Refs & VAR 2021/22

Flying high

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'Furthermore, in the first two years of VAR, viewers not in the stadium were able to see the working out process and it led to screenshots of borderline decisions being shared and creating more negativity for the decision-review system.

As a result, all decisions will be made off-screen from now on.'


So their big solution appears to be less transparency. Got to love the refs in this country. :rolleyes:
 

saivet

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'Furthermore, in the first two years of VAR, viewers not in the stadium were able to see the working out process and it led to screenshots of borderline decisions being shared and creating more negativity for the decision-review system.

As a result, all decisions will be made off-screen from now on.'


So their big solution appears to be less transparency. Got to love the refs in this country. :rolleyes:
They do it in UEFA competitions and I think it's for the best. We don't need to see them doing freeze frame and drawing the lines. It's overkill imo.
 

Flying high

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They do it in UEFA competitions and I think it's for the best. We don't need to see them doing freeze frame and drawing the lines. It's overkill imo.
The problem with that is the lack of trust in the competence, and even the impartiality, of those in charge.
 

awop

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The offside change should be good but watching those refs waive off genuine penalty inducing contacts is going to be infuriating...
 

sullydnl

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11101

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'We're very keen that players are aware that you don't need to go down, you don't need to exaggerate the contact. If the contact is there, we'll find that.'

They haven't a clue. Why would a player stay on his feet hoping they will find the contact, when they can fall over and make sure of it?
 

awop

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That's the only time they will have to talk to anyone for the whole season. As soon as they feck it up they will procede to hide while everyone rages on the internet.
They can mix it up as much as they want, real progress will only come when there is real consequence to making a bad decision (especially after looking at it with VAR).
 

SadlerMUFC

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Just get rid of the lines all together. If you can't tell with the naked eye if a player is offside or not, then it's not a clear and obvious mistake...
 

WeePat

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'We're very keen that players are aware that you don't need to go down, you don't need to exaggerate the contact. If the contact is there, we'll find that.'

They haven't a clue. Why would a player stay on his feet hoping they will find the contact, when they can fall over and make sure of it?
"if the contact is there, we'll find it' - the reason players go down soon as they feel contact is precisely because they haven't 'found it'. Players who do try and stay up after being pulled or impeded in some other way are applauded in the media for 'being honest' but rarely do they get anything from the ref in those situations.
 

sullydnl

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'We're very keen that players are aware that you don't need to go down, you don't need to exaggerate the contact. If the contact is there, we'll find that.'

They haven't a clue. Why would a player stay on his feet hoping they will find the contact, when they can fall over and make sure of it?
I think the idea is that under the new rules part of the consideration as to whether a penalty will be awarded is whether the way the player goes down makes sense relative to the level of contact. So (in theory) the reason a player wouldn't go down to "make sure" it's a penalty is that doing so may actively count against them, as the ref will see the exaggerated contact and not award a penalty he (again, in theory) might have given if the player reacted naturally (or just dived in a more convincing way, I guess).

Needless to say it's primed to be an absolute shitshow of inconsistency.
 

cyberman

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'We're very keen that players are aware that you don't need to go down, you don't need to exaggerate the contact. If the contact is there, we'll find that.'

They haven't a clue. Why would a player stay on his feet hoping they will find the contact, when they can fall over and make sure of it?
But contact isn’t a foul. More advice that is ignored from 3 weeks in it is.
 

sullydnl

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Looking at the rule changes:

1) The handball stuff is obviously an improvement, though that's mostly by walking back on changes they made in the last few years. So all of that was a waste of time, really.

2) The offside stuff is an improvement too, though it does mean you could have situations where the linesman flags a goal as offside, VAR shows the goal is offside but it is awarded anyway as it isn't quite offside enough. I wonder how people will react when they're on the wrong side of that call.

3) The stuff about soft penalties will probably be a pile of shite.

Suppose two out of three isn't bad relative to their normal standard.
 

stw2022

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If it’s not clear and obvious by looking briefly at a still image then every attacker should be given the benefit of the doubt in offside situations
 

Ekkie Thump

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I’ve been a massive, relentless critic of VAR but it seemed to work pretty damn well in our match today. Maybe it can be fixed?
Yeah same here. Shite as it was for us I was glad we didn't spend an age deciphering whether Bruno's toe happened to be a hair offside. Thought the reffing was pretty good generally too.
 

Mb194dc

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I’ve been a massive, relentless critic of VAR but it seemed to work pretty damn well in our match today. Maybe it can be fixed?
It already worked better in other leagues and at the tournaments.

Looks like we'll get less intervention this season, like at the Euros, hopefully, which should improve things.

Communication is still an issue though, e.g for Utd 4th goal yesterday. Looked offside, but why not show the image showing the nearside defender playing him on?
 

11101

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They said Bruno's goal would have been offside last year, so I'm all for the changes. It's definitely better without all the pratting around with lines etc.
 

Moonwalker

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The great accomplishment of last year's bickering and moaning is to vote in a less transparent system but with 'better optics', and it appears to have restored everyone's faith in the beautiful game.

That is at least until the first couple of decisions go against us, at which point everyone will be at the races again, throwing their toys out with renowned vigor.

The one thing they can genuinely improve - is to not change horses in midstream in regards to rule interpretations which is of critical importance to the integrity of the competition, and something they've failed with, miserably, last year. They've had time to work it out now and have the experience of last year, and hopefully we won't see drastic U-turns halfway through the season.
 
