I can't lie I was completely brainwashed and thought he was right about everything. Now that the dust has settled I can see the reality. I apologise to you, but you were a handsome fraud.
Ruben Amorim. Fired for being crap. Full stop. Just another addition for Amol as he loves it
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Currently Carrick is making a mockery our of Amorim performance wise. But let's not forget Ruben did set a certain character standards and proceeded with clearout of Antony, Sancho, Garnacho, Rashford from the squad. This is something we must give him.
I was a supporter until the final against Spurs. It wasn’t that we lost but basically we lost in the same way we had lost half a dozen games in the couple of months prior. It was the exact same pattern.
He was direct and unfiltered in his media conversations which I think crated an illusion of someone who was very confident in their craft.
In the second season, there was some hope that he would turn it around as we started better but you could see the predictable pattern of failures. I think his mentality and inability to remain composed is probably an even bigger problem than his formation.
Not acknowledging the clubs or fans is pathetic though. It genuinely does make me view him in a more negative way than I would otherwise,
He was direct and unfiltered in his media conversations which I think crated an illusion of someone who was very confident in their craft.
In the second season, there was some hope that he would turn it around as we started better but you could see the predictable pattern of failures. I think his mentality and inability to remain composed is probably an even bigger problem than his formation.
Not acknowledging the clubs or fans is pathetic though. It genuinely does make me view him in a more negative way than I would otherwise,
Absolutely. Especially when you consider that the fans have been singing his song basically from day one and through it all. You can debate whether that should have happened, but he definitely had really good support throughout.
Can't argue with that, Ruben got rid of bad culture in that dressing room. That said his football was diabolical. I was at the West Ham game before Christmas and Spurs at Saturday. Like watching a different club in every way, the positivity from the fans and speed of build up, passing combinations, subs. Carrick has completely made a mockery.
Frankly, we have no idea if getting rid of those players was actually Amorim's doing and wouldn't have happened without him. People are just arbitrarily attributing that to him as if it was some kind of special initiative he took where any other manager would have just kept those players. Same goes for really vague things like "setting character standards." What actually indicates that this is something he did? Not only did I not see any significant boost in "character standards" under him, there's also nothing to suggest that this was something he made a point of doing. On the contrary, his style of management (constant negativity, calling the team shit, throwing players under the bus, too scared to watch a penalty shootout, freezing young talent out of the club, playing everyone out of position, etc.) points to the exact opposite. If any players somehow underwent a growth of character during his tenure, I venture to claim that it was in spite of him, not because of him. Why would such an egocentric miser inspire players? Is there any indication at all that this is actually something he did in fact do? Or are people just making it up based on no evidence of any kind?
What we can say for certain is that when it comes to the things we do know were his own personal doing, it was utterly terrible. Game management, tactics, substitutions, formation, treatment of players, inspiring confidence and so on. The things that are demonstrably his purview. He fecking sucked at all of that. It's funny to me that people's perceived positives of his tenure are all things that we really have no idea to what extent he was responsible for. He's already being praised for signings when the reality is that he wanted completely different players from the ones we signed.
What we can say for certain is that when it comes to the things we do know were his own personal doing, it was utterly terrible. Game management, tactics, substitutions, formation, treatment of players, inspiring confidence and so on. The things that are demonstrably his purview. He fecking sucked at all of that. It's funny to me that people's perceived positives of his tenure are all things that we really have no idea to what extent he was responsible for. He's already being praised for signings when the reality is that he wanted completely different players from the ones we signed.
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I feel like a little old lady who was being conned out of her life savings by the waiter I met on holiday, but now this nice young policeman called Michael has stepped in to sort everything out.
Roughly 90% of your posts in the last month have been in this thread. And half of your posts in the Carrick thread have mentioned Amorim.
Yet, anyone who isn't banging a drum of hate against Amorim is called a cultist. It only takes a handful of agendas posters to ruin any discussion.
Have a break.
Yep, and it’s exactly what Sporting fans said he would do too. He set standards at this club and created a level of team cohesion.
The problem is he was too inexperienced for the league, tactically naive and too stubborn to do anything about it.
Wrong thread. Possibly the wrong forum.
He wanted Martinez instead of Lammens, he was mad about that.
I wanted Lammens, as Martinez has a volatile personality and makes errors aplenty.
He did continue clearing out bad apples, but also froze out Mainoo.
In fairness, that was insane.
Very impressive by Mainoo though.
Having the fitness required to last a full 90 was a concern while he was playing regularly.
He's not only jumped straight into first team action without looking rusty, he seems to have actually improved his fitness and condtioning.
Excellent points and in particular the bolded. It’s something I’m seeing crop up more and more amongst our fanbase. Attributing credit to Amorim for transfers, squad building etc:
It’s a strange nonsensical one not only because of what you’ve said but because when he slagged off the board publicly the response from a section of the fanbase was that he was calling them out for not backing him in the market etc.
So they didn’t back him in the market but then his supporters subsequently claim he build this squad.
As implied, He didn’t want Lammens or Sesko but somehow he is responsible for this current squads make up.
I will freely admit to being someone who would have preferred Watkins and Martinez to Lammens and Sesko in the summer.
So I don’t think Amorim was that out of order for wanting those targets but yeah you don’t get two bites at the cherry.
You can’t say the board didn’t back him and subsequently that he build the squad and these signings were his.
And yeah the character building stuff is the biggest load of tosh. I mean you could swing it one way I guess . In that he was so bad, our players simply went through a character building process having to put up with him for over a year. I’d imagine their ability to be patient and tolerant was tested to the extreme.
