The Trump Presidency : Part 2

maniak said:
Something interesting is that if greenland gets invaded, it shows that apparently the US army is pretty vulnerable to the fascistic whims of an insane president.
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Just like we warned about in the 2024 election thread.
 
Tropical Bob said:
Malcom Nance is suggesting that the 11th Airborne Division, stationed in Alaska, is being mobilised on the pretence that they are going to Minnesota, but are actually prepping to go to Greenland. He said over a year ago that if this specific division was mobilised it would be for Greenland. They are a parachute infantry division specialised for extreme cold weather.


He thinks the message Trump sent to Norway was basically a definitive statement that they are going to take Greenland.

I’m not sure people are taking this seriously enough. The confidence of his administration to stand in front of a camera and tell us that white is black, and black is white just tells me that they are all in on this, 100%. It’s push, push, push.
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I read it the same way. I didn’t believe he was going to do it before the letter.
 
Can Norway order the Noble committee to give him a prize now and then every 2-3 months ?

If he sees himself as some global peace keeper, he may stop some of this madness.
 
maniak said:
Half the americans here kept saying the institutions would hold.
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That was wrong and naive. I'm pretty sure you remember me (and plenty of others) screaming bloody murder and telling you that it would be a GRAVE mistake to be indifferent whether Trump or Harris won. All of this was laid out in Project 2025 and there for all to read. The US has fallen.
 
WI_Red said:
Half? It was one person.
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I don't have the energy to go through all that to show you there were multiple people saying he couldn't do this or that because it needed approval from this or that body of government.
 
maniak said:
Half the americans here kept saying the institutions would hold.
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That was in reference to Trump dissolving the constitution, declaring martial law, and suspending elections. When that happens, they would've failed.
 
maniak said:
Raoul was the most obvious because he kept saying it a la baghdad bob while the institutions crumbled in the background, but pre-election there were more.
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Check the CE posting guidelines before posting any further.
 
Freak said:
It’s a real indictment of the American people that they voted this lunatic in as their president. Absolute morons.
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It is. Every single voter who abstained from voting D (in a battleground state obviously) because of this or that is culpable.
 
maniak said:
I don't have the energy to go through all that to show you there were multiple people saying he couldn't do this or that because it needed approval from this or that body of government.
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That's just not what happened. The basis for why most of us were so passionately arguing for Harris, even with her massive policy issues, was because we feared the institutions would be no more than tissue paper.
 
WI_Red said:
That's just not what happened. The basis for why most of us were so passionately arguing for Harris, even with her massive policy issues, was because we feared the institutions would be no more than tissue paper.
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Exactly. @maniak was one of the posters who got really told off as well for being "Meh" about the importance of the Dems winning if I recall correctly...What was going to happen was so clear and obvious - which is why we went crazy!
 
SirAF said:
Exactly. @maniak was one of the posters who got really told off as well for being "Meh" about the importance of the Dems winning if I recall correctly...What was going to happen was so clear and obvious - which is why we went crazy!
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I was never meh, I simply said I wouldn't vote a genocide supporter. I never said there would be no differences and I never denied trump would be worse than harris, that was always obvious.
 
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WI_Red said:
That's just not what happened. The basis for why most of us were so passionately arguing for Harris, even with her massive policy issues, was because we feared the institutions would be no more than tissue paper.
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I guess people can just read the pre-election thread if they want to see who's right.
 
maniak said:
I was never meh, I simply said I wouldn't vote a genocide supporter. I never said there would be no differences and I never denied trump would be worse than harris, that was always obvious.
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Which is bad enough when Trump would do nothing to stop said genocide and it was clear that Harris would be infinitely better in every single other topic. You need to be pragmatic in politics sometimes - that was such a time. You have to back the "lesser evil" in such a grave matter.
 
