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2021-22 Performances


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Bebestation

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I like him further up the pitch and when he dribbles out of tight situations.

Just another player like VDb, Pogba that need a proper CDM playing next to him
 

Kostov

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Not at all. Fred was upfield of McTominay and he runs back past him and he runs past the defenders and was in the right position just in case DeGea's save popped in front. All this time McTominay was jogging back as if he was a grandfather. No sprinting to get back at all.
To do what? Score an own goal or probably play onside the Villareal player? It was shambolic piece of play.
 

romufc

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When McTominay plays CDM, I am always surprised the position he picks up.

Surely you cannot let a player receive the ball infront of the defence and turn. He keeps getting bypassed with 1 pass and is chasing. Its either he is in the wrong position or the defence is too keep.

His positioning sense is very poor defensively.
 

Pogue Mahone

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When McTominay plays CDM, I am always surprised the position he picks up.

Surely you cannot let a player receive the ball infront of the defence and turn. He keeps getting bypassed with 1 pass and is chasing. Its either he is in the wrong position or the defence is too keep.

His positioning sense is very poor defensively.
It’s just as bad when we’re in possession. Really poor at finding space, constantly shielded by opposition players. He just doesn’t have any sort of positional sense at all, in defence or in attack.
 

romufc

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It’s just as bad when we’re in possession. Really poor at finding space, constantly shielded by opposition players. He just doesn’t have any sort of positional sense at all, in defence or in attack.
Yep, you can tell he looks lost. When you play as CDM, you need to tell others what to do, if he drops into the CB role, then the CB have to push wide so we can build, but he can;t do anything.

I can see a very functional midfield with Fred, Bruno/Donny and a DM
 

Longshanks

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Not at all. Fred was upfield of McTominay and he runs back past him and he runs past the defenders and was in the right position just in case DeGea's save popped in front. All this time McTominay was jogging back as if he was a grandfather. No sprinting to get back at all.
If Fred was in the right position there wouldn't of been a shot for the de gea to save. All that Fred achieves by sprinting across the pitch is leaving that space open for the shot. He doesn't get anywhere near the ball or the man, nor does a cover another player. He just gets drawn to the ball like a schoolboy, if he defends his space the danger is minimal and the whole action likely leads to nothing, and we wouldnt be here talking about it.
 

harms

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I didn't expect some people to argue that he's had a good game, wow. He'll always be a player capable of nice moments — usually either a lovely-placed shot or a decent dribble forward (using his physicality to brush off his opponents), he's had a couple of those last night... but overall he was hopeless and by far our worst midfielder on the pitch. He simply doesn't have the understanding of the very basics of the game in terms of tactics, positioning & spatial awareness — and you can only get away with it when you're capable of producing outstanding bits of skill on a more or less regular basis (like Pogba — and even a player of his talent still struggles often because of it).

This chance sums up McTominay.

That's pretty damning, wow.
 

Pogue Mahone

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If Fred was in the right position there wouldn't of been a shot for the de gea to save. All that Fred achieves by sprinting across the pitch is leaving that space open for the shot. He doesn't get anywhere near the ball or the man, nor does a cover another player. He just gets drawn to the ball like a schoolboy, if he defends his space the danger is minimal and the whole action likely leads to nothing, and we wouldnt be here talking about it.
:houllier:

Watch it again. He’s the only United midfielder who gets anywhere near the player that takes a shot and the only United player who covers the Villareal player at the far post who would have had a tap in if De Gea got a weaker hand to it.

Also. Look at the starting position of our two CMs when the move gets started.
 

harms

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The issue is, really, that at his best he's very much an attacking box-to-box player with his goalscoring ability from midfield being his most impressive feature. But he's nowhere near good enough to play such a crucial role for Manchester United, so he gets shoved into a position that he doesn't know how to play at because he's tall and strong. He'll probably be a great fit for one of the lower-third PL clubs.
 

VanDeBank

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This chance sums up McTominay.

If Fred was in the right position there wouldn't of been a shot for the de gea to save. All that Fred achieves by sprinting across the pitch is leaving that space open for the shot. He doesn't get anywhere near the ball or the man, nor does a cover another player. He just gets drawn to the ball like a schoolboy, if he defends his space the danger is minimal and the whole action likely leads to nothing, and we wouldnt be here talking about it.
Is this comment supposed to be with regards to that clip? Let me get this right: You think Fred's at fault as the left sided midfielder for a failed interception on the right side followed by a casual jog back by Scotty while Fred is sprinting like crazy past him? :lol:
 

Adam-Utd

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First of all it was not their only chance, and yes that video sums up McT, having zero positional awareness, no defensive instincts and on top of that, not enough effort getting back defending. In the same time, I am not sure why would you credit anyone (same goes for Fred)?

