Saudi sports minister gives update on buying club from Glazers

[UnrelatedPsuedo]

It has everything to do with it. It's part of the big plan. It buys them a lot of goodwill and enhances their image.

It simply doesn’t. It’s nonsense.

They’re not running out of oil and they don’t look at Manchester United as something that will make any meaningful money. Because on their scale, we don’t, nor will we ever.

 

[UnrelatedPsuedo]

We have had enough moral views from both for and against the Saudi takeover. As always, its 50-50 things.

Can we actually discuss about football side of things, changes to the club and financial power?

We could really be the super power of football by far if the Saudi took over and invest heavily with proper football structure in place in the club.

At the very least, we are in dire need to revamp our football structure in the club starting from appointment of proper CEO/DOF and then everything else.

There are simply no Moral views FOR a Saudi takeover.

 

[DartMaverick]

20% of the club is out of control by the Glazers, but this is type A shares, the parasites control type B shares with 10x voting rights, but the same dividends.
The most annoying part of this discussion it is always the same long argument between moralists and those to whom the glory is most important, no matter what. Maybe just create the one thread related to Saudis, discuss only news and rumors, but not moral and ethics questions.

 

[Yakuza_devils]

There are simply no Moral views FOR a Saudi takeover.

Well noted on your opinion. The same way I respect many western countries stand on supplying arms and weapons to the Saudis. Doing investment and business hand in hand with the Saudis government to the tune of hundred of billions. Especially USA and UK.

BTW, what do u think about footballing side of thing if the Saudi took over the club?

 

[Dion]

Well noted on your opinion. The same way I respect many western countries stand on supplying arms and weapons to the Saudis. Doing investment and business hand in hand with the Saudis government to the tune of hundred of billions. Especially USA and UK.

BTW, what do u think about footballing side of thing if the Saudi took over the club?

I'd be equally appalled if the UK or US governments tried to buy the club.

I think it would be utterly irrelevant.

 

[UnrelatedPsuedo]

No of course the atrocities are to be condemned, what I’m saying is that simply shouting and wagging your finger at them isn’t going to change anything.

Integration into western culture will only help the situation over there.

Look at the boxing last night, the more we integrate the more willing they will be to conform to modern standards and human rights.

Recently the Saudi’s have allowed women to attend cinema, they’ve had music venues which women can attend and I believe they are allowed to drive.
The above sounds crazy normal to us but they are big big changes and it’s directly influenced by western culture.

To integrate and influence rather than shout and condemn with every word is the way forward.

You keep saying ‘Integrate’.

What the Fcuk are you talking about. All countries have their own way of living life. The ‘Western Way’ isn’t some gold standard that all cultures are trying to attain.

Read a book or two. Saudi Arabia as a country is not trying to become Westernised. Not in any way, shape or form.

They’re not seeing Western Culture as the mirror that shows how ugly their own reflection is. You’re beyond stupid if you think that’s what’s happening.

 

[GenZRed]

So many people on their high horse these days. Your clothes are likely made by workers in sweatshops that might as well be slaves. Your smartphones and ipads are made in Chinese factories that have suicide nets to stop their own workers killing themselves.

The world is burning right now. Yet it appears that the Saudi government buying a football club in England is so important. Get real.

 

[UnrelatedPsuedo]

Well noted on your opinion. The same way I respect many western countries stand on supplying arms and weapons to the Saudis. Doing investment and business hand in hand with the Saudis government to the tune of hundred of billions. Especially USA and UK.

BTW, what do u think about footballing side of thing if the Saudi took over the club?

Manchester United would cease to exist on the footballing side if we were purchased by Saudi Arabia.

There are lines. You’ve got to pick a principled position somewhere.

 

[GenZRed]

You keep saying ‘Integrate’.

What the Fcuk are you talking about. All countries have their own way of living life. The ‘Western Way’ isn’t some gold standard that all cultures are trying to attain.

Read a book or two. Saudi Arabia as a country is not trying to become Westernised. Not in any way, shape or form.

They’re not seeing Western Culture as the mirror that shows how ugly their own reflection is. You’re beyond stupid if you think that’s what’s happening.

Well from an economic point of view, most of the world appears to be trying to attain our economic development. How practical that actually is, considering the vast amount of materials goods people chuck away after a few months, to make way for more worthless crap, I really am not sure.

Socially though, yes not all cultures are trying to attain the 'western' way of living.

 

[red thru&thru]

So many people on their high horse these days. Your clothes are likely made by workers in sweatshops that might as well be slaves. Your smartphones and ipads are made in Chinese factories that have suicide nets to stop their own workers killing themselves.

The world is burning right now. Yet it appears that the Saudi government buying a football club in England is so important. Get real.

