The curious case of Patrick Dorgu

Jeffthered said:
It's not only this.. but who else are we going to get now? Dorgu is Dorgu, at least we know him and he has proven that he can add value. There are a number of squad members who cannot say the same.. let's focus on getting rid of them and getting in replacements. Dorgu is no ZZ, but he can be a v decent Premier league player.. and at times he can be a v v effective Premier League player.

You think of getting rid of players, you have to replace them. We can't even find a back up for Luke Shaw, or Bruno, which is madness. And I also think Dorgu has warranted his time. It is Carrick's job to make him a better player.
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It's Carrick's job to win matches. This training Dorgu needs is remedial. I don't think Dorgu has warranted jack shit. He gets paid to do a job, and currently he's not at the level to perform the job he was ostensibly hired for. It's not his fault he was bought to play wingback by a mad coach who is no longer here, but that shouldn't mean he is hung around Carrick's neck like an albatross.
 
Wing Attack Plan R said:
It's Carrick's job to win matches. This training Dorgu needs is remedial. I don't think Dorgu has warranted jack shit. He gets paid to do a job, and currently he's not at the level to perform the job he was ostensibly hired for. It's not his fault he was bought to play wingback by a mad coach who is no longer here, but that shouldn't mean he is hung around Carrick's neck like an albatross.
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This is generally our problem. Players not at the required standard but we feel we need to give time and coaching and they will come good when all they actually become is deadwood.
 
Wing Attack Plan R said:
It's Carrick's job to win matches. This training Dorgu needs is remedial. I don't think Dorgu has warranted jack shit. He gets paid to do a job, and currently he's not at the level to perform the job he was ostensibly hired for. It's not his fault he was bought to play wingback by a mad coach who is no longer here, but that shouldn't mean he is hung around Carrick's neck like an albatross.
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You base that on the Hull game then. As he had several surprisingly good matches last season against some of the best teams in the league.
Based on the Hull game only Lammens is a semi decent player…
 
ron86 said:
This is generally our problem. Players not at the required standard but we feel we need to give time and coaching and they will come good when all they actually become is deadwood.
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That’s the situation when you are riddled with debt.
We are forced to try to make them work. I was against Dorgus signing but he has honestly been very good against the best teams in the league. Might as well use him there.
 
Lyng said:
You base that on the Hull game then. As he had several surprisingly good matches last season against some of the best teams in the league.
Based on the Hull game only Lammens is a semi decent player…
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He was a problem for teams but also for us, he bumbles around the pitch, he did give us some directness but let’s be honest he isn’t scoring that goal against Arsenal or Newcastle again
He’s got a place in the squad but not starting 11 for me
 
SirScholes said:
He was a problem for teams but also for us, he bumbles around the pitch, he did give us some directness but let’s be honest he isn’t scoring that goal against Arsenal or Newcastle again
He’s got a place in the squad but not starting 11 for me
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His goals aren’t the important part. He was a constant problem for their fullbacks because he just kept running at them. No he shouldn’t be the starter in most games but selling him would be madness.
 
Wing Attack Plan R said:
I'm not a scout. I think your Danish bias is in overdrive mode. You'll note that I've advocated for him to be loaned out somewhere that he can ply his new trade as a winger or full back. He just can't learn on the job at United.
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My danish bias that was against his signing?
Also this underhanded xenophobia is fecking tiresome.

The problem is if we get rid of him we are one body shorter. Say Cunha gets injured what then? If I had any trust in our owners to go get an upgrade I would agree with you, but I don’t trust they would.
 
Lyng said:
My danish bias that was against his signing?
Also this underhanded xenophobia is fecking tiresome.

The problem is if we get rid of him we are one body shorter. Say Cunha gets injured what then? If I had any trust in our owners to go get an upgrade I would agree with you, but I don’t trust they would.
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Rashford plays.
 
Lyng said:
My danish bias that was against his signing?
Also this underhanded xenophobia is fecking tiresome.

The problem is if we get rid of him we are one body shorter. Say Cunha gets injured what then? If I had any trust in our owners to go get an upgrade I would agree with you, but I don’t trust they would.
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Get a grip. You're Danish, he's Danish, it's natural for a Dane to want a Dane to stay and come good. Engage like an adult.
 
Lyng said:
His goals aren’t the important part. He was a constant problem for their fullbacks because he just kept running at them. No he shouldn’t be the starter in most games but selling him would be madness.
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Agreed selling him isn’t the answer
 
Wing Attack Plan R said:
Get a grip. You're Danish, he's Danish, it's natural for a Dane to want a Dane to stay and come good. Engage like an adult.
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So you want anyone from your country to do well at United? Regardless of their quality?
And by that you imply my nationality means I can’t judge a player without bias?
Talk about needing to get a grip.
 
SirScholes said:
Suppose it’s should we sell him?
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Would be a strange question then, or certainly an incomplete one. If ‘selling him isn’t the answer’, you would think there was a problem where a proposed solution was to sell. So what is that problem? He is shit? He is the third best left winger we have? We need a left back, for example, and can only acquire one if we sell someone for decent money?

