Racism in Italy - even anti-racism is filled with racism

[Ramos]

The Italian problem with immigrants (black immigrants on top, but also caucasians from eastern europe have their own peculiar ways) these days, which Salvini is exploiting for his own far right agenda, does not depend on skin colour: it is the perceived entitlement as charity tourists, it is the organised small extortions played at every traffic light and at entrance of every supermarket, it is the vulnerable menaces roaming near every train station, it is the small and big crimes perpetrated to survive, it is the untruthful playing of the refugee card coupled with the victim card when denied... these alienate the locals against immigrants, as it happens everywhere and every time (ities we were in the late ‘800s and esrly ‘900s, so we know ourselves). Again, it is not blackness with all its historical weight, Italians as a group do not know what it is and do not give a feck actually: you can be green, pink, yellow, brown, white... it is just the strong perception some do not want to play the same difficult game locals have to play to survive, in that helped by sly leftists who use complex migration waves to make business out of integration.

That's a bunch of BS. Italians don't live in a vacuum. I've actually heard Russians say the exact same thing.

I mean, read this from Alexei Smertin three years before the WC. It's the same damn reasoning as the Curva Nord.

"Racism in Russia is like fashion. It comes from abroad, from different countries"

"It was never, ever here before. Ten years ago, some fans may have given a banana to black guys - it was just for fun."

"It is something against the opposition, not against a person"

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/34297056

I'm a bit tired of racism being explained away with things we have heard a million times before. "It's not their ethnicity, it's just their culture and/or religion we don't like." "We don't care about skin colour, it's just these immigrants." "We're not really racist, we just want to intimidate you and hurt you in the deepest way possible by dehumanizing you." It's all not very original.

 

[Bepi]

You wanted to hear the counterpart and all you are writing below my two posts offering insight is just more abuse and downplaying? It’s your problem, as pretty often with people screaming wolf. Bye.

 

[Stacks]

The Italian problem with immigrants (black immigrants on top, but also caucasians from eastern europe have their own peculiar ways) these days, which Salvini is exploiting for his own far right agenda, does not depend on skin colour: it is the perceived entitlement as charity tourists, it is the organised small extortions played at every traffic light and at entrance of every supermarket, it is the vulnerable menaces roaming near every train station, it is the small and big crimes perpetrated to survive, it is the untruthful playing of the refugee card coupled with the victim card when denied... these alienate the locals against immigrants, as it happens everywhere and every time (ities we were in the late ‘800s and esrly ‘900s, so we know ourselves). Again, it is not blackness with all its historical weight, Italians as a group do not know what it is and do not give a feck actually: you can be green, pink, yellow, brown, white... it is just the strong perception some do not want to play the same difficult game locals have to play to survive, in that helped by sly leftists who use complex migration waves to make business out of integration.

https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-...y-forte-dei-marmi-louis-vuitton-a7905026.html like Samuel L Jackson and Magic Johnson?

 

[giorno]

https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-...y-forte-dei-marmi-louis-vuitton-a7905026.html like Samuel L Jackson and Magic Johnson?

Adriano and Martins back when they were inter's stars, too

 

[giorno]

You wanted to hear the counterpart and all you are writing below my two posts offering insight is just more abuse and downplaying? It’s your problem, as pretty often with people screaming wolf. Bye.

The gist of your post was "we're not really racist and even if we are it's not our fault"

That's not a counterpoint, that's apologism

Ultimately the reasons why we are racist don't matter when weighted against the fact(and it is a fact) that we are racist

 

[sunama]

So, he has made 2 appearances for Inter and scored 2 goals.
Not bad.

 

[Tostao_80]

You wanted to hear the counterpart and all you are writing below my two posts offering insight is just more abuse and downplaying? It’s your problem, as pretty often with people screaming wolf. Bye.

The irony in your post. And you dared to use the word downplaying. The only person downplaying is you. Youre downplaying blatant racism from Italians and trying to explain it away as something else. Its no wonder there are not many clampdowns in Italy, there is no accountability. Acknowledge first there is a problem. Many Italians cant even do this.

 

[Jippy]

@Bepi quoting from your post "
>>>>On the other hand, the upper stance from English posters here vilifying Italy as a country is pretty terrible, you just have to look at the ghettos in your cities with muslims, asians, blacks and withes all living separated (London being the globalist exception)..<<<>

So theres muslim ghettos, then asian ghettos then black and white ghettos? Wtf? And what colour are the muslims in the muslim ghettos if they arent living in the white or black or asian ghettos..or is being muslim a separate race? At least this puts a different slant on the right wing trope about islamaphobia not being racism as islam is not a race.

How many 'ghettos' do you think we have in the UK?

 

[FootyCrew]

Something along the lines of "We're not racists just because we yell racist things. We only do it because we want others to get sad so they don't perform or feel comfortable playing against our team". It's how I read their view.

Sounds weird, but that's right.

Many ultras like to upset black players from the rival team, so they might not perform well, and actually not only black players, they do the same with some physical traits of players: bald,short,ugly,etc

Sames happen in Ukraine,Russia,Netherlands,Brazil, and other countries.