This is what I'm saying. Where do you start and stop with the morals? You just have take the situation as it is.

 

[Yakuza_devils]

I'd be equally appalled if the UK or US governments tried to buy the club.

I think it would be utterly irrelevant.

Where do we draw the moral line? Only effect us when they own our football club? There is no end to this discussion.

In football term, I'm in support of change of ownership be it Saudi or others. We need big changes in the club to bring us forward.

 

[Dion]

So many people on their high horse these days. Your clothes are likely made by workers in sweatshops that might as well be slaves. Your smartphones and ipads are made in Chinese factories that have suicide nets to stop their own workers killing themselves.

The world is burning right now. Yet it appears that the Saudi government buying a football club in England is so important. Get real.

This is, and will always be, the most profoundly moronic argument made on the internet. Everyone who has ever made it has either run out of reasonable things to say or never had anything reasonable to say to begin with.

And without doubt, everyone who makes it should be deeply ashamed but inevitably wont.

 

[matt10000]

Well noted on your opinion. The same way I respect many western countries stand on supplying arms and weapons to the Saudis. Doing investment and business hand in hand with the Saudis government to the tune of hundred of billions. Especially USA and UK.

BTW, what do u think about footballing side of thing if the Saudi took over the club?

Neither the US or UK government have an interest in becoming our owners and so your argument has no relevance.

Imagine the government buying a stake, it was bad enough for Newcastle Utd fans when Phoney Tony Blair claimed to be a fan (although unfortunately no pundit had the guile to ask him to name their starting 11 at the time).

 

[Yakuza_devils]

Manchester United would cease to exist on the footballing side if we were purchased by Saudi Arabia.

There are lines. You’ve got to pick a principled position somewhere.

Again well noted on your opinion.

To many other the change of ownership (Saudi or other) could be the beginning of something good. Our current ownership turning us from football superpower in Europe to being out of Top 4 consistently.

 

[Yakuza_devils]

Neither the US or UK government have an interest in becoming our owners and so your argument has no relevance.

It was bad enough for Newcastle Utd fans when Phoney Tony Blair claimed to be a fan (although unfortunately no pundit had the guile to ask him to name their starting 11 at the time).

So where do we exactly draw the moral line?

 

[Dion]

So where do we exactly draw the moral line?

How about when the owners would have the power to deny the democratic right of an entire country, incarcerate people, torture or execute them?

 

[Dion]

In fact can anyone give me one good reason why people who control the mechanisms of state for any country should be able to buy a football club?

 

[Yakuza_devils]

How about when the owners would have the power to deny the democratic right of an entire country, incarcerate people, torture or execute them?

So, morally we should boycott anything to do with this regime? Including government, organisation and people dealing with the Saudi right? Also, anything Saudi invest, produce and have anything to do with. So on and so forth. Where is the moral line?

 

[Yakuza_devils]

Anyway, I have had enough of discussion about politics and moral in this thread.

I presume nobody interested in discussing about football. Adios!

 

[Spoony]

In fact can anyone give me one good reason why people who control the mechanisms of state for any country should be able to buy a football club?

There's no good reason, states should not be allowed to purchase football clubs. But will you continue to follow United?

 

[red thru&thru]

So, if the Saudis or someone like the Chinese take over, what is the first thing you reckon they will do? Surely the first thing they do is reshape the board. Appoint a new footballing CEO with a DoF.

 

[JPRouve]

So, if the Saudis or someone like the Chinese take over, what is the first thing you reckon they will do? Surely the first thing they do is reshape the board. Appoint a new footballing CEO with a DoF.

The CEO will most likely be one of them or at the very least the most senior individual will be someone close to them like Al Khelaifi or Khaldoon Al Mubarak after that it's anyone's guess, they could hire a COO/General Manager like JC Blanc at PSG or Soriano at City and these are the ones actually dealing with most organizational matters, the person that they pick may or may not hire a DOF.

 

[UnrelatedPsuedo]

Well from an economic point of view, most of the world appears to be trying to attain our economic development. How practical that actually is, considering the vast amount of materials goods people chuck away after a few months, to make way for more worthless crap, I really am not sure.

Socially though, yes not all cultures are trying to attain the 'western' way of living.

To your economic point: Western Culture is simply “Consume. Everything”

And socially?.... ‘Western Culture’ simply isn’t what other countries are striving for. It’s easy to think that, but anyone that’s travelled will attest to it not being the case.

 

[matt10000]

So where do we exactly draw the moral line?

Well I don’t like the current owners very much and would like them to be replaced but replacing a family of parasitic leeches with a murderous thuggish de facto ruler who denies his own people of human rights, imprisons his own people for criticising authorities or advocating political and rights reforms, systematically discriminates against women and religious minorities, curtails academic research deemed sensitive, bans political parties, censors local media and executes people who were involved in anti-government protests when they were under 18 years old......

