Rashford is going ahead with surgery and could be out until October

[Fahad Jawaid]

Why has he delayed his operation for another 3 weeks, why could not he have this operation straight after Euros, it just means he will be 3 weeks late which is vital for our season, now he is expected to be back late October/early Nov, and he will miss matches against Everton, Leicester, Liverpool, Tottenham & Mancity (probably). This could be a decisive period for us, where either we could come out all swinging or get taken down and remain top 4 side this season.

From the on-set there seems to be soo much stupidity from the Ole, Rashford & Southgate regarding his fitness.

Ole:
- Putting its foot down and telling Rashford during mid-season to go have have his operation when clearly he was not fit.
- Or not using him if he was not fit and stinking up the place therefore sending a message that unfit Rashford is not worth much and he himself goes and gets his operation done
- Discussing with Rashford & Southgate that he needs to have his operation and if that means he misses Euro so be it.

Rashford:
- Going to euro unfit and not putting his club first
- Not having a discussion with Southgate about his playing chances and essentially going there as a cheerleader only.
- Not having the operation straight after Euro and messes up 3 weeks where he would be missing all important matches which are 6 pointers.

Southgate:
- Taking unfit players to the Euro
- Not being open with Rashford that his minutes will be limited and its better he gets his operation done.

 

[roonster09]

The problem is the contradiction.

"I put the club first" then "I went to the Euros because it was my dream"
"I wasn't fit to the point I was letting people down" then "I was deemed fit and the injury was being managed so whats another couple of weeks"
"I was playing so badly that I felt I was letting people down" yet "Had I known I wouldnt play in the Euro's I may have done things differently"

None of that makes any sense at all, all contained in the one statement. Its perfectly reasonable to point that out without being accused of anything and it fact it completely validates both sides of the ongoing Rashford debate because he appears be agreeing with everyones view in one post/press release.

How is playing Euros contradict putting club first? If that wasn't the case maybe he would have had surgery during midseason to be fully fit for England. Just because he says he puts club first doesn't mean he doesn't give shit about England.

Ofcourse there is nothing wrong with pointing that out, there are lunatics who actually said whole injury thing was an excuse/fake. There are even more stupid things they came up with, so a fake injury takes 3 months to heal. Maybe they think Operation is just a fake set up.

 

[roonster09]

Those threads are still there to view. We know even he thought his performances for us were below standard but at the time when posters suggested he might not be playing well - or even after the fact as they looked back on the season - they were attacked.

It’s very easy to run posters out of threads. Maybe some don’t have the inclination to argue the toss with a stranger online, and that’s fair enough.

But the idea that watching someone play was a better barometer of how they’re playing than out of context cherrypicking of stats (something the poster termed the ‘eye test’) is considered something deserving of widespread derision, seems incredible to me.

But like I said, the threads will always be there to read for people to see what the response was to posters who thought there’d been a dip in form.

The second he has a poor performance next season the only people to voice that view will be Tory racists who want kids to die of starvation…or something…and of course

It's there for every one to see. How none of top 7 clubs in top leagues will sign Rashford, posting fake stats, yeah Valid criticism

 

[stw2022]

Why has he delayed his operation for another 3 weeks, why could not he have this operation straight after Euros, it just means he will be 3 weeks late which is vital for our season, now he is expected to be back late October/early Nov, and he will miss matches against Everton, Leicester, Liverpool, Tottenham & Mancity (probably). This could be a decisive period for us, where either we could come out all swinging or get taken down and remain top 4 side this season.

From the on-set there seems to be soo much stupidity from the Ole, Rashford & Southgate regarding his fitness.

Ole:
- Putting its foot down and telling Rashford during mid-season to go have have his operation when clearly he was not fit.
- Or not using him if he was not fit and stinking up the place therefore sending a message that unfit Rashford is not worth much and he himself goes and gets his operation done
- Discussing with Rashford & Southgate that he needs to have his operation and if that means he misses Euro so be it.

Rashford:
- Going to euro unfit and not putting his club first
- Not having a discussion with Southgate about his playing chances and essentially going there as a cheerleader only.
- Not having the operation straight after Euro and messes up 3 weeks where he would be missing all important matches which are 6 pointers.

