Film Star Wars Episode IX The Rise of Skywalker [Theories]

[B20]

I thought this was the best of the three. As with the others, it was too long, too furiously paced, too many side treks, "plot developments" that made no real sense and character paths I failed to be invested in.

But, despite the many gimmicky call backs to the old movies, I felt like the main story of kylo and rey was a genuinely good and well told one. Told a new story whilst being very much a star wars saga. I wished they'd trimmed the fat around this saga to make a more focused and better paced piece. But this arch itself made the movie worthwhile.

 

[stepic]

i went in with low expectations and they were met. what a shitshow. bringing back Palpatine has to be probably the worst decision of all, basically ruining the whole concept of vader being the one to bring balance to the force which is essentially the whole point of the movies up until now. the redemption of rylo, trying to turn rey to the darkside, all the exact same bloody storyline. to hell with creativity. abrams is an idiot.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

Chewies reaction was probably the best bit of the entire film.
Lukes force ghost raising the xwing made me laugh, it's just another example of JJ doing what he likes and making the whole story a joke.
The fleet turning up was expected but a genuine cringe moment. They'd written themselves into a hole and decided to have the entire Galaxy show up to help.

I'll give it another watch in a few months but i'm a star wars fanboi, enjoyed parts of Last Jedi (I liked some of the story but the film made some bad errors), I actually found this film funny and not in a good way.

I still can't understand why getting the galaxy to show up wasn't the B plot. Seriously; out of nowhere Nostalgic Character #4 appears with everyone whilst Finn did bugger all. Bull.

 

[RedSky]

I still can't understand why getting the galaxy to show up wasn't the B plot. Seriously; out of nowhere Nostalgic Character #4 appears with everyone whilst Finn did bugger all. Bull.

It was just, urgh. Made even worse by the Emperor then somehow disabling the entire fleet with his hands.

Awful, awful shit.

 

[stepic]

where exactly has the new republic been the entire sequel trilogy? in TFA it's Leia who sets up the resistence or whatever and then it's just about them the whole time. the republic won the bloody war and they're just ignored, almost as if abrams wanted to replicate the OT in having a small resistance against the might of the first order. pathetic.

 

[Volumiza]

I felt like the main story of kylo and rey was a genuinely good and well told one. Told a new story whilst being very much a star wars saga.

Yeah, two good characters that fit in well with the rest of the series.

They should have done this ...

I wished they'd trimmed the fat around this saga to make a more focused and better paced piece.

And done this ...

I still can't understand why getting the galaxy to show up wasn't the B plot.

That would have been a logical and much better B plot.

 

[RedSky]

where exactly has the new republic been the entire sequel trilogy? in TFA it's Leia who sets up the resistence or whatever and then it's just about them the whole time. the republic won the bloody war and they're just ignored, almost as if abrams wanted to replicate the OT in having a small resistance against the might of the first order. pathetic.

In TFA, they use Death Star 8 on the new republic planets, appartently according to cannon it took out most of the new republic fleet along with the planets. They basically ended the new republic in one assault. Which is a bit weird as that means all of them were just at home chilling when the reality is a fleet and new order like that would have ships all over the Galaxy trying to keep the peace. *shrugs*

The writers really did a horrible job with each film in hindsight, the 'story' was awful.

 

[stepic]

In TFA, they use Death Star 8 on the new republic planets, appartently according to cannon it took out most of the new republic fleet along with the planets. They basically ended the new republic in one assault. Which is a bit weird as that means all of them were just at home chilling when the reality is a fleet and new order like that would have ships all over the Galaxy trying to keep the peace. *shrugs*

The writers really did a horrible job with each film in hindsight, the 'story' was awful.

eh. so basically: you win the war, then within 20 years you a) don't realise those who you just defeated have re-armed completely with even more sophisticated tech and b) are consequently wiped out completely in one assault. hmm. stupid writing just in order to recreate the same 'feel' (small band of good guys against the might of the bad guys) of the OT, basically. what a waste of time.

 

[GBBQ]

I listened to Anthony Daniel's audio book (I Am C3P0) over the last week and he was full of praise for Abrams. He was fairly enthusiastic about the new trilogy, including TROS, compared to being catty about George Lucas and his treatment during the original trilogy. So I guess Abrams went into this with the best of intentions but there was either too much studio interference, he's not up to making the movies or there just isn't a good story to be told after Return of the Jedi

 

[Reiver]

Fanboy?