 

[Ødegaard]

Sounds weird, but that's right.

Many ultras like to upset black players from the rival team, so they might not perform well, and actually not only black players, they do the same with some physical traits of players: bald,short,ugly,etc

Sames happen in Ukraine,Russia,Netherlands,Brazil, and other countries.

It's wrong, no matter where it happens.

 

[11101]

The Italian problem with immigrants (black immigrants on top, but also caucasians from eastern europe have their own peculiar ways) these days, which Salvini is exploiting for his own far right agenda, does not depend on skin colour: it is the perceived entitlement as charity tourists, it is the organised small extortions played at every traffic light and at entrance of every supermarket, it is the vulnerable menaces roaming near every train station, it is the small and big crimes perpetrated to survive, it is the untruthful playing of the refugee card coupled with the victim card when denied... these alienate the locals against immigrants, as it happens everywhere and every time (ities we were in the late ‘800s and esrly ‘900s, so we know ourselves). Again, it is not blackness with all its historical weight, Italians as a group do not know what it is and do not give a feck actually: you can be green, pink, yellow, brown, white... it is just the strong perception some do not want to play the same difficult game locals have to play to survive, in that helped by sly leftists who use complex migration waves to make business out of integration.

In my experience living in Italy Italians are always trying to assert themselves over others. Often it's not race based and amongst themselves it's definitely not, but when it comes to immigrants they are happy to use race as an easy way to do it. That is pretty much the definition of racism.

 

[FootyCrew]

The Italian problem with immigrants (black immigrants on top, but also caucasians from eastern europe have their own peculiar ways) these days, which Salvini is exploiting for his own far right agenda, does not depend on skin colour: it is the perceived entitlement as charity tourists, it is the organised small extortions played at every traffic light and at entrance of every supermarket, it is the vulnerable menaces roaming near every train station, it is the small and big crimes perpetrated to survive, it is the untruthful playing of the refugee card coupled with the victim card when denied... these alienate the locals against immigrants, as it happens everywhere and every time (ities we were in the late ‘800s and esrly ‘900s, so we know ourselves). Again, it is not blackness with all its historical weight, Italians as a group do not know what it is and do not give a feck actually: you can be green, pink, yellow, brown, white... it is just the strong perception some do not want to play the same difficult game locals have to play to survive, in that helped by sly leftists who use complex migration waves to make business out of integration.

Also lot human trafficking with those "NGOs" in the mediterranean.

People is getting so upset.

 

[giorno]

In my experience living in Italy Italians are always trying to assert themselves over others. Often it's not race based and amongst themselves it's definitely not, but when it comes to immigrants they are happy to use race as an easy way to do it. That is pretty much the definition of racism.

Yep. Our racism is borne of the need to hate others. Race is just a convenient excuse. But that doesn't make it not racism

 

[MarkK]

This letter from Inter fans really is an interesting read. Frist of all, they start by claiming that there is a "real racism problem" elsewhere in Europe but not in Italy. This is already a bit racist in itself. Then they claim that they're not using racist abuse because they are racists but only because they want to help their own team. This is similar to suggesting that you don't dislike foreigners but you want them out because you love your country (which, of course, is a classic argumentation of a racist). Then they have the nerve to ask a racially abused player to help them communicate that the abuse is not serious.

I'm afraid that this lack of self-reflection and self-criticism may be typical for racist and their supporters and it explains the success of Salvini a lot. He can probably say whatever he want and pretend he's having a laugh. Just like Donald Trump.

 

[Bepi]

In my experience living in Italy Italians are always trying to assert themselves over others. Often it's not race based and amongst themselves it's definitely not, but when it comes to immigrants they are happy to use race as an easy way to do it. That is pretty much the definition of racism.

That’s the nearest I can read here for the true, classic Italian ‘guappo’ attitude and also reflects the brainly simple and bodily plain macho-for-our-values attitude empowered by Salvini and his many fans, which is not thugness yet just because antibodies, in the form of centre-left social orientation from catholic solidarism is still strong and now back in power... we will see how long and how able to deter Salvini’s social poison. As for your conclusion, I am not sure it is racism because it is actually worse, it is discrimination against any diversity (poor, women, disadvantaged, disabled, lgbt, skin), more nazi-like... or nazi-lite today... that’s why the strong perception in Italy Salvini is actually an illiberal, anti-democratic neo-fascist a la Putin, who he admires a lot and tries to mimic who really knows why.

 

[kouroux]

Another shocking racist attack on Lukaku https://www.express.co.uk/sport/foo...Luciano-Passirani-pundit-Inter-Milan-Italy-TV

"If they go one-on-one with you you're dead, you fall to the ground. You're alright if you have ten bananas to give him to eat, otherwise…”

 

[sullydnl]

Yikes.

 

[izec]

Wtf

 

[KirkDuyt]

Fecking hell.

At first I thought he meant that a defender should eat those bananas, but he means in order to distract Lukaku you should give him bananas? That's fecking surreal, who says that.

 

[Terminator]

Fecks sake, this isn't even a bad joke this is casual racism.

