Television Tho Prop Grops Throps

[Schmiznurf]

To be fair, given how they both are probably not sober, having them limited to remembering the numbers 1 & 2 is a remarkable feat in itself.

Tbh they do look like they've been on the piss whenever they're on

 

[Keefy18]

It is this expectation that the audience or fans, is supposed to already know who is who straight away, without any help, that really puzzles me.
There is almost a snooty, looking down on people feeling, as if you don't know who the "Murder Grandpa" is then you are not a real fan, that is grating.

Yep, very much supersmarks!

Unless your opinion is one where it blows smoke up every single one of their talents backsides then you're wrong and know nothing.

 

[The Hilton]

I have no problem with using cross over people, but the main point is, to educate people who they are, build them up with videos/interviews etc.
If the Japanese ones are not confident with their English, use subtitles on videos.

Just some information, any information would be far better than the current situation of "Look it is Person X from NJPW!", I mean why should anyone care??

There should be meaning and they dhould make people care, as right now, there is none of that.
Just because Tony might know and be excited about Will Osprey or anyone else from NJPW doesn't or shouldn't mean that everyone else will be.
That takes time and patience, and most importantly work to do so.

I mean unless I am mistaken, there was recently a title change in NJPW, but where was the footage on AEW to back that up?
Instead all we got was the new champion showing up out of nowhere, and cutting a promo in the middle the ring....

I mean, who is Jay White, why should I care about him or his title??
It is this notion of expectation, that everyone is supposed to automatically know who all of these NJPW guys are, that is my biggest bug bear.

This notion that everyone is supposed to know who everyone from NJPW is, their backstories, & how they fit in with other wrestlers that AEW have on their roster, and if you don't, then you are somehow a lesser fan, is very odd.
Surely a TV product should be actively wanting to expand their audience numbers, not try to make it as hard as possible to do so??
It makes no sense to me.

If they were to do another cross over (again this has a lot of similarities to the TNA/impact crossover recently, where they didn't use any footage from any impact shows, it was only one way traffic) then they would or should do things a lot differently.

I know we disagree about AEW in general, but I completely agree with regards to the whole NJPW thing, they've fallen back into the early AEW trap of expecting viewers to know who independent wrestlers are. I have no idea who most of these folks are (only the ones who've turned up on AEW previously), and therefore no idea why I should care, and the only two folks who have had any chance on AEW TV to make me care are Jay White and Will Ospreay.

Personally I think it needed to be a slow burn thing for the end of the year, with a lot more time to introduce people to the folks from that promotion and actually build some rivalries, which could have been done piecemeal so as not to interfere with the internal stories going on, which have basically been put on hold until it's done. Or alternatively, tie most of the stories up and then commit to it for enough time to make it worthwhile, like the WWF/WCW Invasion story.

 

[MUW4Eva]

I know we disagree about AEW in general, but I completely agree with regards to the whole NJPW thing, they've fallen back into the early AEW trap of expecting viewers to know who independent wrestlers are. I have no idea who most of these folks are (only the ones who've turned up on AEW previously), and therefore no idea why I should care, and the only two folks who have had any chance on AEW TV to make me care are Jay White and Will Ospreay.

Personally I think it needed to be a slow burn thing for the end of the year, with a lot more time to introduce people to the folks from that promotion and actually build some rivalries, which could have been done piecemeal so as not to interfere with the internal stories going on, which have basically been put on hold until it's done. Or alternatively, tie most of the stories up and then commit to it for enough time to make it worthwhile, like the WWF/WCW Invasion story.

I still maintain no invasion/crossover storyline can be a successful one, or should be given the go ahead, without full and very careful planning by all involved, and that includes, the sharing of storylines, and of footage.

The more in depth a situation is, the more people will care, the more people will want to tune in.

It is as if they saw an opportunity to work with NJPW and took it straight away, perhaps afraid that WWE might nip in if they didn't, and by rushing in, they have very haphazardly ruined what could have been really great.

No video packages, no interviews, no hype, basically nothing to make anyone who isn't a fan become a fan of these NJPW wrestlers.
Not everyone has the time to watch all of the wrestling shows from around the world, people actually surprisingly have jobs, ha e families that all need attention.

