "last chance saloon" moments of high end European knock out football.

He can't be excused for his lack of CL success post Barca, especially at City where his has spent ungodly sums of money and never got beyond the quarter finals.
 

VJ1762

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Do the same with Klopp, give him 2 years and you'd know they would be challenging for top 4.

but for underdogs Klopp is probably the greatest of all time after what he has done with Liverpool and .
I mean SAF won the European cup winners cup with Aberdeen, defeating Real Madrid. I think to anoint Klopp as the 'greatest' of all time for underdogs is stretching it. He is a great manager, no doubt about that.