Are people just saying Timber because he played under Ten Hag at Ajax, or is he genuinely the best option?
Potential Centre-Back Signings
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
Bayern won't sell in January. Call them in June.
Timber played under ETH, but also formed a great partnership with Martinez. He hasn't looked so good this season, so the question is why...? Is it he plays better under ETH, with Martinez, or he just isn't that good and is now getting exposed? Personally, the fact that he was ETH's first choice to sign from Ajax, even before Martinez, makes me think that he is a really good player with great potential, and that ETH will be back in for him at some point...
Haven’t saw much of Timber but when I have he looks good on the ball. I know people mentioned he can play RB as well, has he played much there?
We need to get rid of Maguire, Lindelof, Jones, Tuanzebe and Bailly.
Instead we need a left footed and a right footed defender. Ndicka is out of contract in Jun-23 so it would be a no brainer not to go after him. Pavard, who can play CB and RB, is out of contract in Jun-24 and has told that he isn't extending his contract as he want new challanges, hence he should also be attainable at a fair price.
Instead we need a left footed and a right footed defender. Ndicka is out of contract in Jun-23 so it would be a no brainer not to go after him. Pavard, who can play CB and RB, is out of contract in Jun-24 and has told that he isn't extending his contract as he want new challanges, hence he should also be attainable at a fair price.
The problem with Pavard is that he’s shite…
My guess is CB will look like this:
-No changes in January
-Summer 2023, Maguire out and a new RCB in. We play with Lindelof or the new RCB as the backup LCB.
-Summer 2024, Lindelof is sold and we buy a cheap young backup left-footed LCB
-Summer 2025, Varane replaced with backup CB assuming the summer 2023 guy pans out
-No changes in January
-Summer 2023, Maguire out and a new RCB in. We play with Lindelof or the new RCB as the backup LCB.
-Summer 2024, Lindelof is sold and we buy a cheap young backup left-footed LCB
-Summer 2025, Varane replaced with backup CB assuming the summer 2023 guy pans out
Yeah, I actually referred to Amad, but “an [Amad] Diallo type of signing” but at CLD. Ie throw 20m at a kid who has potential but still got a few more years left before he is easy and that is a left footed CD.
Although, it would be pretty fun to watch Amad Diallo at CB.
When it comes to playing the ball up from the back and beating the lines, yeah, I think he could be the best option. The kid is a real dribbler, when he is pressured by forwards, he just undress them and get up field. His passing foot isnt world class, but he is unique in the way he gets away from pressure.
Another huge upside is that he is just as good at RD. So you kind of get 2 in 1, someone who can play both at CB and RD.
He hasn’t had a great year for Ajax, but remember, they have a totally gutted squad this season and plays a very offensive style of football. Besides Antony and Martinez, they also sold Haller and Graveberch.
In a season like this one, I think Timber would be immensely valuable to have on the team for ETH. As I understand it, many Dutch pundits have him starting ahead of De Light in the WC. Not at all sure that is correct, but it’s at least and indication of how good he actually is.
Having thought about it, I fully agree with this.
This makes sense.
Preferably Lindelof at LCB, as I agree with @sullydnl in regards to Martinez playing more than Varane.
Would you get a centre back and right back or maybe a player like Timber who can play both?
Shaw/Malacia - Martinez/Lindelof - Varane/Timber - Dalot/Timber (Laird)?
Kim, Skriniar and Timber. Its in no way realistic but I want all three.
Posted this in the Timber thread but think it might be more relevant here…
Thinking about our situation at the back and I really hope we are back in for Timber in the summer. We are in a unique position of having a world class CB pairing but sadly due to Varane’s fitness issues need quality cover at the RCB position. We also need another quality option at RB. And I imagine Timber would look absolutely mint there tucking in and providing quality in the buildup when Varane is fit.
I’m not sure where I see him longterm. Perhaps that depends on who else we acquire and/or the development of Ethan Laird. But I think he will be brilliant whether it be RB or CB and his signing would go a long way toward maximizing Varane’s final years at the top. It almost seems a bit hilarious at this point going back to the Ajax well once again, but Timber’s quality and versatility make him the best option out there for us IMO. Add Ndicka on a free and we are set until Varane’s time comes.
