The natural successor: Has Neymar blown it?

VorZakone

What would Kenny G do?
Joined
May 9, 2013
Messages
21,641
Nop. Having seen both players I disagree completely.

Ronaldo's dribbles completed maxed at 3.3 per game in 09/10. Thereafter 2 to 2.5 per game for next 4 seasons. Than around 1 or less per game in all subsequent seasons. Neymar every season completes 5 to 6 dribbles per game.

Ronaldo's ball skills were also never near what Neymar can produce. Which is why he cut them out of his game significantly and even when he did them, they were pointless eg a flick when a simple pass would do. Neymar is the best at tricks and flicks since Ronaldinho.

Than I don't think anyone can argue that Neymar is a better passer, has better vision and creativity than any version of Cristiano.

The main thing for Ronaldo is mentality and goals. Ronaldo has the strongest mind of all the players I have seen; he is a winner in his head and that translates to winning on the pitch; he has wrung the absolute most out of what he has.
I completely disagree. Wasn't Cristiano also consistently ranked highly on assists? I've also seen him pull off incredible passes, just as many as Neymar.

Also, Ronaldo 2006-2008 was a better dribbler I reckon than Ronaldo 09/10.
 

mshnsh

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Mar 17, 2013
Messages
165
Location
old trafford
You really didn't notice Ronaldo in his prime. He had it all.
Nop. I watched him at United and at Madrid. Its an exaggeration to say the least that he had it all. His main strength above anything else is and was scoring goals. His all round play was never really elite.
 

90 + 5min

Full Member
Joined
Aug 8, 2019
Messages
1,757
Nop. I watched him at United and at Madrid. Its an exaggeration to say the least that he had it all. His main strength above anything else is and was scoring goals. His all round play was never really elite.
You are correct about scoring goals. His main attribute. But don't let that take away shine from his other qualities.
 

Traub

Full Member
Joined
Jun 26, 2009
Messages
9,275
Every time I watch PSG this guys gets out-performed by a 33 year old Argentinian team-mate who flopped in the PL. And that includes the games where Neymar actually turns up.
His peak was that game at the Nou Camp vs PSG where he outshone Messi. Hasn’t done anything since, too munch into his own hype.
 

Raees

Legal Guardian of the Football forums
Joined
May 16, 2009
Messages
28,839
Was good in the first half until he got that elbow injury. Then he disappeared. Must have been in a lot of pain.
 

predator

Youth NITK
Joined
Feb 11, 2013
Messages
5,517
Location
South Manchester
He was excellent in the first half when the whole of his team were aswell. Same with mbappe. They were cutting through citys defence with ease.

During the second half, when their team was being outplayed, they did nothing, as they tend to do zilch as far as tracking back is concerned.
 

Pickle85

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Mar 15, 2021
Messages
174
Nop. I watched him at United and at Madrid. Its an exaggeration to say the least that he had it all. His main strength above anything else is and was scoring goals. His all round play was never really elite.
Yep, he was probably never elite in the tackle. Beyond that though he could pretty much do it all, though was obviously better in certain areas. Neymar is a helluva player, granted, and certain things about the way he plays will appeal more to certain people. That said, you are massively overrating him when you compare him to prime C Ronaldo. People talk about Cristiano as a tier one or two of all time...I think you'd be hard pushed to find more than a handful of people (his sister, you and a few others) that would bother with this comparison. Neymar is a brilliant player at his best and a show pony at his worst. Cristiano is on another level. Sure, he may make football look sexier sometimes which maybe turns your head, but it's like comparing ronaldinho and messi.
 
  • Like
Reactions: oneniltothearsenal

calodo2003

Flaming Full Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2014
Messages
10,272
Location
Florida
Yep, he was probably never elite in the tackle. Beyond that though he could pretty much do it all, though was obviously better in certain areas. Neymar is a helluva player, granted, and certain things about the way he plays will appeal more to certain people. That said, you are massively overrating him when you compare him to prime C Ronaldo. People talk about Cristiano as a tier one or two of all time...I think you'd be hard pushed to find more than a handful of people (his sister, you and a few others) that would bother with this comparison. Neymar is a brilliant player at his best and a show pony at his worst. Cristiano is on another level. Sure, he may make football look sexier sometimes which maybe turns your head, but it's like comparing ronaldinho and messi.
Great post.
 

