United’s Worst Decisions of the Last 12 Years

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Far more than the managers it’s got to be the recruitment since Mourinho.
At least when Maureen left we could have fetched good prices for Martial, Lukaku & Pogba.
Lukaku didn’t work out but we still received a huge fee. Pogba had a couple of good seasons and once again would’ve commanded a big fee when Mou wanted rid.
There were his BIG signings.

Since then though our big signings have been catastrophic. Sancho, Antony, Mount, Højlund… to spend 320 million on those 4 players only to end up loaning two, never seeing one, and realising the fourth isn’t the player you hoped either is incredible.

Maguire was at least an ever present in a few ok seasons, so whilst we overpaid, I don’t see that as such an issue.

Any club can have a Di Maria, Pogba or a Lukaku, but they are players that even if they don’t work out, have big pedigree and command big fees.

If 3 of those 4 players, averaging 80 million /pop either worked out else commanded 55-60m resale fees, we’d be alright.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

A crazy stat is that of our biggest ever 15 signings, 10 of them were signed since 2019.

Of those 10, totalling 716 million euros:

• 2 are out on loan
• 1 is constantly injured
• 1 was sold for 17.6m (almost 40m loss)
• 1 (Cas) we’re trying to loan
• 1 has just done his knee for the second time since joining us.
• 2 are still ”young and learnin’” with one looking promising but the other not so much.
• JUST 2 are first team regulars (Bruno, Maguire) of which we tried selling one just a year or so ago.

 

[Red in STL]

A crazy stat is that of our biggest ever 15 signings, 10 of them were signed since 2019.

Of those 10, totalling 716 million euros:

• 2 are out on loan
• 1 is constantly injured
• 1 was sold for 17.6m (almost 40m loss)
• 1 (Cas) we’re trying to loan
• 1 has just done his knee for the second time since joining us.
• 2 are still ”young and learnin’” with one looking promising but the other not so much.
• JUST 2 are first team regulars (Bruno, Maguire) of which we tried selling one just a year or so ago.

That's not really a crazy stat, it's probably true of most clubs given transfer fee inflation over the years

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

That's not really a crazy stat, it's probably true of most clubs given transfer fee inflation over the years

The stat isn’t crazy man, what’s crazy is that we haven’t received a decent transfer fee for any and only 2 are regular players. That’s crazy

 

[lex talionis]

There is so much competition for "worst" decisions during the post-Ferguson era, but the top of the list has to be the appointment of David Moyes as manager. It was reckless and it was mindless. Moyes had no record of success whatsoever and when he took the reigns the slide to mediocrity instantly began. We've never recovered from that disastrous decision.

 

[DarkLord1984]

A crazy stat is that of our biggest ever 15 signings, 10 of them were signed since 2019.

Of those 10, totalling 716 million euros:

• 2 are out on loan
• 1 is constantly injured
• 1 was sold for 17.6m (almost 40m loss)
• 1 (Cas) we’re trying to loan
• 1 has just done his knee for the second time since joining us.
• 2 are still ”young and learnin’” with one looking promising but the other not so much.
• JUST 2 are first team regulars (Bruno, Maguire) of which we tried selling one just a year or so ago.

Blimey that is horrendous.

 

[FrankWhite]

We all know that Manchester United’s decline over the past decade hasn’t been due to just one bad decision but a series of them. However, if we were to pinpoint the worst single decisions that led to failures, which ones would stand out the most?

For me, these are the biggest mistakes in order:

1. Moyes/Woodward appointment (2013) – The start of the post-Ferguson disaster. Moyes was never the right man, and Woodward’s inexperience in football operations was evident from day one.
2. Ten Hag contract extension (2024) – Absolute shambles with the way it was handled and the outcome we all saw it coming and are living currently.
3. 2013 summer transfer fiasco – From the failure to sign key targets to ending up with Fellaini on deadline day. Absolute mess.
4. Rangnick appointment (2021-22) – A short-term manager with no authority and an advisory role that never happened. The whole thing was doomed.
5. 2022 summer transfer spree – Overpaying for players like Antony and Casemiro, leading to an unbalanced squad and financial strain.
6. Sanchez signing (2018) – A huge flop, disrupted the wage structure, and offered nothing of value on the pitch.
7. Ronaldo signing (2021) – Meant to be a dream return but ended up causing dressing room issues, unbalancing the team, and setting the club back tactically.

