Rashford and Martial are a problem

Brexit_Brigade

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Rashford scores the opening goal, wins a penalty, tears their right-back to shreds all game.

Come back to RedCafe at full-time: "he's just not good enough".
 

Red_toad

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Mods please either lock this thread or take Rashford out of the title. Rashford is hitting 20+ goals in two consecutive seasons and is one of our most influential players.
Yep fully agree, he's our second most influential player and he's lumped into a thread with a player who isn't even trying.
 

K Stand Knut

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Must be around 20 goals this season as an inside forward and we are barely over halfway.
A lot of fans dont know what they want from Rashford and its clouding their judgement. He isnt a creator, he isnt a number 9. Hes a very potent inside forward who stretches teams and scores every other game and is extremly difficult to stop. He basically is our front 3 this season.
Crazy post.



He's been balling on season the left. Can't slice and dice it any other way.
Rashford has less goals and assists than several ‘lesser’ players at ‘lesser’ teams.

He’s very, very good and much less of a problem than Martial but he should not be on this bizarre pedestal that fans and parts of the media like to put him on
 

Josep Dowling

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Martial is the only problem. Rashford lacks consistency but even then he’s get goals and assists. Let him play LW every week and get other players filling the issues of striker and RW.
 

Brexit_Brigade

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Rashford has less goals and assists than several ‘lesser’ players at ‘lesser’ teams.

He’s very, very good and much less of a problem than Martial but he should not be on this bizarre pedestal that fans and parts of the media like to put him on
Players with more assists: Kane, Fernandes, De Bruyne, Grealish.

Which of them is a lesser player? Or are we doing that thing again where we're only talking about assists made with the left foot inside the six-yard box in the last eight weeks?
 

cyberman

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Rashford has less goals and assists than several ‘lesser’ players at ‘lesser’ teams.

He’s very, very good and much less of a problem than Martial but he should not be on this bizarre pedestal that fans and parts of the media like to put him on
He has the most goals from any left inside forward in England and assists as well.
He isnt a stat padder, all of his goals and assists are really spread out so he is constantly affecting games.
It doesnt make sense. He is literally carrying the front 3 from the top scorers in the league
 

MalcolmTucker

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Why does it matter if Rashford isn't a number 9? It's been obvious for 1.5 that he's a left sided forward - Mane doesn't get judged by his ability to play as a number 9, so why do our fans keep mentioning it? He very rarely never plays centrally anyway, I have no idea why it keeps getting brought up

We need to keep Rashford on the left and let the other players sort out who plays centrally or on the right.
 

K Stand Knut

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Players with more assists: Kane, Fernandes, De Bruyne, Grealish.

Which of them is a lesser player? Or are we doing that thing again where we're only talking about assists made with the left foot inside the six-yard box in the last eight weeks?
Conveniently picking assists alone when I’ve clearly mentioned goals and assist not just assists.


You’ve also excluded Cresswell and Digne but that doesn’t suit your argument, does it?

In terms of assists that you’ve mentioned, all the players bar Fernandes have played less minutes than Rashford. Some considerably less.
 

Djemba-Djemba

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Conveniently picking assists alone when I’ve clearly mentioned goals and assist not just assists.


You’ve also excluded Cresswell and Digne but that doesn’t suit your argument, does it?

In terms of assists that you’ve mentioned, all the players bar Fernandes have played less minutes than Rashford. Some considerably less.
Cresswell and Digne have more goals and assists than Rashford?
 

Doracle

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Conveniently picking assists alone when I’ve clearly mentioned goals and assist not just assists.


You’ve also excluded Cresswell and Digne but that doesn’t suit your argument, does it?

In terms of assists that you’ve mentioned, all the players bar Fernandes have played less minutes than Rashford. Some considerably less.
Which players at lesser teams do have 28 goals and assists this season then? I’d love us to sign a right sided one if you can identify one.
 

Djemba-Djemba

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Imagine using energy to slag off Rashford after another performance like that from Martial. It's just weird.
Some people said Rashford was shite and a flash in the pan in about 2017 and they just refuse to admit they were wrong despite all the evidence.
 

K Stand Knut

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No you catch up.

You said Rashford has less goals and assists than several "lesser" players at "lesser" teams.

