Ruud Van Nistelrooy

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Henry was a better player. He wasn't a better finisher.

Aguero was a better player in a top Manchester city team. Ruud would score bucket loads in that team.

Suarez he had a couple of good seasons and thats it.

Shearer scored goals in poor teams, and is the record goal scorer, so maybe.

Michael Owen? Your having a laugh.
 

anant

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So, there's a player who won CL top scorer 3 times (was a record in CL era before Messi and Ronaldo came in), won golden boot in PL, Eredivisie, La Liga (was the only one to do that in 3 major leagues till Suarez replicated the feat), has the 2nd highest goals/games ratio among Utd players, 2nd highest goals/game ratio in CL, held the record for the longest scoring streak in PL, CL and La Liga(tied here), scored 44 goals in a single season while playing in England (a record that still stands).
On the other side we have a player who won golden boot twice.
And we're saying that the latter is the better striker. No one's denying RVPs game was more more pleasing to the eye, and he was better technically, but RVNs goal records more than compensates for all of this.
 

Mainoldo

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Henry was a better player. He wasn't a better finisher.

Aguero was a better player in a top Manchester city team. Ruud would score bucket loads in that team.

Suarez he had a couple of good seasons and thats it.

Shearer scored goals in poor teams, and is the record goal scorer, so maybe.

Michael Owen? Your having a laugh.
Aguero is arguable the best finisher this league has seen so I don’t know what Other narratives your choosing the pick here. Im talking about just finishing and Micheal Owen was a better finisher than Shearer. The injuries ruined own.

Suarez a couple good seasons? Check his actually goalscoring record mate. It’s shockingly good.
 

Mainoldo

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So, there's a player who won CL top scorer 3 times (was a record in CL era before Messi and Ronaldo came in), won golden boot in PL, Eredivisie, La Liga (was the only one to do that in 3 major leagues till Suarez replicated the feat), has the 2nd highest goals/games ratio among Utd players, 2nd highest goals/game ratio in CL, held the record for the longest scoring streak in PL, CL and La Liga(tied here), scored 44 goals in a single season while playing in England (a record that still stands).
On the other side we have a player who won golden boot twice.
And we're saying that the latter is the better striker. No one's denying RVPs game was more more pleasing to the eye, and he was better technically, but RVNs goal records more than compensates for all of this.
So the best finisher is the best striker?
 

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So, there's a player who won CL top scorer 3 times (was a record in CL era before Messi and Ronaldo came in), won golden boot in PL, Eredivisie, La Liga (was the only one to do that in 3 major leagues till Suarez replicated the feat), has the 2nd highest goals/games ratio among Utd players, 2nd highest goals/game ratio in CL, held the record for the longest scoring streak in PL, CL and La Liga(tied here), scored 44 goals in a single season while playing in England (a record that still stands).
On the other side we have a player who won golden boot twice.
And we're saying that the latter is the better striker. No one's denying RVPs game was more more pleasing to the eye, and he was better technically, but RVNs goal records more than compensates for all of this.
Spot on
 

Mainoldo

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Torres, Fowler, Bergkamp, Drogba, Rooney, Tevez also have shouts in that list too.

Purely on finishing RVN perhaps above some of them, but the complete package it has to be Henry
Henry definitely the complete package. I would say he’s above those names though but Torres is a tough one. Shame about his injuries.
 

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Aguero is arguable the best finisher this league has seen so I don’t know what Other narratives your choosing the pick here. Im talking about just finishing and Micheal Owen was a better finisher than Shearer. The injuries ruined own.

Suarez a couple good seasons? Check his actually goalscoring record mate. It’s shockingly good.
My narrative is Ruud would score even more in that city team than Aguero. I'm not denying Suarez is a better player, he isn't a better finisher. How many times did Owen score more than 25 goals a season?
 

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So, there's a player who won CL top scorer 3 times (was a record in CL era before Messi and Ronaldo came in), won golden boot in PL, Eredivisie, La Liga (was the only one to do that in 3 major leagues till Suarez replicated the feat), has the 2nd highest goals/games ratio among Utd players, 2nd highest goals/game ratio in CL, held the record for the longest scoring streak in PL, CL and La Liga(tied here), scored 44 goals in a single season while playing in England (a record that still stands).
On the other side we have a player who won golden boot twice.
And we're saying that the latter is the better striker. No one's denying RVPs game was more more pleasing to the eye, and he was better technically, but RVNs goal records more than compensates for all of this.
Exactly this. Its not even close.
 

