VAR and Refereeing 2025/26 | General Discussion

[NotChatGPT]

It's twattish, but he hasn't Ben Thatchered him. Was defo yellow/orange card and couldn't have moaned if it was red.

Ben Thatcher is probably one of the nastiest of the odd 30 years.

Violent conduct is violent conduct. Everyone can see what he’s attempting. Its a clear red

 

[BeforeKeanetherewasRobson]

It's twattish, but he hasn't Ben Thatchered him. Was defo yellow/orange card and couldn't have moaned if it was red.

But that’s not the rules is it?

Martinez touched a hair bobble and VAR said “tough, rules are rules… violent conduct, straight red”.

Where does it say you can late elbow a player as long as it’s not thuggish?

 

[Withnail]

A forearm to the head like that should be a red. I really don't understand the yellow/orange comments. He was late and the ball was gone. He wasn't trying to grab him and mistimed or anything like that. There weren't any mitigating factors as far as I could see.

 

[Fr. Todd Unctious]

Atwell and Banks again quelle surprise

 

[Aboutreika18]

Also, how did Xhaka escape a card for his late challenge on Shaw?

 

[StamsShinyHead]

A forearm to the head like that should be a red. I really don't understand the yellow/orange comments. He was late and the ball was gone. He wasn't trying to grab him and mistimed or anything like that. There weren't any mitigating factors as far as I could see.

If it's not violent conduct I don't know what is. Ball was gone like you said and he made a deliberate attempt to go for Bruno's head.

 

[Jippy]

But that’s not the rules is it?

Martinez touched a hair bobble and VAR said “tough, rules are rules… violent conduct, straight red”.

Where does it say you can late elbow a player as long as it’s not thuggish?

Martinez was unlucky but it's irrelevant to this decision.
It seems var deemed it below the 'excessive force' requirement for violent conduct but isn't able to give a yellow.

Ben Thatcher is probably one of the nastiest of the odd 30 years.

Violent conduct is violent conduct. Everyone can see what he’s attempting. Its a clear red

Could easily have been a red.

 

[Djemba-Djemba]

You shouldn't need to have to cave someones head in with your elbow for it to be deemed a red card.

 

[2 man midfield]

They'll stop the game and go back 2 minutes because Martinez fondled Calvert lewins pony tail, but this got check completed in 5 seconds flat.

 

[Jippy]

A forearm to the head like that should be a red. I really don't understand the yellow/orange comments. He was late and the ball was gone. He wasn't trying to grab him and mistimed or anything like that. There weren't any mitigating factors as far as I could see.

So should Martinez have got a red for hitting the Sunderland player in the face?

 

[Jippy]

You shouldn't need to have to cave someones head in with your elbow for it to be deemed a red card.

Shame there's no middle ground between tapping someone with your forearm and caving their head in.

 

[Red4ever27]

What the hell was that from Nunes on Schade!? Looked like two clear hands on the back, and god knows what the commentator (Alan Smith) i think was seeing

 

[Djemba-Djemba]

Shame there's no middle ground between tapping someone with your forearm and caving their head in.

He's made no attempt to get the ball, ran past Bruno and hit him on purpose with his forearm.

It's a red card all day long.

 

[Withnail]

So should Martinez have got a red for hitting the Sunderland player in the face?

He could have done but I thought there were as less in that one and there was more of a tussle going on.

 

[Jippy]

He could have done but I thought there were as less in that one and there was more of a tussle going on.

It's aweak as piss but he still catches him in the face.

I don't mind a bit of needle and argy-bargy in a game,

 

[Sylar]

Surprised nobody has brought up (or ive missed) the ref in the Liverpool Chelsea game blocking off that Liverpool player and stopping play / drop ball

But last week when Bruno was blocked off... Nothing carry on

 

[NotChatGPT]

It's aweak as piss but he still catches him in the face.

I don't mind a bit of needle and argy-bargy in a game,

Sure, but there's fairly innocent situations that happens during a bit of a tussle and then there's actual swing movements where it's fairly clear that it's done with intent. The one on Bruno is done with intent and there should only be one outcome in those situations

 

[klayton88]

They seriously need to get a grip of keepers going down and the game coming to a standstill while both sets of players go to the touchline for a drink/coaching. It is slowing the game down so much more than VAR already is.

 

[redshaw]

On Bruno, another one of those, it's late on so we'll leave things as they are.

Bruno was also grabbed by the throat by a Forest player, clear as day red yet it was late on in the game, plucky small club facing a sending off so lets leave it. Clearest violent throat grab as well.

