Park was neither a hero nor unsung.
Unsung heroes in great teams.
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
Sami Khedira.
Played in many great sides but is always sadly labeled average because he wasnt technically as great as his teammates. Intelligence wise, he was brilliant though, which was why so he has had the trophy laden career for both club and country.
From winning the BL with unfancied Stuttgart, practically forcing Ballack to retire after forming a great partnership with Schweinsteiger in the 2010 world cup, then joining Real, where many thought he would struggle but ended up a first XI player for 3 years. Now at Juve where he again played as a first XI player for many years, despite many injury problems.
I do miss his presence in midfield for Germany, someone who allowed everyone else to play with freedom. The midfield of Kroos-Schweinsteiger-Khedira is the best Germany has seen in a long time (and in this decade).
Played in many great sides but is always sadly labeled average because he wasnt technically as great as his teammates. Intelligence wise, he was brilliant though, which was why so he has had the trophy laden career for both club and country.
From winning the BL with unfancied Stuttgart, practically forcing Ballack to retire after forming a great partnership with Schweinsteiger in the 2010 world cup, then joining Real, where many thought he would struggle but ended up a first XI player for 3 years. Now at Juve where he again played as a first XI player for many years, despite many injury problems.
I do miss his presence in midfield for Germany, someone who allowed everyone else to play with freedom. The midfield of Kroos-Schweinsteiger-Khedira is the best Germany has seen in a long time (and in this decade).
and that was only because he got a new song, so the doubters suddenly jumped on the bandwagon
Good shout! Deceptively skillful, extremely hardworking and smart movement. Scored a couple of great goals as well.
Sharpey during the mid nineties for United? People tend to think of Giggs in relation to our left wing during the 90's but he was quite injury prone and Sharpe was playing around 20 games a season just in the league during the mid nineties period of our dominance.
David may is possibly another as well?
David may is possibly another as well?
You have to be kidding right? Hardly a day went by before the virus without some Twitter journalist singing his praises!
Phillip Cocu
He was literally Sung.
I'd say Milner is more underrated than Henderson.
I agree about the back 4 and Pedro (maybe Martinez) I’d disagree with you on Navas thought.
Navas was definitely underrated, you saying ‘he wasn’t very good’ is testament to that. He was a very good keeper.
Wijnaldum I’m not sure about because I don’t know how well he’s rated overall. He’s an excellent player and does a great job at Liverpool.
Marchisio was excellent, a player every squad could use. Versatile and consistent, it’s a shame injuries really affected his standing. I think he was underrated.
Don’t think Luca was average but I don’t think he was underrated either. Consistent player who scored a lot of goals over a lot of years. Even in his late 30s he was banging them in in Serie A.
Ricardo Carvalho at Chelsea. Often left to tidy up after Terry went gung-ho, rarely let them down.
Van der Sar with us. Everyone waxes lyrical about the Ferdinand-Vidic combination at the back (and rightly so), but the man behind them was equally as important. Added to which, he was the first reliable keeper we'd had since Schmeichel six years earlier. There's a decent case for saying he was more consistent (albeit less spectacular) than either Schmeichel or de Gea; Keane has been very critical of Schmeichel conceding soft goals if he felt he didn't get his way and de Gea hasn't had an amazing last couple of years.
Tevez with us? 34 goals in the two seasons during peak "Give it to Ronaldo", but got messed around with turning his loan into a permanent move (negotiations didn't start until May, if I remember rightly). He proved himself an immature git in subsequent clubs, but would he have behaved like that under SAF?
Van der Sar with us. Everyone waxes lyrical about the Ferdinand-Vidic combination at the back (and rightly so), but the man behind them was equally as important. Added to which, he was the first reliable keeper we'd had since Schmeichel six years earlier. There's a decent case for saying he was more consistent (albeit less spectacular) than either Schmeichel or de Gea; Keane has been very critical of Schmeichel conceding soft goals if he felt he didn't get his way and de Gea hasn't had an amazing last couple of years.
Tevez with us? 34 goals in the two seasons during peak "Give it to Ronaldo", but got messed around with turning his loan into a permanent move (negotiations didn't start until May, if I remember rightly). He proved himself an immature git in subsequent clubs, but would he have behaved like that under SAF?
