Pogba apologises to fans after Cardiff

Jazz

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Erm, what has any of that got to do with anything I posted?

My post was not about loyalty or professionalism. My post was about STANDARDS. Pogba seems content with 6th, content with turning up for 1 in every 4 or 5 games. The players I listed would not be content with the standards Pogba seems happy with.

That fan had every right to voice his concern, the standards have been shocking.
He didn't voice his concerns - he abused him. Big difference there.
 

Loublaze

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Erm, what has any of that got to do with anything I posted?

My post was not about loyalty or professionalism. My post was about STANDARDS. Pogba seems content with 6th, content with turning up for 1 in every 4 or 5 games. The players I listed would not be content with the standards Pogba seems happy with.

That fan had every right to voice his concern, the standards have been shocking.
You have no idea what he's content with unless you live in the man's head
 

Gasolin

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happy to see both of them leave in the summer
There is no way we let Paul leave just like that, we need to focus with him, he can win a world cup, he can win the league or the CL with us, and yes, it's a long way to go, there are 9 other field players too, but he's worth more than many in the world. But we need to start investing into some players.
 

dogwithabone

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I just do not see how Pogba fits in to the way Ole supposedly wants us to play. What message is that lazy shrug of the shoulders and outstretched arms going to give to other players who have been told to chase everything ?
 

TRUERED89

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I just do not see how Pogba fits in to the way Ole supposedly wants us to play. What message is that lazy shrug of the shoulders and outstretched arms going to give to other players who have been told to chase everything ?
He done very well under Ole until the whole team fell apart post PSG 2nd leg.
 

Holocene

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I just do not see how Pogba fits in to the way Ole supposedly wants us to play. What message is that lazy shrug of the shoulders and outstretched arms going to give to other players who have been told to chase everything ?
Here’s a crazy thought:

Maybe, just maybe, Ole wants to keep our best player?

Crazy, I know.
 

VP89

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Here’s a crazy thought:

Maybe, just maybe, Ole wants to keep our best player?

Crazy, I know.
There's not a single player in the outfield first XI that deserves to play week in week out, bar Lindelof and arguably Shaw.

Pogba was our best player for about 3 months out of 9 this season.
 

Jib

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There's not a single player in the outfield first XI that deserves to play week in week out, bar Lindelof and arguably Shaw.

Pogba was our best player for about 3 months out of 9 this season.
Our best player since august 2016*
 

Holocene

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He's one of our most senior players now. He needs to grow up and be a leader for youngsters like Lingard, McTominay & Greenwood etc to look up to.
People still think Lingard is young? He’s older than Pogba...

There's not a single player in the outfield first XI that deserves to play week in week out, bar Lindelof and arguably Shaw.

Pogba was our best player for about 3 months out of 9 this season.
I was quoting a post about why Ole would want Pogba. Of course Ole would want him. Pogba’s best performances in a United shirt came under Ole.

I would include Pogba in the list of players that deserves to be in the starting XI. He was our most productive player this season.
 

VP89

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People still think Lingard is young? He’s older than Pogba...



I was quoting a post about why Ole would want Pogba. Of course Ole would want him. Pogba’s best performances in a United shirt came under Ole.

I would include Pogba in the list of players that deserves to be in the starting XI. He was our most productive player this season.
But it means feck all being "the most productive" if you only cluster your input in a span of 3 months and go relatively anonymous for the other 6.

Again being the best out of a bad bunch by way productivity doesn't insinuate he's suddenly worthy of playing for us. The entire squad needs scrapping ideally.

If I were to accept your premise that we keep him, he reportedly wants to go. Why would you keep a player that wants out? His mind would obviously be elsewhere.
 

Holocene

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But it means feck all being "the most productive" if you only cluster your input in a span of 3 months and go relatively anonymous for the other 6.

Again being the best out of a bad bunch by way productivity doesn't insinuate he's suddenly worthy of playing for us. The entire squad needs scrapping ideally.

If I were to accept your premise that we keep him, he reportedly wants to go. Why would you keep a player that wants out? His mind would obviously be elsewhere.
I agree with your point about our squad. It’s shit and a sad state of affairs.

But Pogba’s numbers are decent for a team that finished 6th. He’s the most talented player we have and I want to see him with better players (players I hope we sign over the next few windows).

You don’t know for a fact he wants to leave. You say yourself that it’s based on reports. It isn’t fact. If speaks to Ole and Woodward, and tells them is he ready to leave, then so be it. We should sell him. I don’t want an unhappy player in the team.

But if he’s still here at the start of next season, I think it’s a big indicator that he wants to stay and is ready to be part of Ole’s project.