I think we need to add these up and also show how Casemiro was set up for a selected freeze frame pitch side to make out he was grabbing the Palace player by the throat when he was holding his collar. We've also had VAR trawl through video for a slightest of hair grab by Martinez while getting fouled himself and finding his balance but other incidents of blatant hair pulling have been let go. It shows how refs are trying to find and frame things to get our players sent off.

 

[HookedOnAPhelan]

Bernardo Silva hits Collins, no VAR interference. Isn't that just brilliant.

 

[Anustart89]

Why is everyone calling it an elbow on Bruno when it was a knock with the forearm? I think a yellow would've been fair enough, given it wasn't the elbow, but certainly borderline. Stupid VAR can't give the yellow at least.

Why does it matter?

VIOLENT CONDUCT

Violent conduct is when a player uses or attempts to use excessive force or brutality against an opponent when not challenging for the ball, or against a team-mate, team official, match official, spectator or any other person, regardless of whether contact is made.

In addition, a player who, when not challenging for the ball, deliberately strikes an opponent or any other person on the head or face with the hand or arm, is guilty of violent conduct unless the force used was negligible.

This was clearly not negligible which makes is as clear a red card as you’ll ever see, yet the nuances always come out to explain why simple, letter-of-the-law, decisions don’t go our way while others get off on such technicalities.

Any referee that is for a system where you can watch video evidence of a missed off-the-ball incident and deem that the fair outcome is a drop-ball to Sunderland is simply dishonest and not adhering to the rules, thereby making them unfit for the job.

 

[#07]

Tin foil hat and all that but I am completely convinced that a lot of referees go through our games giving it the big one, trying to make up for Fergie ruining their childhoods. Conciously or subconciously, its clear that referees go out of their way to prove they can referee Man Utd. As if 'being strong' against us is some kind of badge of merit. Its ridiculous what happend today with the forearm smash on Bruno.

Its not the first time. Martinez gets done for a hair pull on Calvert-Lewin, Calvert-Lewin does the same thing days later 'nada'. We don't get a penalty at Bournemouth for a push on Amad, seconds later Maguire gets sent off for a similar thing. Its ridiculous. You just know if one of our players did what Angulo did it would have been a sraight red. The club needs to demand answers. These decisions are costing us points.

 

[Anustart89]

Tin foil hat and all that but I am completely convinced that a lot of referees go through our games giving it the big one, trying to make up for Fergie ruining their childhoods. Conciously or subconciously, its clear that referees go out of their way to prove they can referee Man Utd. As if 'being strong' against us is some kind of badge of merit. Its ridiculous what happend today with the forearm smash on Bruno.

Its not the first time. Martinez gets done for a hair pull on Calvert-Lewin, Calvert-Lewin does the same thing days later 'nada'. We don't get a penalty at Bournemouth for a push on Amad, seconds later Maguire gets sent off for a similar thing. Its ridiculous. You just know if one of our players did what Angulo did it would have been a sraight red. The club needs to demand answers. These decisions are costing us points.

It’s not even that. It’s the fact that this non-red will not cause any post game discussion and Atwell will not have to read his name in the papers. Whereas if United had got away with that one it’d have been full articles in the papers about how United got the rub of the green like we saw when the ball touched Sesko’s fingernail. Or when Dalot got a yellow against City. Or the countless other incidents where we get a favourable decision and the media go on and on about it.

It’s just easier giving something against us than for us. Reverse the decisions in the Bournemouth game and do you think the discourse is the same in the media? Absolutely no chance.

 

[HookedOnAPhelan]

Not a red

 

[NotChatGPT]

It’s not even that. It’s the fact that this non-red will not cause any post game discussion and Atwell will not have to read his name in the papers. Whereas if United had got away with that one it’d have been full articles in the papers about how United got the rub of the green like we saw when the ball touched Sesko’s fingernail. Or when Dalot got a yellow against City. Or the countless other incidents where we get a favourable decision and the media go on and on about it.

It’s just easier giving something against us than for us. Reverse the decisions in the Bournemouth game and do you think the discourse is the same in the media? Absolutely no chance.

Yup. Any grey area situation we benefit from is highlighted in the media, ton of scrutiny, while anything against us is tough luck. Onana a few years back when VAR didn't intervene when he missed the ball and punched the opposition player, ref team gets demoted. When was the last time a referee made a cock up against us, like the red card for Bruno, or Michael Oliver sending the referee to the screen for the non-penalty when Ten Hag got sacked, and he was demoted for the next match? Never, hasn't happened. feck up and we benefit from it, face media scrutiny and get demoted for a weekend.