So, instead of just getting NJPW people on screen ASAP, they should have ironed out everything before hand.
The issues are of course travel, I understand that, having storylines work on two companies in two different continents isn't easy, but that is something that they should have looked to work out before seemingly rushing into this.

This had sooo much potential, but instead what we are left with is at best a D minus PPV, and no hype at all, no information, nothing.

 

[The Hilton]

I still maintain no invasion/crossover storyline can be a successful one, or should be given the go ahead, without full and very careful planning by all involved, and that includes, the sharing of storylines, and of footage.

The more in depth a situation is, the more people will care, the more people will want to tune in.

It is as if they saw an opportunity to work with NJPW and took it straight away, perhaps afraid that WWE might nip in if they didn't, and by rushing in, they have very haphazardly ruined what could have been really great.

No video packages, no interviews, no hype, basically nothing to make anyone who isn't a fan become a fan of these NJPW wrestlers.
Not everyone has the time to watch all of the wrestling shows from around the world, people actually surprisingly have jobs, ha e families that all need attention.

So, instead of just getting NJPW people on screen ASAP, they should have ironed out everything before hand.
The issues are of course travel, I understand that, having storylines work on two companies in two different continents isn't easy, but that is something that they should have looked to work out before seemingly rushing into this.

This had sooo much potential, but instead what we are left with is at best a D minus PPV, and no hype at all, no information, nothing.

I doubt its anything to do with WWE, more likely Tony Khan getting the opportunity to fulfil a dream.

But as you say, if done well, with the talent available it could be brilliant. But it needed a lot more time to build it than has been given. Still, hopefully they'll learn this lesson and give it a better attempt sometime down the road.

 

[TMDaines]

I think the Forbidden Door build has been disappointing, but wrestlers getting injured and NJPW surprisingly having White beat Okada for their top title put big spanners in the works. The intended card would have looked very different a few weeks ago, with CM Punk vs Tanahashi in the main event. I presume we were supposed to get Okada (c) vs Hangman at one point and Jay White probably putting over a top AEW guy (Moxley?) in a singles match, as that four-way match has never felt like the destination, especially with one already on the card. Add Danielson vs ZSJ and that’s a stacked PPV.

Danielson cut a good promo, and it doesn’t sound as if he will be out for too long. I see the online fanbase as already agreed that anyone other than Claudio Castagnoli would be a disappointment. Certainly Gresham or Moriarty would be massively underwhelming for me. This isn’t a spot for Gargano either unless you are really changing his character.

 

[MUW4Eva]

Once again last night/this morning had all of the issues that have been mentioned previously.

No video packages, no interviews, just appearances.

Who is this Okada bloke, & why is he someone that I should care about?
Why were the commentators getting excited over his appearance??

Tell the viewers, give them some information, don't just expect them to know.

Explain why he is who he is, once again Dynamite was a huge let down in that regard.

Far too much expectation, not enough information.

Looking at the Forbidden Door card, why should anyone care about these NJPW wrestlers?

Why is the women's match not a Forbidden Door match, what is so "Forbidden" about two AEW wrestlers facing each other??

It is a total mess of a card, very poorly put together.

 

[MUW4Eva]

I think the Forbidden Door build has been disappointing, but wrestlers getting injured and NJPW surprisingly having White beat Okada for their top title put big spanners in the works. The intended card would have looked very different a few weeks ago, with CM Punk vs Tanahashi in the main event. I presume we were supposed to get Okada (c) vs Hangman at one point and Jay White probably putting over a top AEW guy (Moxley?) in a singles match, as that four-way match has never felt like the destination, especially with one already on the card. Add Danielson vs ZSJ and that’s a stacked PPV.

Danielson cut a good promo, and it doesn’t sound as if he will be out for too long. I see the online fanbase as already agreed that anyone other than Claudio Castagnoli would be a disappointment. Certainly Gresham or Moriarty would be massively underwhelming for me. This isn’t a spot for Gargano either unless you are really changing his character.

As for your points in bold that I have highlighted, what exactly would have made it a "stacked card"??