Mainoldo

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My narrative is Ruud would score even more in that city team than Aguero. I'm not denying Suarez is a better player, he isn't a better finisher. How many times did Owen score more than 25 goals a season?
Not many times.. but if Owen played for United from 97 to 2002 would he not of scored more goals than Cole and Yorke? Just going off you Aguero argument?

It depends how you judge finishing. I mean in the 6 yard box I’d have Ruud over anyone each day. But there is more to being a good finisher, I mean variety is very important hence why some would say Raul was the best.. it’s a hard one really. But I’ve made a thread about it. Let’s see what people think.
 

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Not many times.. but if Owen played for United from 97 to 2002 would he not of scored more goals than Cole and Yorke? Just going off you Aguero argument?

It depends how you judge finishing. I mean in the 6 yard box I’d have Ruud over anyone each day. But there is more to being a good finisher, I mean variety is very important hence why some would say Raul was the best.. it’s a hard one really. But I’ve made a thread about it. Let’s see what people think.
What I'm basing finishing off is in the penalty area, and I've not seen better than Ruud.

Owen should of gone down as one of the greats. He should of smashed the England goal scoring record.
 

Beachryan

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I genuinely can't tell how many people who post on here watched Ruud week in, week out when he was at his peak with us. If they did, something's wrong with memories.

He was our best outfield player by a country mile for much of his time here. Someone disparaged his movement last page. RVN's movement?! He has some of the greatest movement and understanding of any player in the history of the game. He was also excellent in the air, and his hold up play was the best we've had in about two decades now, maybe you could say Ibra's was better but he was also static.

RVP's 1 good season with us was phenomenal, delivered us the 20th and should be heralded as such. But as centre-forward I genuinely don't think there are many attributes that RVP has over RVN. He's more graceful, and better at free kicks. Ruud was stronger, faster to react to situations, better in the air, more two-footed, better at penalties, and was insatiable for almost a decade at the highest level.

Obviously he was not as good as Van Basten though.
 

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I genuinely can't tell how many people who post on here watched Ruud week in, week out when he was at his peak with us. If they did, something's wrong with memories.

He was our best outfield player by a country mile for much of his time here. Someone disparaged his movement last page. RVN's movement?! He has some of the greatest movement and understanding of any player in the history of the game. He was also excellent in the air, and his hold up play was the best we've had in about two decades now, maybe you could say Ibra's was better but he was also static.

RVP's 1 good season with us was phenomenal, delivered us the 20th and should be heralded as such. But as centre-forward I genuinely don't think there are many attributes that RVP has over RVN. He's more graceful, and better at free kicks. Ruud was stronger, faster to react to situations, better in the air, more two-footed, better at penalties, and was insatiable for almost a decade at the highest level.

Obviously he was not as good as Van Basten though.
I get the same impression. The guy was absolute magic. My only guess is that he's a fleeting memory among increasingly younger generations of fans who grew up with the likes of RvP, Robben, et al.
 

NM

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I get the same impression. The guy was absolute magic. My only guess is that he's a fleeting memory among increasingly younger generations of fans who grew up with the likes of RvP, Robben, et al.
Exactly. He was the best true center forward around. If he came a couple of years earlier or later his trophy cabinet would match his skill. He was our best player for most of the time he was here.
 

TheNewEra

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What I'm basing finishing off is in the penalty area, and I've not seen better than Ruud.

Owen should of gone down as one of the greats. He should of smashed the England goal scoring record.
Ruud definitely had a much longer run than Owen too considering Owens injury plagued career.

In terms of a finisher in the box I honestly struggle to think of a better finisher too, he had the one chance that he finished outside of the box I believe that started with an elbow (not really much in it) all the others I believe were within the box during his United career.

I do think he suffered slightly when Beckham left, because he went from making runs and being picked out to a young Cristiano who obviously didn't possess Beckhams crossing.

Thinking about those teams, you realise how special SAF was at rebuilding squads
 
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Aguero is arguable the best finisher this league has seen so I don’t know what Other narratives your choosing the pick here. Im talking about just finishing and Micheal Owen was a better finisher than Shearer. The injuries ruined own.

Suarez a couple good seasons? Check his actually goalscoring record mate. It’s shockingly good.
In what world was Owen a better finisher than Shearer.

did you ever see Shearer at Blackburn? Phenomenal player. Owen’s injuries curtailed him career, and so did Shearer’s - but he adapted and changed his game.

RVN is up there with the best. Shearer and Aguero were better players and better finishers, Henry was just brilliant, but RVN is pretty much next in line and was one of the very top players in PL history.
 

