Anyone been impressed with Kagawa's performances in central midfield for us in pre-season? He's done a very good job in the role Van Gaal has given him. His skill-set allows him to excel in key areas and that's obviously useful for us. For example, his sharp turns and passing make him an excellent alternative to Herrera. Personally I can't see both starting together, but he's a very good option to have and why selling him shouldn't be considered this summer.
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Yep I have. Early days though.
Good option to bring off the bench if we need to control a game however his skill set is wasted if he plays so deep. Much better if he's receiving the ball and turning with it rather than being the one to carry it from deep.
I definitely agree we shouldnt be selling him. I dont think he is right for a 2 man midfield against any sort of reasonable opposition however. He should get enough gametime out wide or as a #10, maybe the occasional game in CM against weaker opponents.
Thing with Kagawa is he needs players similar to him to link up with - its no good saying "well he is an attacking player so stick Carrick with him" as the two just wont click the way Kagawa will with a Herrera, Mata or Cleverley - he needs players around him who can play the same
Thing with Kagawa is he needs players similar to him to link up with - its no good saying "well he is an attacking player so stick Carrick with him" as the two just wont click the way Kagawa will with a Herrera, Mata or Cleverley - he needs players around him who can play the same
Another thread for a player???
We've too many threads for a single player
We've too many threads for a single player
It´s preseason. Can´t draw too many conclusions. Shinji takes a lot of risk but is very good on the ball and usually it works out. Wouldn´t mind playing him in CM against certain opponents, I believe Giggs used Shinji in CM too at the end of last season? 10 is best position though and I doubt LvG can change that.
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That turn he did was fantastic.
I agree, he did well in midfield. Learning to play better when in limited space and deeper in midfield now..
He's not a midfielder. I doubt he is combative or strong enough to play there too often. It's a shame he hasn't managed to stake a real claim to his proper position here as he's a very talented player.
I think he's done okay but I'd worry about him against a team who's midfield presses a lot
His passing is there but he's got absolutely no presence, particularly when we're on the back-foot. He'd have to be playing in a 3 ahead of a very good defensive minded player to play in a more withdrawn midfield role.
Against bottom 6 or 7 sides you might get away with it, but he'd get blown away against decent sides in a midfield two behind someone like Mata.
Against bottom 6 or 7 sides you might get away with it, but he'd get blown away against decent sides in a midfield two behind someone like Mata.
Nah. He's way too light and would need two midfielders in there with him, and if youre having two others with him in there you may as well put him as a ten with two behind him. We need to stop shoehorning non-central midfielders into central midfield.
No
Wasn't really happy with him in the LA game but today he's done great job. Problem with him would be that he needs some very defensive midfielder alongside him to work in this system I think. He was good transporting the ball forward, playing slick passes and shit but with Cleverley as the defensive midfielder ( ayy ) and then Lingard we were open through the midfield.
He's looked decent but I really doubt he is a real option there. He looked horribly out of place in those couple of games at the end of last season when he played in a midfield for instance. A couple of his biggest failings, his lack of strength and assertiveness will be even more of an issue if he was played in a deeper role.
He had one or two quality moments last game and he did the same today. A lovely left footed pass through the Keane and a nice little dribble and pass. You'd still want a bit more than that from a quality CM option but still some good signs. For me only Smalling was better in the 2nd half
With us having too many no.10s in the squad (something that van Gaal himself as publicly spoken about), this move was always on the cards. I mentioned it early doors in a thread dissecting van Gaal's preferred systems back in May that I could see Kagawa being utilised as a central midfielder beside a CM (Herrera) and behind Mata in the AM role. It's looked very promising thus far and I'm excited to see how this develops.
So far so good with him as a CM. much better than last season anyway in that position. It would be both his and the club's gain if he could make a cm position his.
