SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)

T00lsh3d

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I hadn't noticed that before, the spacing is bizarre, 500, similar to the 1000 above, then the top 5000 basically the same again.

It makes the graph next to useless, as it elongates and stretches the lines at varying points.

I assume this is done to fit it into a space usable on the Internet, but it looks like it's agenda driven to make some countries look worse etc...

Edit: I'm sure it does have its uses, but for general comparison of progression it makes it pretty difficult
I subscribe to the ft and have a high opinion of it generally, but that graph is shite, particularly from a financially-orientated institution
 

Shane88

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The American health care system is truly immoral.
It's easy to put this on a faceless system. But I really want to see what the decision-making is like first-hand in these situations.

Does an accountant come down from their office and say "tough shit, kid"? Does a doctor tell them "No money, unlucky."? I suppose they're in isolation and they won't go into the room and just gave the kid the *empty pockets* gesture from a window as he was clawing for breath.

What a disgusting country.
 

Lj82

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Surely the China numbers look less and less likely? But I fully acknolwedge that I have no facts to back it up but more of logical conclusion, stepping into conspiracy theories.
Without going into conspiracy theories, in the initial couple of months when wuhan spiralled out of control and before they ramped up production of test kits, patients had to wait more than a month to get tested. This include even medical professionals like the famous doctor Li who died. Many people died before they got tested, and they dont make it to the statistics. There were also many people who gave up seeking treatment in hospitals because they were overwhelmed. They too won't make the statistics.
 

11101

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United Kingdom
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France had a 499 jump today.
It would be interesting to see that table rebased to 50 or 100 deaths. Some countries were just trickling early on, only after about 50 can you really say it gets out of control.
 

Lj82

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It's easy to put this on a faceless system. But I really want to see what the decision-making is like first-hand in these situations.

Does an accountant come down from their office and say "tough shit, kid"? Does a doctor tell them "No money, unlucky."? I suppose they're in isolation and they won't go into the room and just gave the kid the *empty pockets* gesture from a window as he was clawing for breath.

What a disgusting country.
Not Corona virus related but I had a taste of that when I wanted to bring my son in for a checkup. I called and even though we do have insurance, we are "out of network", hence they won't admit him.

I was like wtf?
 

UnrelatedPsuedo

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Not really any need to be so passive aggressive, it is being shared liberally across all education levels, on social media. It isn't being shared across people 'that understand it' and is misleading when glanced at, which is what 90% of people looking at it will do.

This has already been talked about above, and I've conceded that it is useful in the right place, or when explained.

Unless it's escaped your notice, we're on a football forum, where the majority of people aren't going to go away and start 'educating themselves' about every single graph or table that comes their way. If we were on a medics forum or a statistics forum then maybe.

You know nothing about me, or my background, but we're both reading this info on redcafe. Generally information is provided at the readers level, so that it is understood. Anyone sharing info above the average readers level, without explanation is either purposefully misleading the audience, or just a very poor communicator.

Obviously there are many levels of intellect or understanding on here, and on twitter, but when someone misinterprets what has been shared, why not just explain? Or indeed note that it already has been explained by posters before you, instead of flogging a dead horse, for no other reason than to stroke your own ego, and show everyone how much smarter you are than the rest of us.

The graph obviously is a very useful tool for those that know how to use it properly, the fact is though that 99% of people won't know how to use it properly, and it being shared so freely is confusing at best for the majority that see it.

I guess I'm fortunate, I've studied statistics, economics and econometrics etc so I can read up on it properly and learn how to interpret it properly. But a lot of people won't have that understanding, and certainly won't want to spend the time trying.

Edit: I've replied to your other comment. I've been a bit less defensive in that one :lol:
I have zero ego. I wasn’t being a dick or passive aggressive. Just sensible.

Don’t suggest that pandering to the lowest common denominator is sensible in a time like this. It’s not. People can understand this shit.
 

Penna

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It's easy to put this on a faceless system. But I really want to see what the decision-making is like first-hand in these situations.

Does an accountant come down from their office and say "tough shit, kid"? Does a doctor tell them "No money, unlucky."? I suppose they're in isolation and they won't go into the room and just gave the kid the *empty pockets* gesture from a window as he was clawing for breath.

What a disgusting country.
From my limited experience, they don't get past the front desk if they don't have the right insurance. I did a study trip to various USA hospitals when I was working, and all of them looked like posh hotels with lovely private rooms - however, a lot of people never get into those places. I remember coming back and seeing our rather ordinary NHS hospital, and thinking how the patients would prefer to have this for no cost every time they needed care.
 

