The John Murtough Era

Status
Not open for further replies.

Trequartistry

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Mar 29, 2017
Messages
236
The tweet sent above, you could make the same post for Woodward during his tenure here
 

bringbackbebe

Full Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2021
Messages
1,648
Tell you what. We talk about giving ETH time. Murtough seems to be the first football man to have power at the club. He will need time himself
His behind the scenes work is being clearly recognized & has helped him consolidating his position. I'm excited about someone at the top finally keeping a low profile at our club and doing work.
 

Skills

Snitch
Joined
Jan 17, 2012
Messages
42,010
His behind the scenes work is being clearly recognized & has helped him consolidating his position. I'm excited about someone at the top finally keeping a low profile at our club and doing work.
I'm hoping Ten Hag is the same and doesn't let the publicity of being the Man Utd manager get to his head.
 

bringbackbebe

Full Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2021
Messages
1,648
I'm hoping Ten Hag is the same and doesn't let the publicity of being the Man Utd manager get to his head.
Indeed. He must avoid all controversies publicly focus on just getting stuff done rather than getting into mind games with competitors. That time will come, but right now, we need to punch in our own weight category.
 

L1nk

Full Member
Joined
Dec 31, 2017
Messages
5,064

Lets hope he is sound with all this new found power
 

Yakuza_devils

Full Member
Joined
Oct 30, 2016
Messages
2,840
Tbf, Rangnick is a disaster as manager. Big big mistake. Hope he can contribute as consultant.

ETH is the fans' favorite and hope we get it right this time.

This summer is important to see how well we conduct our transfers. We need to be more efficient compared to Woodward time.
 

Idxomer

Full Member
Joined
Aug 3, 2014
Messages
15,009
Hindsight and all but there haven't been many decisions he has got right so far.
 

ShinjiNinja26

Full Member
Joined
Feb 9, 2013
Messages
11,025
Location
Location, Location
Hindsight and all but there haven't been many decisions he has got right so far.
How many decisions has he actually made though? So far it’s only really hiring Ralf and ETH and he hasn’t even managed a game for us yet. Ralf’s admittedly not worked out but bar that what else has he got wrong?
 

Idxomer

Full Member
Joined
Aug 3, 2014
Messages
15,009
How many decisions has he actually made though? So far it’s only really hiring Ralf and ETH and he hasn’t even managed a game for us yet. Ralf’s admittedly not worked out but bar that what else has he got wrong?
He has been appointed in March last year. You have Ole and Phelan's renewals, failure to get a midfielder last summer, and the delay of Ole's sacking which resulted in Rangnick and the mess of having no reliable coaching staff for him. Actually having no plan at all when Ole left might be his and the club's biggest blunder.
 

ShinjiNinja26

Full Member
Joined
Feb 9, 2013
Messages
11,025
Location
Location, Location
He has been appointed in March last year. You have Ole and Phelan's renewals, failure to get a midfielder last summer, and the delay of Ole's sacking which resulted in Rangnick and the mess of having no reliable coaching staff for him. Actually having no plan at all when Ole left might be his and the club's biggest blunder.
He may have been appointed then but Ed Woodward didn’t actually leave until Feb or March this year so I don’t know how much influence he really had on a lot of those decisions. I’ll choose to judge him on what he’s done post Woodward leaving, this summer window is a big one for him.
 

wolvored

Full Member
Joined
Jul 6, 2016
Messages
9,871
He may have been appointed then but Ed Woodward didn’t actually leave until Feb or March this year so I don’t know how much influence he really had on a lot of those decisions. I’ll choose to judge him on what he’s done post Woodward leaving, this summer window is a big one for him.
I said similar. Woodward would have made all the big decisions as he was a egomaniac who would only do his own thing.
 

Sparky Rhiwabon

New Member
Joined
Jul 10, 2013
Messages
16,946
First the appointment of Ralf Rangnick to take the helm as interim manager known for his progressive footballing philosophy after which he'll have enough insight to advice the board regarding the way forward.
Then the strategic process of hiring a manager who plays a brand of football united would be proud of most likely its going to be Ten Hag.
Early days but this seems promising, if we're this thorough and strategic regarding recruitment and awarding contracts then I feel its only a matter of time before we're back to competiting with the best sides.
Yeah, about that…
 

Greck

Full Member
Joined
Dec 1, 2016
Messages
7,099
He may have been appointed then but Ed Woodward didn’t actually leave until Feb or March this year so I don’t know how much influence he really had on a lot of those decisions. I’ll choose to judge him on what he’s done post Woodward leaving, this summer window is a big one for him.
We're really going to continue postdating the commencement of his tenure till the year 2025. It has never actually been a secret Murtough brought Ralf. We don't even need a cover up for this because the original intention behind the appointment wasn't even that bad.
 

