Which French/European films?
Television The 'Cuties' Netflix Controversy
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
I wouldn't' even use the word uncomfortable tbh, too light a word. As I said in the rest of my post I'd not be surprised if the girls you see in these scenes have been exploited and forced into these horrific situations.
But you have no idea if that's the case, nor are there any suggestions of it, correct?
Oh? Why so?
Loads from Europe. But the US as well. What about Taxi Driver, which I mentioned before. Or Pretty Baby which is a famous example.
What are you basing the claims of exploitation on?
No. However if you we a kid that age or you knew a kid that was put into those situations in a show, in the apparent name of art, would you find that normal?
Exploitation of young children into performing depraved acts of being sexualized and the subsequent footage being sold for public viewing.
Whether I find it normal or not is not the question. You said you would not be surprised if they were exploited, which is completely different.
This is how you would characterize this film? On what grounds?
People is so dumb 
This movie is not sexualising kids.
Society, internet, Instagram, YouTube is what is sexualising kids. All of it, under the close vigilance of their daddies, who think that by not acknowledging it, it's not happening.
This movie is not sexualising kids.
Society, internet, Instagram, YouTube is what is sexualising kids. All of it, under the close vigilance of their daddies, who think that by not acknowledging it, it's not happening.
On the grounds that you can see the kids performing acts of being sexualized in the movie.
I know the premise of the movie. I’ve seen the trailer and it’s not something I want to watch as I think it’s exploitation of children. They’re themselves are not old enough to understand the impact this could have. That not everyone would find it as a work of art but something to jerk off to. I have a problem with that so don’t presume to tell me what I know and don’t know.
You haven't watched the film, and are basing your entire judgment on a trailer and youtube reviews. I think I'm pretty comfortable with saying that you don't know what you're talking about with your characterization of the film.
Because it's not a normal situation for a kid to be in. They apparently made a film against child exploitation by exploiting child actors. Therefore they are guilty of (at best) complete moral negligence.
The difference between video games is that they’re exactly that a game. This on the other hand is a real person, whom, for my money, is being exploited. I understand the premise of the movie completely but again, I feel we shouldn’t need 90 minutes of this to have a healthy discussion.
The CNC, the French film regulator, didn't think so. I don't think it's been banned in any territories that I know of on those grounds either.
So I can’t read the synopsis of the film and the message it’s trying to convey? I have and I watched the critique of the film and I came to conclusion that I don’t want to be watch that garbage. Maybe you are the one that doesn’t have a clue because I’m pretty sure I’m okay from my point of view on this film.
You can. And you can of course decide that you don't want to watch the film - you can't however pass judgment on it, as you have not seen it. I mean, it's pretty straightforward, no?
Like I said, I don't agree with it. The footage that we see in the movie should be illegal to film, less so legally available to watch. No amount of social commentary or starting any discussion comes anywhere near the risk of exploitation of these kids who were asked to perform these acts, and were actually made to go through it. Anyone who prioritizes any kind of social discussion over the physical and mental well-being of young kids who haven't even entered their teens yet being influenced into performing such scenes is nothing but demented.
Moreover the actually controversy is about Netflix who went ahead and decided to use the exact snapshot of the objectionable footage and put it as the poster of the film for people browsing their website just for gaining extra views and traffic. I'm glad they are receiving cancellations on the back of this, absolutely pathetic from them.
I don’t think you can watching an edited clip of a film and fully understand the message it’s trying to convey. It’d be like watching 5 minutes of edited Full Metal Jacket clips on YouTube and coming to the conclusion that the movie is saying war is cool.
If what you have seen means you’re against watching the film I think that’s a fair stance to take and one that every individual will have to weigh up. What I disagree with is watching 5% of the film without the context of the narrative and thinking you can gauge the message and what the film is trying to say.
Whatever you do never download tiktok .
But from my understanding, that's exactly the point of this film. That young girls are doing this sort of thing without realizing what it means to older people; they are just copying behaviour on the assumption that it's not normal, cause that's what you see in music videos and wherever. And so that, if we are scandalized by seeing this in a movie, we should think of what young girls (and boys, for that matter) are getting to see every day, and how normalized that has become.
I mean, as I think I saw pointed out in the Trump or US Elections thread, people are all disgusted by Cuties, but no-one comments on girls in high-school skimpy outfits at pageants or in cheerleader squads. Are we, as a society, thus saying that young girls can reasonably be sexualized as long as it's a known, set context? E.g., yes when cheerleading, but not in film? There are good discussions to be had, and the film triggers them - exactly by having these scenes and making people feel uncomfortable.
The film isn't responsible for Netflix's marketing strategy though.
Im pretty sure you should be able to differentiate between someone filming/performing something themselves as opposed to being asked to by a crew of filmmakers looking to make money on the back of it?
Yeah, it is a separate criticism of Netflix, not the filmmakers.
In the context of this discussion that has been done above, including the post I was replying to, it was pretty obvious that I was referring to a commercial film filming kids for such scenes and not social media apps allowing kids to upload their own footage - which is a completely separate discussion.
