So who's responsible for transfers/recruitment - and are they any good?

altodevil

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Club and ten Hag quite happy to not have the manager involved heavily with transfers, with a focus on coaching. This seems fairly sensible in a modern footballing context.

However, that leads on to who will be responsible and are they any good?

Looks to be Murtough and Arnold at the moment. It remains to be seen what influence Rangnick will have in his follow-up consultancy role. There are rumours of us bringing in someone like Paul Mitchell in some capacity. Then we have Fletcher hanging around like a bad smell.

First off - how do you feel about the coach having a far smaller input on recruitment in general? I think in a vacuum it can be a good thing.

Secondly though - how confident are you that our current staff can recruit sensibly? I'm not sold, and quite frankly been scarred by Woodward and the noises over Rice.
 

mikeyt

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It's worked well for him at Ajax because he's had knowledgeable football people making football decisions. We don't have that so I'd be pretty concerned with our current staff despite the lack of Woodward. If we get Ten Hag lets get VDS with him.
 

Pexbo

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Arnold is basically an accountant. His only input will be how much we can afford and how we structure deals. He’s not making decisions around who is right for us, that happens long before he is involved.
 

altodevil

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Arnold is basically an accountant. His only input will be how much we can afford and how we structure deals. He’s not making decisions around who is right for us, that happens long before he is involved.
Do you also think the same of Woodward?
 

Bobcat

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Not so concerned about the transfer commitee, but our scouting network seems incredibly poor really.

When was the last time we discovered a young, unpolished gem? Not talking about 12-15 year olds that go through the academy, buy players in the late teens/early twenties that turn into top players
 

Dolf

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I’ve been asking myself that too.

Who actually pulls the trigger on a transfer?
 

MUW4Eva

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Not so concerned about the transfer commitee, but our scouting network seems incredibly poor really.

When was the last time we discovered a young, unpolished gem? Not talking about 12-15 year olds that go through the academy, buy players in the late teens/early twenties that turn into top players
Does Russo not count, as she came from America, as a 20 year old?

Now she is the best English striker in the country (alongside Dowie perhaps).

So, there is at least one there, that we did well to find and bring to the club.
 

kthanksbye

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No, they're not. We're either going to keep buying one season wonders from lower teams for unjustified transfer fees, or buy fading stars from bigger teams who are looking for a big pay cheque. Anyone else we'll buy will be another Dan James instead of another Vida or Evra or even Chicharito.
 

jeepers

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That's why we need a proper Director of Football. I honestly don't know what Murtough does, or has done. Let's hope Rangnick is allowed to continue in the consultancy role and he gets to guide Murtough and Fletcher properly. The director will be the one who identifies the right players that fit the profiles the manager requires. If we had a director of football, we probably wouldn't have ended up with Maguire and Wan-Bissaka, because Ole would have told the director that he wants to play a high line and a intense pressing game, so the director will get the respective departments to identify and shortlist players according to attributes that fit the style of play the manager wants.
 

Bwuk

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Murtough and his team have done a good job with recruitment at youth level.

Managers can't be signing who they want or we end up in the mess the current squad is in.
 

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It's worked well for him at Ajax because he's had knowledgeable football people making football decisions. We don't have that so I'd be pretty concerned with our current staff despite the lack of Woodward. If we get Ten Hag lets get VDS with him.
Van der Sar has nothing to do with transfer or football policy at Ajax. As CEO, he's purely a business guy. Overmars was the brains behind all of it - except obviously he couldn't be hired now, what with his sexual harrassment scandal and his dismissive attitude to it. (Not that that stopped Antwerp from hiring him, but that episode says a lot about Antwerp really.)
That's why we need a proper Director of Football. I honestly don't know what Murtough does, or has done. Let's hope Rangnick is allowed to continue in the consultancy role and he gets to guide Murtough and Fletcher properly. The director will be the one who identifies the right players that fit the profiles the manager requires. If we had a director of football, we probably wouldn't have ended up with Maguire and Wan-Bissaka, because Ole would have told the director that he wants to play a high line and a intense pressing game, so the director will get the respective departments to identify and shortlist players according to attributes that fit the style of play the manager wants.
Murtough has a strong history moving up through these kinds of roles. He's actually someone United fans should have some confidence in, and the structure looks pretty solid right now. It remains to be proven in practice, of course, but any talk about United missing the right people in key positions currently makes no sense.
I was just thinking that! :lol: Just quote a couple of your existing posts @Adnan, you've written it all several times already. ;)
 

Mainoldo

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As long as it’s the same people we’ve had for the past few years. I wouldn’t mind.