Cascarino

Full Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2014
Messages
3,498
Location
Wales
Supports
Swansea
I don’t think it’s too egregious to claim Neymar was better than Ronaldo when it comes to technical ability. Ronaldo was clearly the superior player and no slouch himself when it came to the technical stuff either, but Neymar being the better technician is a fair assessment imo
 

Eddy_JukeZ

Full Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2012
Messages
12,384
I don’t think it’s too egregious to claim Neymar was better than Ronaldo when it comes to technical ability. Ronaldo was clearly the superior player and no slouch himself when it came to the technical stuff either, but Neymar being the better technician is a fair assessment imo
I would agree.
 

RooneyLegend

Full Member
Joined
May 3, 2013
Messages
11,576
I don’t think it’s too egregious to claim Neymar was better than Ronaldo when it comes to technical ability. Ronaldo was clearly the superior player and no slouch himself when it came to the technical stuff either, but Neymar being the better technician is a fair assessment imo
That's not even up for debate.
 

Amar__

Geriatric lover
Joined
Sep 2, 2010
Messages
19,506
Location
Sarajevo
Supports
MK Dons
I don’t think it’s too egregious to claim Neymar was better than Ronaldo when it comes to technical ability. Ronaldo was clearly the superior player and no slouch himself when it came to the technical stuff either, but Neymar being the better technician is a fair assessment imo
Yep. Ronaldo is nowhere near technically same as Neymar is near overall as a player when comparing their careees.
 

He'sRaldo

Full Member
Joined
Jan 10, 2019
Messages
2,617
I don’t think it’s too egregious to claim Neymar was better than Ronaldo when it comes to technical ability. Ronaldo was clearly the superior player and no slouch himself when it came to the technical stuff either, but Neymar being the better technician is a fair assessment imo
Not at all, unless you mean close control/ ball manipulation. Technically Ronaldo was on par in his pomp.
 

11101

Full Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2014
Messages
14,836
Yep, he was probably never elite in the tackle. Beyond that though he could pretty much do it all, though was obviously better in certain areas. Neymar is a helluva player, granted, and certain things about the way he plays will appeal more to certain people. That said, you are massively overrating him when you compare him to prime C Ronaldo. People talk about Cristiano as a tier one or two of all time...I think you'd be hard pushed to find more than a handful of people (his sister, you and a few others) that would bother with this comparison. Neymar is a brilliant player at his best and a show pony at his worst. Cristiano is on another level. Sure, he may make football look sexier sometimes which maybe turns your head, but it's like comparing ronaldinho and messi.
Agree with your overall post but that's an unfair comparison to Ronaldinho. Those two are far closer to each other than Neymar and Ronaldo ever have been.
 

Bennz McCarthey17

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Sep 5, 2019
Messages
114
Location
Somewhere in South Africa
Supports
Africa
There has never been a version of Neymar that has been on par with Prime Cristiano fullstop :nono: .Every tom dick and harry is being compared to Cristiano, the guy has 5 Ballon D'ors, the only player to win one in the EPL in decades, still hasn't been done since he left 12 years ago. This must be one of those Jokes that posters make a "living" off on here( I've seen a certain poster commenting negatively on every topic Cristiano, weeks later he is a full member). Tells you a lot about this place.
 

Zehner

Full Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2018
Messages
3,940
Location
Germany
Supports
Bayer 04 Leverkusen
Agree with your overall post but that's an unfair comparison to Ronaldinho. Those two are far closer to each other than Neymar and Ronaldo ever have been.
Nah. Ronaldinho was my childhood idol but Neymar in terms of impact on the field isn't far behind him by any means other than sympathy while Cristiano is relatively clear second to Messi.

What distinguishes Cristiano from Neymar is his productivity in his prime. Also a terrific dribbler and good passer but woth twice the output Neymar had. But it's not that much between his best versiom amd this current version of Neymar. Look what he did to Bayern, I dom't remember CR7 having such a game against a top opponent. Meymar is just an unreal player, too.
 

Gehrman

Phallic connoisseur, unlike shamans
Joined
Feb 20, 2019
Messages
4,574
Nah. Ronaldinho was my childhood idol but Neymar in terms of impact on the field isn't far behind him by any means other than sympathy while Cristiano is relatively clear second to Messi.

