Other Pop culture becoming an oligopoly.

[BusbyMalone]

It feels to me like commonality is a big part of the appeal (and subsequently something I often feel the exact opposite feeling to).

I didn't understand this really until I dated a girl who liked Marvel movies and once sat round a table with her friends while they were talking about it. I couldn't imagine there was much to talk about but they sure were prattling on.

It's the exact same situation with TV. Most people watch TV because it's fun to talk about it with people - look at this place for example. There's a big difference in quality for sure but the motivation is the same.

All this is of course magnified by some trillions in the always-on, ever-connected digital age.

Edit - I'm basically describing the Network Effect - https://www.investopedia.com/terms/n/network-effect.asp

Yeah, that's a part of it for sure. There's definitely a cultural bonding going on due to the fact that it's so easy to connect with others.

Although that can also warp your perception of what is actually popular. We do underestimate the mainstream at times. I was reading about Breaking Bad, a show that obviously invited a lot of intense discussion and debate and seemed like it was watched by everyone, only to learn that it got fewer viewers per episode than Chicago Fire. A show that I don't hear ANYONE talk about or, quite frankly, a show that I didn't even know existed.

 

[Vidyoyo]

Yeah, that's a part of it for sure. There's definitely a cultural bonding going on due to the fact that it's so easy to connect with others.

Although that can also warp your perception of what is actually popular. We do underestimate the mainstream at times. I was reading about Breaking Bad, a show that obviously invited a lot of intense discussion and debate and seemed like it was watched by everyone, only to learn that it got fewer viewers per episode than Chicago Fire. A show that I don't hear ANYONE talk about or, quite frankly, a show that I didn't even know existed.

Ooo that's interesting. I'm surprised by that

 

[JPRouve]

Whenever I see these points made, I feel totally excluded. I don't listen nor care for pop music. On the few occasions where I see artists that are supposed to be in that category of currently popular artists they are complete strangers. Like that woman that was singing before the CL final(Duo Lupa?), isn't she supposed to be a big thing?

 

[caid]

Whenever I see these points made, I feel totally excluded. I don't listen nor care for pop music. On the few occasions where I see artists that are supposed to be in that category of currently popular artists they are complete strangers. Like that woman that was singing before the CL final(Duo Lupa?), isn't she supposed to be a big thing?

Similar experience across mediums. I think marvel / disney movies are the only one i have any awareness of.

 

[BusbyMalone]

Whenever I see these points made, I feel totally excluded. I don't listen nor care for pop music. On the few occasions where I see artists that are supposed to be in that category of currently popular artists they are complete strangers. Like that woman that was singing before the CL final(Duo Lupa?), isn't she supposed to be a big thing?

Bloody hell grandad, that was Camila Cabello

 

[JPRouve]

Bloody hell grandad, that was Camila Cabello

They are as irrelevant as the other. And it's a bit insulting for grandads, I bet most of them are more aware than I am due to their grandkids.

 

[predator]

Probably been mentioned buy so many modern songs are samples of older ones.

 

[JPRouve]

Probably been mentioned buy so many modern songs are samples of older ones.

Interpreted by terrible artists.

 

[BusbyMalone]

They are as irrelevant as the other. And it's a bit insulting for grandads, I bet most of them are more aware than I am due to their grandkids.

I've heard the sum total of ONE song from her. So I'm no wiser!

 

[BusbyMalone]

Probably been mentioned buy so many modern songs are samples of older ones.

In 2019 I think it was 1 in 5 songs in the Billboard top 100 included samples. A big jump from where it was a decade ago.

 

[Hamnat]

All the while.... TV has more variety than ever, I think.

90's and early 00's it was heavy laugh track sitcoms and police procedurals. Well from an American point of view, but a lot of this.

With so many streaming services now hungry for content and all the money from major studios attracting what used to be exclusive to film. A list movie stars in these custom high profile shows and mini series. Tv quality, diversity, and sheer range of options has never been higher. You used to never see an A list movie star agreeing to do television. Now with all these multi million dollar prestige productions they easily sign on. There is no actor almost "too big" for a tv show now.

 

[Cheimoon]

Well, there were some high-profile sequels back then, if "back then" we mean the 90s and 80s. Terminator 2, The Lost World: Jurassic Park, Toy Story 2, and Star Wars: Phantom Menace were the sequels that made up the top 15 highest grossing of the 90s. The 80s actually had a lot of high-profile sequels: Aliens, The Empire Strikes Back, Mad Max 2, Back To The Future Part 2, Beverly Hills Cop 2, Superman 2, and a few more. They just weren't making the massive amounts of money that today's sequels, prequels, etc., are making.

