The natural successor: Has Neymar blown it?

calodo2003

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Neymar has a chance to shine and carry his team in the second leg. It's begging for him to put in a world class, career defining performance. Then go on to win the CL.

It can be done but will it? Probably not.
I would be flabbergasted to see a Neymar masterclass unfold in front of us next Tuesday.

Just ain’t gonna happen. Hope to feck it does, but it ain’t.
 

The Siege

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From his general body language, he has never felt like he's determined to become the best in the world. Like Messi and Ronaldo have this weird hunger that you can see in them, especially Ronaldo. Neymar feels like he just wants to have a good life playing football, make the highest amount of money out of it, and spend the rest of his life chilling. I can respect that, not everyone's in this to have a point to prove.
 

BaillyBaillyBailly

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I would be flabbergasted to see a Neymar masterclass unfold in front of us next Tuesday.

Just ain’t gonna happen. Hope to feck it does, but it ain’t.
From his general body language, he has never felt like he's determined to become the best in the world. Like Messi and Ronaldo have this weird hunger that you can see in them, especially Ronaldo. Neymar feels like he just wants to have a good life playing football, make the highest amount of money out of it, and spend the rest of his life chilling. I can respect that, not everyone's in this to have a point to prove.
I agree, I don't see Neymar pulling a performance out of the hat like he did when Barca knocked out PSG. Even in that game, he was still number 3 in the MSN heirarchy and people were really looking to Messi to save Barca so Neymar's performance came out of the blue.
Neymar has performed in big games in his career but never at the biggest moments, never in finals etc against good teams.
He doesn't seem to want to work hard enough to be considered great. I know Messi and Ronaldo are able to rest on their laurels now and are not expected to defend, but they have earned that. Messi was an extremely hard working part of the team press in Guardiola's early Barca teams, some even cite him as the leader of the press in those teams. Ronaldo is a more selfish player and his hard work went more into himself, making sure he is always in peak physical condition (literally the best he can possibly be in through rigorous sleep schedules, diet, training, conditioning etc). He also trained harder than anyone else.
Neymar just can't be arsed as far as I can tell. Mbappe and Haaland seem to have more of that hard work ethic in them but have less innate talent.
 

RedRonaldo

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Once he decided to play in farmers league during his prime for more money, he is out of it. Still a top player though, but he won’t be remembered as all time greats for sure.
 

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I completely disagree. Wasn't Cristiano also consistently ranked highly on assists? I've also seen him pull off incredible passes, just as many as Neymar.

Also, Ronaldo 2006-2008 was a better dribbler I reckon than Ronaldo 09/10.
Ronaldo has never produced the kind of assist that Neymar produced for the second goal vs Bayern. His assists have mostly been fairly simple passes or crosses or on the counter eg for Rooney vs Bolton in 06/07.

His dribbling was better in 06/07; 07/08 was only sporadically good but mostly relying on pace. 08/09 was a relatively poor season.
Tbh minus the goals there is nothing great about ronaldo's game in Madrid. The man was barely visible.

Uniteds Ronaldo was a different beast. The best in the world. And was much more entertaining than the one who played in la liga.
I agree with you on Ronaldo at Madrid regardless of what his fan boys say. I also agree that Ronaldo at United> Ronaldo at Madrid despite that greater acclaim at Madrid due to his goalscoring feats. But he was never really the BPITW if you watched Messi for Barcelona when fit
Did some people here actually watch Cristiano in his prime?

He was every bit technically as good as Neymar. Immaculate first touch, great close control on full sprint, flicks, backheels, you name it.
Not really. With Cristiano even when he did the tricks and flicks, they looked rehearsed rather than spontaneous the way it is for Neymar or the way it was for Ronaldinho. Something about being Brazilian.
 

VorZakone

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Ronaldo has never produced the kind of assist that Neymar produced for the second goal vs Bayern. His assists have mostly been fairly simple passes or crosses or on the counter eg for Rooney vs Bolton in 06/07.

His dribbling was better in 06/07; 07/08 was only sporadically good but mostly relying on pace. 08/09 was a relatively poor season.