Why has the question as to whether we should sell arisen?
 
Dorgu is 21. Never had a run in the team in his preferred position. When he finally looked like getting one, he performed sensationally, then tore his hamstring. He cost feck all by current standards (25m), has bags of potential and is a physical beast.

Cracking young squad player whose development I will watch with interest. Anyone wanting to sell him now is fecking nuts, lacking any sort of perspective or patience, or all three. Let’s see how he performs and develops this season before jumping to any rush judgements.

It’s genuinely baffling how much people expect from young players and how quickly they write them off.
 
simonhch said:
Dorgu is 21. Never had a run in the team in his preferred position. When he finally looked like getting one, he performed sensationally, then tore his hamstring. He cost feck all by current standards (25m), has bags of potential and is a physical beast.

Cracking young squad player whose development I will watch with interest. Anyone wanting to sell him now is fecking nuts, lacking any sort of perspective or patience, or all three. Let’s see how he performs and develops this season before jumping to any rush judgements.

It’s genuinely baffling how much people expect from young players and how quickly they write them off.
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100%
 
ron86 said:
If they saw him as a lb surely he would've played there more than once?
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yes there might be some indications in training hes not such a good defender or based on some very small sample he can be used as a LW so he's thought as a LW "if anything" that doesnt mean he's good enough there. Since we dont have a proper LW and Cunha got injured. It's only a question of where does he fit now after showing he might not be good enough for both LW and LB, even though not tested in a real game that much.

I like Dorgu but hes not starting for any top 6 team in Prem at all as a LW, he's done a job there and that should be it until we find a better player. Same as Carrick as a manager. Things could have changed if we pressed higher and he would get more space but it aint happening with Carrick at helm, hence he should be tried as a LB for the sake of his career. He came as a WB after all and is close to be playing as LB and LW same time. He showed his limitations as a LW s lets tryb him as a LB, if not he might not play at all and can be an ultimate bench player.

We are not charity and give too many chances to a player from Lecce to make the step up as one of the main attackers though. It was always gonna be too difficult for him to shift his position to LW for a top aspiring club. As a LB he's got a chance because the bar is set low, thats why we should at least give him a chance there
 
Wing Attack Plan R said:
It's Carrick's job to win matches. This training Dorgu needs is remedial. I don't think Dorgu has warranted jack shit. He gets paid to do a job, and currently he's not at the level to perform the job he was ostensibly hired for. It's not his fault he was bought to play wingback by a mad coach who is no longer here, but that shouldn't mean he is hung around Carrick's neck like an albatross.
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Training is remedial?

Were you saying this last season? Please, forward and share all those posts when you and all of these other fans who now want Dorgu out of the club.

You see one football match where everyone bar the keeper was rubbish and you want to sell Dorgu. Why?

That's silly. No loyalty. No patience. He warrants backing because he was a significant reason why we played as we did under Carrick's management.

Yet some on here now think Carrick should just bin him. Staggering.

And to suggest that Carrick is not responsible for improving players...absolutely nuts. Utter nonsense.

Pep Guardiola improves football players. Fact. Maybe his approach was 'remedial'. Sir Alex Ferguson made Cristiano Ronaldo, one of the greatest of all time, a better footballer. Fact. Ronaldo has stated this, quite clearly. Maybe you know more than SAF and Pep about coaching. I do not.

Carrick (who I was told, on here, should be considered a coach..) has a duty to get the best out of his squad. That means improving them. Dorgu. Sesko. Baleba. Mainoo. Amad. All will need coaching and experience to make them better.
 
Jeffthered said:
Training is remedial?

Were you saying this last season? Please, forward and share all those posts when you and all of these other fans who now want Dorgu out of the club.

You see one football match where everyone bar the keeper was rubbish and you want to sell Dorgu. Why?

That's silly. No loyalty. No patience. He warrants backing because he was a significant reason why we played as we did under Carrick's management.

Yet some on here now think Carrick should just bin him. Staggering.

And to suggest that Carrick is not responsible for improving players...absolutely nuts. Utter nonsense.

Pep Guardiola improves football players. Fact. Maybe his approach was 'remedial'. Sir Alex Ferguson made Cristiano Ronaldo, one of the greatest of all time, a better footballer. Fact. Ronaldo has stated this, quite clearly. Maybe you know more than SAF and Pep about coaching. I do not.

Carrick (who I was told, on here, should be considered a coach..) has a duty to get the best out of his squad. That means improving them. Dorgu. Sesko. Baleba. Mainoo. Amad. All will need coaching and experience to make them better.
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I liked him even less last season.
 
Just like at RM, Barca, and Bayern, playing for United carries more pressure than almost any job in the world. Players at most other clubs simply do not face the same level of scrutiny when they underperform, and it is even worse given that United is in such a low moment right now. Anyone unable to cope with this environment has to be moved on. So that's the question; can Dorgu handle this? Talent alone isn't enough. Having said that, Carrick is the ideal person to guide players through the pressure at Manchester United. For now, the players deserve some time, provided results don't slip for too long. That's my opinion anyway.
 
