VAR and Refereeing 2025/26 | General Discussion

Pogue Mahone said:
Is the bias here that he refuses to accept that VAR officials could get anything wrong but doesn’t mind hanging the referee on the pitch out to dry?
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No the clear contradiction from Webb himself on the 2 decisions after the fact. Hanging the on pitch ref out to dry is poor indeed
 
Webb's apology to Forest seems to be a stern warning to all the refs not to give anything to United even if the rules are clear and to use bias in their decisions.
 
RedDevil@84 said:
Webb's apology to Forest seems to be a stern warning to all the refs not to give anything to United even if the rules are clear and to use bias in their decisions.
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More like, it's a distraction from the all the VAR and refereeing decisions that have both been wrong and have decided the title and last relegation spot.
 
noodlehair said:
They need to stop this apology rubbish in general. It was an idiotic decision that had no bearing on anything.

When you pick and choose apologies for specific decisions it looks like bias, because, intentional or not, that is what it is.

If there is an apology it should be a general "sorry we are so sh*t" apology, which is meaningless unless it is coupled with changes.
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this week alone shows the problem. The quick apology for the Mbeumo handball whilst at the same time remaining silent over the Havertz non red card.
 
DavidDeSchmikes said:
this week alone shows the problem. The quick apology for the Mbeumo handball whilst at the same time remaining silent over the Havertz non red card.
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The double standards are genuinely mind blowing. Especially when one incident was in a basically dead rubber fixture and the other happened in a title decider. Then you factor in the player safety issues around incorrectly ignoring dangerous challenges vs handball. On what basis do they decide when an apology is or isn’t needed?!
 
Pogue Mahone said:
The double standards are genuinely mind blowing. Especially when one incident was in a basically dead rubber fixture and the other happened in a title decider. Then you factor in the player safety issues around incorrectly ignoring dangerous challenges vs handball. On what basis do they decide when an apology is or isn’t needed?!
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it's like they've seen the media/pundit backlash over the Mbeumo handballl and based their reaction on that
 
Pogue Mahone said:
The double standards are genuinely mind blowing. Especially when one incident was in a basically dead rubber fixture and the other happened in a title decider. Then you factor in the player safety issues around incorrectly ignoring dangerous challenges vs handball. On what basis do they decide when an apology is or isn’t needed?!
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Did the decision benefit Manchester United?

If YES, then apologise.

If NO, carry on.
 
DavidDeSchmikes said:
this week alone shows the problem. The quick apology for the Mbeumo handball whilst at the same time remaining silent over the Havertz non red card.
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We were knocked out of the FA Cup a few years back due to a goal being allowed in exactly the same scenario (well except that the handball clearly wasn't accidental either).

There was no apology then. Instead there was a long winded explanation from VAR about why it was the correct decision.

The rules haven't been changed since then.

I really wish managers etc. would just publicly call them out on bullshit*t like this, because it is the only way it will stop, since they have no integrity standards or self governance to impose them.
 


Around 3.15 for the handball goal. Explanation from the officials at the time, which they then doubled down on being correct after the game:

If an attacking player’s accidental handball immediately precedes another player scoring, the goal will now be awarded, when last season it was likely to have been ruled out.

However, a player will still be penalised if he commits an accidental handball immediately before scoring himself
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So, according to themselves, not only was the Cunha goal correct to be allowed to stand, but VAR should never have recommended a review in the first place?

Instead they have gone with demoting the ref and apologising for following their own f*cking guidance which they put out in a statement to the media?

Why does no one ever f*cking pull them up on obvious inconsistency like this, and question them as to why they keep doing it?
 
What’s grating is how nobody ever follows up on why Webb feels the better decision would’ve been to disallow the Mbeumo goal? Have him read the rules on that stupid TV show and explain why the laws state that a situation like that is not accidental.

Insteqd, he just goes ”football expects that to be disallowed” even though the laws clearly state it shouldn’t be disallowed. Presenter goes okay and that’s that.
 


