Russian invasion of Ukraine

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Ekkie Thump

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Spain has the bigger number of LNG regassification plants in europe and the fourth in the world after US, korea and Japan. The storage capacity of these plants could cover 60% of the gas imported from Russia. Also Spain has direct connection with a gaseoduct from Algeria, but they are at capacity because their political instability didn't allow them to increase production and also internal consume increased diminishing their exports

The only problem is France, that had always opposed to a pipeline network crossing the Pyrenees because of energy competition with Spain. if only they could solve this connection (I believe there are only 2 minor connections), the dependancy from Russia would diminish a lot
What about UK? It has plenty of regassification plants itself (fewer than Spain but not substantially so). Would it perhaps be possible to open North Sea pipelines to Europe and replenish its own stocks via LNG through its own regassification plants? I know next to nothing here so maybe this is unfeasible for some number of reasons.
 

Rajma

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All this could have been avoided if the Americans listened to people like George Keenan etc. The man who led the Soviet containment policy.
It's very understandable that countries under the Soviet domination don't want to be under Russian domination either but an alternative method could have been found instead of getting them to join NATO.
The Americans could have offered them a defense pact to defend them if attacked. No positioning of nuclear weapons etc.
Emm, Budapest agreement? How did that turned out? Stop living in a cuckooland, when it comes to Russia there’s no alternative method.
 

B20

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Not without its own problems. French planners have been grappling with the problem of nuclear waste which still has no good solution. There was a good Financial Times article on the topic a week or so back.
Lasers are set to solve that problem in the near future.

A big problem with nuclear is that actually building new plants is prohibitively expensive.
 

Foxbatt

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Emm, Budapest agreement? How did that turned out? Stop living in a cuckooland, when it comes to Russia there’s no alternative method.
The Americans threw out the nuclear agreement with Iran too. I don't know where you are from but for a lot of people in the world they create less problem than the Americans and the British.
 

4bars

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What about UK? It has plenty of regassification plants itself (fewer than Spain but not substantially so). Would it perhaps be possible to open North Sea pipelines to Europe and replenish its own stocks via LNG through its own regassification plants? I know next to nothing here so maybe this is unfeasible for some number of reasons.
Im no expert either. Just repeating numbers that i have being reading. Of course everything helps but spain being a better player on distribuiting the gas than UK is because they have 60% mire storage than UK and needs 40% less gas than UK ( smaller population and less gas needs due to clima i reckon) meaning that they can export more. But at then of the day, probably the problem would not be only where to store and regasification but to who buy it and what price. Is so complicated to increase production and have enough special lng vessels to supply the demand. It would be a multiyear effort andit is the middle of the winter now
 

sport2793

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This video does a good job of debunking the idea that Trump was somehow tough on Russia, especially compared to presidents before and after:
 
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This video does a good job of debunking the idea that Trump was somehow tough on Russia, especially compared to presidents before and after:
What does that even matter? What a weird thing to bring up with Ukraine and Russia on the brink of war. Ukrainians and Russians don’t care about Trump right now..
 

Classical Mechanic

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What about UK? It has plenty of regassification plants itself (fewer than Spain but not substantially so). Would it perhaps be possible to open North Sea pipelines to Europe and replenish its own stocks via LNG through its own regassification plants? I know next to nothing here so maybe this is unfeasible for some number of reasons.
I wonder if the conversation around fracking will come back into play soon.

https://www.lse.ac.uk/granthaminsti...al-reserves-of-shale-gas-are-there-in-the-uk/
 

VorZakone

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Apparently, Lavrov tried to resign multiple times but wasn't allowed to. According to former Polish foreign minister.
 

sport2793

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What does that even matter? What a weird thing to bring up with Ukraine and Russia on the brink of war. Ukrainians and Russians don’t care about Trump right now..
This point has been brought up several times over the past week in this thread by different posters and I think the video does a good job of explaining why the point is not correct. No need to get so defensive on the behalf of Ukrainians or Russians. Plus this conversation is important to both countries as the US is the most important member of NATO. There's a reason why on the brink of war the Ukrainian foreign minister was in Washington D.C. today. It's also telling that Macron put in so many hours trying to broker a summit that he wouldn't even be involved in himself.