I think perhaps that is where we draw the moral line?

 

[Dion]

So, morally we should boycott anything to do with this regime? Including government, organisation and people dealing with the Saudi right? Also, anything Saudi invest, produce and have anything to do with. So on and so forth. Where is the moral line?

I know you think you're being clever with this "moral line" question, but you're really not.

We shouldn't allow a state to buy a football club because there is no good reason for them to own one. That fact is self-evident.

 

[Dion]

There's no good reason, states should not be allowed to purchase football clubs. But will you continue to follow United?

Of course not.

 

[sun_tzu]

I know you think you're being clever with this "moral line" question, but you're really not.

We shouldn't allow a state to buy a football club because there is no good reason for them to own one. That fact is self-evident.

Fek morals... If they buy mbappe they can behead journalists as the half time show for all I care

 

[DartMaverick]

Tbh I have nothing against Saudis, either it will be state or individual businessman, as long as new owner takes care of football results, titles, success, stadium and the whole infrastructure

May be some kind of poll about that here?

 

[MackRobinson]

I'm honoured that you remembered my posts. I hardly remember any posters post. But would be great to read again what made you think I'm pro Saudi. I'm just as interested to know what pro Saudi even means?

Not that many people are consistently defending possible Suadi ownership so it sorta sticks out.

A positive maybe that the Saudi’s would be in it to make us better from top to bottom. Best facilities, best staff, best stadium etc. They wouldn’t be in it for the profits but for the statement.

And if they do get bored and want to sell, it’ll be easier and cheaper to buy from the Saudi’s than the Glazers.

Let's get the Saudis in. If nothing else, they'll hopefully put in plans to do a much needed revamp of Old Trafford.

I just don't see what the Saudis would gain, from their journalists just making up stuff?!

Also, MBS has already denied wanting the club. Until it's proven that MBS wants United, we have to presume it's a Saudi businessman. So if people are going to attribute every Saudi with the crimes of the government, than should we not do the same with an American and its government?!

We just need the Saudis to let us spend our own money on transfers etc and the Saudis to spend their money in and around the facilities of Old Trafford.

A crime is a crime, no matter what. But at least MBS has started to change things in Saudi. Women allowed to drive. Concerts in Saudi. New cinemas to be open there.

Look, I hate debating politics in sports. I know it goes on but we can't pick and choose. Saudis are already sponsoring us. We played out there in 2008, I think. We are already in bed with the Saudis. If people are so passionate, they should stop supporting the club now. They can't pick and choose when it becomes immoral.

To each his own but it seems pretty pro-Saudi ownership to me...

 

[dabeast]

Not that many people are consistently defending possible Suadi ownership so it sorta sticks out.

Add another vote here - there is no difference between American owners and Saudi owners. In fact, America has been responsible for far more deaths and misery in the Middle East alone than the Saudis. To say nothing of the rest of the world.

Thus, the preference of American owners over Saudis expressed by some over here seems a teensy bit, I am sorry to say, racist.



To each his own but it seems pretty pro-Saudi ownership to me...

 

[Harry190]

It simply doesn’t. It’s nonsense.

They’re not running out of oil and they don’t look at Manchester United as something that will make any meaningful money. Because on their scale, we don’t, nor will we ever.

Should read up a bit before rushing. They're not running out of oil. The current production is actually too high and they're (through OPEC) trying to limit the supply so as to raise prices. North America is self-sufficient now and shale oil has proven a decent alternative when the prices reach a certain level.
Also, there is a definite move away from fossil fuels in the energy and auto industry, further piling pressure on them. The Saudi economy is far too dependent on oil and they recently had some trouble finding outside interest for Aramco's public float. A historical first. So yeah, they're not morons. They need to diversify.
Manchester United is a perfect opportunity for them to have a spearhead. The valuation is peanuts but brings the type of prestige to their brand that they desperately need. Their neighbours and competitors have a considerable lead on them and as the big dog in the yard, they can't just wait and watch.

Manchester United is a loss leader for them. They're not buying to make money, they're buying as a status symbol.

 

[RUCK4444]

You keep saying ‘Integrate’.

What the Fcuk are you talking about. All countries have their own way of living life. The ‘Western Way’ isn’t some gold standard that all cultures are trying to attain.

Read a book or two. Saudi Arabia as a country is not trying to become Westernised. Not in any way, shape or form.

They’re not seeing Western Culture as the mirror that shows how ugly their own reflection is. You’re beyond stupid if you think that’s what’s happening.

Where the feck did I say they are trying to become westernised!? Wind your neck in lad.