 

[We need an rvn]

Another shocking racist attack on Lukaku https://www.express.co.uk/sport/foo...Luciano-Passirani-pundit-Inter-Milan-Italy-TV

"If they go one-on-one with you you're dead, you fall to the ground. You're alright if you have ten bananas to give him to eat, otherwise…”

Obviously taken as racist because of his skin colour and banana's....but could he just be talking about the lack of effort, hence the banana energy comment. Or am I clutching here

 

[Terminator]

Obviously taken as racist because of his skin colour and banana's....but could he just be talking about the lack of effort, hence the banana energy comment. Or am I clutching here

The guy is talking about how good Lukaku is 1v1 and says there's no way to stop him. He is advising the defenders to offer bananas to Lukaku to eat so he would get distracted. Pretty clear if you ask me.

 

[Cassidy]

Obviously taken as racist because of his skin colour and banana's....but could he just be talking about the lack of effort, hence the banana energy comment. Or am I clutching here

You're clutching, he was saying that was a way to stop "distract" them not give them more energy

 

[kouroux]

Obviously taken as racist because of his skin colour and banana's....but could he just be talking about the lack of effort, hence the banana energy comment. Or am I clutching here

you're clutching big time

 

[Sayros]

Fecking hell.

At first I thought he meant that a defender should eat those bananas, but he means in order to distract Lukaku you should give him bananas? That's fecking surreal, who says that.

A really old white guy completely out of touch with reality.

 

[Litch]

you're clutching big time

BIG TIME

 

[charlenefan]

Another shocking racist attack on Lukaku https://www.express.co.uk/sport/foo...Luciano-Passirani-pundit-Inter-Milan-Italy-TV

"If they go one-on-one with you you're dead, you fall to the ground. You're alright if you have ten bananas to give him to eat, otherwise…”

Fecking hell, fecking brutal

 

[VeevaVee]

Feck is wrong with them?

 

[LuisNaniencia]

Italy has issues.

 

[Zlatattack]

How many 'ghettos' do you think we have in the UK?

The state of some of these people. I don't think we really have ghetto's. Most inner city areas, unless they've gone through gentrification are populated will working class people. The middle classes typically live in suburbia and the towns and villages on the outskirts of cities.

In my city and we have 2 suburbs (one of which is very afluent) which have a high percentage of Indian and Pakistani people living there. To some of these people I bet that's a ghetto too.

 

[Litch]

The state of some of these people. I don't think we really have ghetto's. Most inner city areas, unless they've gone through gentrification are populated will working class people. The middle classes typically live in suburbia and the towns and villages on the outskirts of cities.

In my city and we have 2 suburbs (one of which is very afluent) which have a high percentage of Indian and Pakistani people living there. To some of these people I bet that's a ghetto too.

Agree. The more I read stuff on here, the more I understand why nothing really has changed. It's ignorance based on racial stereotypes. It's so inherent that people generally don't know they are doing it.

 

[krautrøck]

How can that be racist when bananas are really nutritious and Rom probably eats one on occasion?

How can monkey chants be racist when all humans technically are apes?

How can a song about Roms long schlong be racist, after all he may just be (and probably is) well-endowed. (<- this was literally on this very forum back when that debate flared up)

etc etc

 

[Cloud7]

Fecking hell that comment is disgusting. The fact that that person actually felt comfortable enough to say that comment speaks volumes.

 

[Ramos]

Imagine someone saying that in MOTD.

 

[tenpoless]

He's not only racist but also very stupid. In the middle of tension like this, He talked about bananas and Lukaku. That's like shooting yourself in the foot.

 

[Cutch]

Terrible enough to think that but to decide to share that opinion on live television, wot the feck

 

[Varun]

Obviously taken as racist because of his skin colour and banana's....but could he just be talking about the lack of effort, hence the banana energy comment. Or am I clutching here

Stretch some more and you'll do your hammy

 

[SweetRightFoot]

What would the authorities do if Real are playing away in Italy and the fans pull out the monkey chants and bananas for Gareth Bale?

(For the record, I deplore racism and the above question is asked in a mixture of whimsy and curiosity)

Not agreeing with your comment at all but the relevant comparison would be inflatable sheep sextoys and leeks thrown at him...

 

[SteveJ]

Yeah, Rom really sounds like the 'twin of Zapata'.

Zapata is primarily known for his speed, physicality, and goalscoring ability as a striker. He usually plays in a central role, and possesses a powerful and accurate shot. He is also known for his ability in the air, courtesy of his height, strength, and powerful physique, which also aids him in defending the ball with his back to goal, and enables him to hold up possession and bring his teammates into play; he is also adept in one on one situations due to his technique and agility.

 

[villain]

Agree. The more I read stuff on here, the more I understand why nothing really has changed. It's ignorance based on racial stereotypes. It's so inherent that people generally don't know they are doing it.

Exactly this.

Unfortunately it takes these blatant in-your-face racist incidents for people to actually see this.
2 years ago when a good portion of our fans were calling Lukaku Stormzy or Heskey and saying he had a 22-inch penis, it was much harder for people to understand that racism is normalised within society.