What do you think? Are there worse individual decisions that should make the list?

I wonder how many of these people are considering bad decisions only in hindsight. E.g. after the FA cup win, a vast majority of fans wanted ETH to stay. Now same people are crapping on Ineos for the worst decision ever.
My point isn't to call anyone out but instead to make the point that there's a difference between a poor outcome and a poor decision. There are also, the mistakes we make by not jumping on opportunities, e.g
missing out on Haaland, Bellingham, caceido etc.

 

[Red in STL]

I wonder how many of these people are considering bad decisions only in hindsight. E.g. after the FA cup win, a vast majority of fans wanted ETH to stay. Now same people are crapping on Ineos for the worst decision ever.
My point isn't to call anyone out but instead to make the point that there's a difference between a poor outcome and a poor decision. There are also, the mistakes we make by not jumping on opportunities, e.g
missing out on Haaland, Bellingham, caceido etc.

Most of these are in hindsight

 

[NewGlory]

We all know that Manchester United’s decline over the past decade hasn’t been due to just one bad decision but a series of them. However, if we were to pinpoint the worst single decisions that led to failures, which ones would stand out the most?

For me, these are the biggest mistakes in order:

1. Moyes/Woodward appointment (2013) – The start of the post-Ferguson disaster. Moyes was never the right man, and Woodward’s inexperience in football operations was evident from day one.
2. Ten Hag contract extension (2024) – Absolute shambles with the way it was handled and the outcome we all saw it coming and are living currently.
3. 2013 summer transfer fiasco – From the failure to sign key targets to ending up with Fellaini on deadline day. Absolute mess.
4. Rangnick appointment (2021-22) – A short-term manager with no authority and an advisory role that never happened. The whole thing was doomed.
5. 2022 summer transfer spree – Overpaying for players like Antony and Casemiro, leading to an unbalanced squad and financial strain.
6. Sanchez signing (2018) – A huge flop, disrupted the wage structure, and offered nothing of value on the pitch.
7. Ronaldo signing (2021) – Meant to be a dream return but ended up causing dressing room issues, unbalancing the team, and setting the club back tactically.

What do you think? Are there worse individual decisions that should make the list?

All correct but they are all on-the-surface observations except for Woodward one. All our troubles are caused by root cause of - moron owners had the worst kind of non-football people running the show for over a decade.

Absolute worst idiots at the very top. Like they didnt even have talent to learn something on the job

Who the feck thought Woodward or Arnold would achieve anything but waste billions and run the club into the ground?

 

[KStandBarmyArmy1993]

There is so much competition for "worst" decisions during the post-Ferguson era, but the top of the list has to be the appointment of David Moyes as manager. It was reckless and it was mindless. Moyes had no record of success whatsoever and when he took the reigns the slide to mediocrity instantly began. We've never recovered from that disastrous decision.

Moyes was a bad appointment but if the club was functioning correctly, he could have done a decent job. The last 3/4 years of Fergie papered over a lot of cracks. Even if the squad was still good, there was clearly no long term recruitment strategy and no real investment in the academy. Even on the commercial side, we allowed rivals to get ahead of us on things like social media.

There's probably only Mourinho and Guardiola that could have thrived in those circumstances.

Wider issues came in those years after Moyes when we seemed to change direction every 6 months. I remember when everyone thought Woodward was a good CEO after the "Van Gaalactico" summer of 2014.

 

[justsomebloke]

I wonder how many of these people are considering bad decisions only in hindsight. E.g. after the FA cup win, a vast majority of fans wanted ETH to stay. Now same people are crapping on Ineos for the worst decision ever.
My point isn't to call anyone out but instead to make the point that there's a difference between a poor outcome and a poor decision. There are also, the mistakes we make by not jumping on opportunities, e.g
missing out on Haaland, Bellingham, caceido etc.

We were all in for both Bellingham and Caicedo I think. They just chose otherwise.

 

[justsomebloke]

Moyes was a bad appointment but if the club was functioning correctly, he could have done a decent job. The last 3/4 years of Fergie papered over a lot of cracks. Even if the squad was still good, there was clearly no long term recruitment strategy and no real investment in the academy. Even on the commercial side, we allowed rivals to get ahead of us on things like social media.