Haha good one.
Pretty much our entire midfield after Keane left other than Scholes. Carrick was never really appreciated by most until after he was gone and Fletcher and Anderson were often rotated in. In a time where teams like Liverpool, Arsenal and Chelsea had star midfielders with players like Lampard, Ballack, Essien, Cesc, Rosicky, Carzola, Wilshire, Gerrard, Alonso, and Mascherano, our midfield was often looked at as our "weak link" by our opponents. I always argued that, and much like Liverpool today, it is the part of our squad that is rotated the most so it's tough for one or two players to stand out. But I would put any of them up against any of the top 4 back then and they would all hold their own...
Quaresma for Portugal when they won the Euros. Probably delivered some of his most mature performances
Karius
Silvestre was awful. Always had a mistake in him. Always.
Marcelo at Real, insanely underrated. It's always just been "oh, and Marcelo was there". What a player.
Wes Brown's contribution in 07/08 as a RB was genuinely excellent (also put in a monster performance against Barca in the CL and an assist in the final). I think it was a big mistake not getting another top class defender after 1999 to partner Stam though.
The moment I saw the thread title I immediately thought of Ji-sung Park and Fletcher.
Phil Neville - centre mid v Arsenal
Fernandinho at City
Guti perhaps? Although I can't say I ever actually watched him much
For Madrid Michael Oliver, legend of the 13th.
Just kidding, I would say Di María, quite forgotten at least for many Madrid fans. He was not an endearing public figure and his departure, constantly talking about money did not leave a good memory, however he was essential for the tenth, and he is not often remembered too much.
Also referring to the Spanish public, I would say Torres. The era of Iker, Xavi, Iniesta, Villa, Pujol, etc, but many fans ignore Torres. He gained a reputation for missing sitters and was quite humiliated, even with nicknames, when he was incredibly important, especially in the first Euro Cup.
Just kidding, I would say Di María, quite forgotten at least for many Madrid fans. He was not an endearing public figure and his departure, constantly talking about money did not leave a good memory, however he was essential for the tenth, and he is not often remembered too much.
Also referring to the Spanish public, I would say Torres. The era of Iker, Xavi, Iniesta, Villa, Pujol, etc, but many fans ignore Torres. He gained a reputation for missing sitters and was quite humiliated, even with nicknames, when he was incredibly important, especially in the first Euro Cup.
Makelele at Real
Cant' really agree with Carvalho: he is considered one of the best center backs of his generation and fans overall loved him everywhere: he was still playing at a very good level late in his career. In fact despite his age and lack of speed, Real Madrid fans said his tenure at the club was actually solid and he still made very good seasons at Monaco, but time beat us all.
Not sure about that. He was a big game player and scored many big goals for us, market out Pirlo in 2 legs.
While Ronaldo and Rooney got the glory he was always just as important to the team.
Nickt Butt. He was playing in a midfield foul of stars: Keane, Beckham, Giggs, Veron etc, but he played many games and was always solid. He was indeed pretty much the second option or for special occasions like Ole and Park but I feel he is not mentioned in the same way.
Mandzukic. A bit like the Khedira case that someone mentioned above. He was instrumental in many occasions for his club teams and his national team.
Edmilson. If you ask anyone to name starters of Brazil's world cup victory in 2002 or Lyon's early success or Barcelona's 2006 season, I think most people would not mention him at all. But he was there, and played a vital role.
Mandzukic. A bit like the Khedira case that someone mentioned above. He was instrumental in many occasions for his club teams and his national team.
Edmilson. If you ask anyone to name starters of Brazil's world cup victory in 2002 or Lyon's early success or Barcelona's 2006 season, I think most people would not mention him at all. But he was there, and played a vital role.
When you say he was just as important for the team as Rooney and Ronaldo I think you say that without processing it's implications.
Was Park ever the first name on the team sheet? Or was he ever undroppable?
He was an attacker who will always be remembered for his defensive contributions. A good player and that's it.
All defensive midfielders in great teams ever. I cant name amy, because they're unsung. Cocu is a good shout maybe, or Nigel de Jong.
Wes Brown in 07/08 was excellent for us. He's often forgotten. Very good player when fit and had a great season.