Escobar

Shameless Musketeer
Joined
Jun 8, 2004
Messages
30,063
Location
La-La-Land
How many decisions has he actually made though? So far it’s only really hiring Ralf and ETH and he hasn’t even managed a game for us yet. Ralf’s admittedly not worked out but bar that what else has he got wrong?
And at the time, most fans thought getting RR for 6 months was a good decision. Didnt work out, but it is no 20/20 again
 

ShinjiNinja26

Full Member
Joined
Feb 9, 2013
Messages
11,025
Location
Location, Location
We're really going to continue postdating the commencement of his tenure till the year 2025. It has never actually been a secret Murtough brought Ralf. We don't even need a cover up for this because the original intention behind the appointment wasn't even that bad.
I wasn’t referring to the hiring of Ralf in the post I was replying to, more the stuff to do with Ole and Phelan and last summers transfer window. I consider the Rangnick appointment to be the first real decision Murtough has made and I agree with you that even though it didn’t work out the intent behind it was good.
 

roseguy64

Full Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2010
Messages
12,172
Location
Jamaica
We're really going to continue postdating the commencement of his tenure till the year 2025. It has never actually been a secret Murtough brought Ralf. We don't even need a cover up for this because the original intention behind the appointment wasn't even that bad.
Who has denied that he was a major decision-maker in appointing Rangnick? People are just pointing out that that is the first real decision we can credit to him and so can only judge him really from that point onwards considering how Woodward was even though he was in the position from before.
 

edcunited1878

Full Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2014
Messages
8,935
Location
San Diego, CA
We're really going to continue postdating the commencement of his tenure till the year 2025. It has never actually been a secret Murtough brought Ralf. We don't even need a cover up for this because the original intention behind the appointment wasn't even that bad.
Now the intention has not been seen through, for whatever reasons. Again, it looks really bad.

If Ralf's first remit was to manage the team to a 4th place, they knew his style and beliefs aren't suited to the team when they hired him. Then Ralf tried to adjust his tactics to suit the team, which was fine up until going out in CL.

Consultants provide strategic advice and insight. People who hire consultants never have to do what they suggest, but why hire a consultant, who has a huge track record of success as a football ops main man, if you don't heed said advice and strategic insight?

Unless Rangnick provided much more info and insight to Fletcher and Murtough throughout his 6 months, then can see them getting all they really wanted from him and cutting him loose.
 

Greck

Full Member
Joined
Dec 1, 2016
Messages
7,099
Now the intention has not been seen through, for whatever reasons. Again, it looks really bad.

If Ralf's first remit was to manage the team to a 4th place, they knew his style and beliefs aren't suited to the team when they hired him. Then Ralf tried to adjust his tactics to suit the team, which was fine up until going out in CL.

Consultants provide strategic advice and insight. People who hire consultants never have to do what they suggest, but why hire a consultant, who has a huge track record of success as a football ops main man, if you don't heed said advice and strategic insight?

Unless Rangnick provided much more info and insight to Fletcher and Murtough throughout his 6 months, then can see them getting all they really wanted from him and cutting him loose.
They maybe never even wanted a consultant. I think it was just incentive to make him leave his old club. They were scrambling for a replacement because they had dallied on Ole's sack. I actually believe Murtough was a part of the decisonmaking process that dithered on sacking Ole. He never actually hid his support. This was him weeks into Ole's sack form.

Manchester United football director John Murtough has reaffirmed the club's belief in Ole Gunnar Solskjaer after a mixed start to the new season.

