The clearout - progression thread

gaffs said:
In a market where Morgan Rogers is worth £116, I think £75mil for Amad is fair.

Would need to be a club with money. Newcastle, who when Bruno G is sold will have taken in over £250m?

Would you straight swap Hall for Amad?
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Interesting question. I’d hope that Amad is worth a bit more than Hall given his position and experience, but last season really wasn’t good enough and the AFCON stuff is always a distraction.

I’d prefer to keep hold of him for now as Mbuemo will occasionally play CF as it stands and Lacey may play at 10 sometimes too, and we should integrate him carefully.
 
lex talionis said:
Creative thinking, but I wouldn't sell Amad right now and I doubt we've get more than half the 75m you've suggested is possible. It's inconceivable that our vault is already empty.
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Come on man. Newcastle paid over 40mil for Bazoumana Touré, Amad's international colleague, who didnt show much in the WC. Amad is a far better player and Prem proven.

lex talionis said:
Mbeumo has off days and I don't think Lacey is ready yet to take on that much responsibility. But back to Amad...he might just usurp Mbeumo.
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Where we not having a discussion the other day where you were saying Amass should be kept to backup Shaw this season?

lex talionis said:
But if I am right that he young Harry is one for the future, then why not have him deputize for Shaw this season,
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Lacey, for me, is a better prospect than Amass.


Amad being sold is a moot point though, as there is no interest in him.
 
gaffs said:
Come on man. Newcastle paid over 40mil for Bazoumana Touré, Amad's international colleague, who didnt show much in the WC. Amad is a far better player and Prem proven.



Where we not having a discussion the other day where you were saying Amass should be kept to backup Shaw this season?



Lacey, for me, is a better prospect than Amass.


Amad being sold is a moot point though, as there is no interest in him.
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Amad is prem proven, but he's not a regular starter. I wouldn't start rubbing my hands in glee over what we might get for him, should we decide to put all our chips on Lacey as being Mbeumo's cover.

Yes, Amass. Amass and Amad are two different players.

Lacey is a great prospect, but I wouldn't get too excited about him, or Amass, just yet.

There is no interest in Amad, and although that could change quickly, United would be daft to let it be known that he's for sale and that we will entertain offers.
 
doomy20 said:
I feel like we are way to pussy with our approach. It’s the job of the sales dep to sit down with players canps to talk business. Tell Zirkzees camp by June that they need to find another club for him by August and if not, their client will not see any first team Football for a year. Same for a few others.
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100%

I recall some uproar when Mourinho sent Bastian to the reserves - gone in weeks though, wasn’t he?

re Rashford, our leverage went when we loaned him instead of telling his camp that without a sale he was going to sit out a world cup year.

We come across too benevolent in terms of selling.
 
So from reports in the last week it looks like there’s a decent chance Vitek, Amass, Collyer, Gore and Wheatley all might go permanently.
 
Stickz said:
100%

I recall some uproar when Mourinho sent Bastian to the reserves - gone in weeks though, wasn’t he?

re Rashford, our leverage went when we loaned him instead of telling his camp that without a sale he was going to sit out a world cup year.

We come across too benevolent in terms of selling.
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Trouble is we operate like that then media gets word and makes these players look unwanted to other clubs
 
ThanksBoss26 said:
So from reports in the last week it looks like there’s a decent chance Vitek, Amass, Collyer, Gore and Wheatley all might go permanently.
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Vitek -£20 Million
Amass - £7 Million
Collyer - £10 Million
Gore - £4 Million
Wheatley - £4 Million

All with buy back and sell on clauses, will be needed if we can only loan out Zirkzee and Bayindir. Rashford looks yo be staying until January at tej earliest.
 
Wing Attack Plan R said:
Amass and Collyer to have buy-back clauses,, so it's not a complete tragedy, but I still think it's a mistake to sell either one of them, particularly Amass.
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I'm genuinely not that fussed, more concerned we can't move Zirkzee and Rashford to get a striker like Watkins or wide forward like Endrick on loan with option to buy
 
Wing Attack Plan R said:
Amass and Collyer to have buy-back clauses,, so it's not a complete tragedy, but I still think it's a mistake to sell either one of them, particularly Amass.
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What about Collyer makes you think it’s a mistake? I ask because I don’t see anything at all in him bar maybe his stamina.
 