Southgate:
- Taking unfit players to the Euro
- Not being open with Rashford that his minutes will be limited and its better he gets his operation done.

I blame Ole for continuing to play him in spite of what he surely could see happening. But I genuinely think United’s and England’s medial staff thought he was fit and available for selection.

United’s doctors didn’t think the injuries he was playing with required him to miss game time and England’s doctors presumably were made aware of any issues and came to the exact same conclusion.

We can either surmise incredible incompetence by two entirely separate teams of sports scientists at the top of their game or maybe they’re not convinced about the severity of the injury and whether surgery is necessarily need.

I think I err on the side of the latter and the whole timetable points to that direction.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.th...-whether-shoulder-surgery-needed-says-solskjr

It looks like an issue doctors at club and county don’t think is that severe but are willing to allow surgery for if the player wants to have it.

Even with injuries that aren’t severe enough to even contemplate surgery you will almost always see management of them through game time adjustments, increasing rest days between games, reducing minutes. We saw absolutely none of that with Rashford.

It has always seemed to be “if he wants to have it - fine”. There seems to be no pushing from the medical team.

Had he gone to the Euros, played well in every game and didn’t miss the penalty in the final I think there’d be a much greater than 50/50 chance he wouldn’t be having surgery and I think those paid to assess his fitnesses to play week in week out would have been perfectly fine with that outcome

 

[Hansi Fick]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

He such a smart, thoughtful, likeable young man.
Great news that he can take the time to get healthy and recover now and here's hoping everything goes as best as it can.

And yes, of course he deserved, and needed, a holiday and no, surgery and rehab are not a holiday.

I still think this has the hallmarks of a surgery the club doesn’t think he needs but are willing to let him have. The relaxed approach makes no sense. I’ve never blamed him for going to the Euros but if surgery was needed surely the club would have it scheduled already immediately after the Euros not in early August. Not allowed it to be delayed for him to have a holiday.

We shouldn't forget that we have little information about the medical details and that there of course are injuries/syndromes/cases where it's not really clear-cut and evident whether surgery or conservative treatment are the right thing to do. And that means not clear-cut and evident to the very specialists and doctors involved. Let alone us. That's why it's not really our place as outside observers to make or judge medical calls like that, let alone draw definite conclusions about intention or character from that judgement.

Jesus Christ.

Have a look at yourself. You are a 4chan user.

Ofcourse it's all fake. Didn't you see few moronic takes that injury isn't serious and how it's all fake.

Rashford is class. On and off the pitch. Happy that he’s sorting himself out.

incredible on the prior page someone is claiming that Grealish is a “breath of fresh air”. One fed the kids of GB during lockdown, one got smashed and drove home before being arrested.

It's astonishing how predetermined, mechanic, and relentless this goes. Rashford is a black young athlete who dared to do social activism that actually was somewhat meaningful and in contradiction to certain interests and positions in power (even if it wasn't radical by any means). And immediately he becomes a target for the right wing social media environment.

And this environment feeds on, and breeds and multiplies, the usual notions, whether mild or rampant, deliberate or not, that are always flying around in such conversations as ours here: lack of loyalty, lack of work ethic, notions that are favourite tropes of the emotional and affectual reactionary connection fans cultivate with football players and which preferably attach themselves to players of colour.

 

[Murder on Zidane's Floor]

All the best to Marcus

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

...hope he takes every bit of time needed. Well deserved recovery period for him. If done right, it will prolong his playing career by a few years. In a sense, this could turn out to be one of the most important moments of his career.

If we make him play through these injuries his career will be over by the time he is 28.

Break now, fix up, come back slow and return to full fitness. We have Sancho, Cavani, Greenwood, Martial, James, Amad etc to cover

 

[Adisa]

Why has he delayed his operation for another 3 weeks, why could not he have this operation straight after Euros

Because he deserves a holiday.

 

[Balljy]

If we make him play through these injuries his career will be over by the time he is 28.

Break now, fix up, come back slow and return to full fitness. We have Sancho, Cavani, Greenwood, Martial, James, Amad etc to cover

Yep, I'm glad they've decided to go ahead with it. It was pretty horrible to watch Rashford through the last few months of the season, he was obviously not right as when he's off form he would normally still give everything.