I agree with you on Ronaldo at Madrid regardless of what his fan boys say. I also agree that Ronaldo at United> Ronaldo at Madrid despite that greater acclaim at Madrid due to his goalscoring feats. But he was never really the BPITW if you watched Messi for Barcelona when fit

Not really. With Cristiano even when he did the tricks and flicks, they looked rehearsed rather than spontaneous the way it is for Neymar or the way it was for Ronaldinho. Something about being Brazilian.
Nonsense.

 

Gehrman

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Just since we were discussing Ronaldo's dribbling, I found this. Anyone know's Neymars?

 

weetee

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You are showing me 1 pass/ great cross on the counter attack to justify that he was a great passer? His passing if anything is the weakest point of his game
What about his free-kicks?
 

Gehrman

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I think Ronaldo's passing and crossing is pretty good. It's just not 10/10. I'm talking about over his entire career mainly. In general his all around game as been great, his dribbling, passing, vision just hasn't been quite up there with Neymar and Messi, but at least compared to Neymar he makes up for that with goals galore and important goals as well.
 

thepolice123

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Nonsense.

Ronaldo is a very efficient and clean passer of the ball but he's never on the level of Neymar in terms of creative passes.

It's hard to make a case for Ronaldo here. You're talking about one of Neymar's biggest strengths and one of the weaker aspects of Ronaldo's game (I wouldn't call it a weakness though).
 

mshnsh

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Just since we were discussing Ronaldo's dribbling, I found this. Anyone know's Neymars?
According to who scored:
2013/14: 3.0 per game (21/22)
2014/15: 3.2 per game (22/23)
2015/16: 4.2 per game (23/24)
2016/17: 5.7 per game (24/25)
2017/18: 4.4 per game (25/26)
2018/19: 7.1 per game (26/27)
2019/20: 6.0 per game (27/28)
2020/21: 4.5 per game (28/29)

Now comparing Ronaldo at the same age (according to the graph):
2006/7: 2.8 per game (age 21/22)
2007/8: 2.9 per game (age 22/23)
2008/9: 1.8 per game (age 23/24)
2009/10: 3.3 per game (age 24/25)
2010/11: 2.4 per game (age 25/26)
2011/12: 2.0 per game (age 26/27)
2012/13: 1.9 per game (age 27/28)
2013/14: 2.4 per game (age 28/29)
 

Gehrman

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According to who scored:
2013/14: 3.0 per game (21/22)
2014/15: 3.2 per game (22/23)
2015/16: 4.2 per game (23/24)
2016/17: 5.7 per game (24/25)
2017/18: 4.4 per game (25/26)
2018/19: 7.1 per game (26/27)
2019/20: 6.0 per game (27/28)
2020/21: 4.5 per game (28/29)

Now comparing Ronaldo at the same age (according to the graph):
2006/7: 2.8 per game (age 21/22)
2007/8: 2.9 per game (age 22/23)
2008/9: 1.8 per game (age 23/24)
2009/10: 3.3 per game (age 24/25)
2010/11: 2.4 per game (age 25/26)
2011/12: 2.0 per game (age 26/27)
2012/13: 1.9 per game (age 27/28)
2013/14: 2.4 per game (age 28/29)
Neymars dribbling is probably only second to Messi

 

mshnsh

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I think Ronaldo's passing and crossing is pretty good. It's just not 10/10. I'm talking about over his entire career mainly. In general his all around game as been great, his dribbling, passing, vision just hasn't been quite up there with Neymar and Messi, but at least compared to Neymar he makes up for that with goals galore and important goals as well.
You very correct here except that in terms of creative passing and long range passing requiring vision (and dribbling) he is significantly inferior to those two. But you are also correct in saying that he makes up for those deficiencies in his game by scoring goals galore and many important ones.

In summary, Neymar has always had much better approach play but Ronaldo is a much better goalscorer.
 

George the Cat

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In 10 years time I think I will remember Benzema's name before Neymar's.
This is true. I have never got all the hoo ha regarding Neymar, might be I missed it all but whenever I’m watching a game he’s involved in he doesn’t stand out.
 