Yeah, he has been the best version of himself we have seen. I always loved the way he played but he has removed all the caveats in the last 4 games.
The vast majority of posts on this forum disagree with this and are far, far more vocal than posts suggesting otherwise. Most are categorically stating that he cannot receive any praise for signings, sales, or changes to club culture.
Quality control
The amount of Ruben Amorim fanboys online (such as twitter) claiming he set the foundation for Carrick just highlights how strange those individuals are.
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I liked him a lot, but his treatment of Mainoo is close to criminal. It's so bad that it even overshadows his terrible record.
When did I call anyone a cultist? All these little rules when, where and how much you have to post are funny. Sort of like there was never the right time to post in the original thread.
I never said you called anyone a cultist. My point is that you and others are obsessive on this topic, yet anyone who doesn't subscribe to the manager as some one dimensional panto villain is portrayed as a member of a cult.
It's not a little rule; agenda posting is poison for discussion boards.
Threadmark.
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Please keep this discussion respectful. Referring to other members as “cultists,” “stans,” “fanboys,” or similar labels because they hold a different opinion counts as othering and shuts down constructive conversation.
This is a discussion forum. Debate ideas, not people. Ongoing use of dismissive or labeling language poisons the well for everyone and derails productive dialogue.
Please stop using these terms and refocus on engaging with the topic in good faith.
This is a discussion forum. Debate ideas, not people. Ongoing use of dismissive or labeling language poisons the well for everyone and derails productive dialogue.
Please stop using these terms and refocus on engaging with the topic in good faith.
Genius. He was just saving his legs and making him angry, ready to unleash him second half of the season..
NOTE stop asking about warnings in public. PM the mod who gave it and ask to explain the reasons
Should this thread continue in the same vein and people can’t be respectful I will close it. He’s no longer our coach, we don’t need to discuss him
Should this thread continue in the same vein and people can’t be respectful I will close it. He’s no longer our coach, we don’t need to discuss him
Yeah!
Why is that same energy and principles not used for people calling players names like idiots, low IQ, dummy, stupid, donkey and many more? or is it because the players aren't on these forum? but you know they might have a friend, father, mother, brother, sister on here reading these insults thrown at them. At some point didn't we have some academy players parents on here? so imagine they get to read insults thrown at their kids but it's all good on here unless you call a poster a "cultist", incredible.
It's so easy for posters to insult players but insulting posters is frowned upon, I mean does it even make sense? It has to change!
I didn't know they were serious
- i've read a few such posts on here and thought they were tongue in cheek....sort of.Anyway, amidst the 90% of shite he caught on and how out of his depth he was, he did about 10% of the things I'd say I think I agreed with him on and which have definitely helped our current plight.
Part of what he's done is set the bar so damn low, winning 4-in-a-row is seen as bloody genius/the second coming of SAF
(i'm half jesting - because i don't want to detract from how impressive Carrick has actually been).I remember hearing that some of our staff members were surprised at the lack of chances Mainoo was getting at the time because he was so impressive in training.
I think @Rolaholic posted it early into this season when people were saying Mainoo had an attitude problem which was why he needed selling. I believed the reports at the time and it seems they were true because, as you say, the second he's been trusted to start he's taken the opportunity with both hands and feet!
I don't disagree, but this isn't the thread for it.
Yeah, Mainoo was never really dominant and rarely if ever finshed 90 mins, so it wasn't a huge stretch to believe the narrative. Thank fcek it didn't pan out with him leaving.
Aye, I thought him leaving was inevitable and I was proper gutted about it. I also felt for Mainoo in regards to the World Cup because I thought with consistent game time he'd definitely be in the squad, and he was going to miss out because our manager just refused to trust him alongside Casemiro and Bruno. You only get about 3 or 4 opportunities at most in your career to go to a World Cup. He still may not make the squad but at least he's got a chance now.
Carrick has been like a nice cuppa tea after an early morning. Just refreshing after the circus we've been apart of during the last few years. Even if he doesn't get the job, we can be thankful that he's come in and just seemingly got us on the right track again.
If that's the case, its odd Amorim never decided to use those foundations himself then.....
I'd be interested to know what "foundations" you think he left.
It took a powerful recency bias to buy the narrative about Mainoo not being good enough. He didn't look good under Amorim (who did!?) and also struggled during the ETH end game (again, just like everyone else) but there were none of these doubts about him during his debut season. And the fact he was usually subbed off before the end when he was still very young really shouldn't have been weaponised against him as some sort of reflection on his fitness or application. He was still just a kid and men's football is a big step up, physically.
No need to be so dramatic, believing someone with more data than me is the easiest way for me to live my life. There were always conversations about his futsal background and stamina, so it wasn't that mental for fans, as the bolded shows. It did irk that he looked so physically dominant at youth level. But it was utterly inexplicable of Amorim as it turns out.
Futsal background?! I definitely missed that angle!
PC Carrick from Aidensfield
Absolutely. Amorim, for all his faults, deserves some credit for the doing the dirty work.
You could not have articulated this better. Bravo. We must not forget that he would still be here if he didn't call time on it by challenging the board in a press conference and walking away with his millions. Serious questions need to be asked of what INEOS were thinking before his appointment and during his tenure to keep him on as long as they did. They have found themselves in this position with Carrick by pure luck. I really hope Wilcox goes at the end of the season and we get someone credible in.
Yeah, lazy narrative, it was suggested it was why he was good in small spaces but couldn't/wouldn't cover ground.
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