Taking a break and getting the body recovered is a net benefit compared to playing through the issue if the last few months of the season is what that looks like form-wise.

 

[9 Stone Elvis]

How is playing Euros contradict putting club first? If that wasn't the case maybe he would have had surgery during midseason to be fully fit for England. Just because he says he puts club first doesn't mean he doesn't give shit about England.

Ofcourse there is nothing wrong with pointing that out, there are lunatics who actually said whole injury thing was an excuse/fake. There are even more stupid things they came up with, so a fake injury takes 3 months to heal. Maybe they think Operation is just a fake set up.

Of course its a contradiction. "Im putting the club ahead of my own wishes/well-being" is essentially the first paragraph. "Im going to the Euro's because its my dream/personal goal" a couple of paragraphs down. I'm not saying he was wrong to do it but its a contradiction.

Look at the arguments on here. Strip out the extreme stuff on either side and look at whats been said

-Rashford is clearly not fit, you can tell by watching him play, his poor performances are because of that.
-Rashord hardly missed a game, the injury cant be that bad, he's been picked for United and been picked for the England squad

Which is true? read his statement again and he says both. Both cannot be true.

You cannot say "My injury is so bad that I feel I was letting everyone down" and also say "My injury was being managed I was playing, whats another few weeks playing for England". Thats a contradiction. This contradiction is further backed up by saying that he was playing poorly enough for Man Utd that he felt he was letting people down by the end of the season yet he expected to play a bigger role for England else he may not have gone? Why would he expect to play for his country in a massive tournament when by his own admission his performances for his club were so bad due to injury that he felt he was letting people down?

The whole statement makes absolutely no sense!

 

[Tom Van Persie]

He’s having shoulder surgery, so why can’t he go on holiday 5-6 weeks after surgery during rehabilitation? It’s not like he won’t be able to walk onto a plane and do physio sessions at a hotels gym?

Because he wanted to go with his friends like Sancho and it sounds like he hadn't made his mind up yet so he took some time off to think about it.

 

[George Beast]

- Not having the operation straight after Euro and messes up 3 weeks where he would be missing all important matches which are 6 pointers.

After a gruelling season before immediately going to the Euros, how can you think he doesn't deserve a break/holiday? If he was to get the surgery immediately after, he'd have gone almost 3 years before his next holiday considering 2020 everything was locked down. Do you really think that would have been best for his mental health? Get real.

 

[roonster09]

Of course its a contradiction. "Im putting the club ahead of my own wishes/well-being" is essentially the first paragraph. "Im going to the Euro's because its my dream/personal goal" a couple of paragraphs down. I'm not saying he was wrong to do it but its a contradiction.

Look at the arguments on here. Strip out the extreme stuff on either side and look at whats been said

-Rashford is clearly not fit, you can tell by watching him play, his poor performances are because of that.
-Rashord hardly missed a game, the injury cant be that bad, he's been picked for United and been picked for the England squad

Which is true? read his statement again and he says both. Both cannot be true.

You cannot say "My injury is so bad that I feel I was letting everyone down" and also say "My injury was being managed I was playing, whats another few weeks playing for England". Thats a contradiction. This contradiction is further backed up by saying that he was playing poorly enough for Man Utd that he felt he was letting people down by the end of the season yet he expected to play a bigger role for England else he may not have gone? Why would he expect to play for his country in a massive tournament when by his own admission his performances for his club were so bad due to injury that he felt he was letting people down?

The whole statement makes absolutely no sense!

Like I said I don't see how him saying he puts club first and playing Euros is contradicting. He would have had operation midseason if he was selfish or if he didn't put club first.

Also yes his injury was bad but not bad enough to miss games bur bad enough not to put 100% effort. It's not black or white.

 

[George Beast]

He’s having shoulder surgery, so why can’t he go on holiday 5-6 weeks after surgery during rehabilitation? It’s not like he won’t be able to walk onto a plane and do physio sessions at a hotels gym?

I don't know about you but doing physio sessions at some random hotel gym by yourself when all your mates already had their holidays doesn't quite scream "fun" or "relaxing" to me

 

[9 Stone Elvis]

Like I said I don't see how him saying he puts club first and playing Euros is contradicting. He would have had operation midseason if he was selfish or if he didn't put club first.

