UK Rail Strikes

[RedSky]

I don't care where is come from because I know exactly how much signallers earn from grade 1 to grade 8.

Yes there are grades...some boxes are busier than others so are paid differently. Don't come at me that the 50k is the average when the 50k is higher than a grade 8 signaller

No, the average for a signaller is 44k, as i said above. The average for the category they fall into is 50k, which includes a few other jobs.

I think Network Rail know what they pay their employees, don't you?

The figures havent come from Network Rail. They've come from the Union. All of these figures seem wrong too, the Government figure of £44k average included the steep wages of Train Drivers who aren't even involved in this strike and are part of a different Union.

In terms of signaling pay. I found a breakdown back in 2019:

Signaller Pay Grades for 2019 are as follows:

Grade 1 - £25,910
Grade 2 - £28,592
Grade 3 - £32,166
Grade 4 - £33,952
Grade 5 - £37,528
Grade 6 - £39,760
Grade 7 - £42,887
Grade 8 - £45,567
Grade 9 - £47,356
Grade10 - £49,142

Granted that was 3 years ago, but I doubt they'd have got any kind of wage increase during covid. Where are you getting your stats from @11101 can you post your source? Or are you simply using the Union figure which includes train aides to the signalling bracket?

 

[Summit]

The figures havent come from Network Rail. They've come from the Union. All of these figures seem wrong too, the Government figure of £44k average included the steep wages of Train Drivers who aren't even involved in this strike and are part of a different Union.

In terms of signaling pay. I found a breakdown back in 2019:



Granted that was 3 years ago, but I doubt they'd have got any kind of wage increase during covid. Where are you getting your stats from @11101 can you post your source? Or are you simply using the Union figure which includes train aides to the signalling bracket?

Worth noting that grade 9 and 10 aren't signaller roles. They are more supervisor and manager roles

 

[calodo2003]

Can a UK judge rule to compel the striking workers to go back to work like a US judge can? Is there any mechanism for that over there?

 

[neverdie]

Can a UK judge rule to compel the striking workers to go back to work like a US judge can? Is there any mechanism for that over there?

possibly could but only if the workers striking were nurses/doctors or members of the police force. anything that was absolutely crucial to the nation. other than that, not a chance and any attempt to do it would backfire massively. the union and labour laws in the UK are some of the worst in Europe but they're still lightyears ahead of the US which has some of the worst in the world. like when Reagan fired twelve thousand striking workers.

 

[calodo2003]

possibly could but only if the workers striking were nurses/doctors or members of the police force. anything that was absolutely crucial to the nation. other than that, not a chance and any attempt to do it would backfire massively. the union and labour laws in the UK are some of the worst in Europe but they're still lightyears ahead of the US which has some of the worst in the world. like when Reagan fired twelve thousand striking workers.

And those were air fecking traffic controllers!

Railway travel isn’t seen as a necessity à la the two you mentioned?

 

[neverdie]

And those were air fecking traffic controllers!

Railway travel isn’t seen as a necessity à la the two you mentioned?

yep. madness that he did that in hindsight.

it is a key industry but people's health isn't put at risk, directly, by not being able to travel so not in the same category. ironically a tory government would probably prefer nurses and police officers to be striking because historically they don't care about the NHS or safety of most people but do care about private profits which the rail strike will be hitting hard.

 

[Don't Kill Bill]

Of course working conditions matter but personally I think the RMT are taking the piss. If their main gripe was about safety issues or fighting against redundancies then I'd be all for it but it's not. It's about giving pay rises to people who in most cases earn way above their station.

Below is an average of what some of them earn. For me the only people who more or less earn their wage is the maintenance workers. £33k for tickets please you think is under paid? I know the drivers aren't going on strike (where's the solidarity?) but they earn more than my wife and she's a specialised doctor. A little bit of reality check is needed here.