No. While maybe looking sort of okay in friendly games, in Prem your need a far accomplish midfielder in that position. With a superior strength at least. What interesting though is that LVG does not play him in number 10 role. With our current group it could mean that we have too many players there as LVG's said already. And while Kagawa at least can play at CM, Nani and Lingard are definitely not a CM's players. So it does not necessarily means LVG does not regard Kagawa as a number 10 option at all, but i do think it means that LVG does not really see Kagawa as a main number 10 option.
Need a gif of his control from that long ball. Sublime
Not suited for a midfield 2 though, clearly.
Not suited for a midfield 2 though, clearly.
I think that's way too gungho and we'd only see 2 of : Ander, Mata, Kagawa at a time.
For me Kagawa is just showing he might be able to be developed as someone to compete for Ander's role next to a disciplined player like Carrick. Fletcher and Cleverley have also tried that role so far.
Kagawa lacks the defensive awareness and nous to play a deeper role. However, he's very good playing as a #8. Having said that, if we are to play him in a deeper role, I'd worry as he wouldn't have the defensive solidity to dominate the midfield.
He seems like a guy you'd only play in CM against lower league opposition or when we're cruising against an average PL side.
That's where many people are wrong i think. We don't need to re-accommodate players, even good ones, into their like 3-rd choice positions for them to stay. I think we should sell players more easily and buy players for positions we need.
Vidals are hard to get, but players like Clasie, Felipe Gutierrez we can definitely get and they won't exactly cost much and even if they would not develop into good players to start, they could be a good cover options.
Yes. He'd have to learn it
Impressed by what he has done on the ball from deeper.
Not impressed by what he does defensively in midfield though. Or what he doesn't.
Been our 3rd best CM overall which is not good for our CM prospects and should already tell LVG enough to buy a new one.
Not impressed by what he does defensively in midfield though. Or what he doesn't.
Been our 3rd best CM overall which is not good for our CM prospects and should already tell LVG enough to buy a new one.
Given that Lingard was also moved into central midfield, I doubt van Gaal's trying to shoehorn all of our #10's into central midfield just because we have Mata in the team. I think he's trying to give match time to everyone and assess how well they perform under van Gaal's philosophy and system.
So far, Kagawa has shown that he can be a good #8 or 10 in this system. However, he can, in no way, be a partner to another attack-minded player in central midfield (Cleverley, Herrera, etc.); otherwise, we'd be easily overrun in central midfield.
Thought he looked really good today, still can't see a staring place for him though. Herrera has the box to box and slightly more attacking midfielder role down, mata is the #10. Pretty obvious we need a defensive minded midfielder next to him and that's just not Shinji. As a first choice back up who can rotate for those 2 positions though, he's brilliant and we won't find a better player to be a sub. Not sure if he'd be happy with just being a squad player though.
I can't see it. He's not got the ability to impose himself on a game and is way to happy just to stroll along with a game rather than dictate it.
Ye, i've been impressed with Kagawa so far, but if Van Gaal's going to continue playing him in centre midfield, he'd need an out and out defensive midfielder next to him, in my opinion.
Lingard playing there was obviously a thing of the moment, with Kagawa you've got a feeling that could be a feature of sorts.
I am not sure Kagawa can be a number 8 against decent opposition even playing alongside a tackling DM. And we currently only have one real DM like that, it's Fletch. Even Carrick needs a more tackling player alongside him.
You can learn positioning, but Kagawa also lacks strength. And that is something you can't rectify.
It's obviously not his best position, but he can definitely handle the role under a coach like Van Gaal.
It's like I've said a thousand times before: the position doesn't really matter, as long as we play quick, fluid, technical football. If he can feature next to a tougher player who knows how to tackle and scare off the opponent, then I think he can become a massive success as a CM.
It's like I've said a thousand times before: the position doesn't really matter, as long as we play quick, fluid, technical football. If he can feature next to a tougher player who knows how to tackle and scare off the opponent, then I think he can become a massive success as a CM.
I'd like to know why you think that. To me, I'd only see this as a problem if we don't have someone like Mata or Herrera in midfield who look for the ball and dictate play from midfield (if we aren't playing a counterattacking setup) or if we play players who are poor with their movements.