Just seen it's already been mentioned..............
Just seen it's already been mentioned..............
agreed. Silvestre is a marginally better version of Rojo.
In big games yes.
Some think he's been the best player in the league this season. So, no
Wijnaldum from the very team fits this thread more
I'll throw in Zinchenko for City
I'll go along with Zinchenko. Wouldn't put him in the bracket of unsung hero though. He's just a very talented modern day full back who may not be getting the praise he deserves.
David Aldbelda played a key role for a Valencia side that were triumphant domestically (La Liga 01/2, 03/4) and European stage (Uefa and Super Cup)
Koeman tried to make an example of him. He broke down in a press conference.
"I'm devastated because this was the last thing I expected after all I have achieved at this club,' Valencia captain Albelda told a news conference on Thursday. 'They haven't explained why they have done this. Koeman just said he didn't have any faith in my leadership on or off the pitch and I responded that after 20 days in charge of the team he didn't know me well enough. 'He has no idea the sort of effort it took for me to get here.'
Albelda said he felt betrayed by club president Juan Soler and his board. 'The directors at this club have no class or status to humiliate me like this. I have received no explanation from the president or anyone in his circle. I am leaving with my head held high and my conscience clean."
The teammates of Maradonna as when you hear Maradonna, you'll invariably hear/think:
Maradonna single handed / One man team / Marodonna's team / Maradonna and the rest
He understandably (and rightly) received the vast bulk of the limelight. Some take it to the extreme though (which is to be expected) and give the impression it was Maradonna and 10 men off the street. Careca, and Valdano to a lesser extent, but the unsung hero I want to mention is José Luis Brown who played every game of the 86 World Cup, scored the opener in the WC final against Germany, heroically soldiered on despite his injury. Softened the blow of the absent Pascarella.
I can see why people use the phrase. It refers to a talismanic figurehead, and Maradonna unequivocally had a galvanising influence. I acknowledge the phrase wasn't intended to be meant literally, but I often get the impression that those who used the phrase are meaning it literally. Perhaps its semantics, but arguably any side considered to be a one man team, will by default have unsung heroes.
Dino Baggio was involved in a Parma side that achieved silverware. Impressively as a defensive midfielder he managed to score 5 goals in the Uefa Cup including two goals against Juventus in the final. Unfortunately for him, he was/is unable to shake the fame of his namesake who continues to enamour the hearts of many. DEspite his accomplishments, there's only one player that immediately comes to mind when you hear Baggio, and it isn't Dino. I can't imagine how frustrating it is for him to be in those shoes.
Duetmar Hamann part of a Liverpool that won the Champions League. His introduction at half time was crucial to the tactical framework of Liverpool as they readjusted to three at the back, Hamann would be situated alongside Alonso giving Gerrard the platform to focus on his offensive forays higher up the pitch.
John Obi Mikel doesn't get enough credit for sacrificing his initial game (formerly played as an advanced midfielder) for the good of his team. I felt his presence was almost symptomatic of the way people felt towards Chelsea's playing style. I get that impression through the intonation of the commentators, almost to say, here we go, Chelsea are going to shut up shop. In terms of fans, I think many people look down when teams deliberately attempt to cede the majority of possession in a resolute defensive performance, often calling it parking the bus which by most indications, has negative connotations. Such a term essentially suggests it took no skill in TeamX succeeding from a defensive perspective. In any case, Mikel had several appearances for Chelsea with his most notable example being his performance against Bayern Munich in the 2012 final. A very good performance from Mikel, which went under the radar due to the seemingly unprecedented nature of Chelsea's win.
Koeman tried to make an example of him. He broke down in a press conference.
"I'm devastated because this was the last thing I expected after all I have achieved at this club,' Valencia captain Albelda told a news conference on Thursday. 'They haven't explained why they have done this. Koeman just said he didn't have any faith in my leadership on or off the pitch and I responded that after 20 days in charge of the team he didn't know me well enough. 'He has no idea the sort of effort it took for me to get here.'
Albelda said he felt betrayed by club president Juan Soler and his board. 'The directors at this club have no class or status to humiliate me like this. I have received no explanation from the president or anyone in his circle. I am leaving with my head held high and my conscience clean."