Utdstar01

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With RVN you always felt you had a chance in any game. Never been so confident in somebody scoring when an opportunity came their way. You knew he would score.

It's a massive shame that we were in a transitional period for the majority of his United career and he dragged us to that title in 02/03. He's the best finisher in the 18 yard box I've seen.
 

Beachryan

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RVN is up there with the best. Shearer and Aguero were better players and better finishers, Henry was just brilliant, but RVN is pretty much next in line and was one of the very top players in PL history.
Yeah I think this is fair. I'd love to imagine RVN in a better team, the number of chances he'd get at City - he would have scored an absolute glut.

Also wonder if Aguero could have been as effective playing in the early 00s. Not a lot of 'tiny' centre forwards back then, I think he would have been bullied. Owen was alright because he was lightening fast.
 

TheNewEra

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Yeah I think this is fair. I'd love to imagine RVN in a better team, the number of chances he'd get at City - he would have scored an absolute glut.

Also wonder if Aguero could have been as effective playing in the early 00s. Not a lot of 'tiny' centre forwards back then, I think he would have been bullied. Owen was alright because he was lightening fast.
In fairness Aguero was a different beast at Atletico, I think he was better at Atletico than he has been at City, even as great as he is now
 

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In what world was Owen a better finisher than Shearer.

did you ever see Shearer at Blackburn? Phenomenal player. Owen’s injuries curtailed him career, and so did Shearer’s - but he adapted and changed his game.

RVN is up there with the best. Shearer and Aguero were better players and better finishers, Henry was just brilliant, but RVN is pretty much next in line and was one of the very top players in PL history.
Yeah quality player at Blackburn and a hell of a shot. But Michael Owen was bloody lethal and could score any type of goal. He didn’t just rely on power like our Alan.

Everything else you’ve said I agree with.
 

El Jefe

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Not many times.. but if Owen played for United from 97 to 2002 would he not of scored more goals than Cole and Yorke? Just going off you Aguero argument?

It depends how you judge finishing. I mean in the 6 yard box I’d have Ruud over anyone each day. But there is more to being a good finisher, I mean variety is very important hence why some would say Raul was the best.. it’s a hard one really. But I’ve made a thread about it. Let’s see what people think.
And so far Ruud has been in most lists. Certainly in more lists that Owen.

Truth is you've had a mare in this thread. You were also dishonest about the caf picking RVP over Ruud when the a clear majority of the posts in the thread below have it as Ruud>RVP.

https://www.redcafe.net/threads/rob...st-striker-we-have-ever-had-in-the-pl.454540/

You prefer RVP which is fine but don't try and pass off your opinion as the consensus when it clearly isn't.
 

Mainoldo

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Yeah I think this is fair. I'd love to imagine RVN in a better team, the number of chances he'd get at City - he would have scored an absolute glut.

Also wonder if Aguero could have been as effective playing in the early 00s. Not a lot of 'tiny' centre forwards back then, I think he would have been bullied. Owen was alright because he was lightening fast.
Listen Aguero’s City team has only been great for 2 years under Pep before that they was just a very good team. Don’t overdo it.. He’s not a guy just been gifted with bucket loads of chances playing for some Pep like Barca team throughout his entire time in England.
 

Mainoldo

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And so far Ruud has been in most lists. Certainly in more lists that Owen.
I didn’t expect him not to be. I said Aguero was the best and he’s doing pretty well in most peoples unbiased list. The fact of the matter is Owen is probably the most underrated striker ever in the prem when you consider the player he was. He was the English Mbappe.

Truth is you've had a mare in this thread. You were also dishonest about the caf picking RVP over Ruud when the a clear majority of the posts in the thread below have it as Ruud>RVP.

https://www.redcafe.net/threads/rob...st-striker-we-have-ever-had-in-the-pl.454540/

You prefer RVP which is fine but don't try and pass off your opinion as the consensus when it clearly isn't.
Yeah I’m not sure how I’m having a mare to be honest.. the tread reads well and I said who was better at their peak. RVN should easily go down as our best striker but mainly due to nostalgia we’ll especially for me. That rivalry with Arsenal was my best football years and RVN contribution was massive.
 

anant

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So the best finisher is the best striker?
If a player is scoring these many goals, it's never just finishing ability. His positioning, anticipation, physical game were all world class as well. Add to that we're talking of an era when defenders and goalkeepers were no nonsense players and we saw lesser goals in that era than the current one.
 

arnie_ni

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Just call me the big man!!

