Our central midfield isn't much better than the teams battling in the relegation zone.
The McFred midfield duo
- Thread starter kouroux
- Start date
It's not better, Mctominay is absolutely shocking a pure passion merchant. If he never come through the academy he'd be playing for Burnley.
Simply has to be addressed this summer. Tchouameni would be perfect, we probably need one more if Pogba goes.
This is our biggest problem.
We are having 2 players in the midfield doing the job of 1/2 a player. Rodri, Fabinho, Kimmich, Casemiro do the role of these 2 and more as they can pass the ball. This allows those teams to play with 2 8's.
I’d sell both at the earliest opportunity. Unfortunately I doubt anyone who might be interested in them could afford their wages though.
Another two we are unfortunately stuck with, the only glimmer of hope is finally having a manager who is not blind to both of their huge deficiencies.
Another two we are unfortunately stuck with, the only glimmer of hope is finally having a manager who is not blind to both of their huge deficiencies.
Using RR and Carrick picking them as evidence of their quality is fallacy city but also because they had no option. Are they supposed to play 9 men to make a point? Is it not pretty telling that RR was already trying to buy a midfielder in january? He walked into the team and decided to upgrade not the fullbacks, not the defenders, not the wingers but the midfield position.
Then using Jose is also wrong because Fred couldn't even get a sniff under Jose. The person who bought him didn't even play him, how is that a point for Fred? So those 4 managers who keep picking them includes 1 manager that didn't even pick them and 2 interim managers who had no choice. They weren't exactly in any kind of a position to replace them but not from a lack of trying.
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Why include the last 3 managers? Jose didn’t play them regularly.
They have played regularly for one manager who had a bunch of transfer windows and a tonne of money to recruit better, and one manager who’s been given not a bean to replace them.
That second manager even in his limited time, has tried to swap them out often too. As early as his second game he played DvB who stank the place out vs. Young Boys, meaning McFred came straight back in the following game. Pogba was in as soon as he came back from that injury, and Matic recently. The problem is, unbelievably at United, just like after Young Boys, you always end up back at this miserable truth that for a run of games, they are our most “reliable” option.
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Mcfred. Until this isn’t sorted, then we will just be going round in circles.
Have to question competence of any new manager if they both start regularly next season. I think you could get away with playing one of them for a season whilst rebuilding but neither should be starting and shouldn’t have both in the squad eventually.
The big thing in their favour is they can run more than our other midfielders. They are both headless chickens of course but it’s a low bar to get in this team. I don’t think either would play as much at any other team in the top 12 let alone both of them. It’s just so odd that we haven’t signed other players, no idea what Ole was thinking.
The big thing in their favour is they can run more than our other midfielders. They are both headless chickens of course but it’s a low bar to get in this team. I don’t think either would play as much at any other team in the top 12 let alone both of them. It’s just so odd that we haven’t signed other players, no idea what Ole was thinking.
Ole played them and I’m sure at some point you way singing that he was at the wheel. No they are not to play with 9 men and won’t have done if they were both injured. He could have equally played DVB or Matic. Not sure where this ‘he can only play 60 mins comes from’. I’ve no idea whether he was trying to buy a midfielder unless I believe everything that’s in the paper and whose to say that wasn’t just cover anyway. Its funny cause he walked into the team and did the opposite. Have we ever seen Harry dropped before or Marcus? Did he pull Dalot out his backside and Tel who both played hardly any football? He even played a young lad who was about to go out on loan. Have I missed anyone?
Jose may not have signed him but Fred just came to the club and Scott was young, new to the position but he made a trophy for him. Jose had a half decent Matic and Pogs too (until he fell out with him). Jose did pick them, Ole picked them, Carrick picked them, was the first to push Fred further forward and the first to drop Bruno. Yes only a few games but was quite telling. RR had no choice, I guess your theory of playing 9 men would have been right if they were both injured. He has choice, just not your choice.