The teammates of Maradonna as when you hear Maradonna, you'll invariably hear/think:
Maradonna single handed / One man team / Marodonna's team / Maradonna and the rest
He understandably (and rightly) received the vast bulk of the limelight. Some take it to the extreme though (which is to be expected) and give the impression it was Maradonna and 10 men off the street. Careca, and Valdano to a lesser extent, but the unsung hero I want to mention is José Luis Brown who played every game of the 86 World Cup, scored the opener in the WC final against Germany, heroically soldiered on despite his injury. Softened the blow of the absent Pascarella.
I can see why people use the phrase. It refers to a talismanic figurehead, and Maradonna unequivocally had a galvanising influence. I acknowledge the phrase wasn't intended to be meant literally, but I often get the impression that those who used the phrase are meaning it literally. Perhaps its semantics, but arguably any side considered to be a one man team, will by default have unsung heroes.
Dino Baggio was involved in a Parma side that achieved silverware. Impressively as a defensive midfielder he managed to score 5 goals in the Uefa Cup including two goals against Juventus in the final. Unfortunately for him, he was/is unable to shake the fame of his namesake who continues to enamour the hearts of many. DEspite his accomplishments, there's only one player that immediately comes to mind when you hear Baggio, and it isn't Dino. I can't imagine how frustrating it is for him to be in those shoes.
Duetmar Hamann part of a Liverpool that won the Champions League. His introduction at half time was crucial to the tactical framework of Liverpool as they readjusted to three at the back, Hamann would be situated alongside Alonso giving Gerrard the platform to focus on his offensive forays higher up the pitch.
John Obi Mikel doesn't get enough credit for sacrificing his initial game (formerly played as an advanced midfielder) for the good of his team. I felt his presence was almost symptomatic of the way people felt towards Chelsea's playing style. I get that impression through the intonation of the commentators, almost to say, here we go, Chelsea are going to shut up shop. In terms of fans, I think many people look down when teams deliberately attempt to cede the majority of possession in a resolute defensive performance, often calling it parking the bus which by most indications, has negative connotations. Such a term essentially suggests it took no skill in TeamX succeeding from a defensive perspective. In any case, Mikel had several appearances for Chelsea with his most notable example being his performance against Bayern Munich in the 2012 final. A very good performance from Mikel, which went under the radar due to the seemingly unprecedented nature of Chelsea's win.
Really insightful comment there. I don't really agree re Mikel though.
The Albelda/Baraja partnership doesn't get the credit it deserves. it was as good as anything in Europe in the first half of the decade.
I dont think he was unsung but just wanted to point out that he was also at Atletico that season when they won the title.
I remember him scoring at Celta in a game that looked like a likely banana skin.
Emmanuel Petit
Fundamental element for a very good Monaco side in the 90's, start of Wenger's Arsenal and one of the best NT ever (France 98-2000). The best french player in 1998 WC for Aimé Jacquet, favourite midfield partner for Patrick Vieira.
I think Petit has the same profile as David Albdela.
Before the stats and analytics came in football, the number of kms ran, recoveries, José Mourinho (who played in someway a part in that IMO), tactics entering "wider audience" etc... A lot of great continental midfielder pre-mid 2000s who did a lot of "hidden" work didn't get the credit they deserve. I think british fans always had more love for the hardworkers (maybe it's a cliché).
Fundamental element for a very good Monaco side in the 90's, start of Wenger's Arsenal and one of the best NT ever (France 98-2000). The best french player in 1998 WC for Aimé Jacquet, favourite midfield partner for Patrick Vieira.
I think Petit has the same profile as David Albdela.
Before the stats and analytics came in football, the number of kms ran, recoveries, José Mourinho (who played in someway a part in that IMO), tactics entering "wider audience" etc... A lot of great continental midfielder pre-mid 2000s who did a lot of "hidden" work didn't get the credit they deserve. I think british fans always had more love for the hardworkers (maybe it's a cliché).
I think it was Gary Neville who recently commented on Tevez. I think he accused him of being very unprofessional and an unsettling element in the squad for quite a while before his last season was over. Something like that, his departure made more sense after reading it.