UK Policing

Sara125

Full Member
Joined
Oct 3, 2015
Messages
3,045
Location
London
I wasn’t sure if there was a mega thread so I have taken it upon myself to create one. I’ve been thinking of it for a while and what finally prompted me to was the Sarah Everard case- I didn’t want to completely derail that thread, and there’s obviously a wider discussion about policing in the UK as a whole from individual officers to an institutional level, especially the MET police.

I kind of want this to be a spin off thread to the ‘Cops in America’ thread with anything included such as recent cases, clips posted on social media etc. Just anything current basically (or past). And there’s a few officers on the caf so they’re welcome to give us insight to what (if any) internal reformations are ongoing.


I’ll start. I saw this earlier (go through the entire twitter thread) and I don’t know how this whole ‘plain clothed officers identifying themselves’ is helpful in any way when Wayne Couzens made it known he was an officer anyway and stuff like the above continues to happen in broad daylight with on-duty, full uniformed officers.
 

Deery

Dreary
Joined
May 21, 2019
Messages
18,590
That’s pathetic what danger was that old guy possessing to do that to him, that cop needs fired he’s obviously wanted to hurt and injury someone playing the big man..
 

yumtum

DUX' bumchum
Joined
May 10, 2009
Messages
7,132
Location
Wales
I think I've come across one Police officer that wasn't a complete power hungry bully, I've come across loads as I grew up on a pretty rough council estate, and they all ty to escalate situations (I saw this from ages 8 - 25) and I've been pulled over a few times, horrible bunch of people as a whole, especially when in numbers.

The profession unfortunately attracts a certain type of person, and while I'm sure the decent cops get promoted into positions where you don't necessarily interact with them (hopefully) the public are still left with the dregs.
 

maniak

Full Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2004
Messages
9,960
Location
Lisboa
Supports
Arsenal
Sadly all countries would have enough material for a thread.
 

11101

Full Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2014
Messages
21,304
The profession unfortunately attracts a certain type of person, and while I'm sure the decent cops get promoted into positions where you don't necessarily interact with them (hopefully) the public are still left with the dregs.
That is true but when you spend 20 years dealing with the absolute scum of society, it's only natural their default position moves away from giving people the benefit of the doubt.

Plus much like the US policing, the more they get dressed up like SAS soldiers, the more they think they're in some kind of war.
 

yumtum

DUX' bumchum
Joined
May 10, 2009
Messages
7,132
Location
Wales
That is true but when you spend 20 years dealing with the absolute scum of society, it's only natural their default position moves away from giving people the benefit of the doubt.

Plus much like the US policing, the more they get dressed up like SAS soldiers, the more they think they're in some kind of war.
I can see where you're coming from, but from experience it's the younger ones that are the absolute weapons and cause more issues than they solve.

Agree completely with regards to your second point, it takes a certain mindset to be armed to the teeth yet carry yourself with humility and empathy, and I don't think the police are able to attract people with that kind of mentality for whatever reason (pay most likely).

I doubt things will ever change purely for the fact most people are generally cnuts, so it stands to reason that most officers will also be cnuts.
 

Pexbo

Winner of the 'I'm not reading that' medal.
Joined
Jun 2, 2009
Messages
68,681
Location
Brizzle
Supports
Big Days
I’m sure they’ll tell us he wasn’t “really” one of them soon though so it’ll be all good.
After they’ve given him a character reference of course.
 

Trequarista10

Full Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2020
Messages
2,541
I think I've come across one Police officer that wasn't a complete power hungry bully, I've come across loads as I grew up on a pretty rough council estate, and they all ty to escalate situations (I saw this from ages 8 - 25) and I've been pulled over a few times, horrible bunch of people as a whole, especially when in numbers.