It's a complete feck up, you have 4 players behind your 2 defensive midfielder, one easy pass and you are exposed, just like we were there. Then proceed to look at Lindelof and AWB, it's that how it is supposed to defend in a situation like that? And on top of that what the feck is Fred doing breaking any sort of defensive line our CB should have held, and you talk like he got to the ball? All that cluster feck and you point out McT only? Yeah one thing I agree McT in absolute shambles in that situation, just like 3-4 more players in that video.
It's fair to say the defence are sitting off too much and playing cowardly as per usual - but that's not really the point here.

It's the distinct lack of effort. You're never going to stop ever ball getting in behind, but at least chase after them and pressure them properly! the fact Fred gets across from about 10 yards away faster than he does is frankly pathetic.
 

KennyBurner

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He has always been a bigger problem than Fred and I think people at last are starting to fully realise that.
That’s the problem, this should have been realized 2 seasons ago. How are people just starting to understand Fred is so much better for how a top team should play? Fred might not be perfect but he plays at such a high intensity and can play the pass even if it might be inconsistent on some days while there is nothing mctominay excels at other than shooting.
Mcfred tag needs to die!
 

youngrell

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I don't think Scott is ever going to be the required level for us, he always seems to look to release the ball at the earliest opportunity even if the situation doesn't call for it, almost like passing the buck to others. He also misses a lot of passing opportunities because he doesn't trust himself to make it – Sancho made a few lovely runs in behind last night that were completely ignored or not seen because of a lack of vision.

However, some people just seem to want to criticise no matter how well he plays. Similar to others like Lingard, he seems to get slammed for all our woes whether he plays well or not, which isn't fair.

Whether he's ultimately good enough or not, if he plays well we should say so.
 

Foxbatt

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If Fred was in the right position there wouldn't of been a shot for the de gea to save. All that Fred achieves by sprinting across the pitch is leaving that space open for the shot. He doesn't get anywhere near the ball or the man, nor does a cover another player. He just gets drawn to the ball like a schoolboy, if he defends his space the danger is minimal and the whole action likely leads to nothing, and we wouldnt be here talking about it.
The fact that he was upfield of McTominay and had to sprint pass everyone to get these shows that McTominay completely messed up. If Fred had not put any pressure on the Villareal player would have ample time to do some more damage. The reason why it bounced off our player was because Fred was sprinting back. There was two shots. The first shot that bounced off our player and the second shot that DeGea saved. None of it was because of Fred. He in fact followed up to cover deGea and was in a position to clear it had the ball popped in front.
 

Longshanks

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:houllier:

Watch it again. He’s the only United midfielder who gets anywhere near the player that takes a shot and the only United player who covers the Villareal player at the far post who would have had a tap in if De Gea got a weaker hand to it.

Also. Look at the starting position of our two CMs when the move gets started.
He gets within 5 yards of the player and thats being generous he makes no difference to what that player does and leaves a lot a space where the ball eventually ends up.

And if your talking about the player that could of been there for a tap in, he was miles offside and he only wasn't more miles offside because Fred had got so deep. He shouldn't be there he should of been pretty much where the second shot was taken from.

I'm not absolving mctom of blame by any stretch of the imaganation, but its freds lack of positional discipline that leads to a player having time and space in the box to get a shot away.

What Fred should do is tell Mctom to get back in there and support A.W.B/lindelof and then stay in his position his area, there is no need to go sprinting across the pitch in some attempt to close the villareal player when theres other players alot closer already there to deal with and its actually in thee area of the pitch.
 

Rozay

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I’ve never been a huge fan, but you could see that he improved second half and that was largely due to is having some sort of shape. Midfield far more compact, players close enough to each other which made it harder for him to get caught out positionally.
 

Chaky_Best

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Is this comment supposed to be with regards to that clip? Let me get this right: You think Fred's at fault as the left sided midfielder for a failed interception on the right side followed by a casual jog back by Scotty while Fred is sprinting like crazy past him? :lol:
Both of them are wrong in his position as there's a single player behind Mc Tominay and Fred doesn't cover him. But to be honest, I was mad at this chance, because it started from VDB positioning where he marks no one and doesn't cut any pass angle.

