PL W FA Premier League

Burnley 0:1 Manchester United

Post-match discussion


Tue, 12 January 2021

simplyared

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I'd say that's about the best team we can put on paper right now. Good performance all round. Maybe not thee best performance in a utd shirt for Pogba, but let me say this: I can't see us winning that game without him.
 

mitchmouse

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Some people seem to think this was a "scrubby" win (heard the word on Sky) but I actually enjoyed the full 90 mins. There have been occasions in the past were would have conceded a soft goal and lost the game - last night we were rarely troubled (did DDG have a shot to save?). We controlled things well enough in the first half to take the sting out of their main threat and were very good in the second half - the first time this season we've done that without Bruno running things.

This was probably Pogba's best game in a United shirt - not jus going forward, he seems to have learnt the importance of defensive work over the past few weeks and is actually really good at getting his head on set pieces flung into our area. I'm not sure his shot would have gone in without the deflection but I think we would have got a goal somehow and Pogba deserved one for his performance (regulars here will no I am far from his biggest fan).

Also think bailly looked good and Maguire looked solid.

On the negative side, rashford was poor and Martial yet again anonymous except for when missing yet another golden chance.really is time for Ole to make the call and leave him out. Do I think we are going to score enough goals to win the PL this season... sorry but no.

Finally, Kevin fFriend's performance was so poor, he shouldn't be allowed to referee in the PL until he's learnt the fecking rules.
 

kafta

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Great win. Not the best match, but i thought our defense was very assuring, and our midfield controlled the game very well.

Standouts were Pogba, Maguire, Bailly and Shaw.

The satisfying thing is that this is the type of game we would've dropped points in last year. We had some luck at the end, but we saw it through well.

Great to see Pogba play at his best.
 

Berbasbullet

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Delighted by the goal we scored, I thought the best chance was going to be the same way we scored last season in this match, turnover high up the pitch and a quick and aggressive attack when their numbers are depleted, as they’re so organised.

We found a way when they were deep and compact, albeit with some luck.
 

BFernandes

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Burnley - what a complete sewer of a club.

Terrible ground, terrible football. They really are utterly depressing to watch - surely their fans want more than this?

There's no excuse for it either. The commentators last night praising them for what they've done and how they've survived over the last few years - do me a favour. They have received hundreds of millions of pounds from the Premier League over the last few years and they still have less of a go of it than new teams getting promoted to the league. What have they got to show for all that money? Clinging on to complete and utter obscurity season after season all the while hoping for their annual top 6 win to keep them going for the next season.

Rancid club.
 
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Desert Eagle

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Shows the mentality of those pundits and commentators that wank about burnley and shit on leeds every chance they get.
 

redmanx

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I'd say that's about the best team we can put on paper right now. Good performance all round. Maybe not thee best performance in a utd shirt for Pogba, but let me say this: I can't see us winning that game without him.
I was pleased to see Pogba step up when it was clear Bruno was having, for him, a poor game. But he has to do this on a more consistent basis and not just when Brunos having a bad game or not in the side, he needs to play like this from the start of matches, not halfway. When Pogba can do this he'll be some player, sadly we wont get the chance to witness this as he'll be leaving end of season, and, taking into consideration his entire time with us, Im not sorry to see him go.
 

Falcow

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The one that worries me the most is Rashford.

I could be totally wrong, but I think his head is so much into his other calling, to work for others, that he is becoming tired. While many footballers leave it to their PR company or whatsoever to take care of things, I think Rashford is involved personally on a very big scale in its day to day things.
Maybe that is taking a toll on him. It is an extreme physical as well as emotional investment. It is not easy too.

Maybe I am worried about nothing and it is just a blip in form.
You could be right. I just dont get it with him. He can be abysmal at times and other times look like he has is up there with the best.
 

Bondi77

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I cannot work out how the Maguire goal was not allowed, it just seems like a player cannot be behind a player and challenge for a header and he was not holding his opponent down...Scandalous!
 

Can7onA

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Bailly, Pogba, Shaw and Matic were outstanding last night. I thought Luke Shaw stepped up in last nights game as someone we can depend upon.

I've always criticised him for shitting out of tackles (the injury probably) but last night he was a beast, unlucky to get booked.
 

gajender

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The one that worries me the most is Rashford.