T00lsh3d

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The Catholic church has 1.2 billion members and our churches are closed. We're managing fine. I think this pastor is probably a) bonkers or b) worried that his source of income will dry up.
My mum is Catholic so I know they’re not all bonkers.....though she definitely is :lol: :lol:
Income is a worry everywhere, but if he’s surviving on donations then he can ask for online donations maybe? I suspect, given the ‘virus-zapping machines, that he’s just bonkers
 

Dve

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Positive news from Scandinavia:

Norway:

- For the second time in the last 4 days, the number of people hospitalised is going down from one day to another. The number of people on ventilators are stable.
https://www.nrk.no/norge/nedgang-i-antall-koronainnlagte_-for-andre-gang-pa-fire-dager-1.14966837

- The football clubs are allowed to start up training again from tomorrow (in small groups).
https://www.vg.no/sport/fotball/i/8m86gG/niso-advarer-eliteserieklubbene-etter-nye-treningsraad

Denmark:

- The earlier prognosis for people hospitalised in Denmark turn out not to be matching the actual numbers. The grey curve in the first figure shows the prognosis, the red curve shows the actual numbers.

https://files.ssi.dk/Prognose for epidemiens fremtidige udvikling 30032020
 

TheReligion

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I'm sorry to hear that. Have you been briefed to act any differently today?

Honestly it's a terrible way to treat you. The NHS is being rightly and unanimously praised, meanwhile the police are continuing to risk contracting Covid whilst having to deal with the normal hazards and dangers of policing at the same time, yet people are shitting on them for doing their best in a very difficult situation.

For what it's worth, I'm grateful. Cheers.
I've been off the past two days but back tomorrow so we shall see. In fairness the brief from the word go as been to exhaust every option before looking to enforce so not sure how else this can be looked at other than just not bothering to actively do anything (it seems some would rather this).

Thanks for the support. In fairness we've had plenty of well wishers I guess it is just frustrating when you get home and put the tv on only to see the media, and others, are seemingly trying to whip up some kind of anti police sentiment which we can all really do without.
 

Pexbo

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I realise this is the most first world of problems right now but are anyone else’s hands absolutely ruined at the moment?
 

Dve

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Hasnt there been a few very young victims in the UK now? Odd considering there has only been 1 under 20 fatality in China and Italy combined so far.
Very few cases world wide. It happens young people die from the seasonal flu as well.
 

Port Vale Devil

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I realise this is the most first world of problems right now but are anyone else’s hands absolutely ruined at the moment?
They were but I am only going out once a day to pick a few things up for ourselves and an elderly neighbour so only use the sanitiser a couple of times a day now whereas at home it is soap and water. I was using some hand cream that a mate gets on prescription that he swapped me for some home made sanitiser :)
 

LordNinio

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I have zero ego. I wasn’t being a dick or passive aggressive. Just sensible.

Don’t suggest that pandering to the lowest common denominator is sensible in a time like this. It’s not. People can understand this shit.
I apologised (sort of) for being so defensive in that reply, but this conversation has been done to death above, so I'm not getting drawn in again.
 

Maagge

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Our (Slovenia's) government has been indicating that they'll be going in the opposite direction. The logic behind it being that the kids are effective spreaders. So imagine the schools won't be the first thing to open. I assume the public transport (it's been suspended here for a couple of weeks now) and non-essential businesses will be the first thing to restart. Any sort of events/mass gatherings will be banned for quite a while.
The thing is though that you cannot really get people back to work when there kids can't get out of the house.
Although I guess that would ensure a slow introduction of people to work again.
 

MTF

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It's easy to put this on a faceless system. But I really want to see what the decision-making is like first-hand in these situations.

Does an accountant come down from their office and say "tough shit, kid"? Does a doctor tell them "No money, unlucky."? I suppose they're in isolation and they won't go into the room and just gave the kid the *empty pockets* gesture from a window as he was clawing for breath.

What a disgusting country.
It was apparently an urgent-care clinic that wouldn't see him without insurance, but did indicate the hospital he should go to. He went to said hospital and got treatment but unfortunately passed away 6 hours after being admitted. The urgent-care clinic not seeing him was probably just due to procedure. Despite the name, when you go to one of them its not an emergency room situation. They ask for your info and insurance before you get an examination. When I went to one a couple of years ago with stomach issues and a high fever, they saw me but recommended that I go to a hospital ER, and offered to call an ambulance for me. What seems to have lacked in this situation was stabilizing the kid and calling an ambulance. They incur no cost for calling the ambulance, but I guess might be potentially liable for giving any form of treatment to someone they don't have the info on.

A face to it? In this case would imagine a front desk person that's overworked for the past few weeks, stressed about their own risk of contracting coronavirus, and not willing to go outside of their limited job description at that time. I think that one of the worst issues in the US is the whole malpractice lawsuits issue that has put so many professionals/services in a situation where they're afraid of later getting sued, more than willing to help out people that they're able to help.

https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-uninsured-teen-dies-refused-care-mayor-says-2020-3
 

Fully Fledged

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Has that been confirmed? That would be interesting information to find out.
I was going on the post that said that 1500 people die on average in the UK in a day. 393 is actually 26% of 1500 so that makes up more than 25% of the average daily total. If the 1500 is wrong then my maths would be wrong.
 