Issue is that there are 3 Villareal players, and it seems too easy for opponents to get behind our midfield. Think it's all related to players intelligence, awareness and positioning/coaching.
 

Stack

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It was a poor pass actually, got lucky with as it ricocheted from the defenders legs to Ronaldo.
I just watched the footage again and you are talking complete bollocks. It never ricocheted off anyone. Best you have another look. 1 min 45 sec in. Your observational skills are a bit suspect....
 

Longshanks

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Is this comment supposed to be with regards to that clip? Let me get this right: You think Fred's at fault as the left sided midfielder for a failed interception on the right side followed by a casual jog back by Scotty while Fred is sprinting like crazy past him? :lol:
Where does the second shot come from? Why does the villareal players have time and space to measure a shot? Who is it that should be covering that space? Who should be picking that player up?

The answer is Fred.

Mctom is at fault for the first shot, but the rebound falls right in the area where Fred should actually be.
It looks good does his lung busting sprinting but it actually achieves the square root of feck all and leaves the space open for the second shot.
 

VanDeBank

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Both of them are wrong in his position as there's a single player behind Mc Tominay and Fred doesn't cover him. But to be honest, I was mad at this chance, because it started from VDB positioning where he marks no one and doesn't cut any pass angle.

Issue is that there are 3 Villareal players, and it seems too easy for opponents to get behind our midfield. Think it's all related to players intelligence, awareness and positioning/coaching.
Ah okay. I see what you mean and I agree.

However, those Jogba antics by Scotty aren't acceptable and I'll cut the man that's sprinting back and trying to correct feck ups by his teammates some more slack.

Where does the second shot come from? Why does the villareal players have time and space to measure a shot? Who is it that should be covering that space? Who should be picking that player up?

The answer is Fred.

Mctom is at fault for the first shot, but the rebound falls right in the area where Fred should actually be.
It looks good does his lung busting sprinting but it actually achieves the square root of feck all and leaves the space open for the second shot.
McTom is also at fault for casually jogging back. He must've expended too much energy doing the hand signals to his teammates.
 

bugmat

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In general? He is good at carrying the ball forward, he is good at pinging balls forward into the attackers, he is good at receiving the ball under pressure and beating players on the half turn, he is good (when given the opportunity) at long range shooting and at bagging goals in general, he is good physically and in the air.

He is also homegrown, which folk may laugh off as romanticism etc, but on a very practical note the club has homegrown quota it needs to hit, so it makes sense to keep someone like McTominay in the squad over a comparatively similar (though in my view more limited) player in Fred, who doesnt do anything to meeting that quota.

McTominay's main weakness is his defensive positioning and reading of the game. He cannot dictate tempo or play those big switches of play reliably, and he sometimes seems to hide from the ball (although I dont think this is actually the case, its more about having that synergy and understanding with teammates of positioning - the positions McT takes up are not those that you would want your DM in). In short, his skillset has very little overlap with what you would want from a DM. Put a Carrick next to McTominay and we would see the best out of him - which for me is a very good player.
:lol: the undererlined if the main reason posters here pump for him.
 

criticalanalysis

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It's fair to say the defence are sitting off too much and playing cowardly as per usual - but that's not really the point here.

It's the distinct lack of effort. You're never going to stop ever ball getting in behind, but at least chase after them and pressure them properly! the fact Fred gets across from about 10 yards away faster than he does is frankly pathetic.
I've pretty much avoided all the player's performance threads the past month or two under Ole (I'm back baby!) but 'good' to see you're still on it with regards to a certain centre back's approach :lol:
 

Adam-Utd

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I've pretty much avoided all the player's performance threads the past month or two under Ole (I'm back baby!) but 'good' to see you're still on it with regards to a certain centre back's approach :lol:
:lol: like a dog with a bone. unfortunately I end up being proved right as usual, just look at his ‘passive’ defending against watford.

Anyways, unfortunately when Lindelof looks the better of the 2 we know we have problems! need Varane back asap. love his style.
 

Lecland07

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Considering how defensive we have been this season, McTominay has managed:

- 1.5 tackles per 90 (positioned 43/49 for midfielders with 5 or more games)
- 2.8 tackles attempted per game (positioned 39/49 for midfielders with 5 or more games)

That is pathetic, to be honest. I understand those figures if we are a dominant side in possession, but we are not.
 