Thinking about our situation at the back and I really hope we are back in for Timber in the summer. We are in a unique position of having a world class CB pairing but sadly due to Varane’s fitness issues need quality cover at the RCB position. We also need another quality option at RB. And I imagine Timber would look absolutely mint there tucking in and providing quality in the buildup when Varane is fit.
I’m not sure where I see him longterm. Perhaps that depends on who else we acquire and/or the development of Ethan Laird. But I think he will be brilliant whether it be RB or CB and his signing would go a long way toward maximizing Varane’s final years at the top. It almost seems a bit hilarious at this point going back to the Ajax well once again, but Timber’s quality and versatility make him the best option out there for us IMO. Add Ndicka on a free and we are set until Varane’s time comes.
I guess maybe we'd just play Timber in the role Mazraoui played at Ajax as a tucked in RB underlapping a ton and tucking into midfield then going out right to a more typical RB role when possession is lost.
Shaw = Blind
Lisandro = Lisandro
Varane/Taller CB = Timber
Timber = Mazraoui
Casemiro = Alvarez
CM/Eriksen = De Jong
Antony = Antony
Bruno/Eriksen = Berghuis
Sancho/Rashford/Garnacho = Tadic
Martial/ST = Haller
to take the most recent Ten Hag Ajax team. And then Dalot plays the Mazraoui role a fair amount, with Timber backing up Lisandro and playing at CB instead of the taller CB in some games or situations, to everyone in England's horror.
I mean we can try but isn't Maguire under contract till 2025 on about 200K a week?
I'm not sure I can see him being in a rush to leave (and to be honest he would almost certainly fall over if he was in a rush anyway)
Still want to have faith in Maguire, and upgrade on Lindelof. Ndicka would be perfect as second LCB. More funds towards the fullback, midfield and striker position.
I wonder if Alvaro Fernandez could have potential as a CB on the left side. ETH is pretty gutsy moving players to new positions, did it with both Timber (RB) and Martinez (DMC) at Ajax.
Fernandez got the size at 6’2, speed, great passing. What remains is of course everything else that comes specific for a CB.
Fernandez got the size at 6’2, speed, great passing. What remains is of course everything else that comes specific for a CB.
I too, would be intrigued by this prospect. I think Fernandez has the attributes to develop as a cb.
Yeah Ndicka would be such a shrewd buy
We could play Alvaro-Lisandro-Timber as basically a back 3 for example if we bought him and went 3 at the back with Alvaro in the role Blind played at Ajax in Ten Hag's last season. Dalot in the Mazraoui role, Antony is Antony. Blind sorta played both LB and LCB depending on which team had the ball, what side of the field the play was on or Ajax just came out for the 2nd half with Blind no longer an LB and now in a back 3 or vice versa.
Role might suit Shaw okay too. If we buy Timber instead of a bigger CB, my guess is we'd see that.
We're after spending 800 gazillion on wingers in the last few seasons. It'd be crazy to move to a back three surely.
Sancho only spent on Antony and played that system with him, which to be fair is really just a back 4, only the RB moves into midfield and the LB tucks in a lot more so the RCB can go right and the LCB plays central.
But it lets Alvaro and Casemiro take on a lot of the long ball duty in the middle of the park and Lisandro and Timber to mop up or at least contest headers so far from other players that knock downs are tougher to win, and gives Timber and Lisandro the chance to back off and concede a header in midfield too, as well lose a header and potentially have Alvaro or Casemiro to get back and make a play.
Basically it compresses play in the other team's ST/#10 area whenever the ball is on our right and Antony has it, and Antony's best quality is really that he doesn't lose the ball. Nobody seems him like a Bernardo Silva, for obvious reasons, and he'll surely never play centrally, but he can keep the ball under pressure and passes accurately and safely (maybe too much for some), so if he has the ball, the LB can tuck in to help with long balls if the ball is lost on the rare occasion he does, so if you keep feeding him, the game is fairly safe. Add a CM who can dictate play and you've got a team that can retain the ball and is set up decently to deal with counters. Then the LW, ST, RB and #10 are charged with getting open and making things happen when they do, so you want proper feck off stars there. We might be okay at LW and Eriksen/Bruno are great 10 options, but we need an 8, a ST and cover for Dalot, which we already know and really do need regardless of the system we use.
A bit surprising not to see Evan Ndicka get a look in for France. Not a single cap so far. There's not a single left footed CB in their world cup squad (unless we want to count Lucas Hernandez, who's always been a LB for them). Kimpembe gets injured and the rookie Axel Disasi gets in instead. Hope he isn't of interest just because he's free.