They seem to have a good knowledge base. It’s normally the managers last word that has caused us to have problems.
 

Dr. Dwayne

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Secondly though - how confident are you that our current staff can recruit sensibly? I'm not sold, and quite frankly been scarred by Woodward and the noises over Rice.
I believe there were comments about Arnold saying he would leave football decisions to football people or something like that. So not worried about him playing FM like Woodward.

It's the scouting network that I'm concerned about. They don't seem to be very good yet appear to have been around for ages.
 

limerickcitykid

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I believe there were comments about Arnold saying he would leave football decisions to football people or something like that. So not worried about him playing FM like Woodward.

It's the scouting network that I'm concerned about. They don't seem to be very good yet appear to have been around for ages.
Woodward: “I don't get involved in recruitment like people think I do. There's a myth that I look at YouTube and choose players. I don't. Having an eye for players is an art. I have no interest in doing that.”

Sure it doesn’t matter what Arnold says when people just pick and choose what they want to believe anyway.
 

tomaldinho1

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Ragnick assisting Bout and Murtough will be fine. I think the key is excluding the manager to be honest - we all know why type of players we need, let the transfer committee work on that and the head coach be a coach. No blurred lines.
 

Teja

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I wonder if he'll get sick of posting about our club structure at some point :lol:

We should seriously consider stickying some of his comments at the top and use that as a baseline for discussion rather than rehashing the same arguments and counter arguments over and over.
 
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A modern structure demands that the manager does not choose the signings. We need to be able to replace managers and still have continuity. However, the manager surely should be able to at least pick from the selected players that the club deem will be good transfers.

I’m not a football manager but even as an IT manager, I couldn’t work with new employees without having any input at all into who they are. Well, I mean I could but if someone didn’t work out then that would make me disgruntled.
 

golden_blunder

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That's why we need a proper Director of Football. I honestly don't know what Murtough does, or has done. Let's hope Rangnick is allowed to continue in the consultancy role and he gets to guide Murtough and Fletcher properly. The director will be the one who identifies the right players that fit the profiles the manager requires. If we had a director of football, we probably wouldn't have ended up with Maguire and Wan-Bissaka, because Ole would have told the director that he wants to play a high line and a intense pressing game, so the director will get the respective departments to identify and shortlist players according to attributes that fit the style of play the manager wants.
Why would he coach Fletcher?
 

Abraxas

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Do you also think the same of Woodward?
I don't think Woodward ever influenced transfer choices apart from indirectly when he pulls the plug because negotiations fail and then you have to try Plan B, C and D. It's a stick he's constantly beaten with based on zero evidence and is contradictory to the likelihood that he simply negotiated deals as he's the main suit, and thus his name is across all transfers. Then you get numpties putting 2 and 2 together and getting 5. He probably deserves a beating, but for the right thing! Which is arguably horrendous structuring of deals, dithering and dodgy renewals. The idea he sat in the board room playing football manager with our funds is ludicrously farfetched, he's an accountant!

As for the topic, who knows if they're any good. I don't feel like the current incumbents under this supposedly new structure (Murtough etc) have made enough transfer deals to judge them. They could be great or utter shite. But they're certainly not best in class on paper which is a bit worrying because this is Man Utd. They really should be.
 

jesperjaap

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Not so concerned about the transfer commitee, but our scouting network seems incredibly poor really.

When was the last time we discovered a young, unpolished gem? Not talking about 12-15 year olds that go through the academy, buy players in the late teens/early twenties that turn into top players
Completely agree. I mean with social media etc, its a bit different to days of Fergie and signing players never heard of, as the like sof youtube we are aware if take an interest in many a young talent.

But I totally agree, we simply havent signed anybody under the radar really since Ferguson, certinaly not very good. Only potential ones have been Pellestri, Amad or Hannibal and its far too early to tell.....and we shelled out a fortune comparitively on them.

Apart from that, what have we had in nearly a decade? Rojo? Bailly? Fred? Dalot? James? We spent £140m on them too
 

Adnan

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Club and ten Hag quite happy to not have the manager involved heavily with transfers, with a focus on coaching. This seems fairly sensible in a modern footballing context.

