VAR and Refereeing 2025/26 | General Discussion
- Thread starter Pogue Mahone
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Don't attribute to malice what can be attributed to incompetence is very applicable here. You might want to add cowardice though. I have absolutely no doubt that referees are terrified of ruling against Arsenal in this run-in, because they don't want to be seen as being a decisive factor in another bottling.
Yesterday's decision is still absolutely unreal. I can't believe the mental gymnastics that must have gone on in the heads of the VAR refs as they justified why it shouldn't be a red card.
Yesterday's decision is still absolutely unreal. I can't believe the mental gymnastics that must have gone on in the heads of the VAR refs as they justified why it shouldn't be a red card.
Is the bias here that he refuses to accept that VAR officials could get anything wrong but doesn’t mind hanging the referee on the pitch out to dry?
It’s a terrible decision but maybe a bit like the Dalot on Dorku one? Not enough force?
The other similarity being that both decisions did Arsenal a big favour!
Lets see if there's a media meltdown and apology to Burnley over this. Won't be holding my breath the two faced tossers
Both probably should have been red, but the Dalot one was more glancing, whereas Havertz made solid contact with studs to calf. It's easier to rationalize not giving one for Dalot, in my opinion. There is no real excuse for the Havertz one, considering the kind of red cards that are routinely given in this league.
At least it’s a change from the Onana v Wolves incident where both the on-field ref and VAR were demoted the following week. Progress!
I think Dalot was lucky as well, but you're right - on the VAR conversation they say glancing contact. It's just incompetence when they happily sent Simons off for this:
Because it was completely different. Bruno's foul looked like a leg breaker live but on replay it was clearly just a leg trip. Didn't catch the spurs player with his studs, didn't plant his foot, just went high and tripped him with the outside of the boot
This one was a very clear straight red card
Dalot was a glancing contact with the studs (after getting a touch on the ball) from a stand-still which severely reduces the force compared to a lunge where the player throws his body behind the tackle towards a player with no chance of reaching the ball.
If you look at the replays you can even see the Burnley player’s ankle twist from the impact. I think that’s the worst part of the tackle in terms of danger while everyone else is focusing on studs on calf (which is more a measure of how out of control it was rather than anything else).
A more valid comparison would be when Rooney kicked a West Ham player to trip him on a counter and kicked him on the thigh and got sent off, which was widely hailed as the correct decision because the force used was completely unnecessary to stop the player. This was mistimed, out of control and unnecessarily endangering the opponent who could’ve sprained or broken his ankle because Havertz wanted to stop the counterattack.
Yesterday's decision was farcical but I don't believe Arsenal would've succumbed to Burnley pressure, even down to 10 men. Just a bit silly that they fail to act on a decision that should be as straightforward as they come.
The West Ham disallowed goal was actually the correct call for me, Raya is clearly fouled but the infuriating part is obviously that Arsenal themselves have benefitted from such shenenigans on multiple instances this season and that can't be allowed. I think the change in officiating was a deliberate one and it came closely after the Arsenal vs Chelsea game which was a total joke with full on wrestling at pretty much every corner and then some. Because of that you now have a season in which everything was allowed in the first part and then officiating became more stringent again later on, which now ONCE AGAIN benefitted Arsenal against West Ham. It's the inconsistency that's inexcusable.
The West Ham disallowed goal was actually the correct call for me, Raya is clearly fouled but the infuriating part is obviously that Arsenal themselves have benefitted from such shenenigans on multiple instances this season and that can't be allowed. I think the change in officiating was a deliberate one and it came closely after the Arsenal vs Chelsea game which was a total joke with full on wrestling at pretty much every corner and then some. Because of that you now have a season in which everything was allowed in the first part and then officiating became more stringent again later on, which now ONCE AGAIN benefitted Arsenal against West Ham. It's the inconsistency that's inexcusable.
It's not, because it makes that kind of open manipulation obvious
Without VAR, there would still be the excuse of "ref didn't see it well". With VAR though?
I do think there's an element of not wanting City to win the title this year
Remember 2 years ago the team that won the league thanks to the refs was City, too
Raya likely was fouled, the problem is Arsenal committed at least 3 fouls long before it happened, all of which were stonewall penalties.
But they haven't conceded a pen or red card all season, so?
I really don't understand why they don't do that.