Pexbo

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Would you say you're concerned about the dermatitis?
Just being a wimp, they’re dry as nun‘s sense of humour.

They were but I am only going out once a day to pick a few things up for ourselves and an elderly neighbour so only use the sanitiser a couple of times a day now whereas at home it is soap and water. I was using some hand cream that a mate gets on prescription that he swapped me for some home made sanitiser :)
We’ve not been able to get hold of any hand soaps, liquid or bars for ages so it’s been a combination of fairy liquid and hand sanitiser which has absolutely destroyed my hands. I’m using E45 now but it’s not doing much.
 
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I was going on the post that said that 1500 people die on average in the UK in a day. 393 is actually 26% of 1500 so that makes up more than 25% of the average daily total. If the 1500 is wrong then my maths would be wrong.
600,000 a year on average in the UK, so yeah, approx. 1500 /day. Obviously theY don’t all die on the same day though, and there’s just less deaths in the Summer, always.
 

Ludens the Red

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I've been off the past two days but back tomorrow so we shall see. In fairness the brief from the word go as been to exhaust every option before looking to enforce so not sure how else this can be looked at other than just not bothering to actively do anything (it seems some would rather this).

Thanks for the support. In fairness we've had plenty of well wishers I guess it is just frustrating when you get home and put the tv on only to see the media, and others, are seemingly trying to whip up some kind of anti police sentiment which we can all really do without.
As with police, it only takes one idiot officer for the entire force to come into question or be slated. This is something I’ve kind of just accepted.
That officer who was trying to dish out a fine for someone marking the pavements and then being a massive cock about it... is the one I’m referring to. But yeah people will always react to these sorts of things in the same way. It’s a chance for them to get their pitch forks out. They’re in the small minority though and that should always be remembered, they just happen to shout the loudest. They’ll move onto something else in a few days.
 

Port Vale Devil

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We’ve not been able to get hold of any hand soaps, liquid or bars for ages so it’s been a combination of fairy liquid and hand sanitiser which has absolutely destroyed my hands. I’m using E45 now but it’s not doing much.

Not sure where you are based but there seems plenty on Amazon at not too much of an extortionate price but it is also pretty easy to make and there are plenty of YouTube videos on easy recipes.

Soap is loads better at home than using sanitiser but fairy liquid would be better on its own in the house as long as washed thoroughly.
 

JPRouve

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I was going on the post that said that 1500 people die on average in the UK in a day. 393 is actually 26% of 1500 so that makes up more than 25% of the average daily total. If the 1500 is wrong then my maths would be wrong.
If you want an actual reference, in France in March 2019 53629 people died, in 2018 60407 people died. I think that it would be fair to assume that during March 2020 around 10% of total deaths will be attributed to Covid-19, the mortality from March 1st to 16th as increased by 6% with some areas allegedly seeing a 50% increase.

So while the total increase isn't out of the ordinary when you consider the difference between 2019 and 2018, the fact that one virus is the cause of the increase is still quite impressive.
 

Yik

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This may be an incredibly stupid question. But if every single person was to don this, would it not help things get back to normal? Well I mean besides the whole mass Borderlands cosplay we'd have on our hands.

These apparently go for a £100 each, one for every adult in the UK (approx 50 mill), we'd be sorted for about £5 billion. Pocket change compared with all the bailouts going around!
 

horsechoker

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This may be an incredibly stupid question. But if every single person was to don this, would it not help things get back to normal? Well I mean besides the whole mass Borderlands cosplay we'd have on our hands.

These apparently go for a £100 each, one for every adult in the UK (approx 50 mill), we'd be sorted for about £5 billion. Pocket change compared with all the bailouts going around!
Don't the filters need to replaced often? That would add up and then try producing 70m of these when most of the world is in lockdown.
 

Ian Reus

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This may be an incredibly stupid question. But if every single person was to don this, would it not help things get back to normal? Well I mean besides the whole mass Borderlands cosplay we'd have on our hands.

These apparently go for a £100 each, one for every adult in the UK (approx 50 mill), we'd be sorted for about £5 billion. Pocket change compared with all the bailouts going around!
It would cost as much to distribute them.
 

Pexbo

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This may be an incredibly stupid question. But if every single person was to don this, would it not help things get back to normal? Well I mean besides the whole mass Borderlands cosplay we'd have on our hands.