I could be totally wrong, but I think his head is so much into his other calling, to work for others, that he is becoming tired. While many footballers leave it to their PR company or whatsoever to take care of things, I think Rashford is involved personally on a very big scale in its day to day things.
Maybe that is taking a toll on him. It is an extreme physical as well as emotional investment. It is not easy too.

Maybe I am worried about nothing and it is just a blip in form
.
I believe you are overthinking it Rashford has always been inconsistent even during the games infact most of our attackers are similarly frustrating ,hopefully they would eventually gain consistency in not so distant future otherwise we will have some decisions to make .
 

MrBest

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I personally thought Maguire was alright for this match? Kept things tidy, nice and composed in the build-ups, won his aerial defensive duels and had a goal harshly ruled out. Seems like a lot of people agree too, based on the average ratings anyway.
That's fair, everyone has there own entitlement to there own judgement. I felt that other than a few routine headers, Bailey covered his ass countless amount of times. He found himself out of position, dropped his shoulder too much allowing space and a severe lack of leadership. He probably should of had a goal but if it was not for Bailey, he gets exposed again. I remember a moment in the second half when Bailey covered for him because he just let a man jog past him, Bailey has to run the whole 6 yard box to cover him and then he blasted Harry for being out of position and getting the team into that state. How many blocks and dives did Bailey have to do on the left side as Harry was jogging around somewhere or trying to recover?
 

RC89

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Biggest improvement from last season for me is the grit and determination in games like these
Yhup we don't win either of last night's or the Wolves game last season.
 

Oldyella

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I'd say that's about the best team we can put on paper right now. Good performance all round. Maybe not thee best performance in a utd shirt for Pogba, but let me say this: I can't see us winning that game without him.
Best players but not best team imo. Rashford just doesn't work on the right. If we want Cavani up front, which I think we should, a tough decision needs to be made re Martial/Rashford.
 

MrBest

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This incident has taught me that some people on here are liberal with the use of "clearly" and maybe I have poor eyesight. Shaw was lucky to get only a yellow.
It definitely looks worse in slow motion, i wouldn't say it is a clear red card, I actually think yellow was fine, Shaw gets touch on the ball first, there was no intent, it is the follow through that looks rough. Saying that, I don't think anyone understands the rules anymore, even referees. We are currently at this stage where these decisions are 50/50. What would be great is if someone out right says, if you follow through, irrespective of touching the ball, and you hit the opposition player above the ankle, you get a red. Unfortunately, VAR and the governing board do not know how to make a decision, let alone implement them.
 

tenpoless

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Has anybody mentioned Baily yet?
He's been very good. He's still an asset to the team. Let's just hope he won't get injured or get a red card anytime soon. He was always a good defender, faced Ronaldo several times in La Liga and didn't look out of place. Shit defenders usually look out of place against that Ronaldo. I know this because I watched him extensively on Youtube the moment we signed him.
 

Jeffthered

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Bailly, Pogba, Shaw and Matic were outstanding last night. I thought Luke Shaw stepped up in last nights game as someone we can depend upon.

I've always criticised him for shitting out of tackles (the injury probably) but last night he was a beast, unlucky to get booked.
This is where I feel we can get carried away. Luke Shaw has proven over a number of years, that he is not a player we can rely upon, not if we wish to win trophies.
 

londonredmaniac

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Some people seem to think this was a "scrubby" win (heard the word on Sky) but I actually enjoyed the full 90 mins. There have been occasions in the past were would have conceded a soft goal and lost the game - last night we were rarely troubled (did DDG have a shot to save?). We controlled things well enough in the first half to take the sting out of their main threat and were very good in the second half - the first time this season we've done that without Bruno running things.

This was probably Pogba's best game in a United shirt - not jus going forward, he seems to have learnt the importance of defensive work over the past few weeks and is actually really good at getting his head on set pieces flung into our area. I'm not sure his shot would have gone in without the deflection but I think we would have got a goal somehow and Pogba deserved one for his performance (regulars here will no I am far from his biggest fan).

Also think bailly looked good and Maguire looked solid.

On the negative side, rashford was poor and Martial yet again anonymous except for when missing yet another golden chance.really is time for Ole to make the call and leave him out. Do I think we are going to score enough goals to win the PL this season... sorry but no.

Finally, Kevin fFriend's performance was so poor, he shouldn't be allowed to referee in the PL until he's learnt the fecking rules.
Agree with all of that
 

MrBest

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Fecking hate playing against Burnley, who are in good form at the moment, but we did what we had to.