Rail travel assistants including ticket collectors, and guards – £33,310

• Rail construction and maintenance workers – £34,998
• Rail transport workers including signallers and drivers’ assistants – £48,750
• Train and tram drivers – £59,189
• Rail and rolling stock builders and repairers – £46,753

On the other hand, when BA go on strike I'll be 100% behind them as I think their wages are well behind considering the work they do. As for front line workers who risk their lives every day or save lives everyday I'd give each one a medal and a start off wage of £40k which is still well behind what a drivers feckin mate earns. Nope don't have a lot of sympathy for the railworkers I'm afraid.

We should put everyone on the Forevergiggs' wifes national pay scale and he can decide how much less than his wife they should be allowed to be paid. It is not like people take jobs based on the pay rate offered or anything like that. You can imagine the tension when her annual pay award letter drops on the mat and we are all waiting with baited breath to find out how much we can ask for this year.

Lets bore down into this for a minute before we commit , what do you mean by specialised doctor?

The BMA site has the following table is this the right one?

Scale value	Value £
Min	45,124
1	49,745
2	55,790
3	58,756
4	62,978
5	66,614
6	70,249
7	73,883
8	77,519

 

[11101]

The figures havent come from Network Rail. They've come from the Union. All of these figures seem wrong too, the Government figure of £44k average included the steep wages of Train Drivers who aren't even involved in this strike and are part of a different Union.

In terms of signaling pay. I found a breakdown back in 2019:



Granted that was 3 years ago, but I doubt they'd have got any kind of wage increase during covid. Where are you getting your stats from @11101 can you post your source? Or are you simply using the Union figure which includes train aides to the signalling bracket?

Network Rail provide the 44k average for signallers.

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...-and-what-they-earn-who-are-the-real-fat-cats

The ONS provide the 50k average for the wider category.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentan...s/datasets/occupation4digitsoc2010ashetable14


In other words, they're correct.

 

[RedSky]

Network Rail provide the 44k average for signallers.

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...-and-what-they-earn-who-are-the-real-fat-cats

The ONS provide the 50k average for the wider category.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentan...s/datasets/occupation4digitsoc2010ashetable14


In other words, they're correct.

Right so you're basing all of this on a piece by the guardian with a throwaway comment here. " The average signaller earns £44,000, according to Network Rail." There's no actual source for these figures, google it yourself and try and find a salary for signallers. £44k is always the top end bracket, Grade 8+ which as Summit has said is management. I have no idea where the Guardian pulled the value from but it's clearly not right. Unless you trust everything you read in a paper 100% and don't bother doing your own research, if that's you, then clearly it's correct. If you can actually find a source from the Network Rail confirming that then by all means prove me wrong. But in no way am I going to believe a throwaway line in a paper as proof.

The ONS piece is a load of shite that's been panned by several sources. It includes train drivers into the assumed valuation which inflates the wages significantly as they're paid a significantly larger wage. The Government very much used this "estimate" on purpose and you've taken it hook and line. A reminder, once again. The train drivers have a different Union and are not on strike.

To add some more weight to the table I posted above. A reminder I'll post it again.

Grade 1 - £25,910
Grade 2 - £28,592
Grade 3 - £32,166
Grade 4 - £33,952
Grade 5 - £37,528
Grade 6 - £39,760
Grade 7 - £42,887
Grade 8 - £45,567
Grade 9 - £47,356
Grade10 - £49,142

Here's my own research (taken from the Network Rail career site)

Signaller Grade	Location	Entry Salary	Salary Completion	Source
2	Crewe	£29,221	n/a	link
3	Farncombe	£29,221	£32,872	link
3	Haslemere	£29,221	£32,872	link
3	Grindleford	£29,221	£32,874	link
5	Woking	£34,699	£38,354	link
6	Gloucester	£38,354	£40,635	link
7	Cambridge	£40,635	£43,831	link
7	Westbury	£40,635	£43,831	link
9	Three Bridges	£46,569	£48,398	link

All those positions confirm the above table is pretty much nailed on. So for an average salary to be £44k it means that the majority of the work force is made of Grade 8 to 10.

In other words, the Guardian article is.... *shock* wrong.