Sorry I'm contracted to The Movie Review Thread. You can access my full review there, as well as other bonus content: Right now you can see me attempting to communicate with someone of a foreign culture.
I'm only permitted to pompously tell everyone that they're wrong, in an annoyingly snarky way over here.
So it’s ok for children to record themselves In their bedroom in a manner more lewd than those depicted in the film, without the knowledge of their parents, release it to the public in a format that allows direct communication with strangers. Opposed to the film we’re discussing which had their parents and a child psychologist on set, had to meet governing body standards, and director Doucouré constantly reaffirming both the message of the film and how her experiences as a young refugee girl were being translated onto the screen.
I said that's a separate discussion, not at any point was it said whether or not it is ok or how it should be controlled. Let's talk about what's actually being said without making any assumptions. Nor am I interested in continuing this line of whataboutism. Feel free to comment on the discussion for which this thread was made.
No Moby, what I’m doing is asking questions, this is an assumption
You can’t separate Cuties from the wider context of children and sexualisation, and how it’s depicted. That’s what Cuties is about and why it’s frustrating that so many people who haven’t watched the film are missing the point entirely. “Cut our that talk about TikTok and child sexualisation, we’re here to talk about Cuties!” That’s what Cuties is. It’s a mirror and it’s depicting a part of society that a lot of people would rather not think about. So instead of discussing what the mirror is showing, people just want to smash the mirror. Out of sight out of mind.
It's a bit weird to not want to watch the movie because it contains disgusting garbage, and then go on to watch the disgusting garbage several times with all the other parts cut out, I think was the point.
I watched the trailer once then I seen a person who reviewed it with everything blurred out. So no I haven’t watched it several times.
You posted two reviews, but fair enough, I didn't watch them.
I posted one review of some weirdo saying those girls were hot and it wasn’t his fault for thinking that — it was the directors intention. Do you not see the problem with what he’s saying. Which a lot of other twisted fecks will be saying? Hence the reason I’m repulsed by this movie.
Think it's been made pretty clear that my concern with this and what I am here to discuss is a commercial film filming a bunch of kids for objectionable scenes and then promoting the very obscenity for commercial benefits, which is exactly what I was discussing with the other poster before you deciding to jump in with your totally unrelated opinion piece. I've clarified earlier that regardless of whatever message the film is supposed to convey, there cannot be in any circumstance be a permission for a commercial film crew to use kids as props and make them go through the kind of scenes that have been shown in the film, as simple as that. Whatever the actual outcome of the film in your opinion is has no bearing on the rights and boundaries of young children that cannot be allowed to be crossed by anyone including their parents, especially with the makers of the video doing so for commercial gains. Again, and for the last time, the issue is making kids performing obscene acts for a commercial film, with a bunch of adults (doesnt matter if they are parents or filmmakers) influencing them into doing so, which is absolutely 100% out of bounds and has no place in any acceptable media.
You keep emphasising ‘commercial’. What do you mean by that and what bearing do you think it has on what we’re discussing?
Wrong again. The emphasis is on the fact that a bunch of adults apart from the kids themselves made the decision to film these kids performing obscene acts, which is the biggest issue here and something that cannot be allowed. The fact that the footage is not only commercially sold, but has streaming sites like Netflix actively marketing it to users using exact snapshots/pictures of those kids during those scenes which is incredibly disturbing and pathetic. The filmmakers and subsequent sites like Netflix are well aware that the kind of footage that is present in the film would easily sell, given the amount sick creeps, perverts and pedophiles out there, same reason why child porn has a market in the world, and they are out making far more money out of it than they would have in a movie about the same topic without this kind of specific footage. It's exploitation in every sense of the word.
The way Netflix marketed it would fall within the scope of exploitation, I agree.
From all reports of people who have actually seen the film, it is not exploitation.
Unless watching the entire film is going to erase the particular scenes that are extremely objectionable, how does it even matter? Like I said above it doesn't matter what the film is about, when you can clearly see exact content which is completely out of bounds by itself, as would be the case if a movie had a scene where an underage kid was actually getting raped by an adult and filmed extensively, there's no message or any context that can be added to justify that.
No do I care about those who find it acceptable, there would be some who would be fine in filming kids entirely naked for a film to send a message about places living in poverty where people dont have clothes to wear, and what not. Like I've said earlier, if anyone is willing to accept filming such scenes just because it starts a social conversation, or because it mirrors a serious social issue, then they have totally ignored the far bigger issue of kids being exploited to film and market the said material, which is something I am not going to agree to.
“Wrong again” ? I was asking you what you meant by that distinction and how that changes the narrative on what we’re discussing. Stop taking these questions as some affront, I’m just better trying to understand your view better.
The reason I ask about commercial is I wonder if that makes a change in how you perceive the validity of the message the film is conveying. You’ve mentioned it several times and it seems to me that the film making profits does invalidate whatever the film is trying to say in your eyes. Does the film being written and directed by Doucouré about her personal experiences and created as an indie project mean that she is unable to broach sensitive topics with any authenticity because Netflix signed distribution rights and fecked up the marketing?