Also yes his injury was bad but not bad enough to miss games bur bad enough not to put 100% effort. It's not black or white.

Im not saying not put in 100%. I didn't mention that.

I didn’t want to let anyone down but ultimately looking at some of my performances towards the end of last season I felt like I was.

I had been deemed fit for the full season, and given my injuries were being managed, what was another couple of weeks?

He can say both these things if he wants but he cant run with the narrative that the injury affected him so badly that he felt he was letting people down, then two paragraphs later say that he was fit to play all season so was fit to play for England.

 

[Shiva87]

Im not saying not put in 100%. I didn't mention that.

I didn’t want to let anyone down but ultimately looking at some of my performances towards the end of last season I felt like I was.

I had been deemed fit for the full season, and given my injuries were being managed, what was another couple of weeks?

He can say both these things if he wants but he cant run with the narrative that the injury affected him so badly that he felt he was letting people down, then two paragraphs later say that he was fit to play all season so was fit to play for England.

This shows a classic lack of understanding of human phychology. He says "looking back" I felt like I was. And he says that when he decided to do the euros he thought it was okay because his injuries were being managed.

If anything, it shows poorly on our coaching staff and medical team who didnt work with him enough to show him how the injury is impacting him in training and in games (despite it being managed).

 

[roonster09]

Im not saying not put in 100%. I didn't mention that.

I didn’t want to let anyone down but ultimately looking at some of my performances towards the end of last season I felt like I was.

I had been deemed fit for the full season, and given my injuries were being managed, what was another couple of weeks?

He can say both these things if he wants but he cant run with the narrative that the injury affected him so badly that he felt he was letting people down, then two paragraphs later say that he was fit to play all season so was fit to play for England.

Let's agree to disagree. IMO you are reading too much into this and taking his words as a typical forum debate where every word is dissected to get whatever meaning you want to.

 

[9 Stone Elvis]

This shows a classic lack of understanding of human phychology. He says "looking back" I felt like I was. And he says that when he decided to do the euros he thought it was okay because his injuries were being managed.

If anything, it shows poorly on our coaching staff and medical team who didnt work with him enough to show him how the injury is impacting him in training and in games (despite it being managed).

He said he "felt like he was" Yes he is looking back on it at the point of the statement but he is admitting that he felt it at the time. Thats a key difference to saying "looking back perhaps I did" or some such.

So if his performances for us were so bad that he felt like he was letting people down how did he think he would perform for England?

 

[9 Stone Elvis]

Let's agree to disagree. IMO you are reading too much into this and taking his words as a typical forum debate where every word is dissected to get whatever meaning you want to.

Shrug, I can only take the words he used. Im sure the team that wrote them chose them carefully. My entire first point was that it was a terrible statement because of the fact that it only added fuel to the fire, and that exactly what its done.

 

[ShinjiNinja26]

Good decision. Should’ve had it done during the Euros but better late than never.

 

[roonster09]

Shrug, I can only take the words he used. Im sure the team that wrote them chose them carefully. My entire first point was that it was a terrible statement because of the fact that it only added fuel to the fire, and that exactly what its done.

It wasn't a terrible statement. It's not his fault people love to read too much into this, dissecting his statements like a forum multi quote posts or think everything through black or white lense.

You think him playing for Euros was contradicting what he said about club. I don't think it was. So why should Rashford think what others think when even simple statement is read in so many different ways.

 

[mu4c_20le]

He should've kept it simple and just tweeted "I wanted to get the surgery!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

 

[Shiva87]

He said he "felt like he was" Yes he is looking back on it at the point of the statement but he is admitting that he felt it at the time. Thats a key difference to saying "looking back perhaps I did" or some such.

So if his performances for us were so bad that he felt like he was letting people down how did he think he would perform for England?

Again, I would agree with @roonster09 . You are fitting in his statement to suit your predetermined outcome.

To me, I can only respect what he did last season for us. Him going to the Euros was stupid (in hindsight) because of how Gareth refused to play him. If he would have known his lack of involvement, perhaps he would have made a different choice.