However, that leads on to who will be responsible and are they any good?

Looks to be Murtough and Arnold at the moment. It remains to be seen what influence Rangnick will have in his follow-up consultancy role. There are rumours of us bringing in someone like Paul Mitchell in some capacity. Then we have Fletcher hanging around like a bad smell.

First off - how do you feel about the coach having a far smaller input on recruitment in general? I think in a vacuum it can be a good thing.

Secondly though - how confident are you that our current staff can recruit sensibly? I'm not sold, and quite frankly been scarred by Woodward and the noises over Rice.
You're asking the pertinent questions and I can understood fans being sceptical about the club, when it comes to recruitment. But I think before we pass judgement on our recruitment structure in it's present state, we must delve into the past and attempt to understand the transition from Fergie to Moyes and the structure Moyes inherited when he arrived at the club and the development/evolution of this recruitment structure to the present day.

And it's well documented that Moyes inherited a structure on the football side that was severely lacking when it comes to detail and thoroughness in identifying players. We had one full-time scout (Jim Lawlor) and all the scout reports were stored in his head according to reports, instead of a database, which should've been the normal procedure at any club.

So Moyes attempted to rectify the recruitment issues by bringing in a very competent technical scout, called James Smith and also Moyes attempts to lure John Murtough from his role as the head of Elite performance with the Premier League. Smith arrives pretty quickly but Murtough doesn't arrive at the club until the end of 2013, beginning of 2014. Murtough's role is to restructure the whole setup from the scouting/youth/ data analytics to bring it in-line with the modern game.
Moyes loses his job in April, 2014 and Man City waste no time in poaching James Smith from us. And they (City) could do this to us because we didn't really have a structure on the recruitment side that could make use of multiple scouts and provide those scouts with optimal working conditions for them to excel at their work. Man City, Liverpool, Leicester etc could do this, and hence had better recruitment. And it wasn't because they were doing anything out of the ordinary either.

Murtough carried on with his duties at the club which were independent from the first team and the manager. And he had formed a strategy to develop the club at the youth/structural/data analytics levels, which was beginning to take shape around 2016. We went through the LVG debacle because LVG made a mess of recruitment and was signing players like Rojo because they impressed him in a World Cup semi-final. And those were his words to MUTV after we'd signed Rojo. It was a complete and utter scatter gun approach to recruitment and decisions were being made by LVG on the basis of one game. The failure of the manager being the DoF was in full swing.

The Premier League proven Mourinho arrives, and again tells reporter's (Like LVG) that he's given a list of of targets to the board for them to sign for him. They sign various targets for him in the first few seasons, which include two CBs that are signed on the say so of Mourinho's independent scouts, according to Jason Burt of the Telegraph. Burt went on to say on TV (I posted the link at the time ) that every signing that was made during Mourinho's time at the club was his signing and his signing alone with the aid of his personal recruitment staff.

And in 2017, it was reported that United had completed the restructuring process when it comes to the scouting network, which included the data analytics team. And the following year, in 2018, a transfer committee was created with Marcel Bout, Jim Lawlor and Mick Court given veto power. And they were backed up by 60 full-time scouts, 300 casual scouts and the data analytics team. Which was a huge contrast from the time Moyes arrived at the club and we had a non existent data analytics department and one full-time scout. Below is what Daniel Taylor reported in 2018 about the transfer committee vetoing Mourinho and his targets.

Daniel Taylor: "Manchester United did not follow through with some of José Mourinho’s transfer targets because of misgivings about the players he had identified and a decision, from the top of the club, that he should not be allowed to get his way if it meant potentially wasting tens of millions of pounds on a short-term fix".

"To Mourinho’s intense irritation, United’s conclusion was that in most cases he had targeted defenders who were no better than those they already had and who, in today’s inflated market, could conceivably have cost upwards of £70m without vastly improving the team."

"United believe Van Dijk’s fee will not seem disproportionate within a year but, with the prices currently so inflated, the club do not want to pay similar amounts unless their targets are at a certain level – higher, plainly, than Maguire or Alderweireld."

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...united-veto-jose-mourinho-wishlist-cash-fears

Woodward confirmed the above in a interview with Andy Mitten.