I agree with everything in your post except you being a fanboi, if you don’t remember disapperaing bodies in Star Wars, you aint no fanboy.

I remember disappearing bodies, it was more how/why Leia and Ben's bodies disappeared. The parameters for this occurring have obviously changed over the years but, whatever they currently are, I wouldn't have expected either Leia or Ben to have met them. I felt their bodies disappearing muddied this subject even more, if that's possible.

 

[Reiver]

And Obi Wan in the very first movie. @Reiver are you sure you're a fanboy?

The disappearing bodies upon death was retconned to have happened to Obi Wan and Yoda due to the training they received from Qui Gon. It seemed to be linked to having the knowledge gained to be able to retain your consciousness upon death and not simply becoming part of the wider force. There have been discrepancies in this and, since Disney took over the franchise, I dont know if there has been other explanations offered.
Either way, the body disappearing seems to be linked to the deceased having a particular knowledge of the Force, which I doubted either Leia or Ben would have. Then again they might. Also there was a time delay in Leia's body disappearing which just adds to the whole WTF moment for me.

 

[sullydnl]

1) Of course Ben Shapiro is a big Star Wars nerd. That really should have been immediately apparent to me. He's like a living caricature of the worst, most disparaging visage of what an internet nerd is.

2) Of course TROS is his favourite of the three Disney film.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

Always enjoy this guy's videos.

 

[Sylar]

The movie was more fun to watch than TLJ. I kinda understand what RJ wanted to do, but it was a mistake after TFA. You cant follow up TFA with TLJ. It just cant be done when you are doing a trilogy. With Luke being introduced at the end of ep7, and Leia and Han (though being killed) and pretty much being a continuance of ep6, it just seemed random (and needed to be its own start not a sequel)

TROS was fun although pretty much rushed / crammed. But still fun to watch. The ending parts were just a bit OTT (the kiss, Reys second name).
Thankfully nothing was as bad as flying Mary Poppins Skywalker.

 

[ChaddyP]

Watched it yesterday and wished i didnt. Felt like i was watching fast and furious 9 and not an actual star wars show. I think they should just scrap this entire trilogy and remove it from being canon.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

The more time thats elapsed from me watching this, and the more I've read and heard about it since, the less that I want to go back and watch it.

It's such a mess... and seems so hell-bent in undoing what was done in TLJ to make its movie... when it could have used what was done in TLJ to make basically the same bloody movie.

 

[padr81]

The more time thats elapsed from me watching this, and the more I've read and heard about it since, the less that I want to go back and watch it.

It's such a mess... and seems so hell-bent in undoing what was done in TLJ to make its movie... when it could have used what was done in TLJ to make basically the same bloody movie.

Not really, the last jedi killed off every plot thread that the first movie set up. Big villain dead, Luke Skywalker gone. The only threads it left were will Rey/Kylo turn. RoS is a poor movie but it could never be anything but given the fact it was the 3rd part of a trilogy with nothing to play for. Series bad guy gone, the rebels all exploded so admiral suicide could suicide to bring an explosive end to the worst plan of all time. There was nothing left after TLJ.

I've seen people saying he could have used what was done in TLJ to make the same movie what I'd like to know is how? There was nothing left when it was over.

Its a trilogy of...

7 - JJ tries to remake Ep4 pretty badly but its kinda watchable.
8 - RJ decides feck star wars and feck JJ "i'm gonna shock all the fans because I wanna be a greater writer at subverting expectations than D&D." "im also going to destroy JJ original plot because I'm too cool to make a real Star Wars movie. Oh and feck whoever makes Ep9 because I'm gonna leave him with no plot other than anyone can be a jedi."
9 - JJ makes an entire movie trying to win the same fans over whilst throwing sly digs at RJ's movie making a movie thats almost equally as bad.

The entire thing seems like 2 famous directors trying to undermine each other whilst both are taking a dump on a series thats been trash since 1980 anyway.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

Not really, the last jedi killed off every plot thread that the first movie set up. Big villain dead, Luke Skywalker gone. The only threads it left were will Rey/Kylo turn. RoS is a poor movie but it could never be anything but given the fact it was the 3rd part of a trilogy with nothing to play for. Series bad guy gone, the rebels all exploded so admiral suicide could suicide to bring an explosive end to the worst plan of all time. There was nothing left after TLJ.

