I remember the furore but am unsure of whether a fine was issued.
I'm glad it means something to you. I don't see any reasoning behind forcing people to wear it. One can remember those who lost their lives in WWI without wearing a poppy or any other political item. The act of not wearing a poppy isn't to desecrate those who lost their lives in the tragedy of war.
Correct, and if we applied that same logic to any charity then we wouldnt donate money to anyone. They aren't willingly financially supporting war criminals.
@sullydnl summed up perfectly how i was going to respond.
I've already said that @stevoc, I said that in the post you responded to. I would prefer if you addressed it and didn't continue as though I've stated she shouldn't be able to opt out.
McClean made a statement to explain why he was opting out, which he didn't have to as he owes no one an explanation. He made it clear that in the part of Northern Ireland where he comes from (Derry) the poppy is seen not as a symbol to honour war dead but as a symbol of murder and Catholic persecution.
The guy is from the UK, he has every right to live and work in any part of it.
I think you've taken that out of context mate. I never meant imply that you hadn't said that.
To be fair if he had walked out for a match one day a few years ago and every november since without a poppy and no one had batted an eyelid then there would have been no drama surrounding it at all. But instead he's been abused, criticized in the media and basically forced to repeatedly explain his stance. Not wearing one isn't making a statement it's making a choice.
Likely no one will say anything to you in normal workplaces I wouldn't worry.
Indeed. When I was a kid, November 11th was still known as 'Armistice Day' and at school, if the day fell during the week, we would all stand in silence for two minutes at 11 o'clock. I really don't care for the way people now point fingers at those who don't wear the poppy as if it signifies disrespect or an attempt to dishonour the fallen. I don't want any part of that as it's just an attempt to score cheap political points.
Why would he not be happy making a living in a country he’s entitled to work in? Coming a bit close to the EDL types of ‘if he doesn’t wear it, he can feck off home’ reasoning.
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That's not really true. Many soldiers in the past have respected their enemies and what the common soldier gave for their countries, even the Germans. It only doesn't happen where an enemy behaved inhumanely or unfairly ie the Japanese or Taliban.
Well actually there would still be quite a huge number of charities he could support without anywhere near the same chances of his money helping people who commited war crimes in his locality. I mean a near endless amount.
Who said he didn’t have the right to do so?
How many of those vets have committed war atrocities in NI do you think? There’s still that very small chance those people being helped are rapists, murderers, fraudsters etc. We are talking infinitesimal numbers on both regards.
EDL? Seriously? It’s nowhere near that. Piss off with that shit. It’s not necessary.
No he didn't have to do it, but he has anyway. I’ve outlined already why I think that assessment, that interpretation isn’t right. You’re welcome to respond to that post.
He's also somehow linked the poppy to dictatorships, rising racism and Brexit, so it's no big surprise.
He's on a roll!
You questioned why a UK citizen is comfortable making money in the UK? Because he doesn’t wear a poppy?
Nobody said that. However it absolutely has been politicised and the guys that’s seem to have a problem with people choosing not to wear it are largely on the right.
No. I didn't. I didn't make the connection between the Poppy's donation going to the British Legion, and therefore supporting the mental and physical wellbeing of war criminals. I was applying that same logic to illustrate a point. If you had followed the context of our posts you'd have known that. But no, you jumped in with comparisons with the EDL, which is a pretty dickish thing to do.
One of his best.Uhhhhhhh ....
Oh he did alright
Oh yes, it's certainly bound to be a very small amount. They're still there though and you're still more likely to support them through that charity than through, say, donating to the local homeless shelter, or the local GAA club, or by giving money to a Derry child fighting cancer, or by paying for the funeral of a local fan, all of which McClean has actually done. As I said, it's much easier to avoid supporting war veterans when you don't support a charity that specifically aids war veterans.
Well . . perhaps if you'd grown up a Catholic in 1970s Derry then you'd have a different interpretation.
The British Army killed innocent people in his hometown. I’d say that maybe he does in fact find it insufferable, and expecting him to sing God Save the Queen is ridiculous
. I don’t see how that makes him a bellend. It’s just like those asking the NFL to ban players for kneeling during the anthem. You can’t scream for free speech and a democratic society, and call someone a bellend for having his own principles.You do seem to be enjoying yourself, Sully. Carry on.I have to admit I do enjoy the arguments in these threads pretty much every year.
Maybe. But just as he is entitled to his opinion on the matter, so am I for believing he is wrong, no?
The British Army killed innocent people in his hometown. I’d say that maybe he does in fact find it insufferable, and expecting him to sing God Save the Queen is ridiculous
I think it also highlights why this kind of stuff needlessly causes trouble. People can pay their respects however they want. A lot of this goes back to some trying to show just how much more respect they have than others.
It seems you're struggling to read through the red mist. No one said he should sing God save the queen. Are you high?