"We have a long-term strategy and confidence in the direction that we’re going," Murtough said at the latest Fans’ Forum meeting. "Premier League is one of most competitive leagues in the world - players in from abroad and other leagues tell us how different it is - but we are 100 per cent up for that challenge.
Need to keep control, don't get carried away, don't deviate from our plan. Ole and the staff are very focused on that. "Don't get distracted by what's said on social media, which can sometimes create fervour and hysteria. It’s part of the modern game, but we stay focused.
Yet we're supposed to believe his own statement coup[led with the renewal of Ole's staff had nothing to do with him and was big bad Woodward acting alone to the dismay of Murtough. He even still defended those quotes months later in december.
“As a club we felt Ole had earned the right to be given the chance to turn things round, but didn’t get a reaction after the international break. The Watford game made it clear change was needed.
Unless people want to stretch logic and say his powers kicked in the day after Ole was sacked but right before Rangnick was hired which makes no sense. Murtough has already been a part of the mistakes. The push to scrub his own involvement in the season make no sense when his own words even contradict that he wasn't a strong part of it. As far as I'm concerned Arnold is the one who gets the clean slate.

edit oh and that hideous Bruno contract, it's almost as if they were eager to let everyone know it was business as usual with or without Woodward. Can't blame that one on only Woodward but I half expect people to try anyway.
 
Last edited:

Greck

Full Member
Joined
Dec 1, 2016
Messages
7,099
Another act of incompetence was not sounding out potential replacements for Ole simply because they thought it would be disrespectful to Ole.

Murtough said: “Out of respect for Ole we did not approach other managers before he left.
Jesus effin Christ. Even woodward wasn't that stupid.

Our plan then was to appoint an experienced interim manager.

“Ralf was our clear first choice. He’s someone I have admired for a long time, we’re delighted he’s here.
His own briefings give the impression of a golden retriever at a science fair. There's always at least one gem.

and for what it's worth I'm not actually against scrapping Ralf's consultancy. It was becoming clear he had a different vision from the rest of the club (revolution vs evolution) but the development does make the last six months feel like it was unnecessary and didn't need to happen. The benefit of enduring his mediocre management was supposed to be his role beyond that. With that falling through it looks like they should have gone in a different direction, especially if they had acted on time.
 
Last edited:

TwoSheds

More sheds (and tiles) than you, probably
Joined
Feb 12, 2014
Messages
12,739
Another act of incompetence was not sounding out potential replacements for Ole simply because they thought it would be disrespectful to Ole.


Jesus effin Christ. Even woodward wasn't that stupid.



His own briefings give the impression of a golden retriever at a science fair. There's always at least one gem.

and for what it's worth I'm not actually against scrapping Ralf's consultancy. It was becoming clear he had a different vision from the rest of the club (revolution vs evolution) but the development does make the last six months feel like it was unnecessary and didn't need to happen. The benefit of enduring his mediocre management was supposed to be his role beyond that. With that falling through it looks like they should have gone in a different direction, especially if they had acted on time.
Problem was they'd already alienated McKenna and Carrick who were the only people within the club with the stature to take over as interim manager. Fletcher had only ever coached the U15s or something so would have most likely just ended up as yet another stick to beat the board with. So you'd then be looking for a manager from outside who knows he only gets 10 games or whatever, is available, and wants the job rather than just looking for his next permanent job. Honestly I'd have been quite happy with Dyche for a few games but let's face it that would have just been yet another media circus and the players looking down their noses at him. Not worth the hassle most likely. The board had already thrown away the season in October.
 

Matt851

Full Member
Joined
Sep 10, 2016
Messages
2,109
And at the time, most fans thought getting RR for 6 months was a good decision. Didnt work out, but it is no 20/20 again
He is literally paid to be better at managing these appointments better than a fan would. And to many, hiring someone whose strengths were in long term strategic planning for a short term stint seemed a bit weird particularly given his recent record of managing clubs for the last two seasons out of ten. It was only made to seem vaguely sensible by his role post the management stint which always seemed rather ill defined. Realistically ralf is much better qualified for murtoughs job than he is

Appointing ralf isn't a case of a correct decision just not working out its something that didn't make sense from the off, if you gave it a little thought. That's also ignoring the fact no one at the club had given a new manager any thought before sacking ole. Something that seems very much part of murtoughs role
 

UNITED ACADEMY

New Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2018
Messages
13,127
Supports
Erik ten Hag
He has been appointed in March last year. You have Ole and Phelan's renewals, failure to get a midfielder last summer, and the delay of Ole's sacking which resulted in Rangnick and the mess of having no reliable coaching staff for him. Actually having no plan at all when Ole left might be his and the club's biggest blunder.
Those are still on Woodward though since he was still in charged until end of 2021.
 

Yakuza_devils

Full Member
Joined
Oct 30, 2016
Messages
2,840
We are supposed to already have a proper football structure under Murtough to ensure continuity for bigger chance of success for a new manager.