What I said is that the more we integrate with them on a sports and social level the better, in the hope that stronger ties with the west will go at least some way to influence their stance on human rights.

Now I suggest if you can’t understand the benefit of cultural integration then kindly feck off back under the rock you came from

 

[Amarsdd]

Add another vote here - there is no difference between American owners and Saudi owners. In fact, America has been responsible for far more deaths and misery in the Middle East alone than the Saudis. To say nothing of the rest of the world.

Thus, the preference of American owners over Saudis expressed by some over here seems a teensy bit, I am sorry to say, racist.



To each his own but it seems pretty pro-Saudi ownership to me...

fecking hell! why are people here acting so dumb or being dumb to not understand the difference between a business person owning the club and a state owning the club. If it was just a business person from Saudi trying to buy the club most people here would have a lot less objection.

 

[JPRouve]

Add another vote here - there is no difference between American owners and Saudi owners. In fact, America has been responsible for far more deaths and misery in the Middle East alone than the Saudis. To say nothing of the rest of the world.

Thus, the preference of American owners over Saudis expressed by some over here seems a teensy bit, I am sorry to say, racist.



To each his own but it seems pretty pro-Saudi ownership to me...

We are talking about the House of Saud not a random person from Saudi Arabia, people have an issue with a particular set of people and not their nationality.

 

[red thru&thru]

Not that many people are consistently defending possible Suadi ownership so it sorta sticks out.








To each his own but it seems pretty pro-Saudi ownership to me...

Wow, I'm really honoured for all the effort you have put in on getting all these previous posts. But yes, I'm happy for new ownership that I know will demand success both on and off the pitch for my club.

 

[dabeast]

fecking hell! why are people here acting so dumb or being dumb to not understand the difference between a business person owning the club and a state owning the club. If it was just a business person from Saudi trying to buy the club most people here would have a lot less objection.

In which country is the State and big businesses unrelated? Is City owned by the State Of Abu Dhabi or just a private entity?

 

[Olly Gunnar Solskjær]

Knee this thread would be depressing when I opened it. It didn't disappoint. Some would sell their mothers so Man Utd can be running trophies.

Yeah these threads are always a downer to see some of the attitudes.

On a more positive note, posts from people like @matt10000 have helped restore a bit of faith.

 

[Johan07]

buying shares does not give you influence unless you buy a lot of shares (51% ideally). Only a small portion of United is traded. This was simply a cash raising exercise by the Glazers a few years back. We are mostly still privately owned.

I dont see 25 percent of Uniteds shares being a "small portion". Its the opposite. A lot. The Glazers have silently relinquished more and more equity and even if I dont have the exact number they now only control around 75 percent of the equity of United. Its incorrect that this was a one time "small" exercise done years ago. Its been done over time.
Of course they still control the club via the unlisted Class Bs and their voting rights, but diluting their equity that much has more major consequences for them and the club that just voting rights.
Its far from a small thing.
The dividend policy to begin with.
Since all shares are treated equally the Glazers are giving away 25 percent of the dividends to other shareholders when the club does distribute dividends. Which the club will stop doing (distributing dividends) in January 2020 if I read the latest AR correctly. Something that for some reason seems to gone under the radar and also explains a bit of the dump the share price has taken.
It also has major impact for if the Glazers decide to sell and need to unlist Uniteds stock from the NYSE. How that would work today with so much equity alrady floated on the NYSE some US based stock lawyer needs to answer, its beyond my competence.
But to say or imply that the amount of shares that has been floated by the Glazers now is not of major consequence is incorrect.

 

[red thru&thru]

The CEO will most likely be one of them or at the very least the most senior individual will be someone close to them like Al Khelaifi or Khladoon Al Mubarak after that it's anyone's guess, they could hire a COO/General Manager like JC Blanc at PSG or Soriano at City and these are the ones actually dealing with most organizational matters, the person that they pick may or may not hire a DOF.

Yea. I wonder what football team they're looking at and thinking, "We want them to be in charge at Manchester United." As a PR, it would be good to bring in Edwin as ceo and take it from there.

Then surely it has to be looking at modernising OT and Carrington. There is a lot they could do. The club have bought up a lot of land in and around OT and there is so much scope to build on it.

 

[Amarsdd]

In which country is the State and big businesses unrelated? Is City owned by the State Of Abu Dhabi or just a private entity?

of course, there are always relations between businesses and the state that they exist in. But there is a huge difference between that and being directly owned by the state. By your question, it seems you think the US government controls what goes on at United because Glazers are Americans?
As for your question about City, think they are owned by ADUG which is owned by a member of the royal family there. I could be wrong, but there were reports that ADUG was part of a state-owned investment fund. But really I don't give two shits about who owns City.