I don't see Dorgu as our long term starting XI players but right now his role is more a stop gap who provides athleticism and versatility to the team.
 
simonhch said:
Dorgu is 21. Never had a run in the team in his preferred position. When he finally looked like getting one, he performed sensationally, then tore his hamstring. He cost feck all by current standards (25m), has bags of potential and is a physical beast.

Cracking young squad player whose development I will watch with interest. Anyone wanting to sell him now is fecking nuts, lacking any sort of perspective or patience, or all three. Let’s see how he performs and develops this season before jumping to any rush judgements.

It’s genuinely baffling how much people expect from young players and how quickly they write them off.
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I find it absolutely baffling that anyone would come to this conclusion based on the whole of Dorgu’s work so far at United.

If we sold him today does anyone believe there’s be a swarm of top teams looking to steal him off us?

That we’d even be able to turn a profit off him despite the small sum we paid for him?

He may be young, but for me, there’s very little to suggest he’ll ever be a winger for a top team
 
Lyng said:
You base that on the Hull game then. As he had several surprisingly good matches last season against some of the best teams in the league.
Based on the Hull game only Lammens is a semi decent player…
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Amongst all his games, i only remember him being good in two matched, ie, against City and Arsenal. Thats how good player he is.
 
Lyng said:
You base that on the Hull game then. As he had several surprisingly good matches last season against some of the best teams in the league.
Based on the Hull game only Lammens is a semi decent player…
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Amongst all his games, i only remember him being good in two matched, ie, against City and Arsenal. Thats how good player he is.
 
RW is different to LW.

You can't judge a players ability to play as a winger when he is playing on the wrong side of the pitch.

Basic logic.
 
Ahmer Baig said:
Amongst all his games, i only remember him being good in two matched, ie, against City and Arsenal. Thats how good player he is.
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He was pretty consistently good after Carrick took over and until his injury.
But like I have said several times, I was against his signing because of what I saw of him for Denmark. He is simply not technically sound enough that he should be a consistent starter for us. But he is still useful as a squad option, especially given how we lack true squad depth so loaning or selling him would be moronic in our current state.
 
He is not a winger, not a flair type nor a tricky type to defend against. Hes got top engine, raw pace, and physique. I hope Carrick stops playing him as LW and starts developing him as a fullback. Those characteristics i mentioned before usually spells doom for United whenever we have to play against them... just bombing forward when players are out of position. Nightmare. He can be that player.
 
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A lot has been said about Patrick Dorgu which I find to be unfair and it speaks volumes coming from me (who doesn't cuddle players).

a- he's 21 years old which means he's little more than a kid in football terms.
b- he's been moving clubs for most of his career most of whom with different football cultures and mentality (Danish club, Lecce and Manchester United). The cultural shock between moving from a small club in Italy to Manchester United had crippled far more experienced players then he is (Taibi, Darmian etc)
c- he's been playing everywhere across the board (LB, WBL, RB, WBR, RW, LW). That's not great for a player's development

I defended Carrick in numerous occasions but regarding Dorgu its simply baffling. We've got Cunha and Rashford as LW, why do we keep insisting on Dorgu playing there when our alternative as LB is an injury prone player who can't run anymore? That does stink of former colleague camaraderie to me
 
Galactic said:
Just like at RM, Barca, and Bayern, playing for United carries more pressure than almost any job in the world. Players at most other clubs simply do not face the same level of scrutiny when they underperform, and it is even worse given that United is in such a low moment right now. Anyone unable to cope with this environment has to be moved on. So that's the question; can Dorgu handle this? Talent alone isn't enough. Having said that, Carrick is the ideal person to guide players through the pressure at Manchester United. For now, the players deserve some time, provided results don't slip for too long. That's my opinion anyway.
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Tbf we accept a lot more crap and have Far lower standards than them teams
 
I’ve said this before, he was the best player we had in pre season last year. Then the season started and looked like he’s never kicked a ball. When he played against Arsenal and City I just thought whoa there it is. Injury and we are back to the start. If he doesn’t kick in he can go elsewhere.
 
JohnnyLaw said:
I find it absolutely baffling that anyone would come to this conclusion based on the whole of Dorgu’s work so far at United.

If we sold him today does anyone believe there’s be a swarm of top teams looking to steal him off us?

That we’d even be able to turn a profit off him despite the small sum we paid for him?

He may be young, but for me, there’s very little to suggest he’ll ever be a winger for a top team
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I wonder if people actually watch our games.

Last season prior to his injury and after Carrick took over he was literally one of our best players for a sequence of 10 games or so.

He banged in some sensational goals and was a huge threat in attack. Any premier league team that plays in transition would love to have that kind of threat on their team.

Why the need to devalue a player we only paid 25 million for? Based on current prices he is at least a 55 million pound player maybe more.
 
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