It’s all speculation at this point.
 

VP89

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I agree with your point about our squad. It’s shit and a sad state of affairs.

But Pogba’s numbers are decent for a team that finished 6th. He’s the most talented player we have and I want to see him with better players (players I hope we sign over the next few windows).

You don’t know for a fact he wants to leave. You say yourself that it’s based on reports. It isn’t fact. If speaks to Ole and Woodward, and tells them is he ready to leave, then so be it. We should sell him. I don’t want an unhappy player in the team.

But if he’s still here at the start of next season, I think it’s a big indicator that he wants to stay and is ready to be part of Ole’s project.

It’s all speculation at this point.
You're in serious denial if you think he doesn't want to leave. There's speculation and then there's credible reports and journalists all pointing the same way, coupled by his cryptic words to the media since the start of the season.

As for his numbers, I've already addressed it. It means nothing if he's just putting them in for 3 months of the season. He's a player that can't maintain consistency over the course of the league. It's partly why he's great in the world Cup where there's just a few games and gets found out over a longer stretch.
 

Matt 1978

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Remember he didn't play second leg of psg, but he was there first leg, what difference does he make? - - - - - zero. Get him out.
 

Holocene

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You're in serious denial if you think he doesn't want to leave. There's speculation and then there's credible reports and journalists all pointing the same way, coupled by his cryptic words to the media since the start of the season.

As for his numbers, I've already addressed it. It means nothing if he's just putting them in for 3 months of the season. He's a player that can't maintain consistency over the course of the league. It's partly why he's great in the world Cup where there's just a few games and gets found out over a longer stretch.
You’re twisting my words. I never said he doesn’t want to leave. I said it’s speculation from the media. Which it is. I would love to see these “credible reports”.

It’s obvious you don’t rate him that highly. It’s your opinion and you’re entitled to it.

I don’t want him here against his will or by offering him a stupid contract that cripples the club but I do hope we keep him otherwise.

What’s the other option? We sell him for a large sum of money (£120M+). Woodward will piss away that money on yet more average players. We already have to address the midfield because of Hererra. Matic isn’t good enough. That’s potentially 3 midfielders needed. Never mind that we need a CB, RB and RW. It’s too many positions to address in one window. It isn’t plausible.
 

VP89

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You’re twisting my words. I never said he doesn’t want to leave. I said it’s speculation from the media. Which it is. I would love to see these “credible reports”.

It’s obvious you don’t rate him that highly. It’s your opinion and you’re entitled to it.

I don’t want him here against his will or by offering him a stupid contract that cripples the club but I do hope we keep him otherwise.

What’s the other option? We sell him for a large sum of money (£120M+). Woodward will piss away that money on yet more average players. We already have to address the midfield because of Hererra. Matic isn’t good enough. That’s potentially 3 midfielders needed. Never mind that we need a CB, RB and RW. It’s too many positions to address in one window. It isn’t plausible.
I'm not going to bother showing you the links to all reports but as a starer you can refer to the seasons beginning when Pogba pretty much said he's not happy, or James Ducker (highly credible journalist for Man Utd) citing twice that Pogba wanted to leave (once under Jose and once recently). Then there is a mountain of other reports from other sources. I think Evra also hinted Pogba may well leave and he knows him better than most. That goes beyond generic "speculation".

As for what you'd do with the money, you'd use it to buy a proper midfield that works best for the team. The best individual may not be the best fit for the team. Talent isn't the only requisite. The funds you quoted can provide for say Neves, Rabiot (free) and Bruno Fernandes. That's an entirely new midfield from one player who has underperformed for 3 years.
 

Garethw

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Haven't got through all of this, but from what I'm hearing... Fecking on point!
People do not boo Pogba because he is black.
Remember he didn't play second leg of psg, but he was there first leg, what difference does he make? - - - - - zero. Get him out.
Keane and Scholes didn’t play in the CL final in ‘99. It doesn’t work like that.
 

dogwithabone

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Here’s a crazy thought:

Maybe, just maybe, Ole wants to keep our best player?

Crazy, I know.

Ozil is undoubtedly Arsenal’s best player but they’d off load him like a shot if they could find a buyer. Pogba is our Ozil, talented but with a poor attitude.

Being the supposed best individual player doesn’t mean anything if he can’t integrate that individualism into a team ethic and i don’t think Pogba can, not at Manchester United anyway.

On paper you’d never compare Henderson or Wiljnaldum to Pogba but they tick boxes that Pogba doesn’t and they’re the driving force behind a cohesive team.
 

