He was diabolical in the first half of the season, played 1 really good game when Ralf came in and then had a couple of decent performances where he capped it off with a goal or assist to turn it into a good one. He's 6.5/10 at best and so is McTominay
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Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 37
- Goals
- 2
- Assists
- 1
- Yellow cards
- 10
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
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Fred loses the ball too much but the rest of his game is good and from what I've seen even that is less of an issue with Brazil. He's a pretty classic water-carrier type that does well in international football.
McTominay doesn't really do anything well.
McTominay is in no world a 6.5/10 player for a team with top aspirations. Fred is decent (if occasionally profligate) on the ball...McTom is a lumbering waste of dpace.
Fred has more weaknesses with McTominay better in physical battles and in the air. And yes those are part of football too
Worst player on the pitch yesterday. I like the guy but he plays in a critical position where the whole team fail if he fails, and unfortunately he fails a lot.
McTominay has found his PR angle and it’s hard work and passion - sadly neither of these are backed up on the pitch but because he says the right things and looks a bit tough he fools people into believing it.
There was a time I thought he would be a better person to keep around over Fred, awfully wrong. Fred has his many flaws, but Mctominay is just so unbelievably limited. His ceiling has well and truly been reached.
Think he pulled Caicedo over about 5 times yesterday, all because he was wrong side of the man each time.
He'll be warming the bench come the end of next season.
He'll be warming the bench come the end of next season.
Fred is quicker, a better passer (though loose with it), has a better engine, is better in tight spaces, a more ambitious passer and more suited to pressing. The only thing McTominay has overhim is size and strength, both of which are useless if you can't get close to the oppo midfield
I remember when fans used to give shit to players like Nani, Cleverley, Anderson, Berbatov and so many others in our squad.
I just cannot understand how some of these average players like Rashford and McTominay are defended by a section of the fans when in the past, much better players were criticised all the time.
It's like a part of our fanbase wants to believe that these players are actually good.
I just cannot understand how some of these average players like Rashford and McTominay are defended by a section of the fans when in the past, much better players were criticised all the time.
It's like a part of our fanbase wants to believe that these players are actually good.
Me too. ETH might not be given an option though if he isn’t backed.l by the board. We’ve had all this talk of big changes this summer but I’ll believe it when I see it.
Seems to be a Fellaini situation, everyone sees he is shit yet starts games
I don't remember which game it was last season but there was a sequence where we got the ball in midfield and instead of putting himself in space, McTominay decided to move behind the opposition midfielder which put him out of play. Only Cleverley was better at that kind of things, I still don't understand how Carrick didn't manage to slap him in the middle of a game.
I feel for him a bit. He must know he's not up to this level, hence the disappearing act. Reminds me a little of Tom Cleverley.
Ha, you got in with this comparison just before me!
I have never been a fan of Fellaini but that's insulting, Fellaini was a good PL player, he had the right instincts but lacked agility and technique. McTominay is more often than not, just out there running on grass.
Has anyone in the media figured out McTominay yet or are they just ignoring it? I've not seen him get much criticism anywhere.
They aren't anywhere near the same level and both the eye-test and stats back that up.
- Fred makes 25% more passes p/90 because he doesn't spend his time hiding in cover shadow when his own team has the ball...
- His shot-creating actions p/90 are nearly 50% higher because he actually tries to be progressive.
- His pressures p/90 are about 35% higher because he actually tries to win the ball back, McTominay mostly jogs around looking like he's trying to keep the midfield shape.
- His numbers for blocks and interceptions are both better despite him being the one going to the ball more often. Which probably tells you all you need to know about McTominay's positioning when he's 'trying' to shield the back 4.
- Both his xG and xA are also 4x higher each.
You need an actual eye test
Fred is pushed off the ball far more often
They are both average premier league CMs who look like particularly hard workers because of distance travelled/running but they mostly look like that because the majority of our team dont track back or try at all. If either was playing for a different premier league team we wouldnt target them because they dont arent better than the CMs at top half premier league clubs.
Bit rich when you think Fred and McTominay's peaks are the same level. Fred is twice the player.
He should have been re-trained as a Centre Back about 5 years ago.
His technical ability is far to limited to play as a midfielder at this level.
His technical ability is far to limited to play as a midfielder at this level.
Hence why I mentioned this. However the stats are also damning.
I don't know how anyone can watch these 2 and think they are remotely close.
I'm not saying Fred is great and long-term he needs upgrading but he can at least be a squad/rotational option.
McTominay is barely a PL player.
