UK General Election - 12th December 2019 | Con 365, Lab 203, LD 11, SNP 48, Other 23 - Tory Majority of 80

[Fluctuation0161]

Along with the peerage offers, misuse of public funds and lying to the Queen. It's amazing because without a doubt just a single of one them would have destroyed Labour's election chances. But, alas, we live in the world of post truth.

Can you imagine the media coverage if Corbyn had done what Johnson has done!

It is ridiculously under covered and the Tories are left unchallenged by most journalists and pundits.

 

[Kinsella]

Yeah but I need the rent from my second home and my kid needs to go to private school. Honestly though I'm actually a very caring person.

Does the evidence that you're a very caring person extend beyond who you vote for?

 

[Sweet Square]

What do you think influenced their opinion? If not the media, then what? Bearing in mind it's been a concerted media effort over a long period of time.

It has to be this.

Completely my own original take here and haven't stolen this at all!

Just as the Thatcherites and the Cameronites were the dynasty of finance capital, so the Borisites are the dynasty of the retiree. The chosen one of the retiree is not the Boris who submitted to parliament but the Boris who dismissed parliament.

The property owning retiree forms an enormous mass whose members live in similar conditions but without entering into manifold relations with each other. Their mode of living isolates them from one another instead of bringing them into mutual intercourse. The isolation is furthered by poor means of communication(Be it the lack of such things as the internet or the lack of ability to use the internet correctly), transport(Lack of public transport or they already own a car) and the semi poverty of the retirees. Their field of living - semi-detached homes, permits no application of science, and therefore no multifariousness of development, no diversity of talent, no wealth of social relationships(Rupert Murdoch plays a large role here). Each individual retiree is almost self-sufficient, directly paying most of their consumer needs, and thus acquires their means of life more through an exchange with tesco than in intercourse with society. A semi-detached, the retiree and his/her property; beside it another semi-detached, another retiree and another semi detached. A few score of these constitute a village, and a few score villages constitute Hartlepool.

Insofar as millions of retirees live under conditions of existence that separate their mode of life, their interests, and their culture from those of the other classes, and put them in hostile opposition to the latter, they form a class. Insofar as there is merely a local interconnection among these property owning retirees, and the identity of their interests forms no community, and no political organization among them, they do not constitute a class. They are therefore incapable of asserting their class interest in their own name, whether through a parliament or a referendum. They cannot represent themselves, they must be represented. Their representative must at the same time appear as their master, as an authority over them, an unlimited governmental power which protects them from the other classes. The political influence of the property owning retiree, therefore, finds its final expression in the executive power which subordinates society to itself.

Historical tradition gave rise to the english retiree belief in the miracle of a referendum that would bring all glory back to them. And there turned up an individual who claims to be the man of the referendum - Boris.

But let us not misunderstand. The Boris government represents not the revolutionary, but the conservative retiree; not the retiree who strikes out beyond the condition of his/her social existence, but rather one who wants to consolidate his/her existence; not the countryfolk who in alliance with the cities want to overthrow the old model through their solitary , but on the contrary those who, in solid seclusion within this old model want to see themselves and their houses saved and favored by the ghost of Empire. It represents not the enlightenment but the superstition of the retiree; not his judgment but his prejudice; not his future but his past.

 

[Buster15]

Can you imagine the media coverage if Corbyn had done what Johnson has done!

It is ridiculously under covered and the Tories are left unchallenged by most journalists and pundits.

Exactly that. A combination of an almost exclusively right wing press coupled with a very right wing forthcoming tory government will deal a significant body blow to democracy in this country.
They will be free to do exactly what they choose unless there is a very strong opposition to hold them to account.
Despite some interesting Labour policies Corbyn is simply not electable and the quicker he is replaced the better.

 

[Sweet Square]

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The Green Party are shite.

 

[esmufc07]

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The Green Party are shite.

All the party’s are shite.

 

[Ubik]

All the party’s are shite.

The electoral system is shite.

 

[esmufc07]

The electoral system is shite.

We had a chance to change it but no fecker voted

 

[T00lsh3d]

Hull is a bit of a weird one with Hull East, Prescott's old seat, only around three miles from my mum in David Davis's Haltemprice and Howden constituency, which is super-Tory.
But yeah the likes of Hull and Sunderland voting Johnson is remarkable. Both parties must simultaneously have their worst ever leaders.