Delap didn't get a red card for this. And due to the lack of backlash we weren't be seeing an acknowledgement from the PGMOL
 
The thing that infuriates me about this “what football expects” line… you’re encouraging refs to think about what fans might think of every decision. As a United fan, we all know fans expect every decision to not go our way… you see it in the fact that it becomes a massive event whenever one does.

“What football expects” is not a way to referee fairly. How about you just have rules and follow those rules without bias? Too much to ask?
 
Oranges038 said:
Have they issued an apology yet for allowing Bruno's goal today?
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How the linesman even went out on a limb to flag that I don't know. They're told only to flag if it's really clear and this one looked fine anyway but if it was off would have been a marginal var job.
 
Sandikan said:
How the linesman even went out on a limb to flag that I don't know. They're told only to flag if it's really clear and this one looked fine anyway but if it was off would have been a marginal var job.
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They always flag after the play to give their decision on the pitch which VAR then reviews. He didn't raise the flag before Bruno scored the goal, as they do in really clear instances.

We've done this for years now, how are people still not understanding how it works?
 
Anustart89 said:
What’s grating is how nobody ever follows up on why Webb feels the better decision would’ve been to disallow the Mbeumo goal? Have him read the rules on that stupid TV show and explain why the laws state that a situation like that is not accidental.

Insteqd, he just goes ”football expects that to be disallowed” even though the laws clearly state it shouldn’t be disallowed. Presenter goes okay and that’s that.
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It's Howard Webb for goodness sake. Does anyone expect anything resembling common sense or a stance that doesn't immediately put himself in the spotlight ?
 
RedRocket9908 said:
The Beeb has a new article up showing how key VAR interventions affected each club, apparently we would still have finished 3rd with key VAR interventions but would've been 4 points worse off

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/articles/c4g090pjr7ro
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It's a load of bollocks because they don't count things that weren't reviewed, which obviously should have been. Nor do they count stuff like when they choose an early or late frame for offside. Selective reviewing is one of the biggest problems with VAR.

It makes sense to me that Chelsea mainly benefited, even the two supposed mistakes that cost us aren't really mistakes. The only time we got really done was v Arsenal.
 
Anustart89 said:
Andoni Iraola's men had a goal ruled out for offside in a 0-0 draw with Chelsea.

If they’re including offside goals where VAR corrects it then it’s just a joke article to drive engagement.
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Yes, it's a joke article. It doesn't care about whether the decisions were correct or not. It makes us look like beneficiaries of VAR even if every decision corrected in our favour was correct.

A huge issue with VAR is undoubtedly the way it muddies the waters so much that even a team that has been fecked over multiple times a season can be made to look to have benefitted the most.
 
RedRocket9908 said:
The Beeb has a new article up showing how key VAR interventions affected each club, apparently we would still have finished 3rd with key VAR interventions but would've been 4 points worse off

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/articles/c4g090pjr7ro
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What is even the point of this article? Its so dumb. Without analyzing whether the VAR interventions were correct or not, there is no point of an analysis like this; the on-field ref and VAR are basically the same now with one trying to protect the other and vice-versa.
 
Gums said:
Yes, it's a joke article. It doesn't care about whether the decisions were correct or not. It makes us look like beneficiaries of VAR even if every decision corrected in our favour was correct.

A huge issue with VAR is undoubtedly the way it muddies the waters so much that even a team that has been fecked over multiple times a season can be made to look to have benefitted the most.
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Yeah, a team that’s the biggest beneficiary of correct VAR overturns is the team that has the most obvious errors given against them on the pitch, and would’ve been the most shafted one if not for VAR.

Not to mention all the errors against them that aren’t obvious enough for VAR to step in, like when a player grabs an opponent by the throat, or when a player deliberately stamps on an opponent as he’s lying on the ground as two completely random examples that just came to my head.
 
Every fanbase insists the refs are out to get their team. Debatable decisions that go their way tend to be forgotten quickly or rationalized into actually being the correct decision.

It is one of the more tedious things about football and any discussion about officiating is always going to be highly influenced by that bias.
 
Bobski said:
Every fanbase insists the refs are out to get their team. Debatable decisions that go their way tend to be forgotten quickly or rationalized into actually being the correct decision.