I will return to give my opinion on your questions a little later.
 
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Adnan

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Club and ten Hag quite happy to not have the manager involved heavily with transfers, with a focus on coaching. This seems fairly sensible in a modern footballing context.

However, that leads on to who will be responsible and are they any good?

Looks to be Murtough and Arnold at the moment. It remains to be seen what influence Rangnick will have in his follow-up consultancy role. There are rumours of us bringing in someone like Paul Mitchell in some capacity. Then we have Fletcher hanging around like a bad smell.

First off - how do you feel about the coach having a far smaller input on recruitment in general? I think in a vacuum it can be a good thing.

Secondly though - how confident are you that our current staff can recruit sensibly? I'm not sold, and quite frankly been scarred by Woodward and the noises over Rice.
The below link contains the names of the heads of department and the scouts that will work under John Murtough. This recruitment team will for the first time have the power to direct the football side of the club when it comes to recruitment at first team level.

Murtough (DoF)
Deputy (DoF)?
Mick Court (Head of data analytics)
Marcel Bout (Head of Scouting)
Jim Lawlor (Chief Scout)
Henny de Regt (Head of European scouting)

The strength of a recruitment structure isn't defined by individuality but rather as a collective unit working towards a shared goal. No DoF can be successful if the departments below him aren't functioning at a optimal level. And it's the job of the DoF to bring together the best in class within that structure. And the article below from the guys at TGG who have people from professional football backgrounds on their podcasts/webinars etc, said the below quoted bit in the linked article.

A scouting expert told TGG: "This is a very strong set of scouts and the club clearly means business. It will take a while for them to bed in, but the list is incredibly impressive."

https://trainingground.guru/articles/man-utd-scouts-summoned-for-meeting-after-huge-overhaul

I don't think this is a case of the head coach being sidelined when it comes to recruitment. The head coach will have a input and should have a input, which is normal. But what shouldn't happen like we've seen previously, is that the Manager is allowed to make decisions on the football side, independently from the club's recruitment department. That looks like it's changed now with John Murtough the head of football operations.


Your second question can only be answered by saying 'let's wait and see'. What we do know is that the recruitment team listed in the above article is now going to take control of the club at first team level, which wasn't the case before. And this recruitment team that has been put together by John Murtough over several years, is said to be very impressive as far as the personnel, headhunted to fill those positions are to go by.

And me as a United fan, I can only be upbeat about our prospects in the mid to long-term. Because now the potential to create a streamlined approach to recruitment with a thorough and detailed process in identifying the correct profile of player for the head coach is a real possibility due to the reasons I've already explained.

I've also noticed over the years that some of the pundits on our TV channels in the UK and even our journalists can't seem to look past the manager model and are confused about the DoF model. That then filters down to fans on social media and it causes much confusion.

Take the below quote from Paul Scholes as a example. He's asking for Edwin van der Sar to be DoF in 2020, when he's got no experience working on the football side of the club when it comes to making structural decisions. Now with Overmars gone, it's Gerry Hamstra who is running the football department at Ajax and he was the assistant DoF at the club before the Overmars scandal.


 
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Kingslayer18

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The below link contains the names of the heads of department and the scouts that will work under John Murtough. This recruitment team will for the first time have the power to direct the football side of the club when it comes to recruitment at first team level.

Murtough (DoF)
Deputy (DoF)?
Mick Court (Head of data analytics)
Marcel Bout (Head of Scouting)
Jim Lawlor (Chief Scout)
Henny de Regt (Head of European scouting)

The strength of a recruitment structure isn't defined by individuality but rather as a collective unit working towards a shared goal. No DoF can be successful if the departments below him aren't functioning at a optimal level. And it's the job of the DoF to bring together the best in class within that structure. And the article below from the guys at TGG who have people from professional football backgrounds on their podcasts/webinars etc, said the below quoted bit in the linked article.

A scouting expert told TGG: "This is a very strong set of scouts and the club clearly means business. It will take a while for them to bed in, but the list is incredibly impressive."

https://trainingground.guru/articles/man-utd-scouts-summoned-for-meeting-after-huge-overhaul

I don't think this is a case of the head coach being sidelined when it comes to recruitment. The head coach will have a input and should have a input, which is normal. But what shouldn't happen like we've seen previously, is that the Manager is allowed to make decisions on the football side, independently from the club's recruitment department. That looks like it's changed now with John Murtough the head of football operations.


