UEFA Super Cup 2020 - Bayern Munich v Sevilla (8pm UK time)

SilentStrike

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Sorry to break it to you, but Kimmich just won a treble as a midfielder.
While I don't disagree, for some reason I feel that the current Bayern haven't matched that 2013 Bayern side yet. Nothing against the current Bayern, but I rate that 2013 side as one of the best club teams ever, certainly top 3. Surely the current Bayern generation can match that, but they haven't yet. Just like Kimmich can match Schweinsteiger, but he hasn't yet.

That world cup final, where first Khedira got injured in warmup and later Kramer early on in the game, which caused Schweinsteiger to be the lone CM for almost 120 minutes was the most warrior-like performace I have seen. The way he marked Messi out of the game while also having a personal battle with Marscherano, was unbelievable. A performance forever in the history books. Sure, again, Kimmich is 25 and can match that, he has the same fighting spirit in him as Schweinsteiger in that final, but he hasn't yet.
 

NoPace

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Sorry to break it to you, but Kimmich just won a treble as a midfielder.
He made the key play in the CL final from RB? It was a cross right onto Coman's head so good he scored even though he's shite in the air?

Kimmich is a very very good DM, but he and Alexander-Arnold seem miles ahead of everyone else at RB so it's just tough to see how Bayern and even Germany are better off with him at DM and not RB.
 

Acrobat7

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While I don't disagree, for some reason I feel that the current Bayern haven't matched that 2013 Bayern side yet. Nothing against the current Bayern, but I rate that 2013 side as one of the best club teams ever, certainly top 3. Surely the current Bayern generation can match that, but they haven't yet. Just like Kimmich can match Schweinsteiger, but he hasn't yet.

That world cup final, where first Khedira got injured in warmup and later Kramer early on in the game, which caused Schweinsteiger to be the lone CM for almost 120 minutes was the most warrior-like performace I have seen. The way he marked Messi out of the game while also having a personal battle with Marscherano, was unbelievable. A performance forever in the history books. Sure, again, Kimmich is 25 and can match that, he has the same fighting spirit in him as Schweinsteiger in that final, but he hasn't yet.
Don‘t think your reply was intended for me but nonetheless I agree for the most part. ;)
 

hasanejaz88

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While I don't disagree, for some reason I feel that the current Bayern haven't matched that 2013 Bayern side yet. Nothing against the current Bayern, but I rate that 2013 side as one of the best club teams ever, certainly top 3. Surely the current Bayern generation can match that, but they haven't yet. Just like Kimmich can match Schweinsteiger, but he hasn't yet.

That world cup final, where first Khedira got injured in warmup and later Kramer early on in the game, which caused Schweinsteiger to be the lone CM for almost 120 minutes was the most warrior-like performace I have seen. The way he marked Messi out of the game while also having a personal battle with Marscherano, was unbelievable. A performance forever in the history books. Sure, again, Kimmich is 25 and can match that, he has the same fighting spirit in him as Schweinsteiger in that final, but he hasn't yet.
I was going to to start a thread after the final for comparing the 2013 side versus this year's to see what people thought as to which was better.

The 2013 does have this aura of invincibility around them given how easily they dismissed high quality teams (Juve, Barca), but then again this Bayern side won every match in the UCL season while in 2013 they lost twice (BATE and Arsenal).

I think the aggressive pressing tactics Fink has employed goes against his team because it makes them look more vulnerable in defense than they actually were. They conceded 8 goals in 11 games while the 2013 side conceded 11 in 13, that doesn't factor the vastly superior amount of goals this team scored over their 2013 counterparts.

I think people would consider Heynckes more balanced tactics a better fit against Finks heavy pressing style in a one off match. You would consider Robben-Ribery, with Schweinsteiger at the base on midfield, to be able to open up 2020 Bayerns defense at will, but then against Neymar-Mbappe-Di Maria weren't able to when many thought their would as well.

I don't think we're ever seen a team as ruthlessly dominant as the 2020 Bayern team in recent years, should be considered as one of the greatest single season UCL teams.
 

Acrobat7

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What are you on about? He played as a right back in the final stages of the CL.
He played probably 3 out of 50 games at RB due to Pavard being injured. The others he played as a DM/CM.
He is a midfielder.
 

Acrobat7

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The most important games of the season he played them at right back.
Mate, he played there because there was no RB available. Yes, I choose to ignore Odriozola who was hot trash.

You claimed that „Kimmich should win a treble as a midfielder first“.

It is completely okay if you don’t rate him. Opinions luckily differ. But you phrased it as if Kimmich had been playing RB this season. Maybe you only watched the CL Finals tournament and not the 47 other Bayern matches. That is obviously okay since I also don’t watch a lot of the games of teams i don’t follow.

Kimmich is a midfielder. He played last season as a midfielder. He will play this season as a midfielder.
 

