The MMA thread

[RedFish]

Bullshit. (unless you are talking about just a grappling match)

in MMA, the wrestler will usually beat the BJJ expert, because he can still win keeping the fight on the feet, while the BJJ would need to take the fight to the ground first, which is not easy against a top level wrestler.

Take Covington playing around with a BJJ 3rd degree black belt in RDA, or better yet, Covington dominating vs one of the best BJJ practitioner in the UFC ever (Maia).

Yeah, it seems wrestling or the ability to wrestle is the single most important advantage you can have as a MMA fighter. I haven't checked but I think I heard on commentary that all except 3 of the active men's champions have a wrestling background.

Prefer standup myself but can't deny the importance of being able to wrestle.

 

[George Owen]

 

[Rick88]

Bullshit. (unless you are talking about just a grappling match)

in MMA, the wrestler will usually beat the BJJ expert, because he can still win keeping the fight on the feet, while the BJJ would need to take the fight to the ground first, which is not easy against a top level wrestler.

Take Covington playing around with a BJJ 3rd degree black belt in RDA, or better yet, Covington dominating vs one of the best BJJ practitioner in the UFC ever (Maia).

What you dont realize is that Covington has also trained in bjj. I am talking about a wrestler with no bjj experience. Kumaru Usman, Covington, Woodley are all black belts in Bjj. All the champions in UFC have a wrestling background except Miocic and Max Halloway.

My comment was only about someone's comment that an Olympic level wrestler would just walk in and dominate. Never will happen as the levels of striking and bjj are at insane levels which people here dont seem to understand. And yes, I still stand by my statement where in a pure wrestler (with no bjj experience) will not be able to win against a bjj black belt and I stand by that statement. I do train in mma and have a blue belt in bjj. So I definitely have an idea about what I am talking about. Someone else who trains, I am willing to engage in a debate with him/her.

 

[Nucks]

What? Put an elite wrestler against a high level black belt of Jiu Jitsu, the wrestler will lose 9 times out of 10. Plus DC himself was an Olympic wrestler. Dont think you understand what level these guys are at.

Uhm, yea no.

I've been watching MMA since 1995ish. BJJ has long since been surpassed as the pre-eminent grappling skill in MMA. The truth is, BJJ was really only effective against wrestlers, when wrestlers had no idea what or how to defend against submissions. The moment wrestlers began to train basic submission defense and understand how to navigate a JJ players guard, was the moment that balance of power shifted inextricably in favor of wrestlers.

Wrestlers are by the nature of wrestling, better athletes. They are more "game bred". Wrestling dictates when and where the fight takes place. Wrestling vs JJ is almost always the Wrestler in the dominant top position, pounding away on the JJ player in the dominated position.

Daniel Cormier was an olympic level wrestler. He never medaled at the Olympics, and he's also 40 years old. 30 year old DC takes Stipe down and decisions him. 40 year old fat DC gassed after 4 rounds. I'll also note that, if DC actually took his diet seriously, he'd probably be fighting at 185 pounds. He has an undisciplined diet, and so has fought at HW and LHW, and was incredibly sloppy at both weights.

Geno Petriashvili would run through Stipe, and hold him down for as long as he wanted. I'd guess that Sadulaev who would technically be a 205 pounder in MMA, would have his way with Stipe on the ground as well.

Most Brazilian (or just JJ) black belts, are essentially amateur hobbyists. Being a black belt means almost nothing, because there is almost no athleticism requirement to achieve a black belt in BJJ. You're not required to be sport competitive to acquire a black belt. Take wrestling for example. Let's use the US model for developing wrestlers. For every division 1a full ride athlete on scholarship for wrestling, there are THOUSANDS of kids who fell by the wayside through the grind of competition. The attrition level at every step of development in wrestling is enormous. Every year kids try out, some make it, dozens don't. Each level this group is whittled down further and further until you reach the college ranks, and virtually every single person who is wrestling in college, is not only an extremely high level athlete, they have a mindset that has been ground to a razor edge through a decade + of grueling competition, and grueling training.