Nogbadthebad

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He spent most of his time yesterday hiding.

Hes very good at it, subtley shifting position so there is an opponent between him and the ball so he can't be passed to.

Bad passing drops other players in it too.

Scott should be a great squad player for the club, that is where his level is, and its not his fault he keeps being picked to start, but he doesn't have enough to his game to be a starter.

Its not fair on him, never mind bad for the team.
 

thepolice123

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He had a few eye-catching moments but he is mainly the reason why we suck at building up from the back.

If we had someone like Parejo in the team instead of him, we would absolutely cruise the game. And Parejo is a decent player at best.
 

criticalanalysis

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:lol: like a dog with a bone. unfortunately I end up being proved right as usual, just look at his ‘passive’ defending against watford.

Anyways, unfortunately when Lindelof looks the better of the 2 we know we have problems! need Varane back asap. love his style.
To be fair of what little games I've seen this year (as I've not bothered to plan my day around them as much), the Swede has been okay and decent in spots compared to his team mates. But yeah low expectations and such.

In any case I'm sure I'll see you back in that thread during the season :D
 

United in sin

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Is this comment supposed to be with regards to that clip? Let me get this right: You think Fred's at fault as the left sided midfielder for a failed interception on the right side followed by a casual jog back by Scotty while Fred is sprinting like crazy past him? :lol:
Beggars belief doesn't it?
 

Foxbatt

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Is this comment supposed to be with regards to that clip? Let me get this right: You think Fred's at fault as the left sided midfielder for a failed interception on the right side followed by a casual jog back by Scotty while Fred is sprinting like crazy past him? :lol:
Fred is also at fault for the ricochet falling to another Villareal player who forced DeGea to make the save. :lol: Might as well be that Fred is at fault for the ref not giving us a penalty?:lol:
 

elmo

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The issue is, really, that at his best he's very much an attacking box-to-box player with his goalscoring ability from midfield being his most impressive feature. But he's nowhere near good enough to play such a crucial role for Manchester United, so he gets shoved into a position that he doesn't know how to play at because he's tall and strong. He'll probably be a great fit for one of the lower-third PL clubs.
He's Championship level at best.

Can't believe someone as poor as him made it through our academy, let alone start that many games for the first team.
 

roonster09

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He's Championship level at best.

Can't believe someone as poor as him made it through our academy, let alone start that many games for the first team.
So that's Rashford, Lindelof, McTominay that's championship level at best. Ole must be a genius to finish 2nd with 3 "championship level" players in starting 11.

I'm sure AWB, Fred are championship level too.
 

roonster09

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His biggest weakness is his movement, he is very static both with and without possession. He doesn't create good angles to receive passes and also his anticipation in defensive side is poor.

He shouldn't be anything more than a back up player to play in domestic cup games.
 

roonster09

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Right, now point me where I said those other players were championship level? :houllier:
He's stealing a living with us.

Championship level at best.
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/victor-lindelöf-2020-21-performances.457019/page-15#post-26118458

He wouldn't even start for a championship team that's aiming for promotion.

How much are we paying him again?
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/marcus-rashford-2019-20-performances.448822/page-15#post-24642389
 

Andycoleno9

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I don’t think he’s jogging because he’s lazy he just has no idea where he needs to be. Why sprint if you don’t know where to sprint to?! His positioning is utterly clueless, when we have the ball and when we don’t. It’s by far the weakest part of his game and it’s a huge problem for the team.

The only possible saving grace is that a really top coach might be able to drill that positional sense into him. And his other attributes are decent enough to make him an interesting project for the new manager. It won’t be easy though.
What exactly he has to be interesting project? His technique is limited and that is something which you have or not. With technique comes passing, ball control and creativity.
So i don't know based on what and why McT should be in our team while he is quality for Burnley or Newcastle.

He sums up our problem for years. Academy player must get 4 years in first team before we decide that he is not good enough. For me it is pretty simple; he is nearly 25y old. He would not be starter in most of PL teams. So, he should not be even on the bench of Manchester United.
 

elmo

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Ok, the Rashford one was hilarious, and Lindelof is admittedly better than Championship level.

But I stand by my take that Scott is clearly no where near good enough. He's either an idiot at making himself open for passes or he's hiding by running towards opponents so the ball doesn't get to him.

One of the worst ever player to start so many games for us.