If we beat the scousers at the weekeend, then we are serious contenders for the league
I was firstly annoyed that we only got a single goal but then I had a look into Burnley at home. Before the game yesterday, they had played 7 at home, won 3, drew 1 and lost 3. The 3 defeats came before 1st November when every team was finding there feet still because of a lack of pre season. Before yesterday they had scored just 5 but only conceded 7. 3 of the 7 came against Chelsea on 31st October. Other than that game, they have not conceded more than one goal at home and they have played Southampton, Spurs, Chelsea, Palace, Everton, Wolves and Sheffield United. I look back today and think, these three 3 points is just brilliant.
 

Inigo Montoya

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Has anybody mentioned Baily yet?
He's been very good. He's still an asset to the team. Let's just hope he won't get injured or get a red card anytime soon. He was always a good defender, faced Ronaldo several times in La Liga and didn't look out of place. Shit defenders usually look out of place against that Ronaldo. I know this because I watched him extensively on Youtube the moment we signed him.
He's been mentioned many times.
Athletic, brave and rapid. So much better in the air than Lindelof
Downside: not great in possession and his distribution is very poor.

However if he has a good organizer like Maguire next to him, we have a decent to very effective CB partnership.

Shout out to Shaw who was equally brave and physical when needed.


Glad we gave Burnley a taste of their own medicine last night.

Loved it when AWB jumped into Barnes!:devil:
 

jeepers

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Feck off refs. Useless cnuts. Brady got nutmegged and took the man out. He was the last defender as well.

Supremely proud of the team, but we should take the rest of the season one game at a time.
 

Skåre Willoch

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This incident has taught me that some people on here are liberal with the use of "clearly" and maybe I have poor eyesight. Shaw was lucky to get only a yellow.
I agree with this. I think a yellow card was fair, but I totally understand why a red card could be argued. It doesn't really matter if it was a malicious tackle or not, if the Burnley player had his studs planted, it's a potential leg breaker. Not exactly a reckless tackle, but dangerous nonetheless. I was actually a bit surprised he wasn't sent off when watching the game.

But again, a yellow card was fair, and in my opinion the most correct decision.

Brady got lucky as well, though. Not only was it a potential red card with Cavani AND Rashford potentially through on goal, but the tackle itself was bad. Could be argued it was as at least close to as bad as Shaw's tackle. He didn't touch the ball at all, and went in high with a lot of force.

The yellow shouldn't have been erased in my opinion, as the tackle itself was at least a yellow.
If you can't get penalized for things happening after another incident which is later penalized because of VAR, it could get very ugly.
If a player knows for sure that a situation will be reviewed and a free kick/ offside / card / whatever is inevtiable, he can just go ahead and do leg breakers without any real threat about getting penalized for it.
Or am I misunderstanding something?
If you perform a car crash of a tackle, but the player is offside two seconds before, the card is "washed", no matter what kind of tackle it is apparently. Or are there examples of the card still counting, even though the play is moved back because of another offense/offisde/whatever?
 
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Yorkeontop

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It definitely looks worse in slow motion, i wouldn't say it is a clear red card, I actually think yellow was fine, Shaw gets touch on the ball first, there was no intent, it is the follow through that looks rough. Saying that, I don't think anyone understands the rules anymore, even referees. We are currently at this stage where these decisions are 50/50. What would be great is if someone out right says, if you follow through, irrespective of touching the ball, and you hit the opposition player above the ankle, you get a red. Unfortunately, VAR and the governing board do not know how to make a decision, let alone implement them.
I was thinking lucky in the context of the VAR era. Normally I could still see a red being produced though. I'm ok with referees having to make a judgement on whether somebody got enough of the ball but I'm not even sure if that's the law.
Maybe you can explain in detail, why you think it is "clearly" a red.
Learn the etymology of "lucky" if you're serious.
 

tenpoless

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He's been mentioned many times.
Athletic, brave and rapid. So much better in the air than Lindelof
Downside: not great in possession and his distribution is very poor.

However if he has a good organizer like Maguire next to him, we have a decent to very effective CB partnership.

Shout out to Shaw who was equally brave and physical when needed.


Glad we gave Burnley a taste of their own medicine last night.

Loved it when AWB jumped into Barnes!:devil:
True but he's much quicker and stronger than Lindelof, he's a better partner to Maguire I think. Seems like we don't have to worry too much about the defenders after all, we only need what we have to perform this season.

Loved that as well.

