Smalling and Maguire

Zlatattack

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1. Would they be our best CB pairing?
2. Would they be good enough to win the league/compete in the CL with?
 

TrustInJanuzaj

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1: No Smalling had been here a decade and has proven he’s nowhere near good enough. He is decent as a pure defender but has no composure on the ball and wouldn’t get in modern progressive teams. Lindelof and Bailly are both better players by a distance.
2:No (see above)

I expect on usual people will rush to his defence.
 

VP89

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I actually like Smalling and think he's underrated.
 

arthurka

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1: No Smalling had been here a decade and has proven he’s nowhere near good enough. He is decent as a pure defender but has no composure on the ball and wouldn’t get in modern progressive teams. Lindelof and Bailly are both better players by a distance.
2:No (see above)

I expect on usual people will rush to his defence.
It's fair to say that Smalling is very underrated here. He is a better defender than both Bailly and Lindelöf. Brilliant header off the ball and very quick. Great natural ability but not good on the ball. I would say that Maguire and him would be our best pair.
 

Van Piorsing

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Both would have to climb in highest place of their careers for more than just one season and I have basis for doubting that.
 

Sparky Rhiwabon

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1. Would they be our best CB pairing?
2. Would they be good enough to win the league/compete in the CL with?
1. Possibly, although only because the other non-Maguire options are so bad - maybe Bailly is marginally better though
2. Nah, we need a better partner for Maguire, and one who complements him
 

RedPed

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Not the Smalling thing again. He's done at United now. Would be a backwards step with the way we play now. Italy's his level now.
 

Web of Bissaka

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1. Potentially yes.
2. Good enough to nick a league win. CL? no.
Why? Weren't we the best of the rest with Smalling-Lindelof the CB pair commonly in a certain season, but City were having a freak long run of top form back then.

Need to see first Maguire-Smalling playing together.
 

DWelbz19

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Smalling is better than Lindelof and would be a better partner to Maguire, yes.

Whether or not they’re good enough to win a title with? Possibly, but it never truly works like that. The defence as a unit tends to need to play well. Or you simply just dominate and outscore your opponents.
 

Web of Bissaka

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Pogba - Fred - Bruno
Shaw - Smalling - Maguire - AWB

or

Bruno
Fred - Pogba
Shaw - Maguire - Smalling - AWB
Shaw and Maguire are arguably good on the ball, AWB isn't too bad either.

With that trio midfielders who are talented on the ball and want to receive the ball many times, I don't see any problems with Smalling's drawbacks on the ball being a hindrance to the team. Too many good options of players around him.

It's not like with Lindelof, we play better anyway (before Bruno and during Pogba's injury). It's zombie possession.
 

el3mel

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I thought Smalling will be sold in summer anyway. This loan was just a step towards that. However I can't say anything for sure in the current state of football.
 

Rozay

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I always thought he’d be a far more natural partner for Maguire than any that we have. I think they’d have been very solid. I’d far rather see him partner Maguire next season than Lindelöf (or any of the other pretenders for that matter) is we don’t bring anyone in this summer (or Autumn!)
 

Bilbo

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As much as I have always liked Smalling and thought him to be slightly over-criticised by our fans, the simple fact is that he is not a good enough passer of the ball. The strategy that Ole is trying to implement here is clear to see, and its also just as clear to see that Smalling would be a very square peg in a very round hole.
 

Bebestation

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Smalling was the best CB at the club before Maguire and whether he can pass a ball or not does not change that fact.

So keeping players like Jones and selling Smalling is a questionable decision. I personally think Lindelof and Maguire may have good stats but they cover up mistakes or imbalances in their partnerships.

Rojo is gone. Jones has to go now even on a free. I'm not going to pretend like I've seen enough of Tuanzebe but he has maybe one more injury allowed season with us at max if he was rated highly by the management in it self, maybe same with TFM or his time is up already.

Bailly for me is a player that Ole will improve the same way Ole improved the likes of Shaw, fred, Mctominay, Rashford, Martial's play by 10 - 20 % and in my opinion we were starting to see this with potentially Bailly eventually taking Lindelof's position when the time was right.

My position of smalling is highly dependent on Lindelof. If we bring a new CB in then I'm okay with Smalling leaving the club.
Maguire gets a potential new partner competing with Bailly and a bit lower down Lindelof. That's a very solid looking 4 CB's. 5th CB is a youngster.

Likewise if we dont bring someone in then Smalling is Maguires partner competing with Bailly and a bit lower down Lindelof and a 5th CB of a youngster.


Lindelof is way too casual for me as a starting defender, even AWB or Shaw would be better at CB with their tenacity.