I’m West & Hessle which Emma Hardy. I suppose Labour were in a damned-if-you-do damned-if-you-dont position. If they’d come out and backed leave we wouldn’t be having this conversation....but they’d have lost their remain constituencies in the south.

 

[Kentonio]

I’m West & Hessle which Emma Hardy. I suppose Labour were in a damned-if-you-do damned-if-you-dont position. If they’d come out and backed leave we wouldn’t be having this conversation....but they’d have lost their remain constituencies in the south.

There’s a lot of confusion over the leave constituencies in the north too. Just because the constituency itself is majority leave and Labour hold it, doesn’t mean a majority of Labour supporters in that constituency are Leavers.

Labour are a hugely Remain supporting party. That needs to be remembered.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

Exactly that. A combination of an almost exclusively right wing press coupled with a very right wing forthcoming tory government will deal a significant body blow to democracy in this country.
They will be free to do exactly what they choose unless there is a very strong opposition to hold them to account.
Despite some interesting Labour policies Corbyn is simply not electable and the quicker he is replaced the better.

Not electable according to the same right wing media which you (rightly imo) criticised. Maybe the damage to democracy has already been done, making us believe someone like Corbyn is unelectable but Boris Johnson is.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

It has to be this.

Certainly a big factor is that older demographic more likely to vote conservative and simultaneously more likely to vote than the younger demographic.

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politic...06/13/how-britain-voted-2017-general-election

How many years are we going to have to wait for Labour to reach tipping point? Maybe this is why Tories want electoral 'reform', changing constituency boundaries and no vote for 16 year olds!

 

[Jippy]

What do you think influenced their opinion? If not the media, then what? Bearing in mind it's been a concerted media effort over a long period of time.

In terms of voting Brexit? Or Tory? My mum's a floating voter, dunno about her partner.

Sadly I fear my mother voted on immigration largely, despite loving her non-white African immigrant daughter-in-law

 

[Grinner]

Do the libs still bang on about PR? That was always their big issue.

 

[Hammerfell]

All the party’s are shite.

Parties.

 

[Jippy]

I’m West & Hessle which Emma Hardy. I suppose Labour were in a damned-if-you-do damned-if-you-dont position. If they’d come out and backed leave we wouldn’t be having this conversation....but they’d have lost their remain constituencies in the south.

My mother lives in Anlaby and I grew up there.
Yeah agreed. Labour was kinda screwed either way and add in the Corbyn factor and they're toast.
LibDems nowhere in those northern industrial towns.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

In terms of voting Brexit? Or Tory? My mum's a floating voter, dunno about her partner.

Sadly I fear my mother voted on immigration largely, despite loving her non-white African immigrant daughter-in-law

The fact that immigration is framed as the cause for many problems actually caused by austerity/lack of investment, for me is also down to the right wing press.

Edit: to answer your question I meant voting Tory rather than Brexit. From my perspective,I can understand why some people voted for Brexit. I cannot understand how anyone could ever vote Tory.

 

[T00lsh3d]

In terms of voting Brexit? Or Tory? My mum's a floating voter, dunno about her partner.

Sadly I fear my mother voted on immigration largely, despite loving her non-white African immigrant daughter-in-law

I can top you. My mum and late stepdad were active UKIP members a few years ago. She’s an absolute leaver..... She also works voluntarily teaching migrants who appear in the country with nothing basic English

 

[Cheesy]

There’s a lot of confusion over the leave constituencies in the north too. Just because the constituency itself is majority leave and Labour hold it, doesn’t mean a majority of Labour supporters in that constituency are Leavers.

Labour are a hugely Remain supporting party. That needs to be remembered.

Indeed, this is often forgotten. A constituency being Leave doesn't automatically mean it'll turn against Labour - in plenty of Labour cities that voted for Brexit the vote was won by an incredibly narrow margin; if the vast majority of those Remainers (say 48% of a constituency) stick with Labour, then some of their Leave voters staying with them still makes it an easy win.

Along similar lines, remember seeing a poll here a while back that showed Labour Brexiteers were significantly less motivated by Brexit than Labour Remainers, Tory Remainers and Tory Brexiteers. In other words, it's quite possible to keep their vote by offering other exciting policies and alternatives even if you don't deliver on Brexit. In a way I think the rabid online Brexiteers have made us forget that like with Remain, plenty of people who voted for Brexit aren't that arsed about it overall. Even if they care for many of them the jump away from Labour still remains a much bigger political move to make.