Compare this to JJ and BJJ, which for most is a hobby. Where progression isn't a function of competition, it is a function of time and money. For every Jacare Souza, who is a world class athlete, you have dozens of black belts who have never touched a basketball rim in their entire lives. Who are not elite athletes, and wouldn't last 2 days training with college wrestlers.

So no, there is no equivalence between JJ and wrestling these days. Wrestling is the base of the pyramid now. It has been for a long time. Almost all wrestlers have an interest in MMA now as well, and know how to not be easily submitted, unlike 1993 when BJJ was basically Pearl Harbour to the martial arts world. Nobody saw it coming, or was prepared for it, but once people knew what to do, and how to adapt, the magic was gone. Now wrestlers dominate JJ people.

Just look at the Diaz brothers records. They are journeymen, who are considered among the best JJ players in the game. Why are they journeymen? They are journeymen because they get OBLITERATED by wrestlers.

I'll also add that, just in general, the level of athleticism in MMA is absurdly low for a dynamic professional sport. Yes, there are super athletes in it, like Yoel Romero and Jacare Souza, but the fact that a 42 year old Yoel Romero is arguably the most athletic guy in all of MMA tells you all you need to know. The fact that DC, at 40, was just the HW champ, that Stipe at 37 is NOW the HW champ only further emphasizes this.

The super athletes, are playing soccer, football, basketball, baseball, hockey, or they were going and staying in wrestling, and coming to mma when they can't hack it at the elite levels of wrestling anymore (Yoel Romero, Cejudo for example).

Meanwhile, almost every tier of MMA is dominated by wrestlers, and most of them were never world class wrestlers at the levels they eventually maxed out at.

 

[Nucks]

What you dont realize is that Covington has also trained in bjj. I am talking about a wrestler with no bjj experience. Kumaru Usman, Covington, Woodley are all black belts in Bjj. All the champions in UFC have a wrestling background except Miocic and Max Halloway.

My comment was only about someone's comment that an Olympic level wrestler would just walk in and dominate. Never will happen as the levels of striking and bjj are at insane levels which people here dont seem to understand. And yes, I still stand by my statement where in a pure wrestler (with no bjj experience) will not be able to win against a bjj black belt and I stand by that statement. I do train in mma and have a blue belt in bjj. So I definitely have an idea about what I am talking about. Someone else who trains, I am willing to engage in a debate with him/her.

There are basically no wrestlers anymore who don't know submission defense.

Those guys are black belts in JJ, because they fecking dominate black belts in JJ without having to train JJ. The best part here is, when you say Stipe doesn't have a wrestling background. Guess what, wrestling IS HIS BACKGROUND. He was a NCAA Div1 Wrestler in college.

https://www.espn.in/video/clip/_/id/17439058

Spoiler: 7 year JJ player talking about getting smashed by a college wrestler

 

[Rick88]

Uhm, yea no.

I've been watching MMA since 1995ish. BJJ has long since been surpassed as the pre-eminent grappling skill in MMA. The truth is, BJJ was really only effective against wrestlers, when wrestlers had no idea what or how to defend against submissions. The moment wrestlers began to train basic submission defense and understand how to navigate a JJ players guard, was the moment that balance of power shifted inextricably in favor of wrestlers.

Wrestlers are by the nature of wrestling, better athletes. They are more "game bred". Wrestling dictates when and where the fight takes place. Wrestling vs JJ is almost always the Wrestler in the dominant top position, pounding away on the JJ player in the dominated position.

Daniel Cormier was an olympic level wrestler. He never medaled at the Olympics, and he's also 40 years old. 30 year old DC takes Stipe down and decisions him. 40 year old fat DC gassed after 4 rounds. I'll also note that, if DC actually took his diet seriously, he'd probably be fighting at 185 pounds. He has an undisciplined diet, and so has fought at HW and LHW, and was incredibly sloppy at both weights.