What distinguishes Cristiano from Neymar is his productivity in his prime. Also a terrific dribbler and good passer but woth twice the output Neymar had. But it's not that much between his best versiom amd this current version of Neymar. Look what he did to Bayern, I dom't remember CR7 having such a game against a top opponent. Meymar is just an unreal player, too.
This Meymar sounds like some player.
 

Ladron de redcafe

Full Member
Joined
Oct 25, 2020
Messages
833
Nah. Ronaldinho was my childhood idol but Neymar in terms of impact on the field isn't far behind him by any means other than sympathy while Cristiano is relatively clear second to Messi.

What distinguishes Cristiano from Neymar is his productivity in his prime. Also a terrific dribbler and good passer but woth twice the output Neymar had. But it's not that much between his best versiom amd this current version of Neymar. Look what he did to Bayern, I dom't remember CR7 having such a game against a top opponent. Meymar is just an unreal player, too.
I think that Cristiano has always been more consistent than Neymar. I agree with you that Neymar at his absolute best is simply a better player. He has way more influence in matches because he's a threat in a myriad of ways, but how often do you get that version of Neymar? His form fluctuates much more than it does for other top players and that had to factor into how a player is rated, in my opinion.
 

Bebestation

Full Member
Joined
Oct 9, 2019
Messages
4,224
Shows that ruling it with one club in one league doesnt mean you can control the world.

It's why my GOAT is a whole different level of proven.
 

Pickle85

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Mar 15, 2021
Messages
174
Agree with your overall post but that's an unfair comparison to Ronaldinho. Those two are far closer to each other than Neymar and Ronaldo ever have been.
I didn't mean it as a knock to Ronaldinho - one of my favourite players ever to watch. Shame his peak wasn't longer but he was another with an incredibly broad skillset, beyond simply being able to do the eye-catching stuff.
 

11101

Full Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2014
Messages
14,836
Nah. Ronaldinho was my childhood idol but Neymar in terms of impact on the field isn't far behind him by any means other than sympathy while Cristiano is relatively clear second to Messi.

What distinguishes Cristiano from Neymar is his productivity in his prime. Also a terrific dribbler and good passer but woth twice the output Neymar had. But it's not that much between his best versiom amd this current version of Neymar. Look what he did to Bayern, I dom't remember CR7 having such a game against a top opponent. Meymar is just an unreal player, too.
I don't agree with either of those things.

I struggle to think of more than one or two big games where Neymar has really stood out. Ronaldinho for a short few years was on the verge of embarrassing some of the best teams in the world, the variety of his trophy cabinet and how integral he was to those wins speaks to that. Outside of Barcelona (alongside a certain Argentinian) Neymar hasn't done much at all of note.

I also disagree Ronaldo is a clear second to Messi. I think he is second, but the variety of environments he has performed in vs Messi makes it less than a clear cut race.
 

Oranges038

Full Member
Joined
Oct 19, 2020
Messages
1,270
Blew it the moment he decided to go to France.

In a few years he'll be remembered the same way as Denilson, a total waste of talent.
 

RedRonaldo

Full Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2003
Messages
12,416
Nop. I watched him at United and at Madrid. Its an exaggeration to say the least that he had it all. His main strength above anything else is and was scoring goals. His all round play was never really elite.
He was already Ballon D’or contender and won multiple player of the year awards before he started scoring many goals, remember?
 

Eddy_JukeZ

Full Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2012
Messages
12,384
I think that Cristiano has always been more consistent than Neymar. I agree with you that Neymar at his absolute best is simply a better player. He has way more influence in matches because he's a threat in a myriad of ways, but how often do you get that version of Neymar? His form fluctuates much more than it does for other top players and that had to factor into how a player is rated, in my opinion.
It doesn't though.

His biggest problem at PSG has been that he can't avoid injuries at all.
 

Eddy_JukeZ

Full Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2012
Messages
12,384
Blew it the moment he decided to go to France.

In a few years he'll be remembered the same way as Denilson, a total waste of talent.
He'll go down as Brazil's record goal-scorer in all likelihood.

Blasphemy if you think he'll be remembered in a negative manner akin to Denilson.
 