The issue that the video I linked brings up is that a lot of right wing anti-NATO propagandists in the US centered around Trump are celebrating Putin's actions right now and saying the US should not support Ukraine. If they were in power now (and there's a great chance they could have power by the end of the year), there would be no meaningful sanctions and NATO may not even exist in any relevant form that Putin would be intimidated by at least. So what could seem irrelevant to the average person actually means a lot when it comes to how this conflict might play out.
 

GDaly95

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Would it be fair to say that Putin has complete control over what prominent Russian oligarchs do with their money when it comes to political contributions?

Meaning, Putin can use these oligarchs and their funds to make strategic political investments spread across Europe and beyond in a way that puts key politicians in Russia's pocket to minimize the severity of sanctions?

I assume this falls under the umbrella of 'the plan' or am I going a bit too deep?
 

Enigma_87

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I believe Japan is already diverting gas to Europe, as are the Qataris. The US is also now the world's leading exporter of LNG and biggest supplier to Europe. There's still a lot more that can come from the US imo.
As someone else mentioned I don't think Japan could divert at the moment, due to shortage.

There's also Iran. But needs some work politically and lift some of the restrictions they are currently imposed on them. They have a huge supply that for the time being can be used. I think there has been some talks over the last month and USA have lifted some of the sanctions imposed 6-7 years ago.
 
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This point has been brought up several times over the past week in this thread by different posters and I think the video does a good job of explaining why the point is not correct. No need to get so defensive on the behalf of Ukrainians or Russians. Plus this conversation is important to both countries as the US is the most important member of NATO. There's a reason why on the brink of war the Ukrainian foreign minister was in Washington D.C. today. It's also telling that Macron put in so many hours trying to broker a summit that he wouldn't even be involved in himself.

The issue that the video I linked brings up is that a lot of right wing anti-NATO propagandists in the US centered around Trump are celebrating Putin's actions right now and saying the US should not support Ukraine. If they were in power now (and there's a great chance they could have power by the end of the year), there would be no meaningful sanctions and NATO may not even exist in any relevant form that Putin would be intimidated by at least. So what could seem irrelevant to the average person actually means a lot when it comes to how this conflict might play out.
Putin and Russia are far-left extremists. I hardly can imagine right wingers celebrating Putin invading a democratic country. Even if they are, they don’t represent Trump so that’s false to say that. Every side, right, centre and left is all opposed to this act of bullying.

Don’t agree with your ‘prediction’ at all. Why didn’t Putin invade Ukraine while Trump was in power then? If you say Ukraine wouldn’t exist if Trump was president. He was president and nothing happened to Ukraine.

Putin sounds unhinged and is clearly acting like a mad man, he’s not scared of the whole of Europe so why would he be scared of America. He is invading regardless of which leaders are in power.
 

sport2793

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All this could have been avoided if the Americans listened to people like George Keenan etc. The man who led the Soviet containment policy.
It's very understandable that countries under the Soviet domination don't want to be under Russian domination either but an alternative method could have been found instead of getting them to join NATO.
The Americans could have offered them a defense pact to defend them if attacked. No positioning of nuclear weapons etc.
Stop with this George Kennan revisionism, it was his idea of domino theory that got the US involved in stupid foreign conflicts like Vietnam in the first place! George Kennan's point was to expand U.S. alliances around the world (including NATO) to prevent the Soviets from planting the seeds of communism. He assumed, wrongly, that if one country falls to communism, the rest of the region will follow suit and will combine with the Soviet Union to become a coordinated mass devoted to destroying capitalism. This was proven to be wrong as many cracks developed in the Communist bloc (Russia vs. China, China vs. Vietnam after the US left) that ended up being a big factor in ending the Cold War. Containment is a load of nonsense and irrelevant in this situation.