 

[Maticmaker]

Time off recovering from an injury/rehab is hardly the same as a holiday.

Not with my old boss. I was new in post and once agreed to one of my staff having additional time off because he was off sick during his official holidays. My boss blew a gasket he said "I've have been telling them for ages when they are off sick during their holidays, its just bad luck and now you've ruined all that".... and what is more he meant every word!

 

[9 Stone Elvis]

Again, I would agree with @roonster09 . You are fitting in his statement to suit your predetermined outcome.

To me, I can only respect what he did last season for us. Him going to the Euros was stupid (in hindsight) because of how Gareth refused to play him. If he would have known his lack of involvement, perhaps he would have made a different choice.

I dont have a predetermined outcome.

If he played through injury for us I respect him for that.
If the injury was the reason for poor form thats understandable
Any player wanting to go to the Euros isnt something I would criticise, I would expect EVERY player to want to play if they possibly can

As far as Im aware I have not critissed him for any of the above individually.

Of course you can prioritise your club but still want to play for your country too.

I like Marcus Rashford and on his day he is an excellent player.

With all of the above I dont think you can make the statement he did which has him simultaneously fit enough to play at the very highest level whilst at the same time injured enough to perform so badly that he felt he was letting people down without it being questioned. Its the mish-mash of approaches he has taken to be all things to all people that I have an issue with. If he had just said "I played on into the euro's despite the injury because if I managed 50 games I felt I could do 55, I was managing the problem well" then I have no issue. If he had said "I have to have the surgery, my performances were so bad last season that towards the end I felt like I was letting people down" I fully respect that. I cant respect both.

I also dont see how ANYONE can have an issue with Southgate not playing him whilst holding the opinion that he was poor towards the end of the season. He didn't merit playing for England on form. I also dont understand how Rashford himself can simultaneously hold the view that he was so poor at the end of the season yet expect to play for England. Why would he think that? If he felt he ws letting people down for United by the end of the season surely he would understand a0 why he wasn't picked or wouldnt be picked and b) did he expect to just click back into form at the Euro's just because he really really wanted to play in them as a kid?

 

[Shiva87]

I dont have a predetermined outcome.

If he played through injury for us I respect him for that.
If the injury was the reason for poor form thats understandable
Any player wanting to go to the Euros isnt something I would criticise, I would expect EVERY player to want to play if they possibly can

As far as Im aware I have not critissed him for any of the above individually.

Of course you can prioritise your club but still want to play for your country too.

I like Marcus Rashford and on his day he is an excellent player.

With all of the above I dont think you can make the statement he did which has him simultaneously fit enough to play at the very highest level whilst at the same time injured enough to perform so badly that he felt he was letting people down without it being questioned. Its the mish-mash of approaches he has taken to be all things to all people that I have an issue with. If he had just said "I played on into the euro's despite the injury because if I managed 50 games I felt I could do 55, I was managing the problem well" then I have no issue. If he had said "I have to have the surgery, my performances were so bad last season that towards the end I felt like I was letting people down" I fully respect that. I cant respect both.

I also dont see how ANYONE can have an issue with Southgate not playing him whilst holding the opinion that he was poor towards the end of the season. He didn't merit playing for England on form. I also dont understand how Rashford himself can simultaneously hold the view that he was so poor at the end of the season yet expect to play for England. Why would he think that? If he felt he ws letting people down for United by the end of the season surely he would understand a0 why he wasn't picked or wouldnt be picked and b) did he expect to just click back into form at the Euro's just because he really really wanted to play in them as a kid?

So basically your problem is that he objectively feels both things. So you must be a sorted human being in life who is capable of rationally feeling single emotions.

Rashford is showing he is human. He is feeling seemingly conflicting things and he has expressed them. (Although I don't see them as much of a conflict).

You have assumed that he "felt" he was letting United down before going to Euros (and not after).

It is perfectly natural for him to have felt upset after the EL final and wanted to go to the Euros to erase that. The whole feeling/ reflection on the season typically happens in the off season. Not when you are putting yourself in the best shape possible (despite injury) to be available for your team.

Rest I will leave it to you. Don't think he deserves any criticism for this, but you can have your own view!