 

[11101]

Right so you're basing all of this on a piece by the guardian with a throwaway comment here. " The average signaller earns £44,000, according to Network Rail." There's no actual source for these figures, google it yourself and try and find a salary for signallers. £44k is always the top end bracket, Grade 8+ which as Summit has said is management. I have no idea where the Guardian pulled the value from but it's clearly not right. Unless you trust everything you read in a paper 100% and don't bother doing your own research, if that's you, then clearly it's correct. If you can actually find a source from the Network Rail confirming that then by all means prove me wrong. But in no way am I going to believe a throwaway line in a paper as proof.

The ONS piece is a load of shite that's been panned by several sources. It includes train drivers into the assumed valuation which inflates the wages significantly as they're paid a significantly larger wage. The Government very much used this "estimate" on purpose and you've taken it hook and line. A reminder, once again. The train drivers have a different Union and are not on strike.

To add some more weight to the table I posted above. A reminder I'll post it again.

Grade 1 - £25,910
Grade 2 - £28,592
Grade 3 - £32,166
Grade 4 - £33,952
Grade 5 - £37,528
Grade 6 - £39,760
Grade 7 - £42,887
Grade 8 - £45,567
Grade 9 - £47,356
Grade10 - £49,142

Here's my own research (taken from the Network Rail career site)

Signaller Grade	Location	Entry Salary	Salary Completion	Source
2	Crewe	£29,221	n/a	link
3	Farncombe	£29,221	£32,872	link
3	Haslemere	£29,221	£32,872	link
3	Grindleford	£29,221	£32,874	link
5	Woking	£34,699	£38,354	link
6	Gloucester	£38,354	£40,635	link
7	Cambridge	£40,635	£43,831	link
7	Westbury	£40,635	£43,831	link
9	Three Bridges	£46,569	£48,398	link

All those positions confirm the above table is pretty much nailed on. So for an average salary to be £44k it means that the majority of the work force is made of Grade 8 to 10.

In other words, the Guardian article is.... *shock* wrong.

There's really not much point continuing this if you just keep posting the same table you found on Google over and over.

The ONS data - the classification of rail transport operative does NOT include train drivers. There is a separate classification for them. It's all there in black and white. You are wrong.

The Guardian - I would assume they have received that information from somewhere. Probably Network Rail, since it is them who are cited. Again, that's a pretty reliable source, considering its the organisation that actually employs them.

Yet neither are a match for your 3 year old careers table.

I think I know why your understanding of these numbers is so far off, but I'll let you try to figure it out for a while longer.

 

[RedSky]

There's really not much point continuing this if you just keep posting the same table you found on Google over and over.

The ONS data - the classification of rail transport operative does NOT include train drivers. There is a separate classification for them. It's all there in black and white. You are wrong.

The Guardian - I would assume they have received that information from somewhere. Probably Network Rail, since it is them who are cited. Again, that's a pretty reliable source, considering its the organisation that actually employs them.

Yet neither are a match for your 3 year old careers table.

I think I know why your understanding of these numbers is so far off, but I'll let you try to figure it out for a while longer.

As someone who is clearly incapable of reading or doing your own research, if you bothered to click any of the links you'd see that all of those were positions in 2022.

You are wrong. It's on the career website and not some newspaper who clearly did feck all research themselves and just invented numbers.

I guess the career section of the actual company isn't a valid source and instead a throwaway one line in a newspaper is, because newspapers never get anything wrong or print lies/untruths.

 

[11101]

As someone who is clearly incapable of reading or doing your own research, if you bothered to click any of the links you'd see that all of those were positions in 2022.

You are wrong. It's on the career website and not some newspaper who clearly did feck all research themselves and just invented numbers.

I guess the career section of the actual company isn't a valid source and instead a throwaway one line in a newspaper is, because newspapers never get anything wrong or print lies/untruths.

Still not got it, then?

If you want to disagree with the ONS and Network Rail, you're going to have to come up something a lot better than that.

 

[RedSky]

Still not got it, then?

If you want to disagree with the ONS and Network Rail, you're going to have to come up something a lot better than that.

Ah yes, actual job positions on the companys website isn't accurate guys. Ignore them because they don't lineup with what the Guardian said that one time.