How are people supposed to know just who these NJPW wrestlers are, how good or not they are, what they are good at, what their characters are etc, without any information, in the form of video packages, or interviews??

Why this expectation that people are just supposed to know all about them?

So I am interested to know why you think it would be a "stacked card" if those matches you talk about happened, as AEW have done naff all to explain why they might or might not be.

 

[b82REZ]

There's very few winners in a cross promotion PPV. I expect a variety of screwy finishes and time limit draws.

 

[SalfordRed18]

I've pretty much stayed off SC for the past month or two, not really watched any dynamite or WWEb either. I like the look of forbidden door and will most probably watch

 

[MUW4Eva]

I've pretty much stayed off SC for the past month or two, not really watched any dynamite or WWEb either. I like the look of forbidden door and will most probably watch

The question is, why do you like the look of Forbidden Door, as AEW haven't done anything to make anyone get excited about it themselves....

No malice just curious....

 

[SalfordRed18]

The question is, why do you like the look of Forbidden Door, as AEW haven't done anything to make anyone get excited about it themselves....

No malice just curious....

Okada, Tanahashi, Jay white, ZSJ against most probably cesaro(probably gonna be match of the night), all Atlantic championship decider. Also be interesting to see if there's any changes to BC or the UE at the end of the night. If Kenny will appear or not.

More than enough to be excited about the show sells itself. It's a fan service ppv, if you don't watch or not even moderately interested in new Japan then skip it and move on I guess, it's not for you.

 

[sewey89]

I think the Forbidden Door build has been disappointing, but wrestlers getting injured and NJPW surprisingly having White beat Okada for their top title put big spanners in the works. The intended card would have looked very different a few weeks ago, with CM Punk vs Tanahashi in the main event. I presume we were supposed to get Okada (c) vs Hangman at one point and Jay White probably putting over a top AEW guy (Moxley?) in a singles match, as that four-way match has never felt like the destination, especially with one already on the card. Add Danielson vs ZSJ and that’s a stacked PPV.

Danielson cut a good promo, and it doesn’t sound as if he will be out for too long. I see the online fanbase as already agreed that anyone other than Claudio Castagnoli would be a disappointment. Certainly Gresham or Moriarty would be massively underwhelming for me. This isn’t a spot for Gargano either unless you are really changing his character.

I thought he'd re-signed with WWE?

 

[Holocene]

The question is, why do you like the look of Forbidden Door, as AEW haven't done anything to make anyone get excited about it themselves....

No malice just curious....

Not the person you quoted but a good portion of AEW fans are also fans of NJPW or know of the big names like Okada and Tanahashi. I expect it will do good numbers in terms of PPV but not on the scale of a typical AEW PPV. As long as it's not an absolute disaster, I think it will be the start of something great.

I do agree with your overall point though. It hasn't been marketed well or explained to casual fans.

 

[Sylar]

I'm looking forward to the ppv for great matches

There's very few winners in a cross promotion PPV. I expect a variety of screwy finishes and time limit draws.

I'm surprised there wasn't many multi man tag matches

The 4 way will be interesting

I am surprised they didn't do a better job with okada and ospreay. Those are the two you can and should do as surprise people showing up for the reaction
But the rest needed video packages for sure. Especially once the card was decided

My main question was what is the purpose of it in storyline terms. They made a big deal on commentary that a njpw guy might win the aew title and that mox is defending the company on his back but they haven't played it that way at all until dynamite

Dynamite was great fun to watch though. Especially Christian and his promo. Brilliant stuff

 

[Ekeke]

I thought he'd re-signed with WWE?

The rumor was they're interested. Doesnt mean he is.

 

[TMDaines]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

I think the show is cursed.

 

[Sylar]

Danhausen cursed it clearly

 

[MUW4Eva]

I'm looking forward to the ppv for great matches


I'm surprised there wasn't many multi man tag matches

The 4 way will be interesting

I am surprised they didn't do a better job with okada and ospreay. Those are the two you can and should do as surprise people showing up for the reaction
But the rest needed video packages for sure. Especially once the card was decided

My main question was what is the purpose of it in storyline terms. They made a big deal on commentary that a njpw guy might win the aew title and that mox is defending the company on his back but they haven't played it that way at all until dynamite

Dynamite was great fun to watch though. Especially Christian and his promo. Brilliant stuff

For the point in bold, nope, it isn't for the AEW title, it is for the completely made up interim version, so a completely pointless match, with nothing of any importance on the line at all.