Gehrman

Phallic connoisseur, unlike shamans
Joined
Feb 20, 2019
Messages
4,574
I think he has definitely blown his legacy. He'll be remembered as a great player no doubt, but if he had stayed with Barcelona, I think he would have gone down as a Barcelona legend and Barcelona no doubt would have been more succesfull since they replaced him with flops. In the end very few fans care about PSG or the french league.
 
Last edited:

kingwaynerooney

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Apr 6, 2021
Messages
61
Supports
United
Tbh minus the goals there is nothing great about ronaldo's game in Madrid. The man was barely visible.

Uniteds Ronaldo was a different beast. The best in the world. And was much more entertaining than the one who played in la liga.
 

Boavista

Full Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2021
Messages
239
It's unfortunate, but he'll never be rated fairly while playing in France. It's just too few matches people pay attention to, and in the latter stages of the CL his team lets him down. I thought he was brilliant in the first half, and busy tracking back in the second when PSG's midfield was being smothered and lost control entirely.
 

Oranges038

Full Member
Joined
Oct 19, 2020
Messages
1,270
He'll go down as Brazil's record goal-scorer in all likelihood.

Blasphemy if you think he'll be remembered in a negative manner akin to Denilson.
Like it or not. He will be remembered negatively. Here's why.

1. He's a total cry baby and a cheat on the pitch.
2. He took the easy money in France.
3. He's not won anything important with Brazil.

Despite being their record goalscorer. He's not even in the top 5 or 6 best Brazilian attackers , never mind players. Will barely even make the shortlists for an all time Brazil XI and will always be one of the first discarded.
 

SadlerMUFC

Full Member
Joined
Dec 7, 2017
Messages
4,091
Location
Niagara Falls, Canada
If by not reaching the extremely high levels that Messi and Ronaldo set means that he blew it, then of course he did. However, if we expect the next big player to reach those kind of levels as consistently as these 2 have then everyone is going to blow it. The levels these two have played at will only truly be appreciated after they retire. Regardless of which one you like, they are the two best players to ever play the game and it will take someone really special to challenge that. Honestly, we probbaly won't ever see this again. Certainly not in the same era and certainly not playing against each other at least twice per year...
 

Eddy_JukeZ

Full Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2012
Messages
12,384
Like it or not. He will be remembered negatively. Here's why.

1. He's a total cry baby and a cheat on the pitch.
2. He took the easy money in France.
3. He's not won anything important with Brazil.

Despite being their record goalscorer. He's not even in the top 5 or 6 best Brazilian attackers , never mind players. Will barely even make the shortlists for an all time Brazil XI and will always be one of the first discarded.
You're literally talking nonsense.
 

VorZakone

What would Kenny G do?
Joined
May 9, 2013
Messages
21,641
Did some people here actually watch Cristiano in his prime?

He was every bit technically as good as Neymar. Immaculate first touch, great close control on full sprint, flicks, backheels, you name it.
 

Oranges038

Full Member
Joined
Oct 19, 2020
Messages
1,270
You're literally talking nonsense.
Nah, a player with all the talent in the world that blew whatever chance he had of a great and memorable career. By moving to a rubbish farmers league, wrapped up by one team run by oil money every year. He is still trying to sue his former club for a bonuses and payments.

History will not be kind to him. He will be remembered as fondly as a hemorrhoid.
 

Zehner

Full Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2018
Messages
3,940
Location
Germany
Supports
Bayer 04 Leverkusen
Nah, a player with all the talent in the world that blew whatever chance he had of a great and memorable career. By moving to a rubbish farmers league, wrapped up by one team run by oil money every year. He is still trying to sue his former club for a bonuses and payments.

History will not be kind to him. He will be remembered as fondly as a hemorrhoid.
Nah. The criticism of his antics is exaggerated anyway and people will watch his highlights in the future and see his statistics. His reputation will rather increase with th years.
 

Le Red

Full Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2017
Messages
1,368
Did some people here actually watch Cristiano in his prime?

He was every bit technically as good as Neymar. Immaculate first touch, great close control on full sprint, flicks, backheels, you name it.
People just got too used to the "ruthless striker" version of him.
He was fabulous when playing deeper.
 

MrMarcello

In a well-ordered universe...
Joined
Dec 26, 2000
Messages
47,624
Location
On a pale blue dot in space
Neymar has a chance to shine and carry his team in the second leg. It's begging for him to put in a world class, career defining performance. Then go on to win the CL.

It can be done but will it? Probably not.