On his finishing can’t say I agree. RVP had more variety in his finishes and was better with both feet.

How would you rate RVN compared to other premier strikers for finishing then? Top5?
First for finishing
 

Mainoldo

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If a player is scoring these many goals, it's never just finishing ability. His positioning, anticipation, physical game were all world class as well. Add to that we're talking of an era when defenders and goalkeepers were no nonsense players and we saw lesser goals in that era than the current one.
That all sounds good but it’s not particularly true is it? Messi and Ronaldo are the only ones changing the game by numbers. Strikers are still doing what they do in fact you can argue they don’t make Ruud’s anymore. I can only think of Kane.
 

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Torres, Fowler, Bergkamp, Drogba, Rooney, Tevez also have shouts in that list too.

Purely on finishing RVN perhaps above some of them, but the complete package it has to be Henry
That wasnt the question asked though
 

arnie_ni

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Could you imagine how many goals he'd be scoring in this team with pogba and bruno, or that man city team?

He would be setting records all over the place
 

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So RVN is a better finisher to you than Trezeguet, R9, Raul, Crespo just time make a few?
I'm on the RVN was arguably the best PL striker ever, outside of Henry. But no he wasn't a better finisher than the players you mentioned, now they are all great finishers, these are some of the very best in the history of the game.
 

anant

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That all sounds good but it’s not particularly true is it? Messi and Ronaldo are the only ones changing the game by numbers. Strikers are still doing what they do in fact you can argue they don’t make Ruud’s anymore. I can only think of Kane.
Which bit isn't true? Goals scored- On an average, we saw 986.4 goals scored every season from 2001/02 to 2005/06. The number increased to 1043.8 in time period 2010/11-2014/15. The number has remained constant at this mark in the latest 5 seasons as well (1040.8 (extrapolating goals/game ration this season)
 

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@anant and @Mainoldo, I feel that you are both correct we see more goals today but strikers don't score more, it's the comeback of wide forwards and inside forwards that has added goals, literal strikers have remained in the same range between 15 and 30 league goals per season which was already the case in the 90s. You can find some freak seasons here and there with for example Higuain or Suarez scoring +35 goals but it's not the norm.

Now Van Nistelrooy records is impressive due to his consistency he has basically been one of the very best strikers in the world for 10 years, I include the seasons where he was injured because he has always comeback as strong. That's exceptional and I feel that too often people don't value longevity and consistency at a high level, in my opinion it's even more important than a player's peak. Currently I would say that Lewandowski is the current Van Nistelrooy, you can count on him to do what he is supposed to do, to be at his best or near it, it's something that I have always liked about Van Nistelrooy.
 

KeanoMagicHat

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Aguero
Shearer
Owen
Henry
Suarez
None of them are better finishers than Van Nistelrooy. Aguero is a very good finisher but actually misses quite a number of good chances over a season. Henry and Suarez created more chances for themselves due to being able to beat a man to create a chance in a way that Van Nistelrooy couldn't/rarely did. Suarez at Liverpool was actually quite wasteful sometimes outside of his final season. Owen again created a lot with his pace but not as good a finisher. Closest would be Shearer but I'd still rather Van Nistelrooy. If it's a one-on-one or a ball 12 yards out, I'm taking Van Nistelrooy every time.

This isn't a better overall player thing either, they all have shouts over Van Nistelrooy for that. But put the ball in a certain area for Ruud and he was a genuine phenomenon.

As for Van Persie leading United to the title in 12/13, could say the same about Van Nistelrooy in 02/03. He scored 17 goals in his last 16 league games as United were quite a bit behind and stormed to the title. You're comparing peak Arsenal as a rival, who went invincible the following season, to out of sorts City. Was harder to win the league in 02/03 and RVN was one of the main reasons why. And unlike Van Persie, he did over several seasons for United.
 
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Could you imagine how many goals he'd be scoring in this team with pogba and bruno, or that man city team?

He would be setting records all over the place
Well he played with Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Veron, Rooney, & Ronaldo to name just a few. He didn’t do it on his own.
 

arnie_ni

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Well he played with Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Veron, Rooney, & Ronaldo to name just a few. He didn’t do it on his own.
defenses are worse now though. His movement and ability to find space would leave the current defenders clueless.

Hed be the best striker in the league.
 

lsd

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Kleberson, Djemba-Djemba, Richardson, Fortune, and Bellion as well.


Bar Fortune they barely played a dozen games for Utd and then they mostly played in the league cup and games without Ruud.

It's like excusing Martial's weaknesses by saying he always plays with Chong