The profession unfortunately attracts a certain type of person, and while I'm sure the decent cops get promoted into positions where you don't necessarily interact with them (hopefully) the public are still left with the dregs.
To be honest the ones who get promoted aren't the low IQ thugs you get on the beat, but they are still power mad scumbags. They may be intelligent enough to construct full sentences, or avoid doing something stupid on camera. But they will abuse their power in other ways. Abuse of process, using their favourite weapon of choice - nonsensical bureaucracy. You could safely generalise and say that the ones who get out of uniform are more likely to be sociopaths, whereas the knuckle draggers in uniform are your classic low IQ psychopaths.
 

yumtum

DUX' bumchum
Joined
May 10, 2009
Messages
7,132
Location
Wales
To be honest the ones who get promoted aren't the low IQ thugs you get on the beat, but they are still power mad scumbags. They may be intelligent enough to construct full sentences, or avoid doing something stupid on camera. But they will abuse their power in other ways. Abuse of process, using their favourite weapon of choice - nonsensical bureaucracy. You could safely generalise and say that the ones who get out of uniform are more likely to be sociopaths, whereas the knuckle draggers in uniform are your classic low IQ psychopaths.
Bolded I'd agree judging purely on the type of people that become officers and try to rise, I've just had less interaction with those types (met two, one was a cnut and the other a nice guy, so 50/50 whereas beat cops are more like 95/5) so I don't really want to generalise.
 

Sweet Square

Full Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2013
Messages
23,628
Location
The Zone
British Transport Police apologise to UK black community for corrupt ex-officer
The British Transport Police has apologised to the British black community for the trauma caused by the actions of a former officer involved in at least two serious miscarriages of justice involving young black people. In a letter sent to black civil rights activists, Lucy D’Orsi, the force’s chief constable, insisted the actions of DS Derek Ridgewell, who played a key role in the convictions of the Stockwell Six and the Oval Four, did “not define the BTP of today”.

D’Orsi said she was also keen to explore a proposal, suggested by activists, that the BTP establish a bursary for black students to study criminology or law at university, and promised to “actively aim” recruitment efforts towards British black communities in an effort to build a force that better reflects the public.The Oval Four were a group of young black men who were framed by Ridgewell and accused of carrying out muggings on the underground in London. It took nearly 50 years for all four men to have their convictions squashed. Ridgewell was also behind the conviction of the Stockwell Six, who were accused of attempting to rob on the underground. Two men involved could have convictions overturned. “On behalf of the British Transport Police (BTP), I am sincerely sorry for the trauma suffered by the British African community through the criminal actions of former police officer DS Derek Ridgewell, who worked in BTP during the 1960s and 70s,” D’Orsi wrote.

“In particular, it is of regret that we did not act sooner to end his criminalisation of British Africans, which led to the conviction of innocent people. This is simply inexcusable and is something that my colleagues and I are appalled by.” The apology was welcomed by Winston Trew, one of the Oval Four who was wrongfully convicted in 1972 for attempted theft and assaulting police. “I welcome the apology from the BTP to the British black community who were targeted with false convictions,” he said. “It’s a public acknowledgement that something dreadful went wrong in the 1970s.” Trew also welcomed the proposal to create a bursary, but disagreed with the suggestion that increasing diversity was the solution going forward. “You cannot recruit new people into a broken system, the system needs to change, so the public can have confidence in the police and want to become police officers and have a conducive environment to work in. Inclusion is not the solution.”

The apology was solicited by Kwaku, a history consultant and historical musicologist, as part of a seminar series he has been running on police and the criminalisation of black British youths. He stipulated the apology should be addressed to the “British African community”, a term he said was a more appropriate description of the group than “black British”. Kwaku’s approach caused the BTP to further reflect on the criminal actions Ridgewell had taken 45 years ago and the organisation believed it to be a opportunity to set out the chief constable’s position. “We knew that the BTP has issued an apology in each case,” he said. “But we thought it’s not enough to issue an apology to the individual victims, they have to recognise that the British African community was terrorised and have suffered from the trauma caused by these racist cops, from the terror in the 1970s and 80s.”

The apology will be read out in a discussion led by Kwaku and Cecil Gutzmore, a black community activist, at the Police and the Criminalising of British African Youths by Numbers Zoom meeting on 8 November. A spokesperson for Black Lives Matter UK said: “This is simply not enough. While the BTP’s proposed bursary will benefit a small number of people, it ultimately doesn’t change the daily discriminatory practices of the force.” According to a study of official data, young black males in London were 19 times more likely to be stopped and searched than the general population. The spokesperson added: “What we need is not more black officers carrying out the same racist harassment and violence against black communities. We need an end to stop and search and we need to create conditions in which black communities can thrive, free from poverty and violence.”