SirAF said:
Which is bad enough when Trump would do nothing to stop said genocide and it was clear that Harris would be infinitely better in every single other topic. You need to be pragmatic in politics sometimes - that was such a time.
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Everyone has red lines, you disagree with mine, that's fine.
 
maniak said:
Everyone has red lines, you disagree with mine, that's fine.
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There's nothing wrong with having had a principled issue about Gaza at the time. You could even say that Trump getting elected may have accelarated the peace deal since there's a higher likelihood Bibi wouldn't have done business with Harris.
 
maniak said:
Everyone has red lines, you disagree with mine, that's fine.
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Yeah, my red line is not voting against a fascist president who uses the military against his own people while plotting to invade Greenland.
 
Tropical Bob said:
Malcom Nance is suggesting that the 11th Airborne Division, stationed in Alaska, is being mobilised on the pretence that they are going to Minnesota, but are actually prepping to go to Greenland. He said over a year ago that if this specific division was mobilised it would be for Greenland. They are a parachute infantry division specialised for extreme cold weather.


He thinks the message Trump sent to Norway was basically a definitive statement that they are going to take Greenland.

I’m not sure people are taking this seriously enough. The confidence of his administration to stand in front of a camera and tell us that white is black, and black is white just tells me that they are all in on this, 100%. It’s push, push, push.
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What would you like to see from EU governments to indicate a higher degree of seriousness? I think below the surface they are basically in panic mode, but of course keep it contained in public. I don't see a lot of people saying "This won't happen" anymore. It's a distinct possibility - the US is just that deranged now.

As for the specifics of the 11th Air Brigade, that does seem a tad worrying. I do wonder if there is absolute loyalty in the high command. Surely there are generals that see the madness of this.
 
Mike Smalling said:
What would you like to see from EU governments to indicate a higher degree of seriousness? I think below the surface they are basically in panic mode, but of course keep it contained in public. I don't see a lot of people saying "This won't happen" anymore. It's a distinct possibility - the US is just that deranged now.

As for the specifics of the 11th Air Brigade, that does seem a tad worrying. I do wonder if there is absolute loyalty in the high command. Surely there are generals that see the madness of this.
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This is why Trump placed an incompetent stooge to run the "Department of War". Hegseth has also purged a few Generals after taking over, so if things ever get really bad, the liklihood of a senior officer revolt is substantially less than what it would've been 10 months ago, or during Trump's first term when he was still surrounded by moderately normal people.
 
Beans said:
I mean, China *is* a threat, they’re worse than Trump.

Not to take away from his ineptitude, but China doesn’t get to take the high road with their treatment of the Uyghurs, attacks against India and their usurpation of the South China Sea by attacking the ships of other nations.
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Are we sure that's still the case?
 
SirAF said:
Which is bad enough when Trump would do nothing to stop said genocide and it was clear that Harris would be infinitely better in every single other topic. You need to be pragmatic in politics sometimes - that was such a time. You have to back the "lesser evil" in such a grave matter.
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That's just kicking the can down the road. If you continually keep voting for the lesser evil, who don't actually do much to change things, the Overton window keeps shifting and you're eventually going to end up with the greater evil anyway.
 
Mogget said:
That's just kicking the can down the road. If you continually keep voting for the lesser evil, who don't actually do much to change things, the Overton window keeps shifting and you're eventually going to end up with the greater evil anyway.
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What is the option though? Hoping that Trump and the Far Right extremists of the Republican Party burns down the US completely so something "better" (than the current Dems, spoiler it's not happening) can emerge? I vehemently disagree, you have to fight that shit all the way.
 
Mogget said:
That's just kicking the can down the road. If you continually keep voting for the lesser evil, who don't actually do much to change things, the Overton window keeps shifting and you're eventually going to end up with the greater evil anyway.
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This makes a lot of sense, but its very hard to apply in a two party political system where both choices are often bad, or a lesser version of bad.
 
Raoul said:
This is why Trump placed an incompetent stooge to run the "Department of War". Hegseth has also purged a few Generals after taking over, so if things ever get really bad, the liklihood of a senior officer revolt is substantially less than what it would've been 10 months ago, or during Trump's first term when he was still surrounded by moderately normal people.
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Yep, that's certainly a step in the right direction for them. Still, I imagine most Generals and Admirals to be fairly rational individuals and not MAGA morons, but perhaps that's just wishful thinking.
 