Your second question can only be answered by saying 'let's wait and see'. What we do know is that the recruitment team listed in the above article is now going to take control of the club at first team level, which wasn't the case before. And this recruitment team that has been put together by John Murtough over several years, is said to be very impressive as far as the personnel, headhunted to fill those positions are to go by.

And me as a United fan, I can only be upbeat about our prospects in the mid to long-term. Because now the potential to create a streamlined approach to recruitment with a thorough and detailed process in identifying the correct profile of player for the head coach is a real possibility due to the reasons I've already explained.

I've also noticed over the years that some of the pundits on our TV channels in the UK and even our journalists can't seem to look past the manager model and are confused about the DoF model. That then filters down to fans on social media and it causes much confusion.

Take the below quote from Paul Scholes as a example. He's asking for Edwin van der Sar to be DoF in 2020, when he's got no experience working on the football side of the club when it comes to making structural decisions. Now with Overmars gone, it's Gerry Hamstra who is running the football department at Ajax and he was the assistant DoF at the club before the Overmars scandal.






Great response and overview @Adnan! It does seem encouraging from a structure point of view and we can only hope that this means our recruitment is going to meaningfully improve moving forward. However, do you not believe that our structure is slightly convoluted now, with the hundreds of independent scouts all reporting to Marcel Bout. What I mean is that due to our large bottom structure, we are not able to act and respond quickly, to not only highlight but secure targets. Look at the difference in how Man City, Chelsea or Liverpool act when identifying and securing targets. This has been mentioned before by other reports but sometimes the list of targets sent by scouts gets missed. As an example, apparently one of our scouts recommended Alphonso Davies as a potential target but the club were either too late to follow up or missed his report.

Also, due to the club not having an overall football philosophy, do our scouts know the right kind of profile to be looking for? As a result, we only look at specific requests from whoever the manager is.
 
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I don’t think the transfer committee and veto system is that terrible an idea, but there are a few gaping issues with it.
The overhaul needed is first off to identify how Manchester United rather then the current incumbent in the managerial seat wants to play football.
Once that is decided, only then should we appoint a manager that suits. The manager should clearly then have input into exactly what kind of players and more importantly attributes are required for the system to work.

If we don’t sort all that out first, we’ll likely be in a mess again unless we luckily strike gold.
 

Adnan

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I don't believe all the scouts are reporting to Bout, mate. So for example if the scout reports are emanating from France, then the scouts will report to their head of department, which is Henny de Regt in Europe. And it'll be de Regt who will touch base with Bout who is the Head of Scouting. Bout becomes active with the lead scout in France or elsewhere only when the interest gets to a very advanced stage and the lead scout and de Regt have given their approval. Marcel Bout then runs the final rule on said targets and if impressed selects the targets and whittles them down before sending them to Mick Court and the data analysis team. Then Mick Court and the data team whittle the targets down further and Bout, Lawlor and Court then decide on the short list which is passed on to John Murtough to act upon.

I think we move pretty quickly at youth level, and according to Laurie Whitwell (Athletic) Murtough made swift moves to beat out the competition when signing Hannibal Mejbri and flew the player out with him to watch United's preseason friendly game in Norway in 2019, which beat out the competition. But he couldn't do that at first team level because unlike the youth side of the club where he was the Sporting head. The manager was the Head of sport at first team level and had his own recruitment staff.

And I'm now hopeful that with Murtough as the head of football operations, we'll move quicker. And that couldn't happen under Solskjaer because the recruitment department wasn't setting the directive but the manager and his personal recruitment team, which included Simon Wells and Mike Phelan. Our recruitment team were just there to veto, and even those vetoes were unsuccessful at times as the report from Daniel Taylor confirms.

And your final point is a good one, which I've touched upon before. The best way to utilise a scouting network is to recruit towards a guiding principle, which is either set by the DoF or the head coach, like we've seen at Liverpool. So I'm hoping we come to a decision quickly on who to hire and I wouldn't be surprised if we've already done that.

@Kingslayer18
 
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kthanksbye

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Let's look at all the players we've signed sine SAF left.