One could even argue that containment may have precipitated this conflict although I would argue this war was always going to happen. Putin's speech yesterday showed that he cares more about ideology and historical pride than any real security concerns that NATO might pose. He doesn't even consider Ukraine worthy of being a sovereign state.
 
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Pexbo

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Putin and Russia are far-left extremists. I hardly can imagine right wingers celebrating Putin invading a democratic country. Even if they are, they don’t represent Trump so that’s false to say that. Every side, right, centre and left is all opposed to this act of bullying.

Don’t agree with your ‘prediction’ at all. Why didn’t Putin invade Ukraine while Trump was in power then? If you say Ukraine wouldn’t exist if Trump was president. He was president and nothing happened to Ukraine.

Putin sounds unhinged and is clearly acting like a mad man, he’s not scared of the whole of Europe so why would he be scared of America. He is invading regardless of which leaders are in power.
I’m sorry, what?
 

Revan

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Putin and Russia are far-left extremists. I hardly can imagine right wingers celebrating Putin invading a democratic country. Even if they are, they don’t represent Trump so that’s false to say that. Every side, right, centre and left is all opposed to this act of bullying.

Don’t agree with your ‘prediction’ at all. Why didn’t Putin invade Ukraine while Trump was in power then? If you say Ukraine wouldn’t exist if Trump was president. He was president and nothing happened to Ukraine.

Putin sounds unhinged and is clearly acting like a mad man, he’s not scared of the whole of Europe so why would he be scared of America. He is invading regardless of which leaders are in power.
Putin and Russia are definitely far right. They are like Sarah Palin in steroids.
 

sport2793

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Putin and Russia are far-left extremists. I hardly can imagine right wingers celebrating Putin invading a democratic country. Even if they are, they don’t represent Trump so that’s false to say that. Every side, right, centre and left is all opposed to this act of bullying.

Don’t agree with your ‘prediction’ at all. Why didn’t Putin invade Ukraine while Trump was in power then? If you say Ukraine wouldn’t exist if Trump was president. He was president and nothing happened to Ukraine.

Putin sounds unhinged and is clearly acting like a mad man, he’s not scared of the whole of Europe so why would he be scared of America. He is invading regardless of which leaders are in power.
Mate everything you said is factually incorrect. Can't even take you seriously after you call Putin a far-left extremist, nearly made me spit my water out. You probably should stay out of conversations you have no knowledge about.
 
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Mate everything you said is factually incorrect. Can't even take you seriously after you call Putin a far-left extremist, nearly made me spit my water out. You probably should stay out of conversations you have no knowledge about.
Putin is a communist, right wingers are capitalists.

You should go to the Trump thread so you can continue to agenda there. This thread is for Ukraine vs Russia.
 

sport2793

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Putin and Russia are definitely far right. They are like Sarah Palin in steroids.
Not to mention his naive surprise about how "right wingers shouldn't be celebrating Putin invading a democratic country" and "Every side, right, centre and left is all opposed to this act of bullying." They're some real pearls in that post.
 

Berbasbullet

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Putin and Russia are far-left extremists. I hardly can imagine right wingers celebrating Putin invading a democratic country. Even if they are, they don’t represent Trump so that’s false to say that. Every side, right, centre and left is all opposed to this act of bullying.

Don’t agree with your ‘prediction’ at all. Why didn’t Putin invade Ukraine while Trump was in power then? If you say Ukraine wouldn’t exist if Trump was president. He was president and nothing happened to Ukraine.

Putin sounds unhinged and is clearly acting like a mad man, he’s not scared of the whole of Europe so why would he be scared of America. He is invading regardless of which leaders are in power.
Let me guess, you think Hitler was far left too?
 