RedRonaldo

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According to who scored:
2013/14: 3.0 per game (21/22)
2014/15: 3.2 per game (22/23)
2015/16: 4.2 per game (23/24)
2016/17: 5.7 per game (24/25)
2017/18: 4.4 per game (25/26)
2018/19: 7.1 per game (26/27)
2019/20: 6.0 per game (27/28)
2020/21: 4.5 per game (28/29)

Now comparing Ronaldo at the same age (according to the graph):
2006/7: 2.8 per game (age 21/22)
2007/8: 2.9 per game (age 22/23)
2008/9: 1.8 per game (age 23/24)
2009/10: 3.3 per game (age 24/25)
2010/11: 2.4 per game (age 25/26)
2011/12: 2.0 per game (age 26/27)
2012/13: 1.9 per game (age 27/28)
2013/14: 2.4 per game (age 28/29)
The way you have put it, you have also conveniently ignore the few years where he is making 3.8, 3.8, 4.2 and 3.5 dribbles per games :lol:
 

guardiolafan

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Neymar awful, Mbappe invisible.
Neymar and Di María were great in the first half. Mbappé was invisible, suffered to get past his opponents and was too invisible. Neymar and Di María skillwise look so much better in 1v1 duels or 1v2 duels also.
 

guardiolafan

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Well one thing is certain his caf thread is on the same level as Messi and Ronaldo. Feck me, yes he's very gokd, he's also an annoying twat on the pitch thus the dislike.

In the end he's just a poor man's Robben with worse hair.
No, his career is as good as Robben's and his overall skillset is clearly superior. I love Robben, but say me one thing that Robben does that Neymar can't do.

I hate Neymar off-the pitch, but on it he is an amazing player. He dives a lot, but he also gets fouled a lot.
 

KirkDuyt

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No, his career is as good as Robben's and his overall skillset is clearly superior. I love Robben, but say me one thing that Robben does that Neymar can't do.

I hate Neymar off-the pitch, but on it he is an amazing player. He dives a lot, but he also gets fouled a lot.
I was sure the hair thing would convey the sarcasm.

Robben was definitely faster than Neymar. And a more effective diver. Just ask Mexico.
 

guardiolafan

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I was sure the hair thing would convey the sarcasm.

Robben was definitely faster than Neymar. And a more effective diver. Just ask Mexico.
That's right. Robben vs. Spain is my go-to example of his pace.

Changing the subject from Neymar to Mbappé, Mbappé has similar pace perhaps, but he still has a way to go to better develop his dribbling skills, specially in tight spaces, to at least Robben's level.
 

NasirTimothy

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Well one thing is certain his caf thread is on the same level as Messi and Ronaldo. Feck me, yes he's very gokd, he's also an annoying twat on the pitch thus the dislike.

In the end he's just a poor man's Robben with worse hair.
He’s a much better player than Robben, please stop trolling
 

mshnsh

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The way you have put it, you have also conveniently ignore the few years where he is making 3.8, 3.8, 4.2 and 3.5 dribbles per games :lol:
1.Neymar wasn't playing in Europe at those ages; I'm comparing dribbles at the same age since they predictably decrease with age.
2.Those were his early years when he tried a lot of dribbles but I'm sure the percentage of successful dribbles is relatively low. It was a time when within a game and from game to game he would be brilliant and than extremely frustrating, running into blind alleys,delaying a cross just to dribble, doing keepy ups in the centre circle vs Milan etc
 

SS

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From his general body language, he has never felt like he's determined to become the best in the world. Like Messi and Ronaldo have this weird hunger that you can see in them, especially Ronaldo. Neymar feels like he just wants to have a good life playing football, make the highest amount of money out of it, and spend the rest of his life chilling. I can respect that, not everyone's in this to have a point to prove.
I see people say this a lot, but I've never got that vibe. Say what you want about his diving antics, but on the pitch, he's usually the one forcing the issue. Barca's comeback against PSG being the obvious case. Also, if your assumptions happened to be true, why would he leave Barca at all? Seemed like an easy enough life. I thought it was widely understood that the whole reason he left was because he had a point to prove?
 