Thanks for your insights to ETHs system!
Is this the reason for why we can get linked to such a wide variety of different full backs. One day it’s Thomas Meunier and the other Jeremie Frimpong.
No worries, I watched them a bunch in the CL because they were fun and also it seemed very likely that it was going to be Ten Hag, Pochettino or Potter as our next manager.
Eh that's probably just paper talk that would happen anyways. In some ways those 2 aren't that different, they're both attacking fullbacks who can play as wingbacks and don't defend particularly well.
Jasko Gravdiol should be the top of the list and anyone else is a consolation prize. At 20, that guy is the best center back talent there is.
He does look like the real deal. I’m just not sure we’d go anywhere near the asking price for a position Martinez and Varane are regarded as first choice and not a priority position. I’d imagine we’d be in the market for a defender who’s less than £50m to replace Maguire.
We need 2 more cuz Maguire will go and Lindelof is not good enough. Relevant candidates should be Kim Min Jae, Gvardiol and Timber.
I'm not sure Varane is even capable of a 38 game season, let alone the rigors of European football to add on to that. So if you get Gravdiol, that is a legit 3 person competition for two spots. Ralf Rangnick said at that time that he is a can't miss talent and I completely agree.
I agree too but I just can’t see us spending the 90m that was being quoted in the summer when we have positions with higher priority. I’d love for us to sign him as he looks like the real deal.
I like the look of Kim Min Jae, think he’s be perfect for us. Has a bit of pace aswell which will allow us to play an high line.
That's true but I can't imagine us signing a left footer if he's predominantly going to play on the right. We've finally got one left footer after years of imbalance and now we'd be imbalancing our passing options in the opposite way.
JOsko
GVARdiol
Like you write Guardiola, but instead of "u" it is "v", and no letter "a" at the end.
sorry
At this point in time, he would get my vote (if we were voting)
Yeah looks class but just signed a new deal
Think he is the right profile as we need someone young and talented to be a genuine number one contender with Varane injury issues as our current optios havent been good enough to be confident of them playing 20+ games a season in Varanes absense.
Id never heard of Timber or Martinez before the summer as didnt really watch Ajax at all last year or so. Martinez obviously been fantastic. Hearing Timber not been very good this year.times I hav eseen him I have been really impressed personally decent to good performances but his reading of the game and confidence on the ball, all looks like in his stride and easy to him, think he an raise his game to a top level, the past connections are just a bonus to me.....he reminds me a bit of Nesta in the body frame of Cannavaro
Whether he is the best option is another thing altogether, there are lots of reallly really good young centre backs. The guy at Napoli looks fantastic, Bella Kotchap at SOuthampton looks a top prospect, Guarvidol looks to have world class potential (is left sided tho). I think there are lots of options and its actually on paper at least the easiest option for the positions maybe need upgrading in our squad
He has the quality to be a first choice option at both RB and CB. That is what is so appealing.
Not sure he can pass well enough for Ten Hag, but if the plan was to buy Timber as the backup RB stepping into midfield, this might work.
I think it's more likely we'll end up buying Salisu to be our backup to Lisandro. Similar to City signing Ake from Bournemouth to be an expensive backup, because it's hard to find a decent left-footer and his team might not turn down 35M, especially if they go down.
Yeah, I have to agree with all you just said.
About Gvardiol I worry Chelsea are well down the line with. If we can convince him to hold out, as we'll be getting new owners, which hopefully means more money to spend.
Timber I worry because of his height. Now I know Licha has proven height isn't always a factor, however, I believe players need to compliment each other, and we have that with Licha when he plays next to our current CB's. But for right back with the occasional centre half play? Sure, I'd take him.
Kim looks really good. Seems to have it all. And he will have the marketing capability, too.
Timber deserves to be mentioned. He had worked with ETH and his passing abilities are off the charts. However I wouldn't be comfortable with 2 short CBs. In my opinion we should aim for Napoli's Kim Min-jae. His stellar performances this year had been quite instrumental for Napoli and he's got a 50m euros minimum clause. Regarding Timber, we might consider buying him as a RB. ETH does love a converted CB as a FB (ex Blind) which would then allow his other FB ample licence to attack.
We won't sign Timber again, that would be a massive issue when defending set pieces for us.