Steve Bruce leaves Newcastle

visiting villain

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I'd feel very differently about this news if Bruce hadn't been manager of my club
 

Loon

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When he talked about all the grief he received, even from within his family, and that it will likely be his last management job, I couldn't help but feel sorry for our first in my lifetime title-winning United captain.
 

Maluco

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Rafa had more than 70m to spend, he sold 4 decent players and earned a more money on selling other players. He also spent over 140+ million on nearly 30 players. He could have spent that money better but he didn't, he spent 4 and 5 million on loads of shit championship level players.

Bruce inherited that squad, spent less than 100 million on 6 players. He couldn't earn any money selling players because the ones Benitez left behind weren't worth anything. That is why his net spend is higher.

I have no problem with a club wanting a better manager. But Newcastle never had more. Benitez is hailed as some kind of hero miracle worker whereas Bruce is hated. Even though he has done the same job, earned the same points and kept Newcastle in the same league.
Like I said, every single piece of underlying data suggested they were on the up with Rafa. Shots and tackles were something like 4th in the league overall. He was putting things together and he had the CV to suggest he could do just that.

And again, being forced to sell his best players isn’t a point against him. He did what he had to do to stay competitive and a clear look at the data suggests they were. You can’t use a negative net spend as a point against him.

Bruces numbers are horrible and they are dead last for a number of key stats in the whole league. He also didn’t have a CV to suggest he had a way forward or a plan to turn it round.

Newcastle fans weren’t wrong to back the CL winner over Steve Bruce and they have every right to believe they would be in safer hands with the former. The stats and his pedigree would have been argument enough.
 

Charlie Foley

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Like I said, every single piece of underlying data suggested they were on the up with Rafa. Shots and tackles were something like 4th in the league overall. He was putting things together and he had the CV to suggest he could do just that.

And again, being forced to sell his best players isn’t a point against him. He did what he had to do to stay competitive and a clear look at the data suggests they were. You can’t use a negative net spend as a point against him.

Bruces numbers are horrible and they are dead last for a number of key stats in the whole league. He also didn’t have a CV to suggest he had a way forward or a plan to turn it round.

Newcastle fans weren’t wrong to back the CL winner over Steve Bruce and they have every right to believe they would be in safer hands with the former. The stats and his pedigree would have been argument enough.
I would be really interested in seeing that data if you can put your hands on it please! I was really shocked to see this table below
though more specific stats could show more I guess.
 

Oranges038

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Like I said, every single piece of underlying data suggested they were on the up with Rafa. Shots and tackles were something like 4th in the league overall. He was putting things together and he had the CV to suggest he could do just that.

And again, being forced to sell his best players isn’t a point against him. He did what he had to do to stay competitive and a clear look at the data suggests they were. You can’t use a negative net spend as a point against him.

Bruces numbers are horrible and they are dead last for a number of key stats in the whole league. He also didn’t have a CV to suggest he had a way forward or a plan to turn it round.

Newcastle fans weren’t wrong to back the CL winner over Steve Bruce and they have every right to believe they would be in safer hands with the former. The stats and his pedigree would have been argument enough.
Nope.

He took them from 10th to 13th and left.

Bruce took them from 13th to 12th. That's progress.

They both play shite football, there's not much difference there, they both finished with the same amount of points. The only difference to Newcastle fans is that Bruce managed Sunderland and he was hated before he even took the job. Unless he won the league, it didn't matter what he did, they'd still have hated him and want him gone.
 

Cascarino

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Nope.

He took them from 10th to 13th and left.

Bruce took them from 13th to 12th. That's progress.

They both play shite football, there's not much difference there, they both finished with the same amount of points. The only difference to Newcastle fans is that Bruce managed Sunderland and he was hated before he even took the job. Unless he won the league, it didn't matter what he did, they'd still have hated him and want him gone.
He took over late into the season they got relegated (he took over while they were in the relegation spots, did pretty well too but wasn't enough to keep them up). He then took them straight back up despite losing some big players, and in his two seasons after promotion finished 10th and 13th, which is impressive and a little different to how you portray it.
 

SirMattlives

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Wonder if any of the touted replacements would ever say ‘no thanks, not for those owners’…….thought not.
 

TwoSheds

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Maybe he could be our set piece coach, might actually be able to go a whole game without conceding one!
 

Cascarino

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Do people even find this funny when you consider the shit he and and his family have gone through with the personal abuse?