Fred rushes out of position to pressure, McTominay holds position and tracks back. The only thing that would make Fred's approach better is if we are able to win the ball or force a mistake from rushing out of position. Anytime that doesnt happen now Fred is taken out of the game and McTominay has to try and position himself to cover 2 DM roles, which he doesnt do well because that would require a specialist like Makelele and neither of them are that.
On the ball Fred is more active, that comes with the downside of losing the ball frustratingly and most critically in terrible areas. He's frequent in losing the ball 35-40 yards from his own goal when an opponent pressures him and he has a lack of awareness or a heavy touch. Teams have both targetted and punished this. And it has its benefits too as you listed. Its a good and bad thing - McTominay should be more active and do the things he has shown he can do more often, but not at the cost of losing the ball in terrible areas or with frustrating lack of care passes like Fred.
Fred was better last season if we put his goals and assists to the side, his performances and overall work were better. But of course you dont put those numbers to the side. He was lacking in goals and assists and now this season he has provided them.
McTominay is the opposite. He's better this season with his passing and will spread play much better with his passing than last season where it was a severe issue. But now that he's holding position as a DM more he isnt getting forward and scoring, which is the thing he actually looked best at in previous seasons - shots from the edge of the box and getting on the end of crosses for headers and getting some goals. So while his performances have been better, his end product has gone.
Both are worse than either of Brighton's midfielders from Saturday and they are 9th
He also sort of knows where to be much of the time, an area in which McTominay is in the bottom 10th percentile of prem midfielders to my eye.
He's not Portuguese enough to receive the full media treatment!
He does seem more comfortable with everything in front of him.
In fact, I was thinking yesterday that he'd be much more effective with an elevated postition. Maybe row 10?
Any hope I had for McT has evaporated over the last few months.
Watch the 1st goal yesterday and McTominay's running from the loose ball off the throw, his 'positioning' is woeful. I don't think I've seen a so-called holding midfielder who's so easy to run off and receive passes against between the line. This is just a recent example but I'm sure you can go back and look at the goals conceded throughout the season and you'll see attackers picking up space to receive the ball in front of the back 4 far too easily in McTominay's vicinity.
His tracking of runners is also horrible. See the 3rd goal.
The DM experiment is over, he has no idea where he needs to be when the team is out of possession. His best is as a physical B2B player. Unfortunately you need to have both the ability on the ball in this role and the courage to actually want to receive it and he has neither. Nowhere near good enough for a team with United's aspirations and the fact he's played nearly 200 games speaks volumes about the level the club is at right now.
Mr hide and seek.
Fred's position is always awful. The first thing he will do is vacate space in the middle of the pitch running towards the ball even if other players are already there.
Brutal. This long-running bad joke needs to end.
Wish Jay Spearing had many 170 appearances for Liverpool
He needs to be loaned next season in hope he can salvage some value to sell on, rangers or celtic would be ideal destination.
I will write off next season and ten hag if this guy is still getting regular game time next season.
I will write off next season and ten hag if this guy is still getting regular game time next season.
It isn't entertaining for journos/pundits enough to write a piece or speak about how rubbish he is as he isn't high profile enough or brought for a big transfer fee.
If he starts first game next season I'm deleting my caf account and cancelling my Sky and BT Sports accounts, as it will signal that we have learnt absolutely nothing from this season. If he wasn’t Scottish or academy he'd be playing for West Brom ffs.
Noted.
Fellaini was twice the player though
Correct.
Fellaini was a Plan B, who could be brought on if we were struggling to score a goal.
Scott McT should not be part of any plan to win a match.
Haha.
He probably will be a first team regular next season. I believe that managers pick him because he works hard, doesn't give up and follows their orders. Basically, he has a good attitude.
The problem fans have with him is that he does not possess the skill set to run the midfield of a team aiming for the top.
But he at least presses and tries to win the ball back. McTominay does neither. Just tries to look busy.
The duo are very opinionated and you could defend your stance on the 2 until the cows come home. For me I see much more potential as a squad player in McT than I can see in Fred. Fred has def had some better performances but I just think his bad moments are too bad to accept for where we need to go and I'm with Ekeke on this point and many others above. Also no denying it's a fact how bad McT has been this season
It’s not even about a team aiming for the top.
Let’s do a comparison between holding midfielders in the PL:
1) Man City: Rodri
2) Liverpool: Fabinho
3) Chelsea: Kante
4) Arsenal: Partey
5) Spurs: Hojbjerg
7) West Ham: Rice
8) Wolves: Moutinho / Neves
9) Brighton: Bissouma
10) Crystal Palace: Kouyate
11) Villa: McGinn
Literally every single team has a better DM than McTominay. He’s lower mid-table quality at best.
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