 

[MUW4Eva]

Danhausen cursed it clearly

Another hyped but pointless character, what is the point of him?
Just seems to be their version of R-Truth, but without the ability to wrestle or sing, or actually be funny.

 

[cyberman]

So they chucked a him in to render the entire tournament pointless?

 

[Sylar]

For the point in bold, nope, it isn't for the AEW title, it is for the completely made up interim version, so a completely pointless match, with nothing of any importance on the line at all.

I have no issue with an interim title much like with UFC
Of course it also depends on how long punk will be out. If it's a month or two it works but for longer then you might as well strip punk. (Though he had successful surgery or whatever it was but I don't know how long he's expecting to be out)

I think the way they've done it was weird though.

Another hyped but pointless character, what is the point of him?
Just seems to be their version of R-Truth, but without the ability to wrestle or sing, or actually be funny.

I guess for comedy purposes. But then I reckon keeping him to rampage is the best thing. I don't care about him but a lot do. Think putting him with hook was too early but I'm not bothered either way.

 

[MUW4Eva]

I have no issue with an interim title much like with UFC
Of course it also depends on how long punk will be out. If it's a month or two it works but for longer then you might as well strip punk. (Though he had successful surgery or whatever it was but I don't know how long he's expecting to be out)

I think the way they've done it was weird though.


I guess for comedy purposes. But then I reckon keeping him to rampage is the best thing. I don't care about him but a lot do. Think putting him with hook was too early but I'm not bothered either way.

The interim title is pointless, they should have stripped Punk.

AEW fans have previously taken shots at WWE for the lack of appearances by their Champion, (be it Brock or Roman), yet are now seemingly fine with their Champion not defending it, or being on TV.

Punk shouldn't be Champion, there is no reason why he wasn't stripped of it; it is just a farce having an interim belt, which means whoever wins it, isn't a Champion at all, they are nothing.

 

[Sylar]

The interim title is pointless, they should have stripped Punk.

AEW fans have previously taken shots at WWE for the lack of appearances by their Champion, (be it Brock or Roman), yet are now seemingly fine with their Champion not defending it, or being on TV.

Punk shouldn't be Champion, there is no reason why he wasn't stripped of it; it is just a farce having an interim belt, which means whoever wins it, isn't a Champion at all, they are nothing.

Well, its like UFC. they are interim, its not that big a deal. Again it all depends on how long Punk is out for.
If Punk will be back in a month or so, then you have an interim champion and for storyline purposes, you can have the guy (prob Mox) still defending it and being champ but everybody knows the real champ is returning and you will have the face off. Its built in there.

Id agree with you its a farce if we saw stats to back it up. right now, AEW are fine going down that route (like UFC do)

 

[Stevondo8]

The interim title is pointless, they should have stripped Punk.

AEW fans have previously taken shots at WWE for the lack of appearances by their Champion, (be it Brock or Roman), yet are now seemingly fine with their Champion not defending it, or being on TV.

Punk shouldn't be Champion, there is no reason why he wasn't stripped of it; it is just a farce having an interim belt, which means whoever wins it, isn't a Champion at all, they are nothing.

Interim title is essentially a way for them to pass around the no. 1 contender, no? I’ve not been paying attention but thought it was a case of interim guy faces punk when he returns for actual title. So yeah, bit pointless.

 

[CassiusClaymore]

Bummer about Ishi and even more so about Danielson. The other 4 way looks like it will steal the show and really should be the main event because I think Mox will have to carry a past it Tanahashi to a decent match.

It's not the dream card many hoped it would be but I've bought it via Fite as I want to support this going forward and hope they do more cross promotional stuff. Will try and stay up to watch it live as well.

 

[Schmiznurf]

God that Natalya shit was so cringe.

 

[The Hilton]

Another hyped but pointless character, what is the point of him?
Just seems to be their version of R-Truth, but without the ability to wrestle or sing, or actually be funny.