Amazing how DVB is an example of managers not playing him, when they have choice yet, playing McFred nearly every game based on your theory of no choice. If he has no choice, surely when Scott was injured or Fred had COVID, he‘d continue with Bruno, Pogs and Matic and bring Scott and Fred on? Wasn’t that an option?
I dont think I said regular but he played them but Ok, 2 out the last 3. Maybe it’s me but most people said once RR came in, it was the last of McFred. Are people suggesting they haven’t played regular under RR.
DvB didn’t sink the place out and anyway, people said he deserved more than one game cause McFred have been doing that for ages. Donny was never an option even though he could have been if McFred was so bad. Pogs has come in but equally Fred had COVID and Scott was injured. Matic has come more off the bench than starting. No change there.
Im gonna say it again, I don’t understand why everyone assumes he wanted to replace them? If they are that crap, it cost you nothing to replace them. They are not good enough for where we want to be but equally I’m not convinced that the various managers have seen it as a priority. You get a sense of who the club wants, and despite the paper linking us to loads of midfielders, aside from Rice, I was never convinced we were really in for any of them.
Yeah you definitely quoted the wrong person here. I said none of that. I only addressed selection being a barometer of quality. The rest about VDB, only playing 60 minutes and Ole is from your chat with someone else.
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He had an absolutely dogshit first half and ended it passing the ball directly to the Young Boys lad for their equaliser.
Yes, he stunk the place out.
He has nothing, absolutely not a penny. So how does he replace any of our midfielders with better quality? By grabbing some lad directly off Deansgate and giving him the number 6 shirt?
They are clearly the only reliable option in this squad, which means absolutely feck all.
The only thing Ralf playing them means is that he believes they are a better option than other shit in the squad, something most people agree with anyway they are all shite options.
Complete joke this partnership ever got regular starts in the first place, fully down to Jose & Ole
If Fred has been carrying pianos for all all the supposed artists in our squad, he might want to carry a different instrument because there is no melody in how we play.
Worst partnership in the league by a mile, it's genuinely a Championship level midfield in fact some teams at the top of it have better
The fact is that our squad is woefully I’ll equipped, but if we are going to make the best of it until the end of the season then we have to (a) play players in positions where they can most be effective, and (b) where their limitations are least exposed.
With that said my line up would as follows:
De gea in goal
Dalot and Telles as attacking full backs.
Varane and Lindelöf as CBs.
Matic as a defensive mid.
Fred and Bruno in front of him as aggressive pressers.
Pogba on the left, where he doesn’t have much defensive responsibility.
Sancho on the right.
Ronaldo or Cavani rotating up front.
For me that line up has the best balance of all our options.
With that said my line up would as follows:
De gea in goal
Dalot and Telles as attacking full backs.
Varane and Lindelöf as CBs.
Matic as a defensive mid.
Fred and Bruno in front of him as aggressive pressers.
Pogba on the left, where he doesn’t have much defensive responsibility.
Sancho on the right.
Ronaldo or Cavani rotating up front.
For me that line up has the best balance of all our options.
Nothing shows the downfall of this club as much as this being our main midfield pairing. If we go into next season and we're still starting this average pair I'll give up.
It will be interesting to see what happens with Fred this summer.
He's entering the last year of his contract, and he's not worth the amount of money I imagine he will ask for to re-sign. We'll be wary of letting him leave for free next year, but at the same time, we'll be losing a significant number of players this summer and can't afford to let everyone go.
He's entering the last year of his contract, and he's not worth the amount of money I imagine he will ask for to re-sign. We'll be wary of letting him leave for free next year, but at the same time, we'll be losing a significant number of players this summer and can't afford to let everyone go.
I am totally against fielding midfielders who couldn't pass. Its like playing defenders who couldn't tackle, or striker who couldn't shoot etc.
And McFred is probably the worst midfielders out there in terms of passing.
And McFred is probably the worst midfielders out there in terms of passing.