Terminator 2 and The Lost World didn't crack the top ten grossing of the '90s, and Toy Story 2 was tenth.

Also, just to reiterate, we're focusing on movies here, but this is across the board.

Isn't that a lot less than what we're seeing right now? Cause that's just a handful of films from a decade+. Those are just examples of course, but in general, from my recollection and watching from the 70s, 80s, and 90s (and before), sequels and the like, or cinematic universes (or similar concepts) just weren't as common in film back then.

Same for video games pre-90s, but that was very much still a nascent industry back then. Obviously, there were a lot of games series in the 90s already. But I do wonder how commonly a big title was a new thing back then compared to now. I do think game studios have become more conservative in that sense, and are now less willing to invest big money in something entirely new. (My brother is in the games industry and mentioned something about that some years ago.) Again, that might also be because big titles have become much more expensive and therefore have a greater need to be a surefire hit. And that's similar with movies.

I guess what I would need, is a chart that considers all big titles (movies, games) released each year and indicates which percentage of them is part of a franchise. As I said, my impression is that this has gone up as well.

Again, I have no idea what's the deal with books and music. I'm not sure it's necessarily the same societal dynamic at play though. As I said, music is consumed very differently from the other categories and is heavily influenced by the dynamics of online music (unlike all the others). And budget isn't as much of a thing for books - although maybe it is if marketing budgets are considered?

 

[Cheimoon]

Yeah, that's a part of it for sure. There's definitely a cultural bonding going on due to the fact that it's so easy to connect with others.

Although that can also warp your perception of what is actually popular. We do underestimate the mainstream at times. I was reading about Breaking Bad, a show that obviously invited a lot of intense discussion and debate and seemed like it was watched by everyone, only to learn that it got fewer viewers per episode than Chicago Fire. A show that I don't hear ANYONE talk about or, quite frankly, a show that I didn't even know existed.

This part of the conversation makes me wonder what role social media play here. They sure have made entertainment much more socially connected.

 

[caid]

Isn't that a lot less than what we're seeing right now? Cause that's just a handful of films from a decade+. Those are just examples of course, but in general, from my recollection and watching from the 70s, 80s, and 90s (and before), sequels and the like, or cinematic universes (or similar concepts) just weren't as common in film back then.

Same for video games pre-90s, but that was very much still a nascent industry back then. Obviously, there were a lot of games series in the 90s already. But I do wonder how commonly a big title was a new thing back then compared to now. I do think game studios have become more conservative in that sense, and are now less willing to invest big money in something entirely new. (My brother is in the games industry and mentioned something about that some years ago.) Again, that might also be because big titles have become much more expensive and therefore have a greater need to be a surefire hit. And that's similar with movies.

I guess what I would need, is a chart that considers all big titles (movies, games) released each year and indicates which percentage of them is part of a franchise. As I said, my impression is that this has gone up as well.

Again, I have no idea what's the deal with books and music. I'm not sure it's necessarily the same societal dynamic at play though. As I said, music is consumed very differently from the other categories and is heavily influenced by the dynamics of online music (unlike all the others). And budget isn't as much of a thing for books - although maybe it is if marketing budgets are considered?

Maybe i'm wrong but i thought franchising and branding is a relatively recent concept that wasn't particularly present before the 70's or so and it only really started kicking off in the early 90's.

I think in some ways the idea of a cinematic universe is kind of oversold too. I think Marvel's success has in large part been due to consistently making 'good' movies (or at least good in comparison to the competition in the braindead summer blockbuster competition) and with the recent quality drop they'll have a harder time dragging people out to see obscure marvel hero #26. The guarantee of an enjoyable 2 hours just hasn't been there recently and i dont think its gone unnoticed.

 

[Wibble]

Whenever I see these points made, I feel totally excluded. I don't listen nor care for pop music. On the few occasions where I see artists that are supposed to be in that category of currently popular artists they are complete strangers. Like that woman that was singing before the CL final(Duo Lupa?), isn't she supposed to be a big thing?

Chart music is now so terrible that I avoid it totally. To the point that I had never heard The Shape of You until it became a court case and apparently it was the best selling single of that year. It didn't make me want to shove red hot pokers in my ears to make it stop but how such a bland song even made the charts, much less topped them, I have no idea.

If they never made another superhero movie I would be celebrating in the streets.

 

[Wibble]

Bloody hell grandad, that was Camila Cabello

Who? At least I've heard the name Duo Lipa although I don't think I'd know anything she has released and probably don't want to.

