You are so right
Television Succession
- Thread starter cyberman
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
I reckon Kendall could've changed her mind if he didn't panic and lose his shit. Then again that would've been too calculating on Ken's part. He's no ice cool Michael Corleone. That bloke(Ken) was so desperate, poor bugger.
That ending music. Unreal. Another thing that made the show amazing.
Just watched the finale. Pretty solid ending without it going too dark, even if it was implied.
The whole show in summary for me was that Logan Roy was a ruthless sociopath who had children for no other purpose than continuing his legacy. He wanted them to fight to the death for the right to succeed him in the same fashion of monarchies of the middle ages. Ultimately, that lead to the collapse of his legacy because none of his children were as sociopathic as he was. Instead their attempts to be that ruthless just fecked them all up in different ways.
The show is a well crafted reminder that the kind of aristocracies we consigned to history still exists. Just in less formal terms as they did historicaly. And that they are still playing the same games they always have. At the expense of everyone else in general.
The whole show in summary for me was that Logan Roy was a ruthless sociopath who had children for no other purpose than continuing his legacy. He wanted them to fight to the death for the right to succeed him in the same fashion of monarchies of the middle ages. Ultimately, that lead to the collapse of his legacy because none of his children were as sociopathic as he was. Instead their attempts to be that ruthless just fecked them all up in different ways.
The show is a well crafted reminder that the kind of aristocracies we consigned to history still exists. Just in less formal terms as they did historicaly. And that they are still playing the same games they always have. At the expense of everyone else in general.
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Love that.Thought the ending was fantastic. Really enjoyed it. Great show start to finish.
I'm not so sure about this. If he wanted his other kids to fight for the right to succeed him then he wouldn't only have primed Kendall for succession since he was a kid. Kendall was meant to take over in season 1 but Logan changed his mind. The birthday incident (choosing to attend his father's birthday party over an important business meeting) was the final nail in the coffin, although he probably had a bad feeling about Kendall for a long time.
Logan's struggle is the realisation that none of his children are worthy successors to his empire. Probably because they never had to go through any of the same hardships as him and none of them have his exact set of qualities. He may be a narcissist but he's not deluded enough to believe that his blood alone makes them worthy. His pride is tied to his empire and seeing the empire being lead by someone incompetent, under the Roy name no less, is unbearable. But like most men in his position it is natural for him to also want a Roy to continue his legacy.
If he had loved his children it might have swayed him in the direction of allowing Kendall to take over inn season 1. But since he doesn't (my interpretation), he ultimately lands on "sell" in season 3.
Tell me you hate women without telling me you hate women...
One thing I thought was a bit weird was the brother (Ewan) voting to keep the company. I thought he hated the company and Logan and everything it stood for?
Also, he was a great character and criminally underused this season.
Also, he was a great character and criminally underused this season.
I don’t buy it. Tom could be replaced at any point as CEO. It’s only power for as long as Mattson says so.I think Shiv also would have turned knowing Tom was going to be CEO therefore keeping her within power whereas with Kendall, she will get feck all.
Also Greg getting $200k as an assistant
It’s kind of consistent with his vote against Kendall in season one (was it S1?) when he said something about for better or worse Logan is still his brother. I guess he sees it as a family business?
What are you talking about. I called her a Cnut because she acted like one
Saw a post on Twitter about that. He's basically reaping the rewards whilst moaning about the company and ethics so hypocritical.
That's a really odd conclusion/reach.
Oh leave off
Also, that embrace between Ken and Rom was so odd and weird. Intentionally so, I know. It seemed like a little back and forth. Ken had him in a death grip, but Rom was certainly leaning into it. Sounds a bit like victim-blaming there, but we know his history. Also, it was very reminiscent of Logan embracing Ken at the end of season one when he killed that boy.
Making out that killing that boy was all a lie and he wasn't even there. Somehow, he made the situation even worse! The acting is so good in this show. His desperation was palpable.
I was reading back through the thread from when the episode was aired. Couldn't believe that every other post was about how much various posters hate Shiv, right from the start of the episode. I don't think there's any reason to think she's more hateworthy than any of the main male characters of the show, but it's always the women in these prestige dramas who get those comments...
I'll leave it there, probably not a constructive discussion to have with the way I started it.
Did you actually watch the show?
Her actions were worthy of hate. She got most of it because it ultimately came down to her decision.
Yeah i think it's best to leave the discussion here rather before the thread gets derailed. You were just very quick to leap to "hate women" off the bat.
They're all dislikeable characters, though.