He isn't a CM and never will be, he competes for the number 10 spot. Herrara is a CM, He showed more tackling and running the Kagawa has in his first game, because he IS a CM.
First of all i did not get your point about Mata, Ander. If Mata will look for the ball and "dictate play from midfield" what will Kagawa do in this number 8 role? Sideway passes all around? No thanks. It's number 8's job to dictate the play, while team with the ball, Mata's job should be then to actually create chances and be in the box, finish them as well.
I think Kagawa can't really be a good number 8 in PL mainly due to his lack of strength. With the ball, in attack he does not possess good enough ball protection skills, he looses ball far to easily esp. when physical pressure is applied, and you know you can bet your house that it will be the case in Prem. You probably could get waay with it in Spain, maybe in Italy, but in England you need a certain grit to shrug off challenges. Then without the ball to apply the said pressure yourself, to tackles, to win ball back. Kagawa is a bit of a pushover in that respect. And i don't think you can make do with only one strong player in the middle.
I mean you could probably do with a 1 DM, 2 CM triangle, like a just for example sake
Fletcher
Kagawa-Vidal
Where Kagawa has one defensive player to cover and one ball winner, more of a b2b player. But that's a different formation and in Kagawa will have more of a number 10 role in that system.
So for me Kagawa in number 8's role can work only as a sort of emergency option, when opposition is in "bus mode", when their CM players do not even want to think about crossing halfway line.
--------------- DDG --------------
----- Jones - Smalling - Evans -----
Valencia - Herrera - Kagawa - Shaw
--------------- Mata -------------
---------- Rooney - RVP ----------
We'll win every game 5-3
----- Jones - Smalling - Evans -----
Valencia - Herrera - Kagawa - Shaw
--------------- Mata -------------
---------- Rooney - RVP ----------
We'll win every game 5-3
Oh dear...--------------- DDG --------------
----- Jones - Smalling - Evans -----
Valencia - Herrera - Kagawa - Shaw
--------------- Mata -------------
---------- Rooney - RVP ----------
We'll win every game 5-3
This is even worse than playing two actual box-to-box midfielders in an attacking 4-4-2 setup.
Put Fletcher or Carrick (once fit) in for Kagawa and it would be 5-1. So Kag is still an understudy, however much you try to argue otherwise.--------------- DDG --------------
----- Jones - Smalling - Evans -----
Valencia - Herrera - Kagawa - Shaw
--------------- Mata -------------
---------- Rooney - RVP ----------
We'll win every game 5-3
Yeah I think he could play really well there, but unfortunately for him Herrera just offers us more as the #8, and mata seems perfect for the #10 role in Van Gaal's system. Kagawa would still get plenty of games pretty much as first choice player to come in for anyone in midfield or attack, but I don't think he'll be a starter, and I'm not sure if he'd be content with just being a squad player. He's an excellent player and could go be a key player at other top teams, just at united I don't think he'll ever be much more then a sub. Unless we switch to a 4-3-3 and use him on the wing but he doesn't strike me as van Gaal's type of wide player.
I like Kagawa. But this would scare the shit outta me. He's a number 10. Period. On the other hand, the fact that LVG is trying out Kagawa as a CM might signal that LVG values his attributes and is somehow trying to shoehorn him into the team.--------------- DDG --------------
----- Jones - Smalling - Evans -----
Valencia - Herrera - Kagawa - Shaw
--------------- Mata -------------
---------- Rooney - RVP ----------
We'll win every game 5-3
He should not be played as a central midfielder. He is only played their because he is the only player in this squad role that has the type of movement and passes herrera has as a number 8. Rather we get someone like kovacic and play kagawa as a subsidary player to Mata.
Put that away, you will give someone cancer with that.--------------- DDG --------------
----- Jones - Smalling - Evans -----
Valencia - Herrera - Kagawa - Shaw
--------------- Mata -------------
---------- Rooney - RVP ----------
We'll win every game 5-3
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