I've seen people saying he could have used what was done in TLJ to make the same movie what I'd like to know is how? There was nothing left when it was over.

Its a trilogy of...

7 - JJ tries to remake Ep4 pretty badly but its kinda watchable.
8 - RJ decides feck star wars and feck JJ "i'm gonna shock all the fans because I wanna be a greater writer at subverting expectations than D&D." "im also going to destroy JJ original plot because I'm too cool to make a real Star Wars movie. Oh and feck whoever makes Ep9 because I'm gonna leave him with no plot other than anyone can be a jedi."
9 - JJ makes an entire movie trying to win the same fans over whilst throwing sly digs at RJ's movie making a movie thats almost equally as bad.

The entire thing seems like 2 famous directors trying to undermine each other whilst both are taking a dump on a series thats been trash since 1980 anyway.

Well one example straight away the - the whole end of TLJ was that Luke's death would spark the galaxy to rise up... thats then completely dropped (even though the film requires the Galaxy to rise up) and instead they just random get Lando and Chewbacca to go drum up some support.

 

[Gehrman]

Personally i think rey and kylo should have had a 15 min sex scene.

 

[sullydnl]

The particular idea that TLJ had screwed things up by killing Snoke and leaving no ultimate series villain is really bizzare to me. Kylo Ren was left as the series villain. A somewhat sympathetic and flawed villain who could ultimately be redeemed, sure, but that's a fairly common trope in fiction villainy. The notion that the big bad absolutely has to be some all-powerful and irredeemable force of pure evil is really weird, as if people have never seen a villain arc other than those of previous Star Wars films.

 

[Redlambs]

The particular idea that TLJ had screwed things up by killing Snoke and leaving no ultimate series villain is really bizzare to me. Kylo Ren was left as the series villain. A somewhat sympathetic and flawed villain who could ultimately be redeemed, sure, but that's a fairly common trope in fiction villainy. The notion that the big bad absolutely has to be some all-powerful and irredeemable force of pure evil is really weird, as if people have never seen a villain arc other than those of previous Star Wars films.

Yeah, except SW has always had the rule of two so it makes complete sense in the universe.

 

[caid]

The particular idea that TLJ had screwed things up by killing Snoke and leaving no ultimate series villain is really bizzare to me. Kylo Ren was left as the series villain. A somewhat sympathetic and flawed villain who could ultimately be redeemed, sure, but that's a fairly common trope in fiction villainy. The notion that the big bad absolutely has to be some all-powerful and irredeemable force of pure evil is really weird, as if people have never seen a villain arc other than those of previous Star Wars films.

I dont get why they redeemed Kylo Ren tbh. I thought they made a fairly good point of saying this guy cant be redeemed in the first 2 films. Agree with your point besides that. I think its a bullshit point in general, you dont need 4 hours of set up to tell a good story or to make a functional movie.

Yeah, except SW has always had the rule of two so it makes complete sense in the universe.

Palpatine had no student between Maul dieing and Dooku being recruited, Dooku trained a few sith. Its not a requirement for a star wars story or anything even vaguely close to it.

 

[Bobski]

They should have never bothered with Snoke, Palpatine or any other cartoonish villian. Pretty much the only watchable parts of the last 2 films were the times when they explored the Rey/Kylo dynamic, a bit more depth there, play with the expectations of how those characters were expected to develop and they might have had something.

 

[sullydnl]

Yeah, except SW has always had the rule of two so it makes complete sense in the universe.

A character within the Star Wars universe invented that rule. Other characters (and more importantly, any Star Wars writers) can keep or ditch the rule as they please. It's not like there physically has to be two bad guys as per in-universe rules.

I dont get why they redeemed Kylo Ren tbh. I thought they made a fairly good point of saying this guy cant be redeemed in the first 2 films. Agree with your point besides that. I think its a bullshit point in general, you dont need 4 hours of set up to tell a good story or to make a functional movie.


Palpatine had no student between Maul dieing and Dooku being recruited, Dooku trained a few sith. Its not a requirement for a star wars story or anything even vaguely close to it.