But Ken would have made a terrible CEO though? She made the correct decision at the end
Yep, he's completely delusional and basically even helped Shiv make the decision by bottling that final attempt to convince her. Only an idiot would blame Shiv for his own feck ups.
nah I changed my mind, she was a delightful character who fully deserved that ending.She was the worst in the episode in question. Don’t think it’s a particularly controversial take. She was easily the most annoying
Terrible fecking reach.
Kendall was worse in his quest to become the new king. And he killed a bloke.
They're all dislikeable characters, but shiv was the most jarring. She was playing the otherside because she thought she'd get out on top and get one over Kendal, even started gloating about how she'd played it better and had won. Matsson was never going to hire he was quite clearly just using her, and even when he shafted her in favour of Tom, she in her own words couldn't stomach Kendal winning and voted the deal through. Not because it was the better option, but simply because she couldn't handle not getting her way.
She had no redeeming qualities whatsoever. Roman was an absolute spoilt rich kid cnut but atleast he had wit and was somewhat funny. Kendall was nowhere near as good as his father but atleast had some business acumen, and despite the last few scenes demonstrated care for his siblings. Absent father but still cared for his children.
Shiv constantly cheated on her husband, constantly schemed against her brother's to get her own way and was overall incredibly unlikeable.
If you want to get into the issue at hand of hating women in these types of shows, the issue isn't that people hate them. That's normally justified by their actions. The issue is the way that they're written. Write women characters better and don't feed into tropes. Seen it time and time again, looking at you Skylar. Bitch.
Yep, i think i'd summarise it with the bolded bit.
It's irrelevant in the end though as it's all really just a matter of opinion. They are all unlikeable and based on your own interpretation or reasoning....pick one!
Roman was better because he was somewhat funny? I guess that makes up for helping put a fascist dickhead in the most powerful office in the world. No, Rome's redeeming quality was his humanity. Other than that, he was a little bitch.
You think his redeeming quality was his humanity but mention him putting a fascist in office. Right.
I think there are many reasons for why Shiv is particularly disliked and I don't think it's because of misogyny.
Firstly, out of all the Roy children she seems to have had the least awful childhood. Still awful mind you, but not as bad as the rest. Secondly, unlike the other Roy children who fight over Succession she has practically zero qualifications. Her main motivation is literally power. Roman is only in the race because he feels that there is a legitimate chance that his dad wanted it. Kendall wants it because his entire life has revolved around it. It's his whole purpose in life. "I'm a cog designed to fit only one machine". But Shiv only wants to beat her brothers and come out on top. Lastly, Shiv is way more awful in her interactions with the other people in her life. Roman is rude, chaotic and doesn't see the consequences of his actions and Kendall is a neglectful dad with a singular purpose just like Logan. But the way Shiv treats Tom throughout the series is some psychotic shit.
Shiv has some good and progressive values but the series has shown that these will be thrown right out the door in you offer her what she wants. So even this isn't very redeemable.
Ultimately they're all cnuts. Broken yes, but cnuts nonetheless. But it makes sense that Shiv gets a little more stick than the others.
Firstly, out of all the Roy children she seems to have had the least awful childhood. Still awful mind you, but not as bad as the rest. Secondly, unlike the other Roy children who fight over Succession she has practically zero qualifications. Her main motivation is literally power. Roman is only in the race because he feels that there is a legitimate chance that his dad wanted it. Kendall wants it because his entire life has revolved around it. It's his whole purpose in life. "I'm a cog designed to fit only one machine". But Shiv only wants to beat her brothers and come out on top. Lastly, Shiv is way more awful in her interactions with the other people in her life. Roman is rude, chaotic and doesn't see the consequences of his actions and Kendall is a neglectful dad with a singular purpose just like Logan. But the way Shiv treats Tom throughout the series is some psychotic shit.
Shiv has some good and progressive values but the series has shown that these will be thrown right out the door in you offer her what she wants. So even this isn't very redeemable.
Ultimately they're all cnuts. Broken yes, but cnuts nonetheless. But it makes sense that Shiv gets a little more stick than the others.
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He is emotionally immature and does stupid shit all the time. But when it looks like someone is actually suffering, ie Karl having a panic attack in Turkey, he would show genuine concern. That's it. Being funny isn't a quality, it just makes fans of the show easier to accept him. Which imo is wrong when analyzing redeeming qualities of a character.
Nan Pierce is in Sligo.
What are Kendall's redeeming qualities?
Can we talk about how good Kieran Culkin's impression of Kendall was though?
He didn’t murder anybody. It was literally an accident.
He's so far off the cringe scale that it's funny.