Or because they are millionaires it’s ok is it?

Yours sincerely

Karen
I think Bruce is a decent bloke, who deserves more respect than he got from the media.
That picture though? I find very funny
 

Oranges038

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He took over late into the season they got relegated (he took over while they were in the relegation spots, did pretty well too but wasn't enough to keep them up). He then took them straight back up despite losing some big players, and in his two seasons after promotion finished 10th and 13th, which is impressive and a little different to how you portray it.
Maybe so. But I'm just pointing this idea that he was doing a great job and they were progressing is nonsense. Had he stayed, he would have had to spend as Bruce had to because there was no one to sell to make money, mainly because he filled the place with championship players.

But they wouldn't be much further up than they are. Probably because instead of adding a few quality players like Bruce tried to do, he would have gone out in true Rafa fashion and signed another 30 mediocre players.
 

the_box

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Maybe so. But I'm just pointing this idea that he was doing a great job and they were progressing is nonsense. Had he stayed, he would have had to spend as Bruce had to because there was no one to sell to make money, mainly because he filled the place with championship players.

But they wouldn't be much further up than they are. Probably because instead of adding a few quality players like Bruce tried to do, he would have gone out in true Rafa fashion and signed another 30 mediocre players.
Where are you even getting 30 from? I only see 21. Are you counting loans? If you're trying to make a point about him saddling Bruce with permanently signed players he can't shift, I wouldn't include loans. Are you maybe double counting loans that became permanent?

2016-17 : 10 https://www.transfermarkt.us/newcas...762/plus/?saison_id=2016&pos=&detailpos=&w_s=
2017-18 : 5 https://www.transfermarkt.us/newcas...762/plus/?saison_id=2017&pos=&detailpos=&w_s=
2018-19 : 6 https://www.transfermarkt.us/newcas...762/plus/?saison_id=2018&pos=&detailpos=&w_s=

21 over 3 seasons, including a season with a retooling for the championship after losing most of the quality in the squad, and then shedding some of those players and replacing them once we came back up, is not an insane number. 30, even if it was true, wouldn't be an insane number in that scenario either. Why are you obsessed with thinking it's some kind of smoking gun?
 

Lay

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I hope he does retire. Think the job took a lot out of him.
 

Cascarino

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Maybe so. But I'm just pointing this idea that he was doing a great job and they were progressing is nonsense. Had he stayed, he would have had to spend as Bruce had to because there was no one to sell to make money, mainly because he filled the place with championship players.

But they wouldn't be much further up than they are. Probably because instead of adding a few quality players like Bruce tried to do, he would have gone out in true Rafa fashion and signed another 30 mediocre players.

I think regarding the 30 mediocre players, I'm kind of on the fence. You're right that a lot of players were brought in who don't really add any quality, but it was tricky due to the relegation, the calibre of player willing to join is gonna trend towards the lower side, and Newcastle needed a lot of replacements quickly to replace the exodus of their better players after relegation. This makes it hard to judge some of the transfers, the money they paid for Gayle wasn't particularly well spent for example, but I imagine he was purchased mainly to get them out of the championship quickly, in which he played a big part. Even after promotion when you're limited to £10m or under it's hard to get in real quality on a consistent basis. Even with those restrictions there have been some very good signings. Some misses, and a couple very bad decisions (Ivan Toney is one).


I think Bruce's signings have been damn good (I have no idea how much say he had I'm just judging them by the same context as Benitez). I know Joelinton wasn't anything to do with him, Callum Wilson is great and ASM is a wonderful footballer. Jamal Lewis is a weird situation imo, he has a lot of talent and while he did struggle after joining, persevering with Matt Ritchie as a full back is the wrong decision. He's a good signing in theory but Bruce doesn't have confidence in him. I'm generally not impressed with the way Bruce sets up defensively, when you play pragmatic football you shouldn't be as leaky as they are. Benitez was just as dull to watch (personal opinion, other people might find his/Bruce's football more pleasing than I do) but he was superior at the defensive side of the game. We're 8 games into the season and Newcastle still have no wins and have conceded more than any other side. This is with ASM with fit and in brilliant form (his injury absences in previous seasons has been a real blow for Bruce and Newcastle in general).



It'll come to personal opinion again, but as a neutral I'd rather Benitez by a fair margin. I'm not fond of either manager in terms of their approach, but even without the whole Bruce being an ex-sunderland manager (which is fair grounds to not want someone imo).