There's probably only Mourinho and Guardiola that could have thrived in those circumstances.

Wider issues came in those years after Moyes when we seemed to change direction every 6 months. I remember when everyone thought Woodward was a good CEO after the "Van Gaalactico" summer of 2014.

Not that it really excuses Moyes, but people talk about him inheriting a title winning squad and give too little weight to the fact most of the core of that squad being on the verge of retirement. We were facing a massive rebuild. Expectations back then were clearly unrealistic.

 

[KStandBarmyArmy1993]

Not that it really excuses Moyes, but people talk about him inheriting a title winning squad and give too little weight to the fact most of the core of that squad being on the verge of retirement. We were facing a massive rebuild. Expectations back then were clearly unrealistic.

It wasn't that big of a rebuild at the time imo. Or at least, you knew the obvious weaknesses rather than it being simply the whole team. It was bad decisions over the next couple of years that did make the job a lot harder for others. Especially for Mourinho when he arrived in 2016.

If Moyes had been allowed to sign Baines/Coentrão and a couple of midfielders, we would have had the makings of a decent squad.

We started a Champions League Quarter Final first leg against the then European champions with Alex Buttner at left back and a 40 year old Giggs in centre midfield and still got a draw. Imagine if you had even a half decent left back and had younger legs in midfield.

 

[justsomebloke]

It wasn't that big of a rebuild at the time imo. Or at least, you knew the obvious weaknesses rather than it being simply the whole team. It was bad decisions over the next couple of years that did make the job a lot harder for others. Especially for Mourinho when he arrived in 2016.

If Moyes had been allowed to sign Baines/Coentrão and a couple of midfielders, we would have had the makings of a decent squad.

We started a Champions League Quarter Final first leg against the then European champions with Alex Buttner at left back and a 40 year old Giggs in centre midfield and still got a draw. Imagine if you had even a half decent left back and had younger legs in midfield.

Er, not a big rebuild? Scholes retired. Giggs, Rio and Vidic moved on the following summer, van Persie and Nani the summer after that. Rooney and Evra were on the downturn, even Carrick was well past 30. Who does that leave that was good enough to be described as a core player on a team good enough to challenge for a title? I guess de Gea, but that's about it. And what young players were in the squad, with a real capacity to step up and fill the void? Smalling, Jones and Lingard? It was obvious that we were facing a near-complete makeover, and also that this had been neglected for far too long.

 

[KStandBarmyArmy1993]

Er, not a big rebuild? Scholes retired. Giggs, Rio and Vidic moved on the following summer, van Persie and Nani the summer after that. Rooney and Evra were on the downturn, even Carrick was well past 30. Who does that leave that was good enough to be described as a core player on a team good enough to challenge for a title? I guess de Gea, but that's about it. And what young players were in the squad, with a real capacity to step up and fill the void? Smalling, Jones and Lingard? It was obvious that we were facing a near-complete makeover, and also that this had been neglected for far too long.

At the time, if you'd brought a defensive midfielder and a left back, we would have been in a decent position. It wasn't the massive rebuild that it is now. It should have been gradual. Granted, it was the lack of decent structure behind the scenes that stopped us from being able to do this but on the face of it, the squad was still ok.

Smalling, Jones and Evans were all seen as being great long term options at the time. We had a world class keeper in De Gea, an exciting right back in Rafael. A replacement for Evra (who had been declining for 2 years), younger legs to compliment Carrick's experience and maybe someone to come in and play on the wing would have all worked wonders. Even Rooney and Van Persie still potentially had a couple of seasons left in them. I'd also argue moving one of Vidic or Ferdinand on post 2013 would have been a wise decision.

The two years of appalling following Moyes leaving is what caused the longer term issues. Insane money spent on Di Maria etc. No real thought as to who were signing and the wider issues on our wage structure.

 

[Fenômeno]

Pretty much all of them have been bad.

 

[Ayoba]

In no particular order:

1. Allowing LVG to completely gut the squad
2. Not backing Mourinho after his 2nd season
3. Allowing ETH free reign to sign his players
4. Not sacking ETH after the 2nd season
5. Give Ole the permanent contact, he should've only been there as an interim.
6. Chasing Dan Ashworth for 9 months then sacking him 6 months later
7. Hiring RR to be a director of football type role, then getting rid of him.