You think there is an opposition for City to win it this year at an institutional level, which is then communicated to individual referees for them to alter their in-game decisions? I just don't really buy it. Too big of a conspiracy to be done quietly.
It would make them sound very silly if they were heard by 60,000 people saying ”Havertz lunges at the opponent with no chance of reaching the ball, plants his studs into the opponent’s calf, which makes the opponent’s ankle roll. Yellow card confirmed”.
He did when United got a decision the other day
I don't mean broadcast it at the stadium but it could certainly be an option instead of commentary.
They really don't like transparency. They hide behind the fact that they can take some time and then release some weirdly written statement to back up whatever decision they decide to.
The really is the only reason. Quite ridiculous.
Am I right in thinking Arsenal could win some kind of ‘fair play’ award at the end of this season, too?
Yeah the fair play for winning the league despite having terrible football on display for 90% of your games trophy.
Doesn’t have to be a secret. They don’t give a shite. They do what they want. Have been for years but getting worse. Hope it all comes crashing down on the cnuts,
”Fair play for being the best at getting away with headbutting opponents and planting your studs in their calves” award winners 25/26
««Referees' boss Howard Webb spoke to Forest to explain that while there could be justifiable reasons to judge this was not handball, a better decision, and one that would be expected, is for it to be disallowed”»
If there are justifiable reasons to judge this was not handball, how is then clear and obvious?
If there are justifiable reasons to judge this was not handball, how is then clear and obvious?
And also if it was justifiable why apologise.
We know why there was an apology of course because the media had an absolute shitfit led by Gary Neville.
Meanwhile for the 2nd time in 3 weeks Arsenal should have had a player given a straight red. Wonder will Howard apologise for that.....
I think so yeah
Keep in mind in Italy the current president and vice-president of the referees are under investigation for corruption over VAR use, relating to last season, with no club seemingly involved
So yeah, I absolutely can that happening in england as well
Look of course Arsenal have benefitted from leniency on wwe style corners etc and the fact that they have managed to get this far without a red is wild. I'm not sure about penalties. I don't recall any that blatantly should have been given against them but I don't watch many of their games as they bore me to death. The one last week for all the furore could have gone either way and as usual this season the refs just ignore wrestling in the box. It's not restricted to Arsenal either, just look at what that little rat Bernardo Silva gets away with each week.
But to suggest it's a conspiracy from the top is akin to suggesting the moon landing was faked. It's just a bit silly to me. The PL PGMOL and the refs themselves would all have to be involved. I can't see them all getting together and deciding to go easy on Arsenal (for reasons that have yet to be properly explained as far as I can see).
However, there's always the possibility that Arsenal would be preferred to City, because of the charges or to change things up etc and that this attitude is bleeding into how they're being refereed, on a sort of subconscious level.
When that Spurs Vs Leeds game got 13 minutes of extra time that pretty much confirmed to me that the PGMOL are, at the very least, under instruction to make things more dramatic.
I'm not saying favour one team over another or anything (though didn't the PL chief say they want new winners every few years?) but try make the product as dramatic as possible.
This is such a strange statement. By the decision to be expected are they secretly admitting that decisions aren't meant to go our way?
There are two teams judged differently in the premier league, Arsenal and Manchester United.
At different ends of the spectrum.
At different ends of the spectrum.
This is just the Havertz challenge, right?...
They say it doesn't meet the threshold. Or they apologise. Both of which do not include correcting the mistake. They get away with it either way. It's perfect for manipulation and abuse.
It makes the manipulation and abuse way too obvious. No VAR allowed the excuse of human error, VAR doesn't. No VAR allowed getting offsides wrong, VAR doesn't
More checks don't make maniputaltion and abuse easier
I’m confused, as long as there’s an arbitrary threshold, «clear and obvious», there’s always going to be plenty of wiggle room
So how is the uproar about Havertz not getting sent off? At the same level as a handball decision in a meaningless game, right?
I absolutely and 100% believe this is the case. You can see it in most matches - if it's still close and the narrative is there, the way extra time is played will reflect that. Ditto keeping it eleven v eleven in the crucial matches.
I don't think there's agenda trying to settle the title though. I just think drama = dollars and in the end, all of the Premier League exists to improve the product.
Don’t be silly, All season long, You probably think it all evens out over the season. Those days are long past now, matey
It is not really incompetence, if you have already made up your mind about the decision. It is bias, if not outright cheating.