It's fecking easy not to get involved.

 

[BeforeKeanetherewasRobson]

So should Martinez have got a red for hitting the Sunderland player in the face?

Martinez was unlucky but it's irrelevant to this decision.

 

[Anustart89]

Yup. Any grey area situation we benefit from is highlighted in the media, ton of scrutiny, while anything against us is tough luck. Onana a few years back when VAR didn't intervene when he missed the ball and punched the opposition player, ref team gets demoted. When was the last time a referee made a cock up against us, like the red card for Bruno, or Michael Oliver sending the referee to the screen for the non-penalty when Ten Hag got sacked, and he was demoted for the next match? Never, hasn't happened. feck up and we benefit from it, face media scrutiny and get demoted for a weekend.

It's fecking easy not to get involved.

Exactly this. And the reason is that we have nobody fighting our corner in the media. Gary Neville for one has a huge platform and he’s the worst for going ”ooooooooh THERE, he’s a really lucky boy” when a United player does something, while going ”there’s not enough in that” when something like what happened today happens.

With friends like these, no wonder Shearer and the likes get a free reign in shaping the narrative against us and helping refs having an easy time giving stuff against us.

 

[BeforeKeanetherewasRobson]

You’d swear some posters on here were long term sleeper agents and not United fans… they’d argue anti-United decisions and tie themselves in knots.

Odd

 

[Jippy]

Not a red

Do you seriously want the game to be reffed in such a way that this is a red card?

Haaland just got pulled to the ground when he had a run on and nothing given. Refs are letting more go this season, as we've seen on those corner melees.

 

[BeforeKeanetherewasRobson]

For anyone who hasn’t seen it

 

[HookedOnAPhelan]

Do you seriously want the game to be reffed in such a way that this is a red card?

Haaland just got pulled to the ground when he had a run on and nothing given. Refs are letting more go this season, as we've seen on those corner melees.

I just want consistency. If the Casemiro and Martinez ones are reds, this definitely is.

 

[Jippy]

You’d swear some posters on here were long term sleeper agents and not United fans… they’d argue anti-United decisions and tie themselves in knots.

Odd

I assume that's aimed at me- sleeper agent cos I'm not crying when we don't get every decision. We got a handball goal against pool last week ffs.

I probably found the shirt pulling yellows not given today more annoying tbh cos there's so little scope for subjectivity. with those.

 

[Aboutreika18]

Do you seriously want the game to be reffed in such a way that this is a red card?

Haaland just got pulled to the ground when he had a run on and nothing given. Refs are letting more go this season, as we've seen on those corner melees.

Pretty sure that's always been a red. Beckham in 98?

 

[Jippy]

I just want consistency. If the Casemiro and Martinez ones are reds, this definitely is.

We've neve had that consistency and never will unfortunately, unless we move to AI refs. Even then some decisions will always divide opinion.

 

[HookedOnAPhelan]

We've neve had that consistency and never will unfortunately, unless we move to AI refs. Even then some decisions will always divide opinion.

Come on, this is just defeatist bullshit. "Things will never be perfect so let's never complain about obvious inconsistencies"

 

[Jippy]

Pretty sure that's always been a red. Beckham in 98?

That was a kick out but so soft a red it was incredible.

 

[2 man midfield]

Pretty sure that's always been a red. Beckham in 98?

Beckham kicked out at him. I'm personally not too bothered that Bernardo Silva only got a yellow for that.

 

[NotChatGPT]

I just want consistency. If the Casemiro and Martinez ones are reds, this definitely is.

It's that simple. With Casemiro they freeze the worst possible angle and go "you can't put your hands on the opposition player like that, rules are rules, violent conduct". With Martinez there's no leniency, rules are rules and violent conduct. Then you have a ton of far worse situation where players escape either with yellow cards or no card at all and it's supposed to be accepted in a world with VAR? The clear VAR feck ups against us this season, last season.

It's fecking insane.

 

[Jippy]

Come on, this is just defeatist bullshit. "Things will never be perfect so let's never complain about obvious inconsistencies"

It's realistic, not defeatist. Humans under pressure and physical demands making subjective decisions are never going to be 100% consistent. You can only hope they make as few as mistakes as possible and use var more smartly to assist them.

 

[NotChatGPT]

I'm personally not too bothered that Bernardo Silva only got a yellow for that.

It's not that the action itself is so bad, but it's the lack of consistency. It's clear as daylight that he's actually hitting out and players have been sent off for a lot less than that