 

[Bobby_2024]

A crazy stat is that of our biggest ever 15 signings, 10 of them were signed since 2019.

Of those 10, totalling 716 million euros:

• 2 are out on loan
• 1 is constantly injured
• 1 was sold for 17.6m (almost 40m loss)
• 1 (Cas) we’re trying to loan
• 1 has just done his knee for the second time since joining us.
• 2 are still ”young and learnin’” with one looking promising but the other not so much.
• JUST 2 are first team regulars (Bruno, Maguire) of which we tried selling one just a year or so ago.

You summed up really well as it's pretty much the root cause of our downfall. Same applies to our mangers choice since 2013 (most of the managers were out dated)

It pains to see how much money we spent on these payers on high wages, wish we kept Ralf in a director role who could have got us few good signings for the 600M spent since he left (he recommended Gvardiol/Wirtz/Nkunku/Diaz/Touchameni/Alvarez/Sesko/Enzo/Laimer and some other good upcoming players for less than 20M)

 

[justsomebloke]

At the time, if you'd brought a defensive midfielder and a left back, we would have been in a decent position. It wasn't the massive rebuild that it is now. It should have been gradual. Granted, it was the lack of decent structure behind the scenes that stopped us from being able to do this but on the face of it, the squad was still ok.

Smalling, Jones and Evans were all seen as being great long term options at the time. We had a world class keeper in De Gea, an exciting right back in Rafael. A replacement for Evra (who had been declining for 2 years), younger legs to compliment Carrick's experience and maybe someone to come in and play on the wing would have all worked wonders. Even Rooney and Van Persie still potentially had a couple of seasons left in them. I'd also argue moving one of Vidic or Ferdinand on post 2013 would have been a wise decision.

The two years of appalling following Moyes leaving is what caused the longer term issues. Insane money spent on Di Maria etc. No real thought as to who were signing and the wider issues on our wage structure.

I can understand looking at it like that at the time, but this is exactly what I'm talking about: We were so used to being great and to great replacements being found whenever someone disappeared that we were missing the bleedin obvious: That we had almost an entire team core that was certain to decline badly or disappear entirely within a season or two, with nothing present to replace them. There's a big difference between that and replacing individual parts on the go. As it turned out, Smalling, Jones, Evans and Rafael were not great long term options, at least considered as core players, which none of them were good enough to become.

Rio, Vidic, Giggs, van Persie, Evra - these were world class players in their positions, and together with Rooney and Carrick, they were essentially the difference between what we were before 2013 and what we've been after 2013. It's not the Youngs and Valencias who makes that difference. Sure Moyes was obviously the wrong choice and van Gaal & co made a mess of it when they essentially had to rebuild the whole team while staying competitive. But to replace all of that within two seasons and make it click as a team would be a huge task for anyone, it is really no surprise that it failed and the club should never have put itself in that position.

You can debate if now or then was the bigger rebuild challenge, they are in some ways very different situations. Then the issue was to quickly replace a team core that was great, but falling to age, while money was abundant but expectations for immediate results very high - at the same time as we were transitioning from a manager who'd been there for more than 20 years, and who the whole organisation was in many ways built around. And led by incompetent executives. Now, we have to build something from nothing, against a background of a decade of failure, with limited money but hopefully at least more competent executives.

In any event, I don't think there are any other moments in between that rival these two when it comes to the magnitude of the task.

 

[honirelandboy]

Probably spending 240 million on our supposed world class attack in Sancho, Anthony and Hojlund. Sancho and Anthony be gone in summer. Hojlund in another year or two.

Paul Pogba and Lukaku for 170 million.

Letting De Gea go and signing Onana.

Spending 60 million on a declining casemeiro, his stats before he was sold showed he was on a major decline in La Liga.

Giving Rashford a major contract.

Giving Moyes and Van Gaal the job.

I could go on and on.

 

[antohan]

wish we kept Ralf in a director role who could have got us few good signings for the 600M spent since he left (he recommended Gvardiol/Wirtz/Nkunku/Diaz/Touchameni/Alvarez/Sesko/Enzo/Laimer and some other good upcoming players for less than 20M)

Bit of a bull in a china shop with the diplomatic ability of a German panzer, but just about the only guy that comes out of it all with any credit.