Geno Petriashvili would run through Stipe, and hold him down for as long as he wanted. I'd guess that Sadulaev who would technically be a 205 pounder in MMA, would have his way with Stipe on the ground as well.

Most Brazilian (or just JJ) black belts, are essentially amateur hobbyists. Being a black belt means almost nothing, because there is almost no athleticism requirement to achieve a black belt in BJJ. You're not required to be sport competitive to acquire a black belt. Take wrestling for example. Let's use the US model for developing wrestlers. For every division 1a full ride athlete on scholarship for wrestling, there are THOUSANDS of kids who fell by the wayside through the grind of competition. The attrition level at every step of development in wrestling is enormous. Every year kids try out, some make it, dozens don't. Each level this group is whittled down further and further until you reach the college ranks, and virtually every single person who is wrestling in college, is not only an extremely high level athlete, they have a mindset that has been ground to a razor edge through a decade + of grueling competition, and grueling training.

Compare this to JJ and BJJ, which for most is a hobby. Where progression isn't a function of competition, it is a function of time and money. For every Jacare Souza, who is a world class athlete, you have dozens of black belts who have never touched a basketball rim in their entire lives. Who are not elite athletes, and wouldn't last 2 days training with college wrestlers.

So no, there is no equivalence between JJ and wrestling these days. Wrestling is the base of the pyramid now. It has been for a long time. Almost all wrestlers have an interest in MMA now as well, and know how to not be easily submitted, unlike 1993 when BJJ was basically Pearl Harbour to the martial arts world. Nobody saw it coming, or was prepared for it, but once people knew what to do, and how to adapt, the magic was gone. Now wrestlers dominate JJ people.

Just look at the Diaz brothers records. They are journeymen, who are considered among the best JJ players in the game. Why are they journeymen? They are journeymen because they get OBLITERATED by wrestlers.

I'll also add that, just in general, the level of athleticism in MMA is absurdly low for a dynamic professional sport. Yes, there are super athletes in it, like Yoel Romero and Jacare Souza, but the fact that a 42 year old Yoel Romero is arguably the most athletic guy in all of MMA tells you all you need to know. The fact that DC, at 40, was just the HW champ, that Stipe at 37 is NOW the HW champ only further emphasizes this.

The super athletes, are playing soccer, football, basketball, baseball, hockey, or they were going and staying in wrestling, and coming to mma when they can't hack it at the elite levels of wrestling anymore (Yoel Romero, Cejudo for example).

Meanwhile, almost every tier of MMA is dominated by wrestlers, and most of them were never world class wrestlers at the levels they eventually maxed out at.

Umm just have a look at ADCC. You'll know what elite BJJ practitioners can do. The video you just posted, yes Nick Albin (chew jitsu). Just curious, have you wrestled before or do some now? I hate meeting wrestlers in bjj competitions as they do grind you out. But you generally figure them out.

 

[Dirty Schwein]

Uhm, yea no.

I've been watching MMA since 1995ish. BJJ has long since been surpassed as the pre-eminent grappling skill in MMA. The truth is, BJJ was really only effective against wrestlers, when wrestlers had no idea what or how to defend against submissions. The moment wrestlers began to train basic submission defense and understand how to navigate a JJ players guard, was the moment that balance of power shifted inextricably in favor of wrestlers.

Wrestlers are by the nature of wrestling, better athletes. They are more "game bred". Wrestling dictates when and where the fight takes place. Wrestling vs JJ is almost always the Wrestler in the dominant top position, pounding away on the JJ player in the dominated position.

Daniel Cormier was an olympic level wrestler. He never medaled at the Olympics, and he's also 40 years old. 30 year old DC takes Stipe down and decisions him. 40 year old fat DC gassed after 4 rounds. I'll also note that, if DC actually took his diet seriously, he'd probably be fighting at 185 pounds. He has an undisciplined diet, and so has fought at HW and LHW, and was incredibly sloppy at both weights.

