Players like Harry Kane: Do you respect them for going down with the ship, or are they wasting their careers?

the_answer

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Similar discussion in the NBA. Do you join a group of other winners or do you try to win on your own?

From a competitiveness standpoint I think if you are a core group of stars. You stay put. Lewandowski, Sahin, Hummels and Goetze staying could have turned Dortmund into a super-power. Why go join some other team where the club will not appreciate you as much as Mueller or Schweinsteiger. (If the money is right, and the club values the core group...) stay put with your core co-stars. I respect that much more. Kante, Mahrez, Vardy... could have lead Leicester to another title.

As a fan I am glad that Kane, Vardy etc. are staying put. Its better for competitiveness.

Even without trophies, people gonna remember you if the performance is up there. Totti, Gerrard, Shearer, Ruud...
 

redrobed

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I personally strive to be the best and win in everything I do so find it a little difficult to respect the lack of ambition of the likes of Shearer, Kane, etc
 

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Respect. Anything that lessens the monopolies of the top teams is a good thing. Outside of your own club, Ill never understand how anyone looks at a player as good as Kane and champions him moving to a bigger club so that they can win another x number of titles.
 

Irwin99

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Loyalty is underrated and the interesting thing about Kane he's pretty close to the all time record at Spurs and he could still easily break that and then do a RVP/Teddy and go and win something late on in his career (hopefully at United :drool: )

I just had a quick look at his goal record on wiki and it's not inconceivable that he could break their goal record by the very end of next season.
 

Liver_bird

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He signed a contract when he believed Spurs were on the precipice of going to the next level. He’s a great striker undeniably, but like many have said he may be content with his all round situation at Spurs. Or we could all be underestimating his desire for trophies and he could try to leave in the summer. His issue is his contract, the economic reality of a post covid world and his injuries specifically his ankle.

Who can afford that outlay on him that he’d realistically move to? Only City and PSG, nobody is going to pay what he’s worth to Spurs. It’s just not financially prudent anymore to spend a 100 million plus on a player in his late 20s there’s just too many variables that can go wrong.
 

Sparky Rhiwabon

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His loyalty is admirable although it’s also cost him a LOT of money personally - Spurs have really played on the “one of our own” card - mind you money isn’t everything, and neither is trophies.

Matt Le Tissier is the other one I always think of here.
 

Desert Eagle

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You can do both just look at the likes of Henry. Kane has done enough to always be a spurs great. As long as he doesn't go to Chelsea he can go anywhere and they will still love him.
 

NoLogo

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Maybe winning and money aren't the most important things for him in life and instead he is someone who prefers things to be steady and familiar. I can respect that, if that makes him happy more power to him.
 

Maluco

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I think these is a side to this that only a few have mentioned. Kane runs after golden boots and individual awards. He often returns early from injury because he wants to play every single game. That stands to reason that he wants a club that will play him every single game. He wants a club where he can basically dictate that and get as many minutes as possible.

His eye is on the PL record and I think that means more to him than winning a PL with Man City, for example.

Where else will he be guaranteed to play every game he is fit until the age of 34/35, which he will almost certainly need to get his record?

I don’t think it’s a lack of ambition. I think it’s a tactical choice to make sure he gets the target that he wants. His focus is the PL record, not winning a trophy. I think he wants to stay in control of that objective.
 

Ibi Dreams

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I respect both staying and leaving. For someone like Kane it's a really difficult decision, and leaving doesn't guarantee anything. If he stays at Spurs he'll probably break records and will be remembered as one of the best strikers to ever play in England, so hard to really say he would have wasted his career. Of course players want to win, but there's something to be said for staying at the club that is your home and doing your best every season to try to make them successful.
 

Maluco

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Might as well start a similar thread on Steven Gerrard. Although he did win a CL winners medal.
A bit harsh on Stevie G. He won everything apart from the PL title. Multiple trophies, and I think he scored in all of the finals too.
 

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I don't care either way, I think loyalty to a club is a silly thing to begin with, because it's rarely reciprocated by the club. I'm much more for player power than the old standard of clubs holding all of the cards. I think Kane is simply wasting his career, his loyalty has not been rewarded with a proper team to help him challenge for titles, and he's now 28 with still some good years ahead of him, but he needs to capitalize now if he wants to become anything more than a local legend.
 