All the zonal marking problems from corners was hardly a problem of tactics in my opinion and rather a problem of actual defensive ability and willingness to get stuck in with the head and jumping and hard and high as you can.
 

MadDogg

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Other than his ability (or lack thereof) on the ball, Smalling is a far more natural partner to Maguire than any of our other options. So it depends on what balance you want to hit between ability on the ball (where he's our worst option) and actual defensive ability (where he's our best option) as to where he sits in the pecking order. Ole obviously wanted more of the former.
 

Oldyella

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1. Would they be our best CB pairing?
2. Would they be good enough to win the league/compete in the CL with?
Yes and yes, if he came back it would be our best CB partnership, but Ole has decided to move on and Smalling, although not exactly old, is not getting any younger.

Would have liked to see what they could do as a partnership but this season was the one to try it. We do need to sign a real top notch CB to partner Maguire, our current cbs are terrible.
 

davidmichael

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Smalling looks at his best with a ball playing leader who’ll allow Smalling to just simply defend. He is very quick, great in the air, strong and for me he’s a perfect partner for Maguire.

I’d keep Smalling and have him alongside Maguire, Lindelof, Tuanzebe and Bailly as our centre back options then sell/release Jones and Rojo. If we get offered £20-£25 million for Smalling though I’d imagine we’d take it and sell him but he’s far better than Jones or Rojo and currently ahead of Tuanzebe.
 

Number32

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Not Smalling again. Its like hoping Young, Lukaku, and Sanchez to come back here.
He is over rated in a weak Serie-A. The last time I saw him, he's still a clown playing against Gent in Europa.
 

tenpoless

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Yeah it could work, but only for 2 years top. Smalling is old.
He will still be a way better cover than Jones though and even Bailly I would say. But I would keep Bailly because He's only 26.
 

charlenefan

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Maguire does everything Smalling does but better, Maguire really needs a partner with pace rather than someone like Smalling
 

OnlyTwoDaSilvas

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I'd bring him back as cover. Infinitely more reliable than Bailly and Jones, and a better defender than both.

I'd like to see us bring in a quality centre back to pair with Maguire, but it probably isn't high up the priority list.
 

charlenefan

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Smalling is ridiculous quick, especially for someone his size. His recovery pace is probably his greatest asset.
Smalling's greatest asset is far from pace, it's his ability in the air and physicality. He's a great tool when playing against someone like Deeney but those players are few and far between now and like I said Maguire can deal with those sorts now and do it better
 

OnlyTwoDaSilvas

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Smalling's greatest asset is far from pace, it's his ability in the air and physicality. He's a great tool when playing against someone like Deeney but those players are few and far between now and like I said Maguire can deal with those sorts now and do it better
Of course it is, he was recorded as one of the fastest players in the squad various times. When he played in a high line under LvG, his recovery pace when the opposition got in behind was what he was best at.

He's great at winning the ball in the air too, but I don't think he's ever been particularly great physically, which why he resorts to grappling and grabbing shirts. He's struggled against big 9s before, particularly Benteke and Deeney. I agree that Maguire is better than Smalling against physical centre backs.

I'm not suggesting he's the answer. Ole wouldn't have shipped him out on loan if he wasn't in with a shout to start regularly, but there won't be too many centre backs quicker than Smalling.
 

lex talionis

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I haven't watched Smalling in Italy, but if he's the same Smalling he'd be decent enough to bring back as a squad but not a first choice option to start with Maguire.

Ship off Jones and Rojo, above all else. Stick with Lindelof, Bailly and Tuanzebe. Bring in Koulibaly and if that's doable then let Smalling go, but if not then bring Smalling back for another season. But I wouldn't give any serious consideration to Smalling as a starting CB unless he's really dramatically improved while in Italy.
 

Bebestation

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Is there a reason why Maguire is better on the left?

Say we ditch Smalling & buy a defender who has played at LCB and is left footed like Ake would Maguire be able to shift to the right with ease?

Not saying Ake is the perfect partner either but just want to know how flexible Maguire is.
 

arnie_ni

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Other than his ability (or lack thereof) on the ball, Smalling is a far more natural partner to Maguire than any of our other options. So it depends on what balance you want to hit between ability on the ball (where he's our worst option) and actual defensive ability (where he's our best option) as to where he sits in the pecking order. Ole obviously wanted more of the former.
Sums the situation up perfectly.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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1. Would they be our best CB pairing?
2. Would they be good enough to win the league/compete in the CL with?
The point of why Ole didn't plan to make him a regular from the pre season last summer because of he probably wants to play from the back. Having Smalling will just ruin what the manager wants the team to play especially that Ole loves counter attack and it's even more effective to have defenders who can pass the ball not only to defend. I'm sure Smalling realised that with his age and how the manager wants to play from the back will limit his chance to play regular as he becomes less favourite to the younger centre back & centre back who can play from the back. I'm not surprised if Smalling himself is looking for a new club as well.
 