Who cares about singing ability? It's wrestling, not top of the pops!

As for being funny, that's clearly subjective as Danhausen cracks me up plenty, and a couple of folks I've gotten into AEW rank him among their favourite characters.

 

[Minkaro]

Bummer about Ishi and even more so about Danielson. The other 4 way looks like it will steal the show and really should be the main event because I think Mox will have to carry a past it Tanahashi to a decent match.

It's not the dream card many hoped it would be but I've bought it via Fite as I want to support this going forward and hope they do more cross promotional stuff. Will try and stay up to watch it live as well.

I'd bet this won't be the last Forbidden Door PPV. There's so many potential crossover matches they could do, I'd rather not focus too much on the ones that we could have, and more on the ones we do, which are sure to be great.

Really glad Aussie Open are getting this showcase too. I've seen a bunch of their matches when they wrestled in the UK, and they're great.

 

[choccy77]

I saw the first hour of Smackdown last night, I really regret it.

It's bloody awful.

On a separate note,

I hear the King of Swing might be opening a door soon.

 

[cyberman]

Takahashi out now. I’m sorry but I’m struggling to believe in coincidences, there’s going to be a massive fallout from this imo. I’ll bet any money it’s a disaster trying to book this and wrestlers just aren’t feeling it

 

[The Hilton]

Takahashi out now. I’m sorry but I’m struggling to believe in coincidences, there’s going to be a massive fallout from this imo. I’ll bet any money it’s a disaster trying to book this and wrestlers just aren’t feeling it

 

[Ekeke]

Takahashi out now. I’m sorry but I’m struggling to believe in coincidences, there’s going to be a massive fallout from this imo. I’ll bet any money it’s a disaster trying to book this and wrestlers just aren’t feeling it

How much are you betting there wont be a 2nd AEW and NJPW ppv?

 

[Ekeke]

 

[noodlehair]

Christian's Jungle Boy promo

"You had a father, but your father's dead"

Genuinely nearly made me spit my drink back out.

 

[Ladron de redcafe]

A bit of a situation with Kane making his 3rd controversial statement of the past few months:

Kane on SCOTUS Roe v Wade Decision

Lots of backlash from wrestlers, just as there was after his gun stance last month.

 

[TMDaines]

Quite excited for the show now the build is over. Gonna be something a bit different, as I have not seen many of these Japanese guys much at all. Really excited to see ZSJ and Ospreay too as the Brits on a big stage. Not sure when I am actually going to get the chance to sit down and watch though, so will be offline in the interim.

Mox and White feel like safe bets to win, but wouldn’t at all be shocked to see things mixed up. Tanahashi having his name associated with the AEW title has an obvious pull, and I’m sure there is a strong desire for FTR to win the IWGP tag titles, so something will give.

Would love to see the main event of All Out be the desired FTR vs The Young Bucks match for all of the AEW, IWGP, ROH and AAA tag titles.

 

[Sylar]

A bit of a situation with Kane making his 3rd controversial statement of the past few months:

Kane on SCOTUS Roe v Wade Decision

Lots of backlash from wrestlers, just as there was after his gun stance last month.

He's more of a menace without the mask than he was with it

 

[Sylar]

Quite excited for the show now the build is over. Gonna be something a bit different, as I have not seen many of these Japanese guys much at all. Really excited to see ZSJ and Ospreay too as the Brits on a big stage. Not sure when I am actually going to get the chance to sit down and watch though, so will be offline in the interim.

Mox and White feel like safe bets to win, but wouldn’t at all be shocked to see things mixed up. Tanahashi having his name associated with the AEW title has an obvious pull, and I’m sure there is a strong desire for FTR to win the IWGP tag titles, so something will give.

Would love to see the main event of All Out be the desired FTR vs The Young Bucks match for all of the AEW, IWGP, ROH and AAA tag titles.

I can see a big thing where tanahashi wins it and then we still get him Vs punk

 

[Ekeke]

I can see a big thing where tanahashi wins it and then we still get him Vs punk

Or Hangman wins IWGP, Tanahashi wins AEW and then they have a match to settle who is best