GK Valdes Romero Grant
CB Rojo Blind Bailly Lindelof Maguire Varane
FB Shaw Darmian Dalot Awb
CM Fellaini Herrera Schneiderlin Schweinsteiger Pogba Matic Fred
AM Mata Mikhitaryan Bruno VdB
WF ADM Memphis Alexis James Amad Sancho Diallo Pellestri
ST Falcao Martial Zlatan Lukaku Ronaldo

Tells you all there is to know really.
 

alexanderplatz

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You're asking the pertinent questions and I can understood fans being sceptical about the club, when it comes to recruitment. But I think before we pass judgement on our recruitment structure in it's present state, we must delve into the past and attempt to understand the transition from Fergie to Moyes and the structure Moyes inherited when he arrived at the club and the development/evolution of this recruitment structure to the present day.

And it's well documented that Moyes inherited a structure on the football side that was severely lacking when it comes to detail and thoroughness in identifying players. We had one full-time scout (Jim Lawlor) and all the scout reports were stored in his head according to reports, instead of a database, which should've been the normal procedure at any club.

So Moyes attempted to rectify the recruitment issues by bringing in a very competent technical scout, called James Smith and also Moyes attempts to lure John Murtough from his role as the head of Elite performance with the Premier League. Smith arrives pretty quickly but Murtough doesn't arrive at the club until the end of 2013, beginning of 2014. Murtough's role is to restructure the whole setup from the scouting/youth/ data analytics to bring it in-line with the modern game.
Moyes loses his job in April, 2014 and Man City waste no time in poaching James Smith from us. And they (City) could do this to us because we didn't really have a structure on the recruitment side that could make use of multiple scouts and provide those scouts with optimal working conditions for them to excel at their work. Man City, Liverpool, Leicester etc could do this, and hence had better recruitment. And it wasn't because they were doing anything out of the ordinary either.

Murtough carried on with his duties at the club which were independent from the first team and the manager. And he had formed a strategy to develop the club at youth/structural/data analytics levels, which was beginning to take shape around 2016. We went through the LVG debacle because LVG made a mess of recruitment and was signing players like Rojo because they impressed him in a World Cup semi-final. And those were his words to MUTV after we'd signed Rojo. It was a complete and utter scatter gun approach to recruitment and decisions were being made by LVG on the basis of one game. The failure of the manager being the DoF was in full swing.

The Premier League proven Mourinho arrives, and again tells reporter's (Like LVG) that he's given a list of of targets to the board for them to sign for him. They sign various targets for him in the first few seasons, which include two CBs that are signed on the say so of Mourinho's independent scouts, according to Jason Burt of the Telegraph. Burt went on to say on TV (I posted the link at the time ) that every signing that was made during Mourinho's time at the club was his signing and his signing alone with the aid of his personal recruitment staff.

And in 2017, it was reported that United had completed the restructuring process when it comes to the scouting network, which included the data analytics team. And the following year, in 2018, a transfer committee was created with Marcel Bout, Jim Lawlor and Mick Court given veto power. And they were backed up by 60 full-time scouts, 300 casual scouts and the data analytics team. Which was a huge contrast from the time Moyes arrived at the club and we had a non existent data analytics department and one full-time scout. Below is what Daniel Taylor reported in 2018 about the transfer committee vetoing Mourinho and his targets.

Daniel Taylor: "Manchester United did not follow through with some of José Mourinho’s transfer targets because of misgivings about the players he had identified and a decision, from the top of the club, that he should not be allowed to get his way if it meant potentially wasting tens of millions of pounds on a short-term fix".

"To Mourinho’s intense irritation, United’s conclusion was that in most cases he had targeted defenders who were no better than those they already had and who, in today’s inflated market, could conceivably have cost upwards of £70m without vastly improving the team."

"United believe Van Dijk’s fee will not seem disproportionate within a year but, with the prices currently so inflated, the club do not want to pay similar amounts unless their targets are at a certain level – higher, plainly, than Maguire or Alderweireld."

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...united-veto-jose-mourinho-wishlist-cash-fears

Woodward confirmed the above in a interview with Andy Mitten.

I will return to give my opinion on your questions a little later.
using one of my posts to just say fantastic post there. Great insights and def makes me think better of Moyes in particular
 
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Andycoleno9

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Outside PL it is perfectly normal that manager is not the one who has complete freedom about transfer. We all saw with Ole what happens when you give big freedom to manager regarding squad. When he leaves, you have a mess.
Based in what i know and what i have read about this topic, most clubs work like this; manager says what position(s) he needs, DoF with help of scouts makes shortlist with names and gives that shortlist to manager. Then manager has final say about those players.