 

[Cheimoon]

Who? At least I've heard the name Duo Lipa although I don't think I'd know anything she has released and probably don't want to.

I'll one-up this and say I don't know either name, or this Shape of You song. :P

The thing with music, though, is that it's now so easy to sit in your niche and never get out, and still enjoy tons of music. In the 80s, everybody knew the big hits, cause they were omnipresent. Nowadays, probably the only time I hear mainstream hits (if there is still such a thing) is when I'm in a store or so - and my mind is very good at cancelling out sound and images (like website ads) that I don't need.

Although this does make me wonder why the smash hits are more concentrated nowadays, then.

 

[BusbyMalone]

Isn't that a lot less than what we're seeing right now? Cause that's just a handful of films from a decade+. Those are just examples of course, but in general, from my recollection and watching from the 70s, 80s, and 90s (and before), sequels and the like, or cinematic universes (or similar concepts) just weren't as common in film back then.

Same for video games pre-90s, but that was very much still a nascent industry back then. Obviously, there were a lot of games series in the 90s already. But I do wonder how commonly a big title was a new thing back then compared to now. I do think game studios have become more conservative in that sense, and are now less willing to invest big money in something entirely new. (My brother is in the games industry and mentioned something about that some years ago.) Again, that might also be because big titles have become much more expensive and therefore have a greater need to be a surefire hit. And that's similar with movies.

I guess what I would need, is a chart that considers all big titles (movies, games) released each year and indicates which percentage of them is part of a franchise. As I said, my impression is that this has gone up as well.

Again, I have no idea what's the deal with books and music. I'm not sure it's necessarily the same societal dynamic at play though. As I said, music is consumed very differently from the other categories and is heavily influenced by the dynamics of online music (unlike all the others). And budget isn't as much of a thing for books - although maybe it is if marketing budgets are considered?

Yeah, the sequels I mentioned from the 90s are just the ones that made the highest grossing list of that decade, it's not an exhaustive list of all the sequels made that decade. I just haven't looked, to be honest. It was more to point out that out of the top 15 highest grossing of the decade, only a few of them were sequels, prequels, etc. I had a quick browse of the '80s, and there were a lot of sequels, etc. A few of them made the highest grossing of the decade, but not to the degree which they do now.

But yes, there's no doubt that sequels and the like were less common back then, which again leads back to the question of why. And obviously, I don't have a definitive answer for this, and I'm assuming we're not going to get one. It may very well be the case that people were always willing to accept the same thing over and over again, but were simply not provided with that thing to the degree that they are now. Or maybe it's something particular about the culture in the mid-late nighties and going into the 21st century, that was more receptive to this. Now what that thing is, I don't know. Is it a more broad political and cultural thing? Are we a society and culture that yearns for the past and that has manifested its way into pop culture?

No idea, but it's intriguing to me nonetheless.

 

[BusbyMalone]

Who? At least I've heard the name Duo Lipa although I don't think I'd know anything she has released and probably don't want to.

That's Dua Lipa, to you. Bunch of bloody dinosaurs in here!

 

[BusbyMalone]

So I decided to have a look at the most popular artists on Spotify in terms of streams per month. To be honest, I think most people could probably guess a lot of these.


1. Ed Sheeran. 80.7 million monthly listeners
2. The Weeknd. 75.6 million monthly listeners
3. Justin Bieber. 73.3 million monthly listeners
4. Harry Styles. 72.0 million monthly listeners
5. Dua Lipa. 71.7 million monthly listeners (shout out to @Wibble and @JPRouve)
6. Drake. 66.6 million monthly listeners
7. Bad Bunny (never heard of him either) 62.3 million monthly listeners
8. Doja Cat. 59.6 million monthly listeners
9. Taylor Swift. 57.1 million monthly listeners
10. Calvin Harris. 55.5 million monthly listeners

 

[JPRouve]

So I decided to have a look at the most popular artists on Spotify in terms of streams per month. To be honest, I think most people could probably guess a lot of these.


1. Ed Sheeran. 80.7 million monthly listeners
2. The Weeknd. 75.6 million monthly listeners
3. Justin Bieber. 73.3 million monthly listeners
4. Harry Styles. 72.0 million monthly listeners
5. Dua Lipa. 71.7 million monthly listeners (shout out to @Wibble and @JPRouve)
6. Drake. 66.6 million monthly listeners
7. Bad Bunny (never heard of him either) 62.3 million monthly listeners
8. Doja Cat. 59.6 million monthly listeners
9. Taylor Swift. 57.1 million monthly listeners
10. Calvin Harris. 55.5 million monthly listeners

I would have guessed none of them.