Almost every match we play I look at the opposition midfielders and I see one midfielder clearly better than both McT and Fred. I think the only match I didn't think that in the last few months was the Leeds United match.
You can only play Matic once every 10 days and for just 60 minutes. Even then we would see a degradation after 6 or so matches.
McShit
Fred's class
Fred's class
It's the Mc part of this equation that's always been the bigger problem. Any sensible observer knows this but they're lumped together of course. Fred has more qualities, better performances over the years. I still don't advocate for tearing into McT because I think there's a place in a squad but they are not of the same quality, not even close.
Fred's very good but the midfield is a disaster nonetheless. And, Oh boy, if Spurs had a ounce of creativity in there today it would been a different match.
The existence of this thread is proof that everyone who was part of recruitment is beyond incompetent. If we fans can see it why can't the people at the top see it. We have needed to sign a dm and a CM since Ole's 1st season. 3 years later we are still using the same guys. Brunos insane stats papered over the cracks.
Against Brighton 1-0 down with just McTominay, add Fred & less than 20 minutes later & it is 4-0.
Before the muppets get all excited let me state that in all probability we will start next season with them in midfield.
I'm convinced we're stuck with the McFred midfield forever.
What will be the next dynamic duo if we only sign Frenkie?
McJong
DeFred
Frenknandes
McJong
DeFred
Frenknandes
Fredkie McTong
I reckon both will look considerably better players after a year under Ten Hag.
Fred in particular could thrive in the Schone / De Roon role next to a player like De Jong. I'm also confident Ten Hag will recognise that McTominay is far more effective farther up the field and can be a useful option off the bench for us there.
Fred in particular could thrive in the Schone / De Roon role next to a player like De Jong. I'm also confident Ten Hag will recognise that McTominay is far more effective farther up the field and can be a useful option off the bench for us there.
Pogba and Matic left already but doesn't mean we should be okay with both or either McT and Fred. They are also equally as deadwoods as Pogba and Matic. Time for brand new midfield.
League cup only
Fred will be excellent with De jong. I have no doubt about it
Need to give some perspective on why McFred was used. McTominay and Fred happened to be the only 2 options who could provide energy, consistency, high work rate and defensive capabilities, that is why they were used by Ole and then Rangnick. Because both are not playing in their natural position (McTominay is a CM while Fred is a AM) they have been exposed against teams with better midfield or more compact structure.
ETH might not play both of them in a double pivot. He already has seen and analyzed that tactic so he knows the strength and weaknesses for both players to play there. He will probably shift McTominay to a CM role alongside VDB while he will find another player to fit into the DM role. Probably explains why we are strongly going for De Jong who is capable of playing there (though he is more of a CM).
ETH might not play both of them in a double pivot. He already has seen and analyzed that tactic so he knows the strength and weaknesses for both players to play there. He will probably shift McTominay to a CM role alongside VDB while he will find another player to fit into the DM role. Probably explains why we are strongly going for De Jong who is capable of playing there (though he is more of a CM).
Fred I think will thrive, but I don't see McTominay being good enough in tight spaces or turning to be useful further up the pitch, really. I think he just needs to move to a side lower in the table like Leeds where he can play in a 2 and become a running sort of Laimer type workhorse.
McT isn’t good enough and never will be. He is 25 and he hasn’t even perfected the basics of his position, to the point that his few supporters still talk about him like he is fresh out of the academy with plenty of time on his hands. It’s Criminal.
Fred is serviceable but he certainly doesn’t appear to be someone you can consistently rely on in a title challenging team as a starter. He is not an elite midfielder and he doesn’t have any outstanding quality but it would be a disservice to say he doesn’t have a place and a role in the squad. He just shouldn’t be an automatic starter.
Fred is serviceable but he certainly doesn’t appear to be someone you can consistently rely on in a title challenging team as a starter. He is not an elite midfielder and he doesn’t have any outstanding quality but it would be a disservice to say he doesn’t have a place and a role in the squad. He just shouldn’t be an automatic starter.