Geno Petriashvili would run through Stipe, and hold him down for as long as he wanted. I'd guess that Sadulaev who would technically be a 205 pounder in MMA, would have his way with Stipe on the ground as well.

Most Brazilian (or just JJ) black belts, are essentially amateur hobbyists. Being a black belt means almost nothing, because there is almost no athleticism requirement to achieve a black belt in BJJ. You're not required to be sport competitive to acquire a black belt. Take wrestling for example. Let's use the US model for developing wrestlers. For every division 1a full ride athlete on scholarship for wrestling, there are THOUSANDS of kids who fell by the wayside through the grind of competition. The attrition level at every step of development in wrestling is enormous. Every year kids try out, some make it, dozens don't. Each level this group is whittled down further and further until you reach the college ranks, and virtually every single person who is wrestling in college, is not only an extremely high level athlete, they have a mindset that has been ground to a razor edge through a decade + of grueling competition, and grueling training.

Compare this to JJ and BJJ, which for most is a hobby. Where progression isn't a function of competition, it is a function of time and money. For every Jacare Souza, who is a world class athlete, you have dozens of black belts who have never touched a basketball rim in their entire lives. Who are not elite athletes, and wouldn't last 2 days training with college wrestlers.

So no, there is no equivalence between JJ and wrestling these days. Wrestling is the base of the pyramid now. It has been for a long time. Almost all wrestlers have an interest in MMA now as well, and know how to not be easily submitted, unlike 1993 when BJJ was basically Pearl Harbour to the martial arts world. Nobody saw it coming, or was prepared for it, but once people knew what to do, and how to adapt, the magic was gone. Now wrestlers dominate JJ people.

Just look at the Diaz brothers records. They are journeymen, who are considered among the best JJ players in the game. Why are they journeymen? They are journeymen because they get OBLITERATED by wrestlers.

I'll also add that, just in general, the level of athleticism in MMA is absurdly low for a dynamic professional sport. Yes, there are super athletes in it, like Yoel Romero and Jacare Souza, but the fact that a 42 year old Yoel Romero is arguably the most athletic guy in all of MMA tells you all you need to know. The fact that DC, at 40, was just the HW champ, that Stipe at 37 is NOW the HW champ only further emphasizes this.

The super athletes, are playing soccer, football, basketball, baseball, hockey, or they were going and staying in wrestling, and coming to mma when they can't hack it at the elite levels of wrestling anymore (Yoel Romero, Cejudo for example).

Meanwhile, almost every tier of MMA is dominated by wrestlers, and most of them were never world class wrestlers at the levels they eventually maxed out at.

Agree with this apart from the bolded. When you talk about Triple C, you better put some respek on it!

 

[Rick88]

Again @Nucks you're forgetting the level that these UFC fighters are at. Galvao is one of the legends in grappling and he couldn't cut in MMA. Striking plays a huge role too. An elite level wrestler with no striking is going to get lit up. A grappler with no wrestling or striking will lose. So will a striker with no ground game. To be a champion or an elite level fighter, you have to have a good mix of all. The comment about miocic getting smothered by a wrestler just kind of showed an ignorance. Maybe if you trained yourself, you'd know.

 

[Nucks]

Umm just have a look at ADCC. You'll know what elite BJJ practitioners can do. The video you just posted, yes Nick Albin (chew jitsu). Just curious, have you wrestled before or do some now? I hate meeting wrestlers in bjj competitions as they do grind you out. But you generally figure them out.

I've never been involved in martial arts. I played football, both kinds, and basketball growing up and into college (american football). I've just been a fan of boxing since the 80's, a fan of MMA since I discovered it in the mid 90's, and have had a pretty astute understanding of combat sports ever since I predicted, and bet all of my friends that Evander Holyfield would knock Mike Tyson the feck out in 1996.