 

[11101]

Ah yes, actual job positions on the companys website isn't accurate guys. Ignore them because they don't lineup with what the Guardian said that one time.

Both can be correct.

The ONS take their data from PAYE slips. They're pretty spot on and even give a variance range. You can read their methodology if you'd like and you might also then realise why you are wrong.

 

[RedSky]

To break down the ONS figures:

The median salary for the rail sector is £44,000, which is significantly above the median salary in the country.

The Department of Transport said they arrived at the figure by adding median figures from ONS for categories of workers and then dividing by four (the four categories)

The four categories include rail travel assistants, rail construction and maintenance operatives, rail transport operatives and train and tram drivers.

ONS figures show that rail travel assistants, who include ticket collectors, guards and information staff, have a median salary of £33,310.

Train and Tram drivers were estimated to have a salary of £59,189.

I don't know how many times I have to repeat myself for it to sink in, but the ONS figures include train and tram drivers. You keep saying they don't with zero proof, no quotes, no source, nothing. Is it really that hard for you to accept that you're wrong? You're an adult, you're allowed to say the words "I am wrong". It's ok, just take a deep breath and say them quietly under your breath and walk away. I believe in you!

 

[11101]

To break down the ONS figures:



The Department of Transport said they arrived at the figure by adding median figures from ONS for categories of workers and then dividing by four (the four categories)

The four categories include rail travel assistants, rail construction and maintenance operatives, rail transport operatives and train and tram drivers.

ONS figures show that rail travel assistants, who include ticket collectors, guards and information staff, have a median salary of £33,310.

Train and Tram drivers were estimated to have a salary of £59,189.

I don't know how many times I have to repeat myself for it to sink in, but the ONS figures include train and tram drivers. You keep saying they don't with zero proof, no quotes, no source, nothing. Is it really that hard for you to accept that you're wrong? You're an adult, you're allowed to say the words "I am wrong". It's ok, just take a deep breath and say them quietly under your breath and walk away. I believe in you!

You're not even arguing the right point

You're trying to argue the ONS numbers but you're writing about the DFT numbers there. They are totally different things.

Go download the ONS ASHE data for last year. Then look up the Rail Transport Operative category definition. Have a look about 5 lines above it for the Train and Tram Driver classification. Note they are different.

Then, go and look at the methodology of how the ONS data is collected (its not what you posted above), and finally, read what a mean is. Then you might get it.

 

[TheReligion]

@RedSky & @11101

Could it be to do with overtime? I know a lot happens on the railways so potentially the reason for the difference in figures?

 

[TwoSheds]

You're not even arguing the right point

You're trying to argue the ONS numbers but you're writing about the DFT numbers there. They are totally different things.

Go download the ONS ASHE data for last year. Then look up the Rail Transport Operative category definition. Have a look about 5 lines above it for the Train and Tram Driver classification. Note they are different.

Then, go and look at the methodology of how the ONS data is collected (its not what you posted above), and finally, read what a mean is. Then you might get it.

The mean salary isn't usually regarded as a very good way of calculating salaries as it can be too easily skewed by outliers. Median is more representative of "the average man". I'm guessing with the way the pay bands work though that it's not daft to use in this case.

Also agree with The Religion, the ONS data if looking at payslips probably includes overtime. Currently OT for these workers is paid at 1.5x whereas the government want to slash it to 1.1x. Disincentivising safety you might argue of course.

 

[11101]

@RedSky & @11101

Could it be to do with overtime? I know a lot happens on the railways so potentially the reason for the difference in figures?

Exactly. Those careers numbers are basic salaries for each band. The ONS figures are average total income taken from PAYE, which includes overtime, allowances and any other incentives.

The careers numbers are meaningless when it comes to working out average earnings. Theyre just a guide for new applicants.

@TwoSheds the ONS provides both median and mean. The 48k figure that was being discussed is the median, the mean is 51k.

 

[TwoSheds]

Exactly. Those careers numbers are basic salaries for each band. The ONS figures are average total income taken from PAYE, which includes overtime, allowances and any other incentives.