Bastian said:
What about Collyer makes you think it’s a mistake? I ask because I don’t see anything at all in him bar maybe his stamina.
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Have to agree with this. He simply does not show enough for me. Stamina is great but his overall game is far off the level required for a leading PL side.
 
Wing Attack Plan R said:
Amass and Collyer to have buy-back clauses,, so it's not a complete tragedy, but I still think it's a mistake to sell either one of them, particularly Amass.
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Radek Vítek has a VERY high ceiling - and not just because he's a tall lad ;)

He needs to be included in the potential buy-back clause brigade. Lammens is obviously good and (fingers crossed) will be the number 1 for years to come but having the option on Vítek would be most wise.
 
Bastian said:
What about Collyer makes you think it’s a mistake? I ask because I don’t see anything at all in him bar maybe his stamina.
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He just strikes me as a Simpson/Higginbotham/Gibson type academy player that’ll have a decent career between the bottom half of the prem and the championship.

Interestingly, he’s supposed to be very middle class and pretty eloquent and bright.
 
gaffs said:
In a market where Morgan Rogers is worth £116, I think £75mil for Amad is fair.

Would need to be a club with money. Newcastle, who when Bruno G is sold will have taken in over £250m?

Would you straight swap Hall for Amad?
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Absolutely not, no. We need to be investing in the squad to improve our strength and depth, not gaining in one area but losing in another.
 
Bastian said:
What about Collyer makes you think it’s a mistake? I ask because I don’t see anything at all in him bar maybe his stamina.
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As a rule I find it difficult to let academy players go, pure sentimentality. Collyer reminds me of Nicky Butt or Darren Fletcher. Our midfield is going to be crowded this season but I think we should be looking to have a larger squad to reduce injuries or whatever leads us into crisis every year.
 
Wing Attack Plan R said:
As a rule I find it difficult to let academy players go, pure sentimentality. Collyer reminds me of Nicky Butt or Darren Fletcher. Our midfield is going to be crowded this season but I think we should be looking to have a larger squad to reduce injuries or whatever leads us into crisis every year.
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That's how clubs make money to spend though. We can't just hoard academy players
 
IrwinwasbetterthanCarlos said:
He just strikes me as a Simpson/Higginbotham/Gibson type academy player that’ll have a decent career between the bottom half of the prem and the championship.

Interestingly, he’s supposed to be very middle class and pretty eloquent and bright.
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By way of explanation, It was said here Garner had no future in the Premier League, or at least that he'd never get in a good side, and I was/am a big fan of his. I see Collyer as being someone with a different skillset than our current mids. Same with McTominay, always backed him. Garner always had his admirers on here, but now look at him. People have suggested buying him back. I think a lot of our prospects just weren't used right. I think Collyer has a higher ceiling than the players you listed.
 
Wing Attack Plan R said:
By way of explanation, It was said here Garner had no future in the Premier League, or at least that he'd never get in a good side, and I was/am a big fan of his. I see Collyer as being someone with a different skillset than our current mids. Same with McTominay, always backed him. Garner always had his admirers on here, but now look at him. People have suggested buying him back. I think a lot of our prospects just weren't used right. I think Collyer has a higher ceiling than the players you listed.
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Garner has played 200 games since leaving United; he’s only looked anywhere near good enough in the last 50.

Collyer is 22. He needs to go and play and he’s just not going to get the minutes here bar injury crisis.
 
Shaneo2121 said:
Vitek -£20 Million
Amass - £7 Million
Collyer - £10 Million
Gore - £4 Million
Wheatley - £4 Million

All with buy back and sell on clauses, will be needed if we can only loan out Zirkzee and Bayindir. Rashford looks yo be staying until January at tej earliest.
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We'll get 15m max for Vitek, if that. 6m for Amass. 2-3m each for Collyer, Gore and Wheatley.
 
TRUE NUMBER 9 said:
Radek Vítek has a VERY high ceiling - and not just because he's a tall lad ;)

He needs to be included in the potential buy-back clause brigade. Lammens is obviously good and (fingers crossed) will be the number 1 for years to come but having the option on Vítek would be most wise.
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Absolutely, I think he has a much higher ceiling than lammens.
 