Go on then, name them.
ok.
Rashford has less goals than Callum Wilson, Patrick Bamford and Ollie Watkins.

He also has less assists than Grealish, Digne and Cresswell.

I just don’t think he is as good as some people seem to think he is. He floats in and out of games and often offers very little for 80+ minutes of a lot of games.

He could, and with his talent, should offer more on a game by game basis.
 

Djemba-Djemba

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ok.
Rashford has less goals than Callum Wilson, Patrick Bamford and Ollie Watkins.

He also has less assists than Grealish, Digne and Cresswell.

I just don’t think he is as good as some people seem to think he is. He floats in and out of games and often offers very little for 80+ minutes of a lot of games.

He could, and with his talent, should offer more on a game by game basis.
So he doesn't have less goals and assists combined than any of them?

Ok.

Rashford can be frustrating I agree but I think it's hugely unfair to lump him in Martial and it's unfair to criticise Rashford tonight. He had a good game.
 

Nou_Camp99

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ok.
Rashford has less goals than Callum Wilson, Patrick Bamford and Ollie Watkins.

He also has less assists than Grealish, Digne and Cresswell.

I just don’t think he is as good as some people seem to think he is. He floats in and out of games and often offers very little for 80+ minutes of a lot of games.

He could, and with his talent, should offer more on a game by game basis.
He's in the top 4 players in Europe for goals and assists this season. Might even be 3rd now after today I'm not sure.

People having a go at Rashford constantly when we have 20 odd players worse than him baffles me.
 

Leroy The Red

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ok.
Rashford has less goals than Callum Wilson, Patrick Bamford and Ollie Watkins.

He also has less assists than Grealish, Digne and Cresswell.

I just don’t think he is as good as some people seem to think he is. He floats in and out of games and often offers very little for 80+ minutes of a lot of games.

He could, and with his talent, should offer more on a game by game basis.
Really odd to be holding these things against Rashford. Who yeah probably isn’t having his best season.
But Those three players with more goals are centre forwards. Who I think have even scored more goals than most of city’s players.

Bamford and Watkins also play in teams who are better at creating them chances than we are at creating chances for Rashford.

Grealish and Digne are two top class players when it comes to creativity and that’s their role in the team. They aren’t lesser players than Rashford when it comes to creativity. Again this is an unfair comparison and again Grealish and Digne have more assists than city players.

Essentially Rashford would have to be peak Lionel Messi to score and create more than the players you listed.
 

Ali Dia

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This thread was just highlighting that the duo doesn’t work as well together as we thought last season. Is Rashford occasionally frustrating? Sure. His numbers are good but he’s wasting lots of chances and making us even more predictable a lot of the time. The one time he finally slipped Shaw in we could have scored easily. I would much rather a creator in at least one of the wing positions next season and Rashford is going nowhere so...

Martial. It’s clearly a mental problem isn’t it? It’s not a just drought. He is a player we could still get good money for and he could go on and play really well for another club but we don’t really need him. We need to get a more creative player or a pure striker in his place and the squad will be that bit more balanced.
 
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Pogue Mahone

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Brexit_Brigade

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So he doesn't have less goals and assists combined than any of them?
Isn't it hilarious? And I'm accused of "conveniently" focusing on assists to highlight just how full of crap the "lesser players" argument was (Digne and Cresswell don't have more assists anyway, so nice stat-padding, chap).

If we go by combined goals and assists, Rashford is the 8th-most effective player in the league this season. If we take away penalties (which he doesn't take while the majority of players ahead of him do - Son and Calvert-Lewin the major exceptions) he's 6th, behind Kane, Son, Fernandes, Bamford and Grealish. So sixth in the entire league, behind two of the very best players in the league, two other good players having great seasons, and one admittedly rather crap player having an outrageous season.

This is somehow meant to show that he's just not good enough.

I swear, at this point you people are better off just saying "I don't like Rashford's face".
 

Halftrack

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Isn't it hilarious? And I'm accused of "conveniently" focusing on assists to highlight just how full of crap the "lesser players" argument was (Digne and Cresswell don't have more assists anyway, so nice stat-padding, chap).