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Not to mention his naive surprise about how "right wingers shouldn't be celebrating Putin invading a democratic country" and "Every side, right, centre and left is all opposed to this act of bullying." They're some real pearls in that post.
Biden is president mate, you need to move on with your life. Trump is retired
 

Andycoleno9

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Putin and Russia are far-left extremists. I hardly can imagine right wingers celebrating Putin invading a democratic country. Even if they are, they don’t represent Trump so that’s false to say that. Every side, right, centre and left is all opposed to this act of bullying.

Don’t agree with your ‘prediction’ at all. Why didn’t Putin invade Ukraine while Trump was in power then? If you say Ukraine wouldn’t exist if Trump was president. He was president and nothing happened to Ukraine.

Putin sounds unhinged and is clearly acting like a mad man, he’s not scared of the whole of Europe so why would he be scared of America. He is invading regardless of which leaders are in power.
:lol:. Completely wrong. Russia and Putin are right orientated. Funny how people still think that Russia is left because USSR was.
 

P-Ro

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Wow. For all these years I had no idea Putin was a far-left extremist. The caf really is a treasure trove of surprising facts eh.
 

Revan

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Putin is a communist, right wingers are capitalists.

You should go to the Trump thread so you can continue to agenda there. This thread is for Ukraine vs Russia.
Not only that Putin is not a communist, but he hates communism.

Source: he just said that in his 2 hours speech. He spouted hatred for Lenin, than a good communist can never do.

And Russia is one of the most capitalist countries that exist. Their entire wealth is like in the hands of 5 people. You know the caricature that we make about US wealth inequality and the rich doing whatever they want. Well, that caricature is actually Russia.
 

Simbo

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https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/21/opinion/putin-ukraine-nato.html

Yes, there is a legitimate point to be had. It has become rather retrospective now, but it isn't a fantasy or an apology. Prominent people in prominent positions were wary of NATO expansion post-Soviet collapse. Many predicted this scenario. That doesn't justify a Russian invasion of Ukraine, however. Friedman, in the article above, is no pro-Russian hack, but even he understands the rather simple point made by Kennan and co. Again, it matters less today than it did a month ago, but that is the contextual depth to this event. Putin has used it as a casus belli but the cause should never have been presented to him as justification. All academic now, anyway.
Genuinely curious, did the US 'decide' to expand NATO in the 1990's as some sort of agenda? It is my understanding that it is written into the NATO charter than any european country that meets certain conditions can apply for membership, which can only be granted by unanimous approval of all current members.

Also, anyone can 'predict' that an alliance designed to specifically protect against Russian aggression... is going to upset a Russian imperialist should one gain power. Lets not hold Kennan up as some sort of savant. Its even easier to predict that any former Soviet states would become targets of Russian aggression should they not have sought defensive guarantees from elsewhere.
 
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Wow. For all these years I had no idea Putin was a far-left extremist. The caf really is a treasure trove of surprising facts eh.
Not only that Putin is not a communist, but he hates communism.

Source: he just said that in his 2 hours speech. He spouted hatred for Lenin, than a good communist can never do.

And Russia is one of the most capitalist countries that exist. Their entire wealth is like in the hands of 5 people. You know the caricature that we make about US wealth inequality and the rich doing whatever they want. Well, that caricature is actually Russia.
Please stop
Please go and do some research. Putin was in the community party and your all saying he isn’t a communist.

Your all talking absolute made up crap.
 

P-Ro

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If you think Putin actually being left-wing is surprising then your mind will be fully blown when you discover that he is also a pacifist.
 

Revan

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Please go and do some research. Putin was in the community party and your all saying he isn’t a communist.

Your all talking absolute made up crap.
Yes, he was in the communist party. Circa 30 years ago.

George Washington worked for British at some stage. I guess he was a royalist.

Gandhi too.
 

Andycoleno9

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Please go and do some research. Putin was in the community party and your all saying he isn’t a communist.

Your all talking absolute made up crap.
EVERYBODY who wanted to work for state were in communist party in communist countries.
And that is from someone who actually lives in ex communist country