Yep. If they're happy to set up the Emperor randomly coming back to life in the opening scroll then they could equally set up pretty much any other story they wanted to tell too. They just decided to go down a route that allowed them to feed off nostalgia and fan service as that was broadly what they wanted their particular SW film to provide. Which is perfectly fine as it's their film and they can do whatever they like with it. They weren't forced down that road against their will though.

 

[Ubik]

The dead speak!

 

[Sylar]

Thing is with this star wars it was expected to be a continuation of the original trilogy and the first movie set up it's gonna be more Skywalker's , solo etc

Not sure why the second movie happened the way it did as it just felt out of place in this trilogy given the way the first movie went

 

[stepic]

Thing is with this star wars it was expected to be a continuation of the original trilogy and the first movie set up it's gonna be more Skywalker's , solo etc

Not sure why the second movie happened the way it did as it just felt out of place in this trilogy given the way the first movie went

different director is what happened and no overarching storyline to link the trilogy as a whole. Which is frankly absurd.

 

[stepic]

The dead speak!

war!

 

[Zen86]

The entire thing seems like 2 famous directors trying to undermine each other whilst both are taking a dump on a series thats been trash since 1980 anyway.

That made me chuckle

 

[Sylar]

different director is what happened and no overarching storyline to link the trilogy as a whole. Which is frankly absurd.

I get that but it's the whole free reign the different directors got. It just didn't make sense at all for a billion dollar company in charge

Although I still think the prequels were the biggest F up given it was basically a story about how the chosen one became Vader.

 

[DixieDean]

Saw it again. Like it now, and best of the new trilogy.

Spoiler

I actually like the force heal stuff now. Ben successfully achieved the power his grandfather seeked and had turned him to the dark side. Rey and Ben managed to successfully use it because, of course, it's a light side power.

Although I still have problems with the opening crawl and "Emperor Palpatine is alive somehow". Look; either have the first fifteen minutes be the end of the second movie with the big reveal, or explain it. Don't be lazy and hope some writer in the future does a spin off book.

I liked that part of the story too.

 

[Art Vandelay]

The disappearing bodies upon death was retconned to have happened to Obi Wan and Yoda due to the training they received from Qui Gon. It seemed to be linked to having the knowledge gained to be able to retain your consciousness upon death and not simply becoming part of the wider force. There have been discrepancies in this and, since Disney took over the franchise, I dont know if there has been other explanations offered.
Either way, the body disappearing seems to be linked to the deceased having a particular knowledge of the Force, which I doubted either Leia or Ben would have. Then again they might. Also there was a time delay in Leia's body disappearing which just adds to the whole WTF moment for me.

That retcon never worked given that Qui Gon himself didn't disappear when he's supposed to be the one that discovered how to become a Force ghost. It all got a bit stupid, but the prequels caused a lot of issues like that.

 

[Simbo]

Personally i think rey and kylo should have had a 15 min sex scene.

Damn, if they got together earlier they could have force sexed eachother from accross the galaxy

 

[SoCross]

I walked out of the theatre around the point when Kylo threw away his lightsaber. Horrendous movie.

 

[Drifter]

Congrats
‘Star Wars: Rise Of Skywalker’ Is The First $1 Billion Disappointment

 

[padr81]

Congrats
‘Star Wars: Rise Of Skywalker’ Is The First $1 Billion Disappointment

TLJ?

 

[ChaddyP]

Why did they hire two different directors for a trilogy?

 

[Ubik]

Why did they hire two different directors for a trilogy?

Well the originals had 3, so that wasn't the problem.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

Is the problem a production one or higher management? I can't see Kennedy going into this trilogy without making sure everyone knew what they were moving towards. I mean ffs she's been producing movies since the 80s. Is working for Disney the problem? They can make hit after hit but a story split into three parts isn't their specialism? Is Disney secretly run by a illuminati style group of killer bees?

 

[Sylar]

Is the problem a production one or higher management? I can't see Kennedy going into this trilogy without making sure everyone knew what they were moving towards. I mean ffs she's been producing movies since the 80s. Is working for Disney the problem? They can make hit after hit but a story split into three parts isn't their specialism? Is Disney secretly run by a illuminati style group of killer bees?

Maybe she put somebody else in charge and the third director said he could work with rians stuff

Would be interesting to know and even watch a behind the scenes stuff on this

I mean it made a lot of money but arguably could have made even more than it should have