I also acutely understand the difference between JJ and Wrestling as a function of producing athletes. Where JJ does not have what is essentially a factory behind it grinding through young men to find only the fittest, most elite, resilient and competitive specimens. Sport JJ can be effective, but as you can see from that video, it's six of one, half a dozen of the other. The JJ guys can't handle the wrestlers, until they start adapting to and implementing wrestling techniques and counters of their own. At this point there is so much cross pollination in terms of understanding what BJJ/JJ is, that there are no wrestlers who are really being taken by surprise anymore.

Wrestling produces, just as a function of what it is, elite athletes. JJ has some elite athletes, but it doesn't produce them. This means that when the two meet, you almost always have an athletic superiority in favor of the wrestler, on top of a system that is proactive, versus a system that is reactive. Wrestlers seek to put you on your back, and dominate, that is their entire game. Against wrestlers, JJ almost NEVER is the proactive system, it has to react, and whether you're Damian Maia, or Nate Diaz, if you're on your back, you're almost always losing these days.

This is why you have wrestlers, who become black belts in BJJ so quickly. It isn't because they are going to BJJ practice diligently, it's because, without ever going to a JJ lesson, they already are black belts in 80% of the grappling techniques that JJ is going to teach.

 

[Rick88]

I've never been involved in martial arts. I played football, both kinds, and basketball growing up and into college (american football). I've just been a fan of boxing since the 80's, a fan of MMA since I discovered it in the mid 90's, and have had a pretty astute understanding of combat sports ever since I predicted, and bet all of my friends that Evander Holyfield would knock Mike Tyson the feck out in 1996.

I also acutely understand the difference between JJ and Wrestling as a function of producing athletes. Where JJ does not have what is essentially a factory behind it grinding through young men to find only the fittest, most elite, resilient and competitive specimens. Sport JJ can be effective, but as you can see from that video, it's six of one, half a dozen of the other. The JJ guys can't handle the wrestlers, until they start adapting to and implementing wrestling techniques and counters of their own. At this point there is so much cross pollination in terms of understanding what BJJ/JJ is, that there are no wrestlers who are really being taken by surprise anymore.

Wrestling produces, just as a function of what it is, elite athletes. JJ has some elite athletes, but it doesn't produce them. This means that when the two meet, you almost always have an athletic superiority in favor of the wrestler, on top of a system that is proactive, versus a system that is reactive. Wrestlers seek to put you on your back, and dominate, that is their entire game. Against wrestlers, JJ almost NEVER is the proactive system, it has to react, and whether you're Damian Maia, or Nate Diaz, if you're on your back, you're almost always losing these days.

This is why you have wrestlers, who become black belts in BJJ so quickly. It isn't because they are going to BJJ practice diligently, it's because, without ever going to a JJ lesson, they already are black belts in 80% of the grappling techniques that JJ is going to teach.

So it becomes clear that you dont know much about jiu jitsu athletes apart from that in mma. I'd suggest that you look into the ADCC tournament. Wrestlers have come and gone but not too much success. I do expect Nick Rodriguez to do well this year though.

 

[Oggmonster]

Uhm, yea no.

I've been watching MMA since 1995ish. BJJ has long since been surpassed as the pre-eminent grappling skill in MMA. The truth is, BJJ was really only effective against wrestlers, when wrestlers had no idea what or how to defend against submissions. The moment wrestlers began to train basic submission defense and understand how to navigate a JJ players guard, was the moment that balance of power shifted inextricably in favor of wrestlers.

Wrestlers are by the nature of wrestling, better athletes. They are more "game bred". Wrestling dictates when and where the fight takes place. Wrestling vs JJ is almost always the Wrestler in the dominant top position, pounding away on the JJ player in the dominated position.

Daniel Cormier was an olympic level wrestler. He never medaled at the Olympics, and he's also 40 years old. 30 year old DC takes Stipe down and decisions him. 40 year old fat DC gassed after 4 rounds. I'll also note that, if DC actually took his diet seriously, he'd probably be fighting at 185 pounds. He has an undisciplined diet, and so has fought at HW and LHW, and was incredibly sloppy at both weights.