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...fficer-derek-ridgwell-stockwell-six-oval-four
Stephen Port victim inquests hear of Met ‘institutional homophobia’
The Metropolitan police were guilty of “institutional homophobia” for repeatedly dismissing fears that the deaths of four young gay men in Barking, east London, could be linked, an inquest heard. John Pape, a friend of Gabriel Kovari, the serial killer Stephen Port’s second victim, said he tried to help detectives by passing on information he felt could be helpful but they were “unwilling to engage” with him, and did not seem “curious” about the information he had. Pape rented Kovari, 22, a room for six weeks until shortly before he was found dead in a graveyard from an overdose of the date-rape drug GHB, and said the two had become good friends. “I think it has been said here that the police were underfunded, and under emotional strain. But I think when grieving families, and boyfriends, and friends, are getting close to the truth and trying to raise the alarm 10 months before the Met are even willing to acknowledge that the deaths are even suspicious, then it can’t be a funding issue,” Pape told jurors.

“The only thing that makes any sense of how disturbingly incompetent this investigation was is prejudice, conscious or unconscious. And in my opinion, if this means the lives and deaths of young gay and bi men aren’t treated with significance and respect, I think that amounts to institutional homophobia.”By September 2014, Port had murdered Anthony Walgate, 23, Kovari, and Daniel Whitworth, 21. He left a fake suicide note on Whitworth’s body claiming he had accidentally killed Kovari with an overdose of GHB. Pape was in Facebook contact with Kovari’s former boyfriend Thierry Amodio. Amodio had been told by a “Jon Luck” on Facebook that Whitworth and Kovari were together at an orgy in Barking before their bodies were found in the same graveyard three weeks apart. Luck, it later transpired, was Stephen Port.

Pape said he was alarmed there were “too many unexplained deaths in one area”. “My concerns went beyond what happened to Gabriel and became: is there something happening in Barking that is dangerous to other young gay men?” he said. But police dismissed his concerns, he said. He said he raised doubts at Kovari’s first inquest over whether he and Daniel even knew each other. Police admitted at the time the only evidence that linked the two was the suicide note – which would later turn out to have been faked by Port, jurors were told. Pape said he wished there had been an LGBTQ+ liaison officer at Barking he could have contacted: “Someone allied to the LGBTQ+ community, someone I felt that had some genuine insight into the issues surrounding this.”

He said he contacted gay charities, the gay press and the campaigner Peter Tatchell to express his concerns, adding: “I didn’t trust the police to link it properly.” On Port’s arrest, he said, he felt “anger” that he had not been listened to: “I wish I had pushed myself to do more.” Peter Skelton QC, representing the Metropolitan police service, said officers involved in the case had apologised for the police response but suggested to Pape that “incompetence does not always equate to prejudice”.

Pape replied: “‘You have to ask why are they consistently making so many mistakes. What’s behind it? To my mind, it’s because they just didn’t value those four young men; that it wasn’t worth keeping an open mind and being curious about them. n“I would agree that what happened here was incompetence … but behind that incompetence there has to be a reason why so many people were making such shocking mistakes.”

The hearings continue.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...s-hear-of-met-police-institutional-homophobia
 

esmufc07

Brad
Scout
Joined
Aug 7, 2007
Messages
49,882
Location
Lake Jonathan Creek
Bibaa Henry and Nicole Smallman: Met PCs jailed for crime scene images
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-59474472

Last month, a Met Police tribunal heard Jaffer and Lewis had described the sisters as "dead birds".

During the night of 8 June, Jaffer took four pictures of their bodies in situ and Lewis took two, and superimposed his face on to one of them to create a "selfie-style" image.
 

Tarrou

Full Member
Joined
May 13, 2013
Messages
25,630
Location
Sydney
great that a BBC journo just happened to be passing by at that exact moment and this definitely wasn't a PR stunt
 

horsechoker

The Caf's Roy Keane.
Joined
Apr 16, 2015
Messages
52,202
Location
The stable

Tarrou

Full Member
Joined
May 13, 2013
Messages
25,630
Location
Sydney
So much of this doesn't get reported so glad this one did :)
it would've been a good story if they actually interviewed the kid and explained his story, said why he was on the street, what are his options to get off the street, how the police is helping him with that

but good that the homeless kid has a golf putting set now, that's reassuring