Raoul said:
This makes a lot of sense, but its very hard to apply in a two party political system where both choices are often bad, or a lesser version of bad.
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Exactly. Which is why every sane person is stuck with the Dems for better or worse. There's a guy at work who is disillusioned with everything politics who claims that they are "both as bad as each other" - drives me crazy. That's the attitude that has landed us (not just the US) in this whole mess.
 
SirAF said:
Exactly. Which is why every sane person is stuck with the Dems for better or worse. There's a guy at work who is disillusioned with everything politics who claims that they are "both as bad as each other" - drives me crazy. That's the attitude that has landed us (not just the US) in this whole mess.
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Yep. And perhaps its a bit unfair to the Dems to call them a lesser version of bad. I'm sure that if you listed 10 prominent policy positions (both domestic and foreign affairs), that most on here would side with the Dems on nearly all of them.
 
Raoul said:
Yep. And perhaps its a bit unfair to the Dems to call them a lesser version of bad. I'm sure that if you listed 10 important policy positions (both domestic and foreign affairs), that most on here would side with the Dems on nearly all of them.
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Absolutely, I realize they have their faults but they are criticized way too much on here imho. Every progressive policy in modern day USA has come from the Democrats, not the GOP so that has to count for something,
 
Mogget said:
That's just kicking the can down the road. If you continually keep voting for the lesser evil, who don't actually do much to change things, the Overton window keeps shifting and you're eventually going to end up with the greater evil anyway.
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Is it not preferable for progressives to have the can kicked down the road for five years when the other option is a fascist regime that will do all it can to cling on to power and will rip up every institution that it can along the way?
 
Chip said:
Are we sure that's still the case?
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I don't think we are... Can't say I've seen a compelling case recently.

Mogget said:
That's just kicking the can down the road. If you continually keep voting for the lesser evil, who don't actually do much to change things, the Overton window keeps shifting and you're eventually going to end up with the greater evil anyway.
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What's an effective alternative though?
 
Mogget said:
That's just kicking the can down the road. If you continually keep voting for the lesser evil, who don't actually do much to change things, the Overton window keeps shifting and you're eventually going to end up with the greater evil anyway.
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If you don’t vote for the lesser evil, you accelerate the development that you don’t want and lose precious time, in which civil society can organise itself and attempt to find measures to fight back.
 
Chip said:
Are we sure that's still the case?
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The one thing America had as a moral superiority in their argument was that they were not 'directly' threatening any democratic state (which was obviously arguable by anyone from the middle East, Vietnam, or pretty much anywhere in South America).

The Chinese red line regarding Taiwan almost looks milquetoast in comparison to Trump threatening fellow NATO members and it's absolutely astonishing that the democratic apparatus of America is allowing him to unilaterally destroy any and all goodwill left for the United States.

I expected this hawkish, unpredictable Trumpian politics to at least understand the basic tenets of not going after your allies but I suppose after his behaviour towards Zelensky we shouldn't be surprised. And it wouldn't surprise me if, in future, this doesn't push the rest of the world wholesale towards China, gleefully.
 
GazTheLegend said:
The one thing America had as a moral superiority in their argument was that they were not 'directly' threatening any democratic state (which was obviously arguable by anyone from the middle East, Vietnam, or pretty much anywhere in South America).

The Chinese red line regarding Taiwan almost looks milquetoast in comparison to Trump threatening fellow NATO members and it's absolutely astonishing that the democratic apparatus of America is allowing him to unilaterally destroy any and all goodwill left for the United States.

I expected this hawkish, unpredictable Trumpian politics to at least understand the basic tenets of not going after your allies but I suppose after his behaviour towards Zelensky we shouldn't be surprised. And it wouldn't surprise me if, in future, this doesn't push the rest of the world wholesale towards China, gleefully.
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The strange thing is that no nation of any political relevance seems to have any moral superiority at this point. The two remaining super powers are both struggling for different reasons and the nation with the most nukes is on the cusp of an economic implosion. This is looking more and more like the beginning of the end of the post WW2 international order and the beginning of something new. Unfortunately, it also means several wars will be on the horizon.
 
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