Ole comes out a bit battered and bruised but still a fecking legend.

 

[edgecutter]

Ed Woodward and Richard Arnold's tenure is the worst. Two guys that hadn't a clue allowed to run and ruin one of the biggest juggernaut in world football.

 

[fergiewherearethou]

Probably spending 240 million on our supposed world class attack in Sancho, Anthony and Hojlund. Sancho and Anthony be gone in summer. Hojlund in another year or two.

Paul Pogba and Lukaku for 170 million.

Letting De Gea go and signing Onana.

Spending 60 million on a declining casemeiro, his stats before he was sold showed he was on a major decline in La Liga.

Giving Rashford a major contract.

Giving Moyes and Van Gaal the job.

I could go on and on.

Letting go of De Gea wasn't a mistake, he was on big wages and wasn't up to it anymore, who we replaced him with, that's the mistake.
Also Lukaku was decent, if not good, he scored enough goals and we sold him for a similar amount to what we paid for him.

 

[lex talionis]

Moyes was a bad appointment but if the club was functioning correctly, he could have done a decent job. The last 3/4 years of Fergie papered over a lot of cracks. Even if the squad was still good, there was clearly no long term recruitment strategy and no real investment in the academy. Even on the commercial side, we allowed rivals to get ahead of us on things like social media.

There's probably only Mourinho and Guardiola that could have thrived in those circumstances.

Wider issues came in those years after Moyes when we seemed to change direction every 6 months. I remember when everyone thought Woodward was a good CEO after the "Van Gaalactico" summer of 2014.

It was a long time ago so I could be wrong, but were we not in 3 of the previous 5 (truly winging it) CL finals before Moyes took over?

I agree Fergie could have done even more to build for the future while triumphing in the present, but he still managed to win major trophies. We all expected a step backward no matter who would be appointed, but we didn’t expect freefall to seventh.

 

[lex talionis]

Letting go of De Gea wasn't a mistake, he was on big wages and wasn't up to it anymore, who we replaced him with, that's the mistake.
Also Lukaku was decent, if not good, he scored enough goals and we sold him for a similar amount to what we paid for him.

De Gea agreed to substantially reduced wages.

 

[DJ_21]

De Gea agreed to substantially reduced wages.

Doesn’t mean we should have kept him though. Maybe as a number 2 but the issue is we replaced a declining goalkeeper for an average goalkeeper.

 

[thisisnottaken1]

It was a long time ago so I could be wrong, but were we not in 3 of the previous 5 (truly winging it) CL finals before Moyes took over?

I agree Fergie could have done even more to build for the future while triumphing in the present, but he still managed to win major trophies. We all expected a step backward no matter who would be appointed, but we didn’t expect freefall to seventh.

We were. And yes, I didn’t expect us to fall off as badly as we did.

 

[Kelly15]

David Gill leaving being replaced by Ed Woodward. As that led to a comedy of errors. That was the worst summer for transfers ever. Plus that winter. No way SAF would of approved either of those transfers. Plus Mata being flown in by helicopter. Cringe. That set up that fantastic paino playing trasfer. Not even going to mention his name. But that was beyond Cringe. We became the spice boys. Omg.

 

[Kelly15]

It was a long time ago so I could be wrong, but were we not in 3 of the previous 5 (truly winging it) CL finals before Moyes took over?

I agree Fergie could have done even more to build for the future while triumphing in the present, but he still managed to win major trophies. We all expected a step backward no matter who would be appointed, but we didn’t expect freefall to seventh.

Agreed. It was the planning after Fergie. There was money to spend. But Woodward was not competent at all. If gill stayed on it would of been diffrent. Possibly.
All we needed that summer was 2 to 3 players. Good hungry young players. Like a Anderson, Nani, rooney, ronaldo, Beckham, giggs.
One top midfielder. One defender. And we would of been fine. Plus get a proper manager.
Moyes taking 2 weeks off after getting his dream job, he should of been fired right then and there. Also Talk about a confidence killer. This guy basically told the squad they were shit. Right after winning the leage easy.

 

[lex talionis]

Doesn’t mean we should have kept him though. Maybe as a number 2 but the issue is we replaced a declining goalkeeper for an average goalkeeper.