 

[Gary_Walsh_Nou_Camp_Hell]

If Rash posted that he had a a salad for lunch people to over analyse and criticise somehow.

People complain that the modern player is out of touch and then hammer a guy like Rash for opening up.

 

[9 Stone Elvis]

If Rash posted that he had a a salad for lunch people to over analyse and criticise somehow.

People complain that the modern player is out of touch and then hammer a guy like Rash for opening up.

Ive literally taken it at face value. If you care to point out what part has been over analysed I'm all ears. They are his words.

 

[mancan92]

Of course its a contradiction. "Im putting the club ahead of my own wishes/well-being" is essentially the first paragraph. "Im going to the Euro's because its my dream/personal goal" a couple of paragraphs down. I'm not saying he was wrong to do it but its a contradiction.

Look at the arguments on here. Strip out the extreme stuff on either side and look at whats been said

-Rashford is clearly not fit, you can tell by watching him play, his poor performances are because of that.
-Rashord hardly missed a game, the injury cant be that bad, he's been picked for United and been picked for the England squad

Which is true? read his statement again and he says both. Both cannot be true.

You cannot say "My injury is so bad that I feel I was letting everyone down" and also say "My injury was being managed I was playing, whats another few weeks playing for England". Thats a contradiction. This contradiction is further backed up by saying that he was playing poorly enough for Man Utd that he felt he was letting people down by the end of the season yet he expected to play a bigger role for England else he may not have gone? Why would he expect to play for his country in a massive tournament when by his own admission his performances for his club were so bad due to injury that he felt he was letting people down?

The whole statement makes absolutely no sense!

Alot of people struggle when they take things black and white and I wonder how they make it through life. I don't see how you can't notice the nuance in the situation. But maybe that's where empathy comes in.

 

[united_99]

He should've kept it simple and just tweeted "I wanted to get the surgery!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Exactly.
That’s what a certain almost 26 year old honest, role model, never causing any off pitch trouble and fictional best player in the world would do.

 

[Desert Eagle]

Alot of people struggle when they take things black and white and I wonder how they make it through life. I don't see how you can't notice the nuance in the situation. But maybe that's where empathy comes in.

Three ad homs in three sentences. Well done.

 

[Woodenlung]

So much fuss on this thread over a rather sensible move from Rashford. He's not let down the club or anyone. He played through injury and contributed a lot on the pitch despite his performances being hampered by a lack of full fitness.

 

[snk123]

tbf he did play a significant role in the Euros. (by missing the penalty)

 

[9 Stone Elvis]

Alot of people struggle when they take things black and white and I wonder how they make it through life. I don't see how you can't notice the nuance in the situation. But maybe that's where empathy comes in.

I haven't taken it as "black and white" in general I've been on the fence in the discussions about him. A lot of people struggle when they cant pin someone's opinion into a box. Your irony is hilarious.

 

[9 Stone Elvis]

So much fuss on this thread over a rather sensible move from Rashford. He's not let down the club or anyone. He played through injury and contributed a lot on the pitch despite his performances being hampered by a lack of full fitness.

Having the op is sensible. His statement wasn't.

 

[Gary_Walsh_Nou_Camp_Hell]

Ive literally taken it at face value. If you care to point out what part has been over analysed I'm all ears. They are his words.

Was i replying to you? No.

 

[9 Stone Elvis]

Was i replying to you? No.

Sorry, assumed it was in the general context of the other posts on the matter.

 

[alexthelion]

This shows a classic lack of understanding of human phychology. He says "looking back" I felt like I was. And he says that when he decided to do the euros he thought it was okay because his injuries were being managed.

If anything, it shows poorly on our coaching staff and medical team who didnt work with him enough to show him how the injury is impacting him in training and in games (despite it being managed).

Oh, come on, he'd know exactly how the injury affected him, he's not stupid.

 

[Bertie 2 Hats]

Wishing Marcus a speedy recovery and back to the best of form..

 

[ehsanul]

Marcus has a good PR team that writes good emotional letters so that peoples get emotional by reading it.

 

[Sparky_Hughes]

I fecking love rashy, don't blame him for going to the euros, glad he is having the surgery and can't wait to have him back.