Almost everyone has improved, all we need now is MMM to find their form (and the net more often) and we'd have more than enough to keep the momentum going :devil:
 

macheda14

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He's been mentioned many times.
Athletic, brave and rapid. So much better in the air than Lindelof
Downside: not great in possession and his distribution is very poor.

However if he has a good organizer like Maguire next to him, we have a decent to very effective CB partnership.

Shout out to Shaw who was equally brave and physical when needed.


Glad we gave Burnley a taste of their own medicine last night.

Loved it when AWB jumped into Barnes!:devil:
He’s pretty decent in possession, have you forgotten all of the crazy moves he’s made to get out of pressure in his own box. He’s also not to bad driving forward with the ball out of defence. He is just no where near Lindelöf in terms of distribution.
 

Tom Cato

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The one that worries me the most is Rashford.

I could be totally wrong, but I think his head is so much into his other calling, to work for others, that he is becoming tired. While many footballers leave it to their PR company or whatsoever to take care of things, I think Rashford is involved personally on a very big scale in its day to day things.
Maybe that is taking a toll on him. It is an extreme physical as well as emotional investment. It is not easy too.

Maybe I am worried about nothing and it is just a blip in form.
If he has to choose between the two I hope the club gives him a nice long leave so he can focus exclusively on his charitable work. Title race be damned.
 

Can7onA

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This is where I feel we can get carried away. Luke Shaw has proven over a number of years, that he is not a player we can rely upon, not if we wish to win trophies.
Trust me I don't get carried away, I just think that he has shown a lot more fight the last couple of months (probably because of Telles)
 

Inigo Montoya

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Trust me I don't get carried away, I just think that he has shown a lot more fight the last couple of months (probably because of Telles)
He has. He was good last night.

The only thing Telles has over him is crossing but we've seen precious little of that.

Shaw is still our number 1 LB.
 

noodlehair

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Looks to me like he's pulling his foot sidewards and back after getting some of the ball in order to minimise the risk of injury to both of them.
No idea. I just think it's a foul because he catches the player with his studs...probably a yellow too for the same reason, but it's impossible that its intentional and he's not jumped in or used excessive force or purposely placed his foot off the ground so it isn't wreckless or endangering the opponent either. I don't know how anyone gets to the conclusion it could have been a red card. You can't send people off for bad luck.

The fortunate person in that whole incident is the Burnley player who fouled Cavani, although even that looked completely accidental, but he'd obviously have either been in or played the ball to Rashford if he wasn't brought down. Somehow the ref concluded that was a yellow. Some of the refereeing in our PL games this season has been a new level of awful.
 

Skåre Willoch

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No idea. I just think it's a foul because he catches the player with his studs...probably a yellow too for the same reason, but it's impossible that its intentional and he's not jumped in or used excessive force or purposely placed his foot off the ground so it isn't wreckless or endangering the opponent either. I don't know how anyone gets to the conclusion it could have been a red card. You can't send people off for bad luck.

The fortunate person in that whole incident is the Burnley player who fouled Cavani, although even that looked completely accidental, but he'd obviously have either been in or played the ball to Rashford if he wasn't brought down. Somehow the ref concluded that was a yellow. Some of the refereeing in our PL games this season has been a new level of awful.
You absolutely can.
 

noodlehair

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You absolutely can.
You can't. You can send them off because the rules of the game say it's a red card. The only time it's bad luck is if the ref gets it wrong.

There's an area of interpretation with bad tackles but not to the extent of just sending someone off even though the rules say you shouldn't and there was nothing actually bad about the tackle.
 

Skåre Willoch

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You can't. You can send them off because the rules of the game say it's a red card. The only time it's bad luck is if the ref gets it wrong.

There's an area of interpretation with bad tackles but not to the extent of just sending someone off even though the rules say you shouldn't and there was nothing actually bad about the tackle.
Directly from the FA: "Any player who lunges at an opponent in challenging for the ball from the front, from the side or from behind using one or both legs, with excessive force or endangers the safety of an opponent is guilty of serious foul play."

You could easily argue that the tackle (or subsequent result/follow through) endangered the Burnley player. It was a potential leg breaker, whether it was bad luck and unintentional or not. Now, I also think it's a yellow, but I would very much understand if he'd been sent off. In a way Shaw got lucky with not being more unlucky.
 