Under the new football structure we are supposed to have a team of football people working in the club day in day out.

They know the club inside out and interacts with the players, coaches, experts and whatnot in details to run and plan the football things for long term.

Somehow they see it fit to make the decision to appoint Rangnick knowing that his style of play doesn't suit the squad and yet made the decision that no new signing is allowed. Rangnick style also demands high physical fitness which the squad lacks. Most of all he is more highly regarded as DOF rather than a coach. And now his consultantcy to DOF roles is also scrapped.

The decision making of these people who are paid millions of pounds to run the club is appalling. As one of the biggest football club in the world we should be much more professional with proper long term plan and vision.
 

Vapor trail

Full Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2022
Messages
1,280
Not saying John has failed it's still too early to give an accurate assessment but Murtough seems to suffer from the same limitations that Woodward has and that's not being primed with experience for the magnitude of the role he is currently occupying.

Ragnicks best influence is in the role Murtough has. Those comments about support for Ole are ridiculous given that Solskjaer was incrementally getting worse with time. One of the more pressing issues is also who's replacing Matt Judge. Been reported the club approached Dan Ashworth but he is more interested in Newcastle proposals because it's a more prominent and hands on role.

Realistically if in 24-36 months the club are showing no visible signs of improvement before even thinking about getting rid of ETH, Murtough should have to go in those circumstances. He's already began with a relatively poor start and that is from the team missing top four.
 

pascell

Full Member
Joined
Aug 3, 2012
Messages
14,113
Location
Sir Alex Ferguson Stand
Not saying John has failed it's still too early to give an accurate assessment but Murtough seems to suffer from the same limitations that Woodward has and that's not being primed with experience for the magnitude of the role he is currently occupying.

Ragnicks best influence is in the role Murtough has. Those comments about support for Ole are ridiculous given that Solskjaer was incrementally getting worse with time. One of the more pressing issues is also who's replacing Matt Judge. Been reported the club approached Dan Ashworth but he is more interested in Newcastle proposals because it's a more prominent and hands on role.

Realistically if in 24-36 months the club are showing no visible signs of improvement before even thinking about getting rid of ETH, Murtough should have to go in those circumstances. He's already began with a relatively poor start and that is from the team missing top four.
It's even been reported that no one will replace Judge and his role will be shared between Murtough and whoever they appoint as his junior (more than likely the guy he worked with at the PL).

He's effectively given himself more prominence within the structure and there's no one to tell him with any experience that what he's doing is incorrect, which is a big worry.
 

We need an rvn

Full Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2015
Messages
3,867
Location
Down south...somewhere
Not saying John has failed it's still too early to give an accurate assessment but Murtough seems to suffer from the same limitations that Woodward has and that's not being primed with experience for the magnitude of the role he is currently occupying.

Ragnicks best influence is in the role Murtough has. Those comments about support for Ole are ridiculous given that Solskjaer was incrementally getting worse with time. One of the more pressing issues is also who's replacing Matt Judge. Been reported the club approached Dan Ashworth but he is more interested in Newcastle proposals because it's a more prominent and hands on role.

Realistically if in 24-36 months the club are showing no visible signs of improvement before even thinking about getting rid of ETH, Murtough should have to go in those circumstances. He's already began with a relatively poor start and that is from the team missing top four.
Sorry, but this makes no sense.

he took over in April, by that time we all knew we were well out of the running, in-fighting with the players - you name it, we were a mess everywhere and we could all see rag ‘s management skills were not up to scratch - none of this had to do with murtougj

he’s come in, got rid of a bunch of leading scouts, signed eth, the transfer season has only just started and you’re saying he’s had a poor start??

confused.com
 

RORY65

Full Member
Joined
May 28, 2009
Messages
4,452
Sorry, but this makes no sense.

he took over in April, by that time we all knew we were well out of the running, in-fighting with the players - you name it, we were a mess everywhere and we could all see rag ‘s management skills were not up to scratch - none of this had to do with murtougj

he’s come in, got rid of a bunch of leading scouts, signed eth, the transfer season has only just started and you’re saying he’s had a poor start??

confused.com
His start date is moving back every time someone posts, he was made football director in March 2021 and every indication was he led the appointment of Rangnick for one thing but now he apparently took over only 13 months later? In 3 years time people will be saying we can't judge him yet because he's only new to the role.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.