MadDogg

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Maguire does everything Smalling does but better, Maguire really needs a partner with pace rather than someone like Smalling
I never understand how there's a small portion of our fans who have watched Smalling play for years and still seem to think he isn't fast. He's still probably our fastest central defender despite the fact that I think he's lost a touch of pace over the last year or two, and there aren't many out there that are faster. At most you could say that he can take a couple of steps to really get going if he gets turned, but that's going to be true for anybody with his size.

Other than their size and aerial ability, Maguire and Smalling really aren't anything alike. Their respective biggest weaknesses are some of the other's biggest strengths. That's why many expected them to be a very good partnership as they cover for each other.
 

Raoul

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There was a brief period where Smalling was the best CB (or near it) in the league. He hasn't been nearly consistent enough over the years though. Maquire is a good leader and will be a top player here for a decade imo.

 

Brightonian

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Of all our current CB options, Smalling remains the one who has had the best single season for us (15/16). He was helped by our possession-focussed style (this was under LVG), which limited the pressure on our defence. Maguire this season hasn't been far off that level, allowing for the greater amount of work he's actually had to do, and the fact that it was his very first season for us.

Anyway, that was just one season out of many from Smalling. His appearances have always, barring 15/16, been limited by Rio and Vidic or injury. However he has had plenty of runs of games to stake his claim and never quite managed to do it.

I'm a Bailly fan, to a degree that puts me out of sync with the majority of people on the Caf. For me, the order of preference goes like this:

Maguire
Bailly
Smalling
Lindelof
Tuanzebe
'Others' :nono:

But I wouldn't argue much with someone who swapped Bailly and Smalling there. Overall, I'm happy with our options, and don't want to see a CB come in over the summer.
 

MyOnlySolskjaer

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I'm all for it. In defending Set pieces it's Maguire alone that's kept our decent run of form going. Lindelof is pretty fecking useless in that sense. Smalling adds so much more, it's not like Lindelof is playing out the back like Ferdinand.
 

MyOnlySolskjaer

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Ole improved the likes of Shaw, fred, Mctominay, Rashford, Martial's play by 10 - 20 % and in my opinion we were starting to see this with potentially Bailly
I think Martial has improved enormously to be honest. His finishing is much more varied than the typical far post finish, even starting to score more ugly goals. He has added parts to his game that nobody really saw before. His link up play is fantastic, his movement has improved and even aerially he's becoming a threat e.g. the City game where he was a huge help in defending set pieces and goals such as Chelsea away. He's improved so much from just being the silky dribbler in his first season.

You can see just how much he is benefiting from playing with Bruno and how much he's enjoying that. Prior to that he was feeding of scraps.
 

RedNed77

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Smalling isn’t great on the ball, but which CB’s actually are? I feel lots of the so called better ones are massively overrated. Harry is supposed to be a libero, meh. He’s ok. Smalling is worse than ok as a footballer but, he’s solid defensively. Anybody who says otherwise is a fecking idiot.

I reckon we could cross CB off as a done position for a few years if we yanked him back. He’s definitely better than any other option we have at the club and better than many of the very expensive options we’re looking at buying.
 

Bebestation

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I think Martial has improved enormously to be honest. His finishing is much more varied than the typical far post finish, even starting to score more ugly goals. He has added parts to his game that nobody really saw before. His link up play is fantastic, his movement has improved and even aerially he's becoming a threat e.g. the City game where he was a huge help in defending set pieces and goals such as Chelsea away. He's improved so much from just being the silky dribbler in his first season.

You can see just how much he is benefiting from playing with Bruno and how much he's enjoying that. Prior to that he was feeding of scraps.
Oh I agree, I just held back on the percentage not to over hype the manager and the players too much when they could improve further. Martial has improved from whatever Ole does to alot of the squad- it's hard to see what exactly - but feels like a sense of freedom to their gameplay maybe? Martial has obviously improved from becoming a striker again which is still the managers work.


I remember we were seeing alot of we look poorly coached & we were looking less and less like that with many players improving a level over what was maybe even previously expected.

Considering this is a thread about defenders - I felt that even Lindelof had considerably improved in areas in his game where he felt more like a consistent defender, however still showed flaws to his game that would pop up.

Bailly returned from injury and within the first couple of minutes- you could really see that he would improve under Ole aswell as be a more natural partner towards Maguires weaknesses than Lindelof.
 

RikRuud

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I'd consider all the Cb's currently in the first team (Bar Jones) better than Smalling. Smalling did not want to fight for his place.