El Zoido

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Directly from the FA: "Any player who lunges at an opponent in challenging for the ball from the front, from the side or from behind using one or both legs, with excessive force or endangers the safety of an opponent is guilty of serious foul play."

You could easily argue that the tackle (or subsequent result/follow through) endangered the Burnley player. It was a potential leg breaker, whether it was bad luck and unintentional or not. Now, I also think it's a yellow, but I would very much understand if he'd been sent off. In a way Shaw got lucky with not being more unlucky.
It wasn’t excessive force, nor did he endanger his opponent, this is football. You use your feet. He cannot immediately stop his foot the moment he touches the ball, legs and feet will come together. Really, any tackle or kick could potentially end up like this, because when you kick the ball, there’s always a chance that the opponent’s legs could get in the way of where your foot might go. It wasn’t a lunge, he wasn’t out of control, it was a perfectly normal attempt at kicking a football, that looks so much worse when you play it back in slow motion and freeze frame at the moment where the two players come together. You could literally identify 200 similar situations in any game.
 

BusbyMalone

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Yeah, I don't see how that Shaw tackle was reckless in any way. Nor did he use excessive force. He won the ball, and the fact that his foot then rolled off the top of the ball was the reason why he made contact on the followthrough. It wasn't due to his excessive fore or dangerous play. It was just an unfortunate incident, and luckily for the Burnley player he wasn't injured anyway (I don't think).

I'd just put that down to a sporting incident. It's just one of those things. Certainly not a red card.
 

Oldyella

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He has. He was good last night.

The only thing Telles has over him is crossing but we've seen precious little of that.

Shaw is still our number 1 LB.
Telles has also meant Shaw hasn't been ran into the ground. The fact we can rest him with very little dip in quality is great news.
 

Skåre Willoch

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It wasn’t excessive force, nor did he endanger his opponent, this is football. You use your feet. He cannot immediately stop his foot the moment he touches the ball, legs and feet will come together. Really, any tackle or kick could potentially end up like this, because when you kick the ball, there’s always a chance that the opponent’s legs could get in the way of where your foot might go. It wasn’t a lunge, he wasn’t out of control, it was a perfectly normal attempt at kicking a football, that looks so much worse when you play it back in slow motion and freeze frame at the moment where the two players come together. You could literally identify 200 similar situations in any game.
I guess this is a case where we have to agree to disagree. There is a reason VAR wanted to look at it, and there are many people, even on this very forum, who think a red card could be defended. Some even think Shaw got lucky.

Obviously there is always a risk involved in every tackle. But some tackles/challenges are more risky than others. And the outcome is a factor to be considered, hence the yellow.

Would it have been a red card if the Burnley player had his foot planted and broke his leg, all other factors remaining the same? I think so. That doesn't change the fact that it wasn't a reckless tackle, nor did he use excessive force, but he absolutely did endanger the opponent with the follow through (planting his studs in the shin of the Burnley player). In my (and seemingly quite a few others) opinion, at least.
 

Man of the Match

Paul Pogba image Paul Pogba 89% of 378 votes

Runners-up

Player Ratings

6.6 Total Average Rating

Highest Rated Player

Lowest Rated Player

Compiled from 360 ratings.

Score Predictions

206,10,14
  • Man Utd win
  • Burnley win
  • Draw

Detailed Results

  • 28% Burnley 0:2 Man Utd
  • 23% Burnley 1:2 Man Utd
  • 11% Burnley 1:3 Man Utd
  • 10% Burnley 0:3 Man Utd
  • 10% Burnley 0:1 Man Utd
  • 5% Burnley 1:1 Man Utd
  • 4% Burnley 0:5 Man Utd
  • 1% Burnley 1:4 Man Utd
  • 1% Burnley 1:0 Man Utd
  • 1% Burnley 2:1 Man Utd
  • 1% Burnley 0:4 Man Utd
  • 1% Burnley 2:0 Man Utd
  • 0% Burnley 0:0 Man Utd
  • 0% Burnley 2:2 Man Utd
  • 0% Burnley 2:3 Man Utd
  • 0% Burnley 3:0 Man Utd
  • 0% Burnley 5:0 Man Utd
  • 0% Burnley 1:5 Man Utd
  • 0% Burnley 5:4 Man Utd
Compiled from 230 predictions.
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Match Stats

  1. Burnley
  2. Man Utd
Possession
37% 63%
Shots
12 13
Shots on Target
0 7
Corners
3 4
Fouls
15 13

Referee

Kevin Friend