Piratesoup

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Since Schweinsteiger never won the treble as a RB, I gotta give it to Kimmich.
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Acrobat7

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Since Schweinsteiger never won the treble as a RB, I gotta give it to Kimmich.
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Schweinsteiger also never played for Stuttgart. That’s a stain on his resume as well.
 

kaiser1

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I think 2020 team shades the 2013
The 2013 team were not this dominant they struggled vs Arsenal Valencia and Bate in the group
2020 crushed everyone home and away.
Spurs 10-3, Chelsea 7-1, Barcelona 8-2
Probably the world cup win improved the perception of the 2013 team
 

Lagger

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You mean when he was a winger? He was pretty much a mediocre one. However as a midfielder very few have been better than him. Certainly can't compare kimmich to him. He's won all that as a right back. We'll see if Bayern win a treble with him in midfield.
Out of 11 games in the CL, he played 5 in DM, 6 as RB. In the domestic cup, it's 3 and 3. In the BL, he played all 34 games in DM.

So when you say "He's won all that as a right back." that's factually incorrect. Sorry. He "won all that" basically playing DM and you only paid attention to the last four games because of the mini-tournament they had, where he was put back in that position due to Pavard's injury. Sorry to embarass you, I gave you an out but you didn't take it. This is on you.
 

SilentStrike

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I think 2020 team shades the 2013
The 2013 team were not this dominant they struggled vs Arsenal Valencia and Bate in the group
2020 crushed everyone home and away.
Spurs 10-3, Chelsea 7-1, Barcelona 8-2
Probably the world cup win improved the perception of the 2013 team
I'm sure I didn't watch the Bate game but I did watch Bayern vs Arsenal and it's quite ridiculous to say Bayern struggled tbh.

The first leg in London Arsenal were lucky they had lost 'only' 1-3.

Then in Munich Bayern were in controll all game, had good chances all game and then Arsenal fluked two late goals, one if which in extra time if my memory serves me well so even then Bayern weren't in trouble for a moment. It was more complacency than anything else, after winning the first leg with 3 away goals.
 

Libano

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Out of 11 games in the CL, he played 5 in DM, 6 as RB. In the domestic cup, it's 3 and 3. In the BL, he played all 34 games in DM.

So when you say "He's won all that as a right back." that's factually incorrect. Sorry. He "won all that" basically playing DM and you only paid attention to the last four games because of the mini-tournament they had, where he was put back in that position due to Pavard's injury. Sorry to embarass you, I gave you an out but you didn't take it. This is on you.
The 2013 team was defensively more solid but the 2013 team is more dangerous going forward. Close call.
 

hasanejaz88

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I think 2020 team shades the 2013
The 2013 team were not this dominant they struggled vs Arsenal Valencia and Bate in the group
2020 crushed everyone home and away.
Spurs 10-3, Chelsea 7-1, Barcelona 8-2
Probably the world cup win improved the perception of the 2013 team
As @SilentStrike said (btw it was one early goal and one late goal by Arsenal), Bayern dominated both games against Arsenal and missed plenty chances in the 2nd leg. They also didn't play their full XI with Ribery, Schweinsteiger and Boateng.

2013 seemed to win their matches with utter calmness, without panic, while in 2020 you saw the defenders having to make last ditch challenges or Neuer having to sweep danger away. Again, it might be planned in the sense that they are expecting these situations given their tactics, but it doesn't look as assuring as the 2013 side, who, it seemed, just meticulously took apart the opposition like clockwork.
 
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Lagger

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The 2013 team was defensively more solid but the 2013 team is more dangerous going forward. Close call.
I am reluctant to put one team over the other or comparing players. Different situations shape different players. 2013 and 2020 were both pretty decent teams. The biggest difference is that 2013 saw a team in its autumn, having perhaps one of the last big opportunities to make something happen, whereas this 2020 team is in its spring, with only a few key players being over 30 (Neuer, Müller, Lewa). Everyone knew 2013 was difficult to keep up, this time around it feels like the team might actually keep up the challenge for a few more years.

Biggest task for the future, replacing Lewa and Neuer. They are crucial to the game and they are most difficult to replace. And of those two, I'm most concerned with Lewa's replacement. I've only seen Makaay be as clinical as Lewa. I don't think I know of any striker currently alive that could replace Lewa.
 

kaiser1

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I'm sure I didn't watch the Bate game but I did watch Bayern vs Arsenal and it's quite ridiculous to say Bayern struggled tbh.

The first leg in London Arsenal were lucky they had lost 'only' 1-3.

Then in Munich Bayern were in controll all game, had good chances all game and then Arsenal fluked two late goals, one if which in extra time if my memory serves me well so even then Bayern weren't in trouble for a moment. It was more complacency than anything else, after winning the first leg with 3 away goals.
Vs Bate we lost 3-1 away. I think we got 11 points in the group tied with Valencia while the 2020 team won every game

Vs Arsenal we were on the brink of elimination. Muller and Robben spent the last few mins of the Arsenal game taking the ball to the corner flag to waste time. After that game many people wrote us off including Wenger. The 2020 team was named favorite way early because of their dominant display

@hasanejaz88 our first leg vs Juventus was far from comfortable. After the early Alaba goal Juventus took control in Munich. Ironically what changed things was the injury to Toni Kroos which forced us to play Robben. Robben introduction pushed Juventus back and Bayern gained control.

The final vs Dortmund was far from calm. In the first 30mins Dortmund had about 4 shots on goal which Kuba and Lewandoski missed or Neuer saved. Until Schweinsteiger dropped between the 2 CBs to lift the ball over Dortmund press