Wing Attack Plan R said:
By way of explanation, It was said here Garner had no future in the Premier League, or at least that he'd never get in a good side, and I was/am a big fan of his. I see Collyer as being someone with a different skillset than our current mids. Same with McTominay, always backed him. Garner always had his admirers on here, but now look at him. People have suggested buying him back. I think a lot of our prospects just weren't used right. I think Collyer has a higher ceiling than the players you listed.
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Garner had shown a lot more on loan at a younger and he needed a lot of games that he probably didn’t get with us to develop into the player he is now. Unfortunately injuries and not making an impression on loan have set Collyer back.

He might end up a decent player but he turns 23 this year and he needs a lot of football, not cameos here and there for us. I think his future is probably in the Championship at best but it’s hard as he just hasn’t played enough.
 
Chungy said:
I agree. We've been terrible at selling for so long, I think this is an area that'll take longer to fix than our buying of players.

- Zirkzee may leave, but the best I think will happen is a loan with an obligation to buy, which may bag us more money next summer. But selling outright now I doubt he'd fetch more than 20mil (I think he'd be in the 10-15mil bracket for an outright sale this summer).
- Rashford: frankly, no one's interested. His wages is just a non-starter to most clubs, and his workrate defensively is a big no for big clubs for a player of his quality. Frankly, I think the Barca bid was probably the best value we would have gotten for him. It's either a dirt-cheap sale, another loan, or he'll be forced to stay.
- Our young players like Amass, Vitek, Collyer, etc... will probably not add up to 10 mil, maybe 15mil altogether if we're being optimistic.

So overall, probably just 10-15mil in total sales (not including what we've already got from sales so far this summer).
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Vitek will get sold for at least 15mil on his own. Amass we should not sell, Collyer maybe 5-8 mil.
 
On the topic of Collyer I’d just add that he was more highly rated when he was younger and that injuries hampered him significantly even before he broke into the first team. Similar to Gore in many respects. I’d agree with the poster who suggested that his traits were more understated than others and he was definitely the glue in the team type rather than the flash for me.

I still believe I saw more to his game than he managed to show consistency here in the senior team and hope like Gore to he can show it wherever they end up. They both need regular football.
 
Wing Attack Plan R said:
And I fully admit up front that a lot of it is sentimentality.
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IF we were financially safe as houses then could understand that way of thinking, however we aren't so not in any position to be sentimental. We need to raise some money from sales whatever way we can.
 
Yeah it won't be that much if he is going to Boro.
 
croadyman said:
Where do we actually raise any money this summer?
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Vitek, Amass, Wheatley and Collyer by the sounds of it. Maybe a loan fee for at least one of Zirkzee or Rashford. Small loan fee for Bayindir as well it seems.

Vitek should probably be the biggest fee but if he’s going to Boro with a buy back that will be quite modest you would assume and Boro fans seem to be speculating it is only 6m.
 
croadyman said:
Where do we actually raise any money this summer?
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Thus far, if memory serves correctly, Hojlund, the Greenwood clause & Fredricson. Total ca 50M quid.

Obviously saved a fair wedge on the wages coming off the books from Casemiro, Sancho etc. but I think we need to see some more movement asap so as to swell the warchest, which I do not believe is quite as empty as some think.

Plenty of outgoing options, just need to see their backs going through the door!
 
lex talionis said:
Creative thinking, but I wouldn't sell Amad right now and I doubt we've get more than half the 75m you've suggested is possible. It's inconceivable that our vault is already empty. Mbeumo has off days and I don't think Lacey is ready yet to take on that much responsibility. But back to Amad...he might just usurp Mbeumo.
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Also Mbeumo covers for ST too so Amad will still have a lot of game opportunities. We might sell him next summer, because he might want to start every game by then
 
Ayush_reddevil said:
Goalkeeper in the championship would probably be like 5 million at best
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Christ don't even bother that for measly pathetic figure, wasn't he one of the best keepers in Championship at Bristol City. We are well and truly such a soft touch when it comes to making sales but not surprised just disappointed.
 
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