It is one of the more tedious things about football and any discussion about officiating is always going to be highly influenced by that bias.
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I don't, Chelsea had multiple calls in our favour this season. Including both games v Newcastle and the cup final off the top of my head.

Can't argue with the red cards all season. Even the supposed calls that punished us from BBC to article weren't offside.

Webb has said they're refereeing what football expects, so not what's in the laws of the game. Which explains a lot...
 
Amarsdd said:
What is even the point of this article? Its so dumb. Without analyzing whether the VAR interventions were correct or not, there is no point of an analysis like this; the on-field ref and VAR are basically the same now with one trying to protect the other and vice-versa.
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Agreed. It has about as much use as an article on referee interventions.
 
Bobski said:
Every fanbase insists the refs are out to get their team. Debatable decisions that go their way tend to be forgotten quickly or rationalized into actually being the correct decision.

It is one of the more tedious things about football and any discussion about officiating is always going to be highly influenced by that bias.
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I mean, we had actual referees from Premierleague admitting they made some calls to favour the spectacle in some very high stakes game, so you think we should trust your opinion over that?
 
Mb194dc said:
I don't, Chelsea had multiple calls in our favour this season. Including both games v Newcastle and the cup final off the top of my head.

Can't argue with the red cards all season. Even the supposed calls that punished us from BBC to article weren't offside.

Webb has said they're refereeing what football expects, so not what's in the laws of the game. Which explains a lot...
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Maybe Mr. Webb could explain to me who or what is the "football" that he thinks expects. Is "football" the rule makers, the rule enforcers (referees), the players, leagues, clubs, pundits or fans?
 
NLunited said:
I do think that this is happening. Same with other sports, like F1 and NBA.
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Whether it happened or not, there's absolutely every reason to believe that people who run Premierleague wanted Arsenal to win it. They would be stupid not to, they are running one of the most marketable businesses in the world very successfully, and that's how businesses work.
 
erlichbachman said:
Whether it happened or not, there's absolutely every reason to believe that people who run Premierleague wanted Arsenal to win it. They would be stupid not to, they are running one of the most marketable businesses in the world very successfully, and that's how businesses work.
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All they have to do is tip the scales a little. Just make the 50/50s fall in someone’s favour.

They can totally game it so that there’s as much spectacle as possible.

Bruno getting the assist record is another one. Pretty sure that Dorgu goal would have been an own goal on another day (of course Bruno 100% deserves it).

But, more engagement for the league if Bruno breaks it.

Keep the relegation battle alive until the last gameday. And on and on.
 
NLunited said:
All they have to do is tip the scales a little. Just make the 50/50s fall in someone’s favour.

They can totally game it so that there’s as much spectacle as possible.

Bruno getting the assist record is another one. Pretty sure that Dorgu goal would have been an own goal on another day (of course Bruno 100% deserves it).

But, more engagement for the league if Bruno breaks it.

Keep the relegation battle alive until the last gameday. And on and on.
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Yep, all true.
 
BBC with a little column about winners and losers with regards to poor VAR decisions. I'm sure those are just the ones the PGMOL have owned up to.
 
erlichbachman said:
Whether it happened or not, there's absolutely every reason to believe that people who run Premierleague wanted Arsenal to win it. They would be stupid not to, they are running one of the most marketable businesses in the world very successfully, and that's how businesses work.
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We're not a long way away from the league turning into the WWE then.

Maybe the old United Arsenal rivalry could be revived as a storyline.
 
Love this from the article:

Mikel Arteta's Gunners won the Premier League while becoming the first team to go the whole campaign without receiving a red card or conceding a penalty.

But data logged by the Premier League's key match incidents (KMI) panel shows that Arsenal should have conceded three penalties and received three red cards.

NinjaZombie said:
We're not a long way away from the league turning into the WWE then.

Maybe the old United Arsenal rivalry could be revived as a storyline.
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We are already WWE. Every corner and free kick is evidence of this.
 
Bastian said:
BBC with a little column about winners and losers with regards to poor VAR decisions. I'm sure those are just the ones the PGMOL have owned up to.
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looks at the poor VAR decisions in the article and see how many times PGMOL apologised (and doing so 24 hours after a match)
 
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