The careers numbers are meaningless when it comes to working out average earnings. Theyre just a guide for new applicants.

@TwoSheds the ONS provides both median and mean. The 48k figure that was being discussed is the median, the mean is 51k.

So including overtime isn't irrelevant but it's also not really a fair way of quoting it - they're working for that extra money, and it's also something the employer is trying to cut.

 

[11101]

So including overtime isn't irrelevant but it's also not really a fair way of quoting it - they're working for that extra money, and it's also something the employer is trying to cut.

If you're talking about what a profession earns, you do have to include everything they are paid. Otherwise its not going to be accurate. You can see from the ONS numbers vs the careers page how big the difference is.

 

[TheReligion]

If you're talking about what a profession earns, you do have to include everything they are paid. Otherwise its not going to be accurate. You can see from the ONS numbers vs the careers page how big the difference is.

I agree it should be included but it does also highlight a broken system if in order to function the only way to do so is to pay individuals large amounts of overtime.

 

[dumbo]

Don't forget the pennies they find down the backs of the seats too. We can get this figure up there if we just start using our imaginations.

 

[RedSky]

@TheReligion, given you keep mentioning ONS figures and I kept asking 11101 to actually provide data but he didn't. I will do so instead. See below the breakdown. Reminder, the Train/Tram drivers are not on strike and are part of a different Union, but I added those anyway. This also doesn't include cleaning staff which are for some reason omitted (mainly because I couldn't and clearly neither could the DfT) find a relevant category. But pretty sure you can imagine their pay would be the lowest in the data. Anyway, knock yourselves out. I've already done some calculations but I'll let you guys do your own (including the pennies down the back of the seats).

x = Estimates are considered unreliable for practical purposes

Spoiler: Table 14.1a Weekly pay - Gross (£) - For all employee jobsa: United Kingdom, 2021

Description​	Code​	Median​	Mean​
Rail construction and maintenance operatives​	8143​	£661​	£663​
Rail travel assistants​	6215​	£650​	£667​
Rail and rolling stock builders and repairers​	5237​	£746​	£832​
Rail transport operatives​	8234​	£917​	£932​
Train and tram drivers​	8231​	£1,112​	£1,125​

Spoiler: Table 14.2a Weekly pay - Excluding overtime (£) - For all employee jobsa: United Kingdom, 2021

Description​	Code​	Median​	Mean​
Rail construction and maintenance operatives​	8143​	£571​	£561​
Rail travel assistants​	6215​	£599​	£611​
Rail and rolling stock builders and repairers​	5237​	£723​	£801​
Rail transport operatives​	8234​	£734​	£744​
Train and tram drivers​	8231​	£1,081​	£1,022​

Spoiler: Table 14.3a Basic Pay - Including other pay (£) - For all employee jobsa: United Kingdom, 2021

Description​	Code​	Median​	Mean​
Rail construction and maintenance operatives​	8143​	£509​	£528​
Rail travel assistants​	6215​	£574​	£596​
Rail and rolling stock builders and repairers​	5237​	£679​	£778​
Rail transport operatives​	8234​	£692​	£691​
Train and tram drivers​	8231​	£1,069​	£1,006​

Spoiler: Table 14.4a Overtime pay (£) - For all employee jobsa: United Kingdom, 2021

Description​	Code​	Median​	Mean​
Rail construction and maintenance operatives​	8143​	x​	102.3​
Rail travel assistants​	6215​	77.5​	56.0​
Rail and rolling stock builders and repairers​	5237​	x​	x​
Rail transport operatives​	8234​	206.0​	188.0​
Train and tram drivers​	8231​	x​	102.9​

Spoiler: Table 14.7a Annual pay - Gross (£) - For all employee jobsa: United Kingdom, 2021

Description​	Code​	Median​	Mean​
Rail construction and maintenance operatives​	8143​	£34,998​	£34,020​
Rail travel assistants​	6215​	£33,310​	£35,008​
Rail and rolling stock builders and repairers​	5237​	£46,753​	£44,201​
Rail transport operatives​	8234​	£48,750​	£50,675​
Train and tram drivers​	8231​	£59,189​	£57,505​