SuperiorXI

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No reason to stay at Spurs unless he's a diehard fan from young which I doubt. Think he is just comfortable where he is so will end his career with probably nothing to show.
 

adexkola

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Did Bryan Robson waste his career at United?

Yes he won two titles at the end but those were bit part contributions from him.

Did DDG waste his career? Did RVN?
 

Pep's Suit

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He signed a contract when he believed Spurs were on the precipice of going to the next level. He’s a great striker undeniably, but like many have said he may be content with his all round situation at Spurs. Or we could all be underestimating his desire for trophies and he could try to leave in the summer. His issue is his contract, the economic reality of a post covid world and his injuries specifically his ankle.

Who can afford that outlay on him that he’d realistically move to? Only City and PSG, nobody is going to pay what he’s worth to Spurs. It’s just not financially prudent anymore to spend a 100 million plus on a player in his late 20s there’s just too many variables that can go wrong.
Nah, City can't afford him. Quite sure they won't spend more than £75-80m on one player this summer or next. And Tottenham would demand at least 'Hazard money' (£150m incl. add-ons).
 

KW2006

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Big fish in a small pond. Just like Lingard at Westham maybe.

What is a real winner? Just see Totti at Roma.
 

M15 Red.

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I imagine Kane would be up for a move to Utd, Madrid, Barca etc. It's just that he'd cost too much in the current climate.

If he forces a move that involves a cash/player exchange then it's possible but I dont see him doing that. I wouldn't put that down to a lack of ambition, though. Rather, he's probably just too much of a nice guy to do it.

Only time will tell if he regrets his decision, because he doesn't look like he's going to be winning anything at Spurs in the next few seasons.
 

Jev

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I think he's been unfortunate, really. When he signed his current contract, he had reason to believe he could be the talisman at a side that were on the verge of taking the next step and becoming proper and regular contenders in the Premier League and Champions League – they had been very close in both competitions already. Since he signed, Tottenham's project has nosedived, and now he's stuck on that contract in a COVID environment where it's almost impossible to imagine a top club paying £100 million for a 28-year-old player.

Generally, I respect players who remain loyal to their favourite team, and I can understand why some players find it more fulfilling to be in a safe environment with teammates you like and fans who love you than winning trophies. I also think many fans and media have an incredibly shallow focus on trophies as a mark of greatness, as if Harry Kane instantly became a better player because Spurs won a League Cup.

DDG is another example.
 
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Liver_bird

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Nah, City can't afford him. Quite sure they won't spend more than £75-80m on one player this summer or next. And Tottenham would demand at least 'Hazard money' (£150m incl. add-ons).
City can quite easily afford him given their vast resources. Whether they would ever choose to invest that kind of money in Kane is another matter. They don’t strike me as the kind of club that would make that sort of move in the transfer market. They’ve been a well run club for years and they have pretty good decision makers at every level. Even their PR pieces manage to take root, they’ve amassed a squad with 50-60 million players all over the place and have sold seemingly only Sane for a big fee in the last decade. That’s where they end up being able to say we don’t spend world record fees because we can’t afford it. They have a backup squad that would challenge for the top 6.

They also have the kind of power which means they don’t need to be bending over backwards, if Haalands entourage for instance charges them a kings ransom they’ll walk away. They have the money but they’re trying to build a reputation. It’s just a shame FFP was such a disaster and couldn’t reign the oil clubs in.
 

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Isn't he only on about 200k a week? He's wasting away the prime years of his career earning less than players half of his ability do at bigger clubs. I'd have fired my agent if I was him.
For some people life isn't just about money
 

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Loyalty should be admired but not competing for, and winning the biggest trophies will also somewhat mean that he will never be in the conversations with the all time great CF’s imo. Unless he propels England to a couple of international titles.
 

Demyanenko_square_jaw

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It's up to the player what they want out of their own career.

One thing i don't respect much is the idea that someone has to go to only a few "top clubs" to be a great player. It's a simplistic viewpoint that is bad for the sport.
 

Suv666

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Can't believe posters are looking down on Kane for choosing loyalty over money and glory.
 

tjb

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He doesn't really have a choice.

Its the reason I despise clubs like Spurs and Everton. Players are misinformed into going to those type of situations only to be anchored down by unrealistic price tags set by some of these clubs.