Garethw

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Is that all you took from that? :rolleyes:
I only watched the first couple of minutes mate. I just think the ones booing him are idiots not racists.

The booing of Pogba (top goal scorer etc) is cringeworthy and pathetic. But I don’t think it’s race related for 99.9% of the fans.
 

afrocentricity

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I only watched the first couple of minutes mate. I just think the ones booing him are idiots not racists.

The booing of Pogba (top goal scorer etc) is cringeworthy and pathetic. But I don’t think it’s race related for 99.9% of the fans.
How would you know anyway? Why try to speak for the whole userbase? It's obviously not 0.1% but that's beside the point...

The fan criticism is OTT, whether it's because they are following media narratives, are bigots/racists, don't understand the player, or just generally don't like him... Pick your poison.

Either way, he doesn't deserve it, there are other players that deserve more but get less.

It irks me that you watched 5 minutes, decided that was all it was about and switched off, but that's how it goes anyway, so I won't dig you out over it. There are 2 people talking with 2 different opinions and the video is what? 40 odd minutes? Probably best to watch it further before commenting no?
 
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JPRouve

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I only watched the first couple of minutes mate. I just think the ones booing him are idiots not racists.

The booing of Pogba (top goal scorer etc) is cringeworthy and pathetic. But I don’t think it’s race related for 99.9% of the fans.
I'm pretty sure that they agreed that it wasn't racism but maybe bigotry.
 

Garethw

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How would you know anyway? Why try to speak for the whole userbase? It's obviously not 0.01% but that's beside the point...

The fan criticism is OTT. Whether it's because they are following media narratives, are bigots/racists, don't understand the player, or just generally don't like him... Pick your poison.

Either way, he doesn't deserve it, there are other players that deserve more but get less.
I should re-phrase that. I’d like to believe that in 2019 the colour of someone’s skin does not cause fans to boo them. I’m giving the fan base the benefit of the doubt.

I honestly think it’s to do with the media’s fascination with Pogba’s social media activities. They spin it as a negative and the fans jump all over it.

Lukaku was appalling last season, as was Young, but they weren’t booed. Why target one black man and not the other black players that are under-performing? Personally I just think he pisses fans off. That has zero to do with his skin colour.

Pogba doesn’t deserve the stick at all. I am always fighting his corner on here. Fans should be venting their frustrations at the board.
 

Garethw

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I'm pretty sure that they agreed that it wasn't racism but maybe bigotry.
I didn’t watch the whole video. The first couple of minutes sounded like they believed that Pogba was targeted because of his skin colour.
 

afrocentricity

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I should re-phrase that. I’d like to believe that in 2019 the colour of someone’s skin does not cause fans to boo them. I’m giving the fan base the benefit of the doubt.

I honestly think it’s to do with the media’s fascination with Pogba’s social media activities. They spin it as a negative and the fans jump all over it.

Lukaku was appalling last season, as was Young, but they weren’t booed. Why target one black man and not the other black players that are under-performing? Personally I just think he pisses fans off. That has zero to do with his skin colour.

Pogba doesn’t deserve the stick at all. I am always fighting his corner on here. Fans should be venting their frustrations at the board.
See... Your views aren't that far from theirs. All the points you made are covered...
 

crossy1686

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I didn’t watch the whole video. The first couple of minutes sounded like they believed that Pogba was targeted because of his skin colour.
Anyone who hosts or appears on a fan cam is a reactionary, emotional moron. I wouldn't take anything they say seriously or see it as anything more than a comedy sketch.
 

Sweet Square

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Oh god not this shite again.

They booed Pogba because they were old reactionary men who hate the show boating shtick and also because Pogba is quite clearly a massive bell end.

Anyone who hosts or appears on a fan cam is a reactionary, emotional moron. I wouldn't take anything they say seriously or see it as anything more than a comedy sketch.
Pretty much this. They literally get paid in clicks.
 

JPRouve

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I didn’t watch the whole video. The first couple of minutes sounded like they believed that Pogba was targeted because of his skin colour.
No, they are talking about the whole package and about the difference in treatment between players based on their appearance, personalities and place of birth. They basically answer the points that you make in the post above this one.
 

VP89

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Well done mate, another one to jump the gun. Irony...
Not really jumping the gun. You are suggesting there is a racial element in your post, among other undertones and you don't really seem to appreciate the explanation that he's booed because he's shite for the level we pay him.
 

Cassidy

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Not really jumping the gun. You are suggesting there is a racial element in your post, among other undertones and you don't really seem to appreciate the explanation that he's booed because he's shite for the level we pay him.
I don't think the OP did, they listed all of the things which have been referenced in this thread and basically said pick your poison.