Spoiler: Table 14.8a Annual pay - Incentive (£) - For all employee jobsa: United Kingdom, 2021

​	Code​	Median​	Mean​
Rail construction and maintenance operatives​	8143​	£715​	x​
Rail travel assistants​	6215​	x​	x​
Rail and rolling stock builders and repairers​	5237​	x​	x​
Rail transport operatives​	8234​	x​	£774​
Train and tram drivers​	8231​	x​	x​

 

[neverdie]

anti union person derails rail strike thread by focusing on pay for some reason that isn't clear. the average pay for that union membership is £33k. there's feck all else to be said about it. the only people arguing this point are the kind that won't support the next union either.

including overtime in your assessment is ridiculous btw. that just means that members have to work more hours than they sign up for to cope with cost of living.

 

[RoadTrip]

Of course working conditions matter but personally I think the RMT are taking the piss. If their main gripe was about safety issues or fighting against redundancies then I'd be all for it but it's not. It's about giving pay rises to people who in most cases earn way above their station.

Below is an average of what some of them earn. For me the only people who more or less earn their wage is the maintenance workers. £33k for tickets please you think is under paid? I know the drivers aren't going on strike (where's the solidarity?) but they earn more than my wife and she's a specialised doctor. A little bit of reality check is needed here.

Rail travel assistants including ticket collectors, and guards – £33,310

• Rail construction and maintenance workers – £34,998
• Rail transport workers including signallers and drivers’ assistants – £48,750
• Train and tram drivers – £59,189
• Rail and rolling stock builders and repairers – £46,753

On the other hand, when BA go on strike I'll be 100% behind them as I think their wages are well behind considering the work they do. As for front line workers who risk their lives every day or save lives everyday I'd give each one a medal and a start off wage of £40k which is still well behind what a drivers feckin mate earns. Nope don't have a lot of sympathy for the railworkers I'm afraid.

No point quoting something you can’t read. Median is different to average.

 

[Toblerone92]

A lot of boring fecking tables and figures being quoted here. Skilled jobs command higher rates of pay, and driving a train is a role laden with huge responsibility and requires intense concentration.

Everyone should join a Union and demand better working conditions for themselves and their colleagues.

 

[TheReligion]

@TheReligion, given you keep mentioning ONS figures and I kept asking 11101 to actually provide data but he didn't. I will do so instead. See below the breakdown. Reminder, the Train/Tram drivers are not on strike and are part of a different Union, but I added those anyway. This also doesn't include cleaning staff which are for some reason omitted (mainly because I couldn't and clearly neither could the DfT) find a relevant category. But pretty sure you can imagine their pay would be the lowest in the data. Anyway, knock yourselves out. I've already done some calculations but I'll let you guys do your own (including the pennies down the back of the seats).

x = Estimates are considered unreliable for practical purposes

Spoiler: Table 14.1a Weekly pay - Gross (£) - For all employee jobsa: United Kingdom, 2021

Description​	Code​	Median​	Mean​
Rail construction and maintenance operatives​	8143​	£661​	£663​
Rail travel assistants​	6215​	£650​	£667​
Rail and rolling stock builders and repairers​	5237​	£746​	£832​
Rail transport operatives​	8234​	£917​	£932​
Train and tram drivers​	8231​	£1,112​	£1,125​

Spoiler: Table 14.2a Weekly pay - Excluding overtime (£) - For all employee jobsa: United Kingdom, 2021

Description​	Code​	Median​	Mean​
Rail construction and maintenance operatives​	8143​	£571​	£561​
Rail travel assistants​	6215​	£599​	£611​
Rail and rolling stock builders and repairers​	5237​	£723​	£801​
Rail transport operatives​	8234​	£734​	£744​
Train and tram drivers​	8231​	£1,081​	£1,022​

Spoiler: Table 14.3a Basic Pay - Including other pay (£) - For all employee jobsa: United Kingdom, 2021