Spurs aren't Arsenal, they don't have the history, pedigree or fan support of the big clubs. They aren't City who can promise big wages or ambition, United who have a massive fanbase and can promise popularity, wages and have the historical element.

Look at Koulibaly at Napoli, forced to spend his prime years due to their owner making ridiculous demands. He might have gone on to have a succesful career like a Vidic or Van Dijk, players that will be remembered by fans. Not every player is Totti or Batistuta, who are so great that they are immortalized by fans despite their clubs not providing them the tools to succeed at the highest level. Players like Ayala, who could have been viewed as the greatest defender of their era, are now forgotten. Imagine if Nesta had decided not to leave Lazio and played his entire career there?
 

Bale Bale Bale

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I think these is a side to this that only a few have mentioned. Kane runs after golden boots and individual awards. He often returns early from injury because he wants to play every single game. That stands to reason that he wants a club that will play him every single game. He wants a club where he can basically dictate that and get as many minutes as possible.

His eye is on the PL record and I think that means more to him than winning a PL with Man City, for example.

Where else will he be guaranteed to play every game he is fit until the age of 34/35, which he will almost certainly need to get his record?

I don’t think it’s a lack of ambition. I think it’s a tactical choice to make sure he gets the target that he wants. His focus is the PL record, not winning a trophy. I think he wants to stay in control of that objective.
He would have a better chance of breaking the goals record at City though you'd have thought, even if he doesn't play every minute.

No reason to stay at Spurs unless he's a diehard fan from young which I doubt. Think he is just comfortable where he is so will end his career with probably nothing to show.
Could still end up being Tottenham's, England's and the Premier League's record goal scorer so not quite nothing. Maybe England will do Spurs a favour by winning something, might take the pressure off :lol:
 

Ace Krampus

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In an ideal world, the Premier League would field 20 competitive teams. Given that that's not likely to ever be the case, having star players spread out as much as possible is the best we can hope for.

He'll also be immortalized by the fans who've watched him week in and week out, as opposed to being an also-ran at City or Madrid or whatever Traveling Wilburys super group is en vogue at the moment.
 

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He doesn't really have a choice.

Its the reason I despise clubs like Spurs and Everton. Players are misinformed into going to those type of situations only to be anchored down by unrealistic price tags set by some of these clubs.

Spurs aren't Arsenal, they don't have the history, pedigree or fan support of the big clubs. They aren't City who can promise big wages or ambition, United who have a massive fanbase and can promise popularity, wages and have the historical element.

Look at Koulibaly at Napoli, forced to spend his prime years due to their owner making ridiculous demands. He might have gone on to have a succesful career like a Vidic or Van Dijk, players that will be remembered by fans. Not every player is Totti or Batistuta, who are so great that they are immortalized by fans despite their clubs not providing them the tools to succeed at the highest level. Players like Ayala, who could have been viewed as the greatest defender of their era, are now forgotten. Imagine if Nesta had decided not to leave Lazio and played his entire career there?
Spurs, Everton and Napoli are well within their rights to rule out sales for assets they have invested a huge amount of money, time and resources in. Players shouldn't sign long-term contracts if they're not willing to stay long-term. The idea that clubs have an obligation to sell want-away players is the path to player power and only benefits the biggest clubs, who have way too much power already.
 

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I just hope we aren’t asking this question about Bruno in a season or two.......
 

Maluco

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He would have a better chance of breaking the goals record at City though you'd have thought, even if he doesn't play every minute.
Even improving on his goal output, he will still have to depend on managers coming and going, rotation, competition and new arrivals.

Aguero is one of the greatest strikers of his generation and he is done at City at only 32 years old.

Spurs will have him at the focus and captain until he is ready to retire. And he will have the authority to say when he plays for the most part.
 

Canuckred64

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You have to respect the loyalty, but I feel that after you have retired you do not get the accolades or respect you probably deserve if you have not won any major trophies.
 

Gio

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He doesn't really have a choice.

Its the reason I despise clubs like Spurs and Everton. Players are misinformed into going to those type of situations only to be anchored down by unrealistic price tags set by some of these clubs.

Spurs aren't Arsenal, they don't have the history, pedigree or fan support of the big clubs. They aren't City who can promise big wages or ambition, United who have a massive fanbase and can promise popularity, wages and have the historical element.