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stw2022

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Presumably there are some people who now think the lack of squinting at the screen for several minutes to see if someone’s nose hair is offside has ruined the game?
 

TrustInJanuzaj

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The officiating in our game was much better than pretty much any fixture last season. I thought watching the highlights of the other games, the higher threshold seemed to have worked in all the games.
 

keithsingleton

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Early days i know with the new VAR rules but from the matches I saw yesterday definitely more free flowing football. Let's hope it continues.
 

Moonwalker

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Presumably there are some people who now think the lack of squinting at the screen for several minutes to see if someone’s nose hair is offside has ruined the game?
Really, who are these people?
 

OnlyTwoDaSilvas

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Did they show the VAR lines for Bruno's 3rd goal? They showed a freeze frame without a line which looked like it could be ruled out, but it stood. I'm glad it did, but it would be interesting to know how they're looking at offsides now.

By last season's standards I thought Arsenal could have had a penalty on Friday night, and Maguire could have given one away in stoppage time today. There was no indication that VAR looked at either.

So far, it looks like a much more light-touch approach, which I am in favour of.
 

R'hllor

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Never understood push back vs VAR ( the system ) not the clowns in front of monitors, even in that department you can make tones of improvement but it wont happen sadly due whole ref brothers bs. The system will evolve and improve, specially when it catches up with technology.
 

Doracle

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Generally much better this weekend but the West Ham penalty was a shocker. How does VAR not overturn that?!
 

Utd heap

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VAR is shite thats never going to change. We just make small concessions for it that lead to people who go every week not walking away.
 

Matthew84!

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Did they show the VAR lines for Bruno's 3rd goal? They showed a freeze frame without a line which looked like it could be ruled out, but it stood. I'm glad it did, but it would be interesting to know how they're looking at offsides now.

By last season's standards I thought Arsenal could have had a penalty on Friday night, and Maguire could have given one away in stoppage time today. There was no indication that VAR looked at either.

So far, it looks like a much more light-touch approach, which I am in favour of.
I saw the lines on match of the day, would of been offside last year.
 

Mike Smalling

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Anyone wondering if the VAR pendulum has now swung too much in the other direction, meaning they are now too cautious in overturning the refs original decisions? The foul on Bruno and Arsenal's penalty shout both looked like clear wrong decisions for me, and exactly the type of situations VAR should handle.

Of course, I fully support not looking for every possible penalty and the smallest of offsides. Just seemed like they got two wrong yesterday and are maybe still trying to find the right balance.
 

awop

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I think offsides are an improvement but penalties are still a mess. Unless it's a blatant dive or an obvious foul, penalties incidents should be more often than not a monitor check imo.
I don't think there is enough situations in a given game that it would take too much time.
 

Alex99

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Anyone wondering if the VAR pendulum has now swung too much in the other direction, meaning they are now too cautious in overturning the refs original decisions? The foul on Bruno and Arsenal's penalty shout both looked like clear wrong decisions for me, and exactly the type of situations VAR should handle.

Of course, I fully support not looking for every possible penalty and the smallest of offsides. Just seemed like they got two wrong yesterday and are maybe still trying to find the right balance.
I don't think it was a foul on Bruno and haven't seen Arsenal's penalty shout, but given we've followed the way it was implemented at the Euros, I'd agree it's gone too far the other way.

We've gone from everything referred to VAR is overturned to nothing is overturned.
 

Mike Smalling

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I don't think it was a foul on Bruno and haven't seen Arsenal's penalty shout, but given we've followed the way it was implemented at the Euros, I'd agree it's gone too far the other way.

We've gone from everything referred to VAR is overturned to nothing is overturned.

00:50 in the above highlights. Only two angles though.

Regarding the Bruno incident, I thought it was a clear arm/elbow shove in the back. Whether or not it should be overturned, I didn't see or hear any reference to a VAR check on it, which I thought was strange.
 

Thunderhead

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it's still so subjective, no idea how Martinez wasn't sent of on Saturday v Newcastle, that for me was a red all day even if the pen is overturned for offside

if the ref had given the Saka pen would it have been overruled?

also why did the ref go to the monitor this week in the Newcastle game but didn't last week? still not consistent enough for me.
 

Offsideagain

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Just remember a tackle from behind where the player in possession is pushed over the tacklers leg is not a foul according to Shearer. It’s odds on if Maguire does the same, one-eyed Shearer will be shouting foul. VAR should be used only for offside and penalties.
 

tomaldinho1

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Anyone wondering if the VAR pendulum has now swung too much in the other direction, meaning they are now too cautious in overturning the refs original decisions? The foul on Bruno and Arsenal's penalty shout both looked like clear wrong decisions for me, and exactly the type of situations VAR should handle.

Of course, I fully support not looking for every possible penalty and the smallest of offsides. Just seemed like they got two wrong yesterday and are maybe still trying to find the right balance.
I think it's been good so far to be honest bar Martinez taking out Wilson. Seems much less stop start and quicker decisions.
Bruno's wasn't a foul for me and I think Saka's you can argue is a foul from either player i.e. it's a coming together and you can't expect James to just let him through. I'd be annoyed if either were given against United. As long as the standard stays like this and they don't start revising it mid season, it will be fine.
 

Shane88

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It was never a foul. It was weak from Bruno and I'm sick of his diving. He could've spun or passed it, instead he waited thinking he's automatically entitled to a free kick and he was blasted out of it by a strong fair tackle.

He needs to learn from it and stop being a wimp.