Geno Petriashvili would run through Stipe, and hold him down for as long as he wanted. I'd guess that Sadulaev who would technically be a 205 pounder in MMA, would have his way with Stipe on the ground as well.

Most Brazilian (or just JJ) black belts, are essentially amateur hobbyists. Being a black belt means almost nothing, because there is almost no athleticism requirement to achieve a black belt in BJJ. You're not required to be sport competitive to acquire a black belt. Take wrestling for example. Let's use the US model for developing wrestlers. For every division 1a full ride athlete on scholarship for wrestling, there are THOUSANDS of kids who fell by the wayside through the grind of competition. The attrition level at every step of development in wrestling is enormous. Every year kids try out, some make it, dozens don't. Each level this group is whittled down further and further until you reach the college ranks, and virtually every single person who is wrestling in college, is not only an extremely high level athlete, they have a mindset that has been ground to a razor edge through a decade + of grueling competition, and grueling training.

Compare this to JJ and BJJ, which for most is a hobby. Where progression isn't a function of competition, it is a function of time and money. For every Jacare Souza, who is a world class athlete, you have dozens of black belts who have never touched a basketball rim in their entire lives. Who are not elite athletes, and wouldn't last 2 days training with college wrestlers.

So no, there is no equivalence between JJ and wrestling these days. Wrestling is the base of the pyramid now. It has been for a long time. Almost all wrestlers have an interest in MMA now as well, and know how to not be easily submitted, unlike 1993 when BJJ was basically Pearl Harbour to the martial arts world. Nobody saw it coming, or was prepared for it, but once people knew what to do, and how to adapt, the magic was gone. Now wrestlers dominate JJ people.

Just look at the Diaz brothers records. They are journeymen, who are considered among the best JJ players in the game. Why are they journeymen? They are journeymen because they get OBLITERATED by wrestlers.

I'll also add that, just in general, the level of athleticism in MMA is absurdly low for a dynamic professional sport. Yes, there are super athletes in it, like Yoel Romero and Jacare Souza, but the fact that a 42 year old Yoel Romero is arguably the most athletic guy in all of MMA tells you all you need to know. The fact that DC, at 40, was just the HW champ, that Stipe at 37 is NOW the HW champ only further emphasizes this.

The super athletes, are playing soccer, football, basketball, baseball, hockey, or they were going and staying in wrestling, and coming to mma when they can't hack it at the elite levels of wrestling anymore (Yoel Romero, Cejudo for example).

Meanwhile, almost every tier of MMA is dominated by wrestlers, and most of them were never world class wrestlers at the levels they eventually maxed out at.

Not getting in to the debate that's being had but regarding the bolded bit. I think it tells us he's absolutely roided out his mind to the point he might explode plays a part!

 

[SteveTheRed]

Did I just read that James Haskell, former England rugby player, has signed for Bellator?

 

[Santos J]

Did I just read that James Haskell, former England rugby player, has signed for Bellator?

What the feck, knew they had an announcement but didn't expect that

 

[Dirty Schwein]

Not getting in to the debate that's being had but regarding the bolded bit. I think it tells us he's absolutely roided out his mind to the point he might explode plays a part!

Everyone says this about Yoel but as far as I understand he's never failed a drugs test (except the one tainted supplement that got overturned)? As he was in the Olympics, surely he'd have been tested a tonne more than most...

 

[Oggmonster]

Everyone says this about Yoel but as far as I understand he's never failed a drugs test (except the one tainted supplement that got overturned)? As he was in the Olympics, surely he'd have been tested a tonne more than most...

GSP alluded to the tricks in his podcast, basically he leaves the country and cycles then comes back and is tested there. Something to that effect anyway.

The olympics is pretty corrupt as well, look at Icarus the documentary which explains some of it. I like watching Yoel but he's pretty obviously taking steroids fair enough he's not been caught but I wouldn't have that as a sign of innocence, more they know how to cheat the system.

 

[RedFish]

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FFS!

 

[RedFish]

Did I just read that James Haskell, former England rugby player, has signed for Bellator?

will watch with interest!