I'm always up for an upgrade at any position where there is a player available to us who represents an upgrade at a reasonable transfer, but De Gea wasn't near the top of our problems that needed upgrading. De Gea become a whipping boy when in fact we had problems throughout the squad. And it was pretty clear that Dave was willing to be a backup keeper in the event we brought in a world class keeper...which we most definitely did not.

And if even we felt that it was the right time to get rid of De Gea, we had Dean Henderson ready to step up. I understand that Dean made some nasty comments, but Henderson is objectively a better keeper than Onana. And on top of that, no transfer fee.

Wrong thread to go into depth on this point I know, but although the decision to shitcan De Gea -- withdrawing the offer made to him of reduced wages, which he accepted -- and bring in an inferior keeper doesn't rank among the top ten worst decisions in the post-Ferguson era, it was a horrendous decision that testifies to the mismanagement of club.

 

[Amir]

It was a long time ago so I could be wrong, but were we not in 3 of the previous 5 (truly winging it) CL finals before Moyes took over?

I agree Fergie could have done even more to build for the future while triumphing in the present, but he still managed to win major trophies. We all expected a step backward no matter who would be appointed, but we didn’t expect freefall to seventh.

You could also say we were in the finals of 2008 and 2009, and then were in just one of the four finals ahead of Moyes's appointment, in a year we had a pretty easy run-in the knock out stages.

There was also the question of how handicapped Fergie was by money issues in the last few years of his tenure. We were signing players every year, but we also kept hearing about the lack of value in the market. And I don't think we signed a midfield player after Anderson and Hargreaves in 2007 (an issue which was brought up here time and time again each transfer window).

Ultimately, after 26 years, everything at United was set up for Fergie. Including a squad which had its qualities but wasn't exactly the best we had. I don't know if any manager could have just come into the same set up and with the same squad and win big trophies.

 

[Amir]

People always mention the lack of signings in the summer of 2013 (except for Fellaini, of course) as a major issue. But since then we went and spent loads on money on loads of players. It didn't exactly solve anything.

So I'm extremely doubtful if making a couple of really good signings (on paper) for Moyes in 2013 would have made such a big difference. Would it have suddenly made him a good enough manager for United? Chances are we would have seen exactly what we've seen since: Good players turning bad once they were our shirt, or after a while.

 

[Albo]

First Has to be David Moyes being appointed by Sir Alex and second David Gill replaced by Woodward .

 

[lex talionis]

You could also say we were in the finals of 2008 and 2009, and then were in just one of the four finals ahead of Moyes's appointment, in a year we had a pretty easy run-in the knock out stages.

There was also the question of how handicapped Fergie was by money issues in the last few years of his tenure. We were signing players every year, but we also kept hearing about the lack of value in the market. And I don't think we signed a midfield player after Anderson and Hargreaves in 2007 (an issue which was brought up here time and time again each transfer window).

Ultimately, after 26 years, everything at United was set up for Fergie. Including a squad which had its qualities but wasn't exactly the best we had. I don't know if any manager could have just come into the same set up and with the same squad and win big trophies.

It's absolutely true that the Glazers have been horrifying owners of United since the takeover in 2005 (not sure of the exact year) that Ferguson helped make possible in some way to an effing horse that I've never understood.

I was in no position to second-guess Ferguson at the time that there "was no value in the market", but it seems to me other clubs were able to load up on talent while we struggled to keep the squad fresh. But we did keep winning trophies -- and it would have been 3 CL trophies in 4 seasons but for the fact that we met the greatest club side of all time, featuring the greatest footballer of all time, twice during those 4 seasons -- during that span of time.

Moyes could not have possibly have replicated the success of the last stage of Ferguson's career, but a better manager than he could have kept us in the CL and PL hunt, which is all that most club supporters have ever demanded.

 

[buckooo1978]

extensions for Jones/Martial need to be up there too. Talk about throwing good money after bad....

fundamentally it all comes down to 1 reason

The Glazers inability to understand that they know nothing about the effective running of a football club. Every costly error stems from that

 

[Amir]

Moyes could not have possibly have replicated the success of the last stage of Ferguson's career, but a better manager than he could have kept us in the CL and PL hunt, which is all that most club supporters have ever demanded.

I'm just not sure it was possible without a big overhaul in the squad. Too many players were on the last legs - Vidic, Rio, Evra, we know what happened with Rooney. And that's without taking into account the big gaping hole we already had in midfield.