These apparently go for a £100 each, one for every adult in the UK (approx 50 mill), we'd be sorted for about £5 billion. Pocket change compared with all the bailouts going around!
I bet you’d be hard pressed to source 50k let alone the 70m you’d need for the UK
 

Ludens the Red

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Clear message to those who think they will survive this because they're young, fit and health.
Have to say I don’t really get these kind of posts. It comes across as some sort of weird ‘I told you so/bragging’ sort of thing. It’s as if some people on here can’t wait to read or post about a young person dying due to corona. We all get it, this thing is serious, it effects everyone one way or another. But it is a hardcore stone cold fact that it has very little/no effect on the majority of young, fit and healthy people bar the odd exceptions. Waiting for the one in a million young person it effects and then engaging in this weird ‘I told you so’ warning is just really fecking weird.
A young kid dies and people on the internet just want to use it in some strange point scoring exercise.
 
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Penna

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Just being a wimp, they’re dry as nun‘s sense of humour.



We’ve not been able to get hold of any hand soaps, liquid or bars for ages so it’s been a combination of fairy liquid and hand sanitiser which has absolutely destroyed my hands. I’m using E45 now but it’s not doing much.
Amazon has hand cream of varying kinds, I just sent some to my sis.
 

0le

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This may be an incredibly stupid question. But if every single person was to don this, would it not help things get back to normal? Well I mean besides the whole mass Borderlands cosplay we'd have on our hands.

These apparently go for a £100 each, one for every adult in the UK (approx 50 mill), we'd be sorted for about £5 billion. Pocket change compared with all the bailouts going around!
They aren't very comfortable to wear for prolonged periods of use, particularly if you wear glasses. The cartridges also need replacement and collectively would cost more than the masks themselves over the period of time that you need them for. Lastly, they need a good seal and this isn't always easy to achieve so many people wouldn't wear it properly anyway.
 

Penna

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My mum is Catholic so I know they’re not all bonkers.....though she definitely is :lol: :lol:
Income is a worry everywhere, but if he’s surviving on donations then he can ask for online donations maybe? I suspect, given the ‘virus-zapping machines, that he’s just bonkers
He won't be just surviving on donations, he'll be making lots of money from them!
 

Kentonio

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My mum is Catholic so I know they’re not all bonkers.....though she definitely is :lol: :lol:
Income is a worry everywhere, but if he’s surviving on donations then he can ask for online donations maybe? I suspect, given the ‘virus-zapping machines, that he’s just bonkers
More likely he sees this as a unique opportunity to fleece his followers and attract new ones.
 

Josep Dowling

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Just being a wimp, they’re dry as nun‘s sense of humour.



We’ve not been able to get hold of any hand soaps, liquid or bars for ages so it’s been a combination of fairy liquid and hand sanitiser which has absolutely destroyed my hands. I’m using E45 now but it’s not doing much.
It will be the fairy liquid. I’ve never had skin problems on my hands up until the last week or so. Clearly I was previously a dirty bugger and not washing my hands properly :wenger:.
 

Yik

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Don't the filters need to replaced often? That would add up and then try producing 70m of these when most of the world is in lockdown.
:(

I bet you’d be hard pressed to source 50k let alone the 70m you’d need for the UK
50k eh, sounds just about enough to restart the Premier League! Prob one for left field thread in the football forum.

They aren't very comfortable to wear for prolonged periods of use, particularly if you wear glasses. The cartridges also need replacement and collectively would cost more than the masks themselves over the period of time that you need them for. Lastly, they need a good seal and this isn't always easy to achieve so many people wouldn't wear it properly anyway.
Yes tis a daft idea. I was just reminded today of how during world war 2 gas masks were distributed to the general public in anticipation of mass chemical warfare. Perhaps something of that sort (N95 masks, basic PPE) should be on hand to distribute to the general public in anticipation of something like this. I mean I know the UK government haven't sourced enough PPE for the NHS never mind us, but still going forward, this has to be something to be considered. I'd feel much safer if people wore masks every where like in East Asia.
 

JPRouve

can't stop thinking about balls - NOT deflategate
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This may be an incredibly stupid question. But if every single person was to don this, would it not help things get back to normal? Well I mean besides the whole mass Borderlands cosplay we'd have on our hands.

These apparently go for a £100 each, one for every adult in the UK (approx 50 mill), we'd be sorted for about £5 billion. Pocket change compared with all the bailouts going around!
The point would be limited, you mainly get infected through contact. People will have to take their masks off, to eat or drink or scratch their faces and will get pathogens in their mouth, eyes or nose by contact. You basically rely on the same factor, that people wash their hands regularly and don't touch their faces.
 

horsechoker

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The point would be limited, you mainly get infected through contact. People will have to take their masks off, to eat or drink or scratch their faces and will get pathogens in their mouth, eyes or nose by contact. You basically rely on the same factor, that people wash their hands regularly and don't touch their faces.
What if we are fed through a tube?