And that is the right way.
CEO/owner gives transfer budget to DoF.
DoF gives orders to scouts to find specific players.
Manager gives wish list to DoF.
DoF gives shortlist to manager.
 

Xaviboy

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I think the manager has to have a say in what players he wants in. I'm hoping Ten Haag if he is the going to be new manager will ensure the player meets the criteria to play his system/style of football. Linking closely with recruitment team to have players on shortlist and he wants.



If its going to be possession type football then recruiting players that are comfortable on the ball and can keep it under pressure is what is needed.

You can see Klopp and Pep have say on the players they want.

Last couple of transfer windows Klopp has got in 2 players who have the attributes to play in his front line with Jota and Diaz and both fit in well.

Pep has type of player he wants the recruitment team go and get that player.

Our recruitment team or who ever looked after transfers go for well he will sell this many jerseys. Load if crap, hasn't worked and spent well over the odds on average players.

Need to be recruiting players that fit system. Ten Hag comes in will he want Declan Rice for 100 million plus as he seems to be the next best thing in English football and all hype that surrounds him or will he want someone he knows can play that role and do the job better.
 

Andycoleno9

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Let's look at all the players we've signed sine SAF left.


GK Valdes Romero Grant
CB Rojo Blind Bailly Lindelof Maguire Varane
FB Shaw Darmian Dalot Awb
CM Fellaini Herrera Schneiderlin Schweinsteiger Pogba Matic Fred
AM Mata Mikhitaryan Bruno VdB
WF ADM Memphis Alexis James Amad Sancho Diallo Pellestri
ST Falcao Martial Zlatan Lukaku Ronaldo

Tells you all there is to know really.
Lets be honest here; it is easy to be smart now in hindsight but most of those players looked like good and logical signings when we were buying them. For most of them, we fans, were delighted when we signed them and lots of them were among best on their positions at that moment.
Who here was not delighted when we bought Pogba, Falcao, Zlatan, Lukaku, Varane, Bruno, Alexis, Sancho, Mikhi?
Who here was not impressed with Bailly, AWB, Depay, Martial, Matic after first few months?

Lots of those players failed but they were good signings at that moment.
 

Adnan

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Who do you think decides that the club should renew Bruno's contract @Adnan? Murtough?
I'm not sure about that, but if I was to make a calculated guess, then I'd say the talks regarding Bruno's renewal were on-going during Solskjaer's tenure and they've been allowed to carry on with Murtough's blessing.

And I say that because eventhough Murtough and his team were reported to have given the Fernandes signing the thumbs down, his experience in the team might be needed with us potentially losing a number of players. And there's possibly hope, that maybe a new head coach can curtail his wastefulness and make him more effective in the build up phase.
 

Pexbo

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I'm not sure about that, but if I was to make a calculated guess, then I'd say the talks regarding Bruno's renewal were on-going during Solskjaer's tenure and they've been allowed to carry on with Murtough's blessing.

And I say that because eventhough Murtough and his team were reported to have given the Fernandes signing the thumbs down, his experience in the team might be needed with us potentially losing a number of players. And there's possibly hope, that maybe a new head coach can curtail his wastefulness and make him more effective in the build up phase.
Source?
 

KiD MoYeS

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The Glazer mob sanction everything and anything. But what is worrying is that someone in the club presented £130m for Maguire and Wan-Bissaka as good business, unless it was Ole.
 

Adnan

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"Manchester United were quickly dissuaded from pursuing Bruno Fernandes after it emerged the Portugal international gives the ball away too often".

"The Old Trafford side had been strongly linked with a move for the midfielder"

"But it has now emerged that scouts decided against the signing this summer"

"Fernandes' risk-taking may not have fit in with the club's renewed style of play"

"United are soon expected to refocus their attempts to recruit another midfielder"

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/f...-Fernandes-signing-midfielder-took-risks.html
 
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Andycoleno9

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The Glazer mob sanction everything and anything. But what is worrying is that someone in the club presented £130m for Maguire and Wan-Bissaka as good business, unless it was Ole.
Ole and Ed were only two people in club back then who were in charge for football business