Look at Koulibaly at Napoli, forced to spend his prime years due to their owner making ridiculous demands. He might have gone on to have a succesful career like a Vidic or Van Dijk, players that will be remembered by fans. Not every player is Totti or Batistuta, who are so great that they are immortalized by fans despite their clubs not providing them the tools to succeed at the highest level. Players like Ayala, who could have been viewed as the greatest defender of their era, are now forgotten. Imagine if Nesta had decided not to leave Lazio and played his entire career there?
I agree that Ayala and Koulibaly don’t get the kudos they deserve, but I’m not sure it is their clubs who are to blame. After all, they weren’t wet-behind-the-ears 15-year-olds ready to be exploited by unscrupulous clubs. They were seasoned and wealthy professionals armed with clued-up agents looking after their interests and who knew precisely the length of contract they were signing up for. If it’s about their stature in the game, the only people that don’t recognise how good they were are those fans who cannot separate the quality of the individual from the quality of the team (or league). It was patently obvious to many that both of these performed to a world-class level for a number of years even though their club wasn’t always at that level.

In Ayala’s case he did have a spell at Milan and joined a club midway through back-to-back CL finals which showed the platform to showcase his abilities to a wide audience was very much part of his career. Perhaps as you say it wasn’t high enough profile to give him the legacy he deserves as a player who was comfortably the best defender in the strongest league in Europe during the first half of the 2000s.
 

Andycoleno9

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If i am pro top football player, one day when i retire i would want to see trophies in my CV. Lots of them. What will Kane have? Nothing. Individual records for club and that is it.

Wasting his career just like some other players do.
 

Jam

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If i am pro top football player, one day when i retire i would want to see trophies in my CV. Lots of them. What will Kane have? Nothing. Individual records for club and that is it.

Wasting his career just like some other players do.
If you yourself made it as a footballer and were United’s best player for a solid 10+ years, while the club was “in amongst it” albeit falling short of trophies, would you want to move to City/Liverpool/Tottenham/Chelsea?

There’s a lot of sentimentality to things. He’s a club legend and still earning fair whack.
 

Jam

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Honestly some of you people with the violins out for Kane.

He’s at Spurs through his own volition, and is handsomely rich and leading the line for England. He isn’t a slave being held hostage by Levy. He obviously would want trophies he’s also by all accounts happy there.

I imagine winning one trophy as Spurs captain leading the line would mean a lot more to him than five trophies as a cog at City.
 

Andycoleno9

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If you yourself made it as a footballer and were United’s best player for a solid 10+ years, while the club was “in amongst it” albeit falling short of trophies, would you want to move to City/Liverpool/Tottenham/Chelsea?

There’s a lot of sentimentality to things. He’s a club legend and still earning fair whack.
Yes. I would go to any club where i would win trophies. Any. No sentiments when you are a player because it is your job and your career. And like in any other career you want to earn money and have success. In football success are trophies.
 

tjb

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Spurs, Everton and Napoli are well within their rights to rule out sales for assets they have invested a huge amount of money, time and resources in. Players shouldn't sign long-term contracts if they're not willing to stay long-term. The idea that clubs have an obligation to sell want-away players is the path to player power and only benefits the biggest clubs, who have way too much power already.
Fans then, and clubs then, do not have the right to expect players not to run down their contracts. A player should not be vilified for that.
 

kidbob

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I can definitely respect the loyalty but, for me, even if Kane breaks Shearers's record in the PL and Rooney's record for England I don't think he will ever belong in the same conversation as either, especially Rooney. The fact is he can score all the goals he wants but someone like Rooney was one of the best players for nearly ten years while winning trophies and playing in the best competitions since 18. If he doesn't leave Spurs then Kane will end up like Le Tissier, an absolutely incredible player but there will always be question marks over his ability to play for and with the very best. World Class but just a footnote in history compared to someone like Rooney who will be remembered as a flagship player of his generation.

Now I think Kane is currently the best striker in the World and would instantly make us or Chelsea title contenders but if he never makes the move then it will always be kind of what if.

The likes of Maldini, Scholes and Giggs were one man clubs but they were one man clubs at the very best clubs not at bloody Spurs.
 

Isotope

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As a pro, it's hard to admire him for not going to challenge himself and reach the highest. He has all the talent and skill.