KirkDuyt

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He’s a much better player than Robben, please stop trolling
"much" better? I respectfully disagree. They're very different, but peak Robben was devastating in a way that I've seldom seen Neymar.

Obviously Robben was injured half of the time which hampers him, but Id say they're of a similar level.

If I were trolling I'd have called him a poor man'sand less handsome Dirk Kuyt
 

NasirTimothy

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"much" better? I respectfully disagree. They're very different, but peak Robben was devastating in a way that I've seldom seen Neymar.

Obviously Robben was injured half of the time which hampers him, but Id say they're of a similar level.

If I were trolling I'd have called him a poor man'sand less handsome Dirk Kuyt
Obviously you haven’t watched Neymar play very much then, if you insist on this trolling. Yes Neymar is a much better player than Arjen Robben ever was.

How is Robben comparable? Is he a better dribbler? No, unless you have a particular yen for cutting inside the full back and shooting with your left foot. Every. Single. Time. Neymar has much more skill and variety.

Is he a better passer? No. A better scorer? No. A better playmaker? No
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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Obviously you haven’t watched Neymar play very much then, if you insist on this trolling. Yes Neymar is a much better player than Arjen Robben ever was.

How is Robben comparable? Is he a better dribbler? No, unless you have a particular yen for cutting inside the full back and shooting with your left foot. Every. Single. Time. Neymar has much more skill and variety.

Is he a better passer? No. A better scorer? No. A better playmaker? No
That would make for an interesting debate on here.

So many people here hate Neymar, that they'd side with Robben automatically because of that.

For the record, I think Neymar is better than Robben too, but don't think the gap is that big.
 

Zehner

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That would make for an interesting debate on here.

So many people here hate Neymar, that they'd side with Robben automatically because of that.

For the record, I think Neymar is better than Robben too, but don't think the gap is that big.
I agree. Robben to me was the third best player of his generation and unplayable at times. Neymar is better but not by that much. I'd say Robben is closer to Neymar than Cristiano is to Messi.
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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I agree. Robben to me was the third best player of his generation and unplayable at times. Neymar is better but not by that much. I'd say Robben is closer to Neymar than Cristiano is to Messi.
I'd agree with that. People will see it as a slight to Ronaldo, but it's more-so to do with Messi.

He is clearly a level above Ronaldo to me. I'm not sure if Neymar is a full tier ahead of Robben.
 

NasirTimothy

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That would make for an interesting debate on here.

So many people here hate Neymar, that they'd side with Robben automatically because of that.

For the record, I think Neymar is better than Robben too, but don't think the gap is that big.
Yes, many people’s opinions on the matter will be clouded by the bizarre hate that Neymar gets. But if you look critically at their abilities, Neymar is clearly a better player
 

KirkDuyt

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Obviously you haven’t watched Neymar play very much then, if you insist on this trolling. Yes Neymar is a much better player than Arjen Robben ever was.

How is Robben comparable? Is he a better dribbler? No, unless you have a particular yen for cutting inside the full back and shooting with your left foot. Every. Single. Time. Neymar has much more skill and variety.

Is he a better passer? No. A better scorer? No. A better playmaker? No
Robben is a far better dribbler. Bit of a weird opener. Though I suppose that would start the debate of what good dribbling consists of. Some people equate Robinho doing 12 stepovers in a row as the pinnacle of dribbling. Int hat case, yes Neymar is a better dribbler. However, take your point that Robben can only cut inside, why do you think that even though any fullback that ever faced him would probably hammer into his brain, that he will cut inside, was left staring at the ball flying into the net. That's because Robben is an amazing dribbler and even knowing what he will do, you wont see it coming. Other than that, saying Robben can only cut inside is selling him short massively.

I don't think Robben is a better player than Neymar, I'd say they're in a similar league with Neymar edging it slightly. Truly world class, but not as good as Messi and Ronaldo. They're probably also 2 of the most disliked top players of all time.

Oh, and the poor man's Robben was a joke initially, but saying Neymar is not massively better than Robben is not trolling if you ask me. Saying he has worse hair than Robben, maybe..