If we go by combined goals and assists, Rashford is the 8th-most effective player in the league this season. If we take away penalties (which he doesn't take while the majority of players ahead of him do - Son and Calvert-Lewin the major exceptions) he's 6th, behind Kane, Son, Fernandes, Bamford and Grealish. So sixth in the entire league, behind two of the very best players in the league, two other good players having great seasons, and one admittedly rather crap player having an outrageous season.

This is somehow meant to show that he's just not good enough.

I swear, at this point you people are better off just saying "I don't like Rashford's face".
It's baffling. It's not like we're saying he's perfect or without flaws, it's that he's clearly better than some on here are willing to give him credit for. The fact that so many of his detractors have to fall back to "the eye test" to support the argument that he's not good enough is very telling.
 

acnumber9

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And the only one of those players to break his back during that period of time.
I think this is something that isn’t being made as big a deal of as it should. He literally broke his back when he was hitting the form of his life. To recover this quickly and be on course to have his best scoring and assisting season yet is a big deal.
 

croadyman

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This thread was just highlighting that the duo doesn’t work as well together as we thought last season. Is Rashford occasionally frustrating? Sure. His numbers are good but he’s wasting lots of chances and making us even more predictable a lot of the time. The one time he finally slipped Shaw in we could have scored easily. I would much rather a creator in at least one of the wing positions next season and Rashford is going nowhere so...

Martial. It’s clearly a mental problem isn’t it? It’s not a just drought. He is a player we could still get good money for and he could go on and play really well for another club but we don’t really need him. We need to get a more creative player in his place and the squad will be that bit more balanced.
Very true we should sell this summer but many of our board just care about the money he is making the club and then some of our fanbase are also a bit sentimental about him being sold which is mad
 

roonster09

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Rashford has less goals and assists than several ‘lesser’ players at ‘lesser’ teams.

He’s very, very good and much less of a problem than Martial but he should not be on this bizarre pedestal that fans and parts of the media like to put him on
No you catch up.

You said Rashford has less goals and assists than several "lesser" players at "lesser" teams.

Go on then, name them. Rashford has I think 26 goals and assists combined this season.
ok.
Rashford has less goals
than Callum Wilson, Patrick Bamford and Ollie Watkins.

He also has less assists than Grealish, Digne and Cresswell.

I just don’t think he is as good as some people seem to think he is. He floats in and out of games and often offers very little for 80+ minutes of a lot of games.

He could, and with his talent, should offer more on a game by game basis.
Post something, when someone posts stats to prove it wrong, move the goal posts :lol:

Only 7 players have more goals+Assists than Rashford. From open play only 5 players have more goals+assists than Rashford.

If you take all competitions and in top 5 leagues only 5 players have more goals + Assists than Rashford.
 
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Listar

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ok.
Rashford has less goals than Callum Wilson, Patrick Bamford and Ollie Watkins.

He also has less assists than Grealish, Digne and Cresswell.

I just don’t think he is as good as some people seem to think he is. He floats in and out of games and often offers very little for 80+ minutes of a lot of games.

He could, and with his talent, should offer more on a game by game basis.
Ok. Who has more goals than Callum Wilson, Patrick Bamford and Ollie Watkins AND more assists than Grealish, Digne and Cresswell?

Only Fernandes and Kane? And I guess you can add Son.

Basically you can use the same justification to discount Salah, Mane, all city players etc. You're funny.
 

Terminator

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Rashford and Bruno carry our attackers and thats a fact.

Rashford is of course still young and has areas where he should improve but his output is brilliant for his age.
 

CG1010

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No player not named Messi or Ronaldo can score every game. You need your attacking players to score consistently with others chipping in here and there to win titles. We have Rashford and Bruno doing that regularly (albeit Bruno does score more from penalties which is fine as his role is to create and he does have a lot of assists). The gap is clearly Martial this season.
 

bugmat

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Rashford can be frustrating because of all the opportunities he spurns, but the lad is scoring regularly and assisting too. He's at that stage where you hope it clicks and he becomes this generation's Ronaldo. But he's not the issue.

Martial's form has dropped off a cliff since the end of Project restart and it's really weird. There must be more than meets the eye with how much he's out of it (and why Ole keeps trying to get him to play through it). He doesn't even look like he wants to be playing some times this season.