In a way I think you could compare this topic to Scottish independence and the SNP up north - most constituencies voted No in 2014 but still ultimately went SNP in 2015. The fact the SNP had lost the vote ended up having little bearing the following year because they were able to mobilise their own vote effectively, even if half/just over half the population didn't like them.

 

[esmufc07]

Watch out fellow Northerners.

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[SteveJ]

Feckin' Housemartins...

 

[esmufc07]

Feckin' Housemartins...

The one with the red jumper is the son of @Sassy Colin

 

[Mockney]

Feckin' Housemartins...

 

[Cheesy]

Peaky Blinders prequel looks rubbish.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

The one with the red jumper is the son of @Sassy Colin[/S]

Fixed. Motherfecker has been drinking from the fountain of youth I bet.

Edit: Formatting issue. fecking Tories

 

[Fluctuation0161]

Watch out fellow Northerners.

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Big turn out. Like Boris and his battle bus.

 

[Berbasbullet]

Lack of impartial media means no public outcry. No public outcry means no judgement. It’s a bit like the law of diminishing returns, as the offences keep
mounting up they lose their weight. Remember a few months ago, being found guilty of misleading the queen? All been forgotten about now.

Yep, he has been a complete disaster, but he just goes week on week being a complete moron and everyone forgetting about it.

Literally found guilty of lying to the queen, surely that’s something you’d resign over?!

 

[RedSky]

Honestly curious to know why young people would support the Tories. Unless their families are wealthy and then they're protecting their own assets so fair enough.

 

[Red Dreams]

Honestly curious to know why young people would support the Tories. Unless their families are wealthy and then they're protecting their own assets so fair enough.

or they are ignorant.

 

[altodevil]

Very vocal parents. Impressionable age. There's a fair few to be fair.

 

[Sassy Colin]

17 year olds aren't allowed to vote, fortunately.

 

[Sweet Square]

Certainly a big factor is that older demographic more likely to vote conservative and simultaneously more likely to vote than the younger demographic.

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politic...06/13/how-britain-voted-2017-general-election

How many years are we going to have to wait for Labour to reach tipping point? Maybe this is why Tories want electoral 'reform', changing constituency boundaries and no vote for 16 year olds!

Plus they are pushing for Voter I.D.

In the long run the tories are fecked, so their end goal will be to undermine the democratic norms.

 

[Smores]

Theresa Villiers, the environment secretary, said: “The Conservatives have taken world-leading action to tackle climate change – legislating to achieve net zero, reducing emissions by a quarter since coming to office in 2010, and boosting renewables to record levels.

“We have set manageable targets that will bring society with us.
Corbyn’s Labour would ban people from using their cars or taking
flights, and their plans have been slammed by their own unions as
‘utterly unachievable’.

“Only Boris Johnson and the Conservatives will get Brexit done so we can continue tackling climate change while successfully growing our economy.”

Standard tory response to falling targets, claim your the bestest and Labour will do *insert something crazy*

 

[Smores]

Honestly curious to know why young people would support the Tories. Unless their families are wealthy and then they're protecting their own assets so fair enough.

Have you never met any of these types? All the same they're all arrogant idiots who think being a Tory supporter makes them better than others. I'd assume because their parents also have this elitist attitude.

 

[Sassy Colin]

Honestly curious to know why young people would support the Tories. Unless their families are wealthy and then they're protecting their own assets so fair enough.

Just as curious to know why young people would support Labour. Unless they are naive enough to believe in their bribes from the magic money tree.

 

[Sweet Square]

Have you never met any of these types? All the same they're all arrogant idiots who think being a Tory supporter makes them better than others. I'd assume because their parents also have this elitist attitude.

Just as curious to know why young people would support Labour. Unless they are naive enough to believe in their bribes from the magic money tree.

We can always rely on Colin.

 

[finneh]

Just as curious to know why young people would support Labour. Unless they are naive enough to believe in their bribes from the magic money tree.

The same reason the majority of people vote for any political party - their own selfish interest.

 

[Sassy Colin]

The same reason the majority of people vote for any political party - their own selfish interest.

Pretty much.

We can always rely on Colin.

Personal insults, no more than you can expect from a 'caring' socialist.

 

[Red Dreams]

Personal insults, no more than you can expect from a 'caring' socialist.

You don't even understand what Socialism is.

 

[sullydnl]

Watch out fellow Northerners.

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One can only assume that they will grow up to be the worst people. Being a Tory is bad enough but being a 17 year old Tory at a time when the Tories have damned your generation to a worse future is borderline sociopathic.