Description​	Code​	Median​	Mean​
Rail construction and maintenance operatives​	8143​	£509​	£528​
Rail travel assistants​	6215​	£574​	£596​
Rail and rolling stock builders and repairers​	5237​	£679​	£778​
Rail transport operatives​	8234​	£692​	£691​
Train and tram drivers​	8231​	£1,069​	£1,006​

Spoiler: Table 14.4a Overtime pay (£) - For all employee jobsa: United Kingdom, 2021

Description​	Code​	Median​	Mean​
Rail construction and maintenance operatives​	8143​	x​	102.3​
Rail travel assistants​	6215​	77.5​	56.0​
Rail and rolling stock builders and repairers​	5237​	x​	x​
Rail transport operatives​	8234​	206.0​	188.0​
Train and tram drivers​	8231​	x​	102.9​

Spoiler: Table 14.7a Annual pay - Gross (£) - For all employee jobsa: United Kingdom, 2021

Description​	Code​	Median​	Mean​
Rail construction and maintenance operatives​	8143​	£34,998​	£34,020​
Rail travel assistants​	6215​	£33,310​	£35,008​
Rail and rolling stock builders and repairers​	5237​	£46,753​	£44,201​
Rail transport operatives​	8234​	£48,750​	£50,675​
Train and tram drivers​	8231​	£59,189​	£57,505​

Spoiler: Table 14.8a Annual pay - Incentive (£) - For all employee jobsa: United Kingdom, 2021

​	Code​	Median​	Mean​
Rail construction and maintenance operatives​	8143​	£715​	x​
Rail travel assistants​	6215​	x​	x​
Rail and rolling stock builders and repairers​	5237​	x​	x​
Rail transport operatives​	8234​	x​	£774​
Train and tram drivers​	8231​	x​	x​

I’ve not mentioned ONS figures?

Not sure why the hostility. I just saw you both arguing about the pay and suggest one might include overtime and the other just basic rate

 

[RedSky]

I’ve not mentioned ONS figures?

Not sure why the hostility. I just saw you both arguing about the pay and suggest one might include overtime and the other just basic rate

No hostility at all bud, just throwing down the data because there seem to be a lot of different numbers being mentioned in the thread.

 

[Kag]

The same halfwit who was arguing that agency workers don’t carry out safety critical work (I know for a fact they do) is still polluting this thread with nonsense, I see. I’ve lost brain cells by the page.

 

[Kag]

The pay argument in here is laughable from some. Network Rail want to lay off hundreds of people and re-advertise the same graft under a new title for a fraction of the cost.

What’s this got to do with what somebody’s doctor wife earns? Jesus.

 

[Buster15]

The pay argument in here is laughable from some. Network Rail want to lay off hundreds of people and re-advertise the same graft under a new title for a fraction of the cost.

What’s this got to do with what somebody’s doctor wife earns? Jesus.

Could not agree with you more.
I have been amazed just how judgemental some people are about what other workers get paid.
As you say, it has nothing to do with anyone else.
And if a group of workers decide that they are not satisfied with their pay and conditions, they are perfectly within their rights to use their leverage to try to improve them irrespective of whether other people agree with them or not.

 

[villain]

Don't forget the pennies they find down the backs of the seats too. We can get this figure up there if we just start using our imaginations.

 

[TheReligion]

No hostility at all bud, just throwing down the data because there seem to be a lot of different numbers being mentioned in the thread.

I must have misinterpreted it. Apols

 

[Sweet Square]

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[Crashoutcassius]

dont know anything about the situation, but god it is great when people make politicians look so stupid as the big man does over and over again. shows it all for the nonsense that it is

 

[DavidDeSchmikes]

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[Vidyoyo]

Read somewhere recently that Covid is a catalyst for this as it shook people to think we can do things differently.

I think there's something to it.

 

[TwoSheds]

Good on them. Hope they get the result they're after.

 

[Fingeredmouse]

Read somewhere recently that Covid is a catalyst for this as it shook people to think we can do things differently.

I think there's something to it.

Maybe, but not increasing people's salaries under a rampant cost of living crisis whilst watching exec level pay rocket is surely the main catalyst and forcing people back to the office surely exacerbates this.