Fergie could get that team to win a championship but I think anyone else would have needed major changes to make it competitive. So we would have needed more than just a better manager. We would have needed something that has evaded us for 12 years now: Making the right signings.

 

[ryansgirl]

Not putting somebody in with Ollie to make tactics decisions when things started to look less good because of some of Ollie`s odd decisions. Including not using subs at key times and instead flogging players who needed a refresh.

Ollie identified a key problem with the culture of United`s team - the shared English football culture that was the backbone of Sir Alex`s success and the team building that comes from it. Of course non English players are crucial but just bringing in a bunch of people with no ties to what Manchester United is supposed to be, has been behind some of the nosedive. There are still fans like me who don`t want to see United become a team which fields no locals and has no strong identity.

United`s shift away from that has brought in players who just don`t gell. There have been no identifiable leaders, too, and I`m aware a non English player can be a fantastic leader - look at Keano. But our recruitment has not been focused on bringing in people who will work together because they`re playing for Manchester United and care about it. We haven`t had any leadership qualities in our recruitment for years. Look at how Rio was - a man from Peckham, recruited from West Ham, who was as solid as a rock for years for us and also stepped up as a leader.

And bringing in Mourinho at the wrong time. Should have been given the job before if it were possible. Even then, he was blamed when the players should have been.

 

[lex talionis]

I'm just not sure it was possible without a big overhaul in the squad. Too many players were on the last legs - Vidic, Rio, Evra, we know what happened with Rooney. And that's without taking into account the big gaping hole we already had in midfield.

Fergie could get that team to win a championship but I think anyone else would have needed major changes to make it competitive. So we would have needed more than just a better manager. We would have needed something that has evaded us for 12 years now: Making the right signings.

I agree that Moyes faced challenges that would have bedeviled even Mourinho at the time, but managing a transition from a perennial CL finalist to at least a regular CL participant would not have been that difficult if managed by the right manager. The players who were on their last legs could and should have been wound down -- we could and should have let Rooney go when he was dangling Chelsea over our heads -- and we had the resources to bring in players who were at least reasonable options to replace them. Maybe we don't make it to the SF of the CL during that transition but at least we qualify for the knockout rounds and at least are part of the PL trophy conversation March.

As I recall it now, perhaps wrongly, we were out of the PL trophy conversation by November under Moyes.

 

[Amir]

I agree that Moyes faced challenges that would have bedeviled even Mourinho at the time, but managing a transition from a perennial CL finalist to at least a regular CL participant would not have been that difficult if managed by the right manager. The players who were on their last legs could and should have been wound down -- we could and should have let Rooney go when he was dangling Chelsea over our heads -- and we had the resources to bring in players who were at least reasonable options to replace them. Maybe we don't make it to the SF of the CL during that transition but at least we qualify for the knockout rounds and at least are part of the PL trophy conversation March.

There's just one issue. It was changing a football department that was basically tailored for and around Fergie. That's bigger than anything and it required more than just finding the right manager, and we clearly had no idea how to do that. Or indeed, even that we needed to do something beyond putting another manager in place.

 

[Wing Attack Plan R]

The original sin was allowing the Glazers to buy Magnier's and McManus's shares of the club, which was 2003. Every feck up since then has been small potatoes.

Shocked to learn that we dodged a bullet and avoided being owned by Jeffrey Epstein's girlfriend's dad (Maxwell) and dodged a second bullet by avoiding Rupert Murdoch. Wow.

The club was the subject of takeover bids from media tycoon Robert Maxwell in 1984 and property trader Michael Knighton in 1989, before going public in 1991; they received another takeover bid from Rupert Murdoch's BSkyB corporation in 1998 before Malcolm Glazer's stake was announced in September 2003.

By the end of 2003, Glazer had increased his shareholding from 3.17% to around 15%, which he almost doubled in the year up to October 2004. His acquisition of John Magnier and J. P. McManus's 28.7% stake in May 2005 pushed his own up to around 57%, well over the 30% threshold that would force him to launch a takeover bid. A few days later, he took control of 75% of the club's shares, allowing him to delist the company from the London Stock Exchange, and within a month, the Glazers took 98% ownership of the club via their Red Football parent company, forcing a squeeze-out of the remaining 2%. The final purchase price of the club totalled almost £800 million