 

[giorno]

For every Jacare Souza, who is a world class athlete, you have dozens of black belts who have never touched a basketball rim in their entire lives.

World class athlete=someone who is world class at an athletic specialty

Every sport is different and requires different athletic gifts. There's a broad overlap in certain traits across many sports, but at the end of the day, a world class athlete in soccer is different than a world class athlete in basketball is different from a world class athlete in wrestling is different from a world class athlete in mma

Wrestlers don't need super-reflexes, reactions and explosive hand speed/power. They don't need a body capable of absorbing punishment to a very high degree. An olympic level wrestler with no mma training would get into the cage with Stipe and get Masvidal'd

 

[RedFish]

 

[sammsky1]

McGregor is starting a new PR offensive ...

maybe he's certain he's getting away with the 'Famous Irish Sports Star rape allegation'.

Else a very strange time to ask for forgiveness.


ESPN's Ariel Helwani has an in-depth chat with former UFC two-weight champion Conor McGregor on a host of topics, including his desire to return to the UFC, Khabib Nurmagomedov, future fights, Nate Diaz, his part in a bar altercation, anger issues and much more. This interview comes via ESPN.

 

[Jim Beam]

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FFS!

 

[Luke1995]

Interesting stuff. Now i'm pretty sure ALL questions asked at UFC press conferences are with the blessing of UFC staff

Also, for years I watched these shows like The MMA Hour and had fun with it, but now i'm asking myself if it was all a big lie

 

[George Owen]

Anyone watching Bellator?

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[George Owen]

Nick Newell fighting now... come on!

feck yeah, he made it look easy!! (and with one hand only)

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[George Owen]

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niiice one.

 

[George Owen]

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Mitrione got knock the feck down (without his mouthpiece hahah)

 

[Dirty Schwein]

Interesting stuff. Now i'm pretty sure ALL questions asked at UFC press conferences are with the blessing of UFC staff

Also, for years I watched these shows like The MMA Hour and had fun with it, but now i'm asking myself if it was all a big lie

Wow that was nuts.

 

[RedFish]

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[George Owen]

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Such a nice guy. I hope he wins so they can set up the trilogy.

 

[Raoul]

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[George Owen]

RIP TILL

 

[RedFish]

RIP TILL

What a way to finish your own career. Go Till.

 

[RedFish]

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[Raoul]

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[Hernandez - BFA]

Will be interesting to see Till at middleweight. Should suit him more.

 

[Vato]

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Very hard fight again for Till. If he loses, that might be it for him. What is he on a two fight losing streak now?

 

[Oggmonster]

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Can't wait for him to work his way up the rankings and get caught in another rear naked choke and lose.

 

[Andersons Dietician]

Will be interesting to see Till at middleweight. Should suit him more.

I agree, not having to cut as much weight as he does and deplete himself he should be much better at taking a shot as well but first fight at that weight just throw him Gastelum seems like a big F U from the match makers.

I suppose he is a name and if he somehow wins then that would leap frog him over Costa in to a fight with whoever is holding the belt which would mean more bills for the UFC.

 

[Raoul]

Can't wait for him to work his way up the rankings and get caught in another rear naked choke and lose.

I think he will do well since he’s unlikely to ever face DC again. Would love to see him and Ngannou slug it out some day.

 

[Oggmonster]

I think he will do well since he’s unlikely to ever face DC again. Would love to see him and Ngannou slug it out some day.

Yeah he will probably do better at heavyweight. I think Rumble of old is a tough match up for them all (obviously except DC, I think Stipe would cause him trouble as well.)

He's a bit on the heavy side at the moment isn't he? I saw him at the Bare Knuckle weigh ins and he looked huge....I reckon he'd struggle to make HW limit at the moment!

Think Till loses to Kelvin, it's a ridiculous fight for Till to take, he loses and he's basically